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islam25

Controversial ibne Arabi?

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1 minute ago, Sirius_Bright said:

That's the reason we have to blindly follow an Imam (ma'soom) and filter for an Aalim (non-ma'soom). 

But the Alim i recognised after filter also found to have great respect for ibne Arabi.  And also one of propagator of ibne Arabi. 

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2 hours ago, islam25 said:

Why some shia scholars dissociate and condemn ibne Arabi. 

Ayatollah Ghazy said: " After Masoomin, no body was closer to Allah like Ibn Arabi".

When Imam Khomeini was in Najaf, he studied Ibn Arabic book. To answer your question, all of these differences go back to Irfan which Ibn Arabi was master in that.

I follow Ayatollah Distant and he has a great respect toward Ayatollah Ghazy. Ayatollah Ghazy said Ibn Arabi was Shia Muslim.

Edited by AmirAlmuminin Lover

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1 hour ago, islam25 said:

But the Alim i recognised after filter also found to have great respect for ibne Arabi.  And also one of propagator of ibne Arabi. 

Remember one thing brother. A fallible human being is prone to every sin and blunder. He can be right in one thing and wrong in another. You should not follow any fallible human being 100 percent except in case of fiqh. The only people you can believe blindly in their words and actions are Ahlulbait (ams). 

Read about Shalmagani in the time of minor occultation. 

Edited by Sirius_Bright

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40 minutes ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Remember one thing brother. A fallible human being is prone to every sin and blunder. He can be right in one thing and wrong in another. You should not follow any fallible human being 100 percent except in case of fiqh. The only people you can believe blindly in their words and actions are Ahlulbait (ams). 

Read about Shalmagani in the time of minor occultation. 

We all follow mujathids completely. If you say mujathids do mistakes. Then why we follow them. 

And how can we say those mujathids who praised ibne Arabi did mistake. 

May be it is those mujathids who condemn ibne Arabi did mistake. 

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18 minutes ago, islam25 said:

We all follow mujathids completely.

Let me rephrase it. Taqleed is allowed only in fiqh (not aqaed).

20 minutes ago, islam25 said:

If you say mujathids do mistakes. Then why we follow them. 

Every human being can make mistake except 124k prophets (ams), Janabe Fatema Zehra (s.a.) and 12 Imam (ams). 

22 minutes ago, islam25 said:

And how can we say those mujathids who praised ibne Arabi did mistake. 

Because ibne Arabi praised enemies of Ahlulbait (ams). Rest you figure out. 

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2 minutes ago, Sirius_Bright said:

Let me rephrase it. Taqleed is allowed only in fiqh (not aqaed).

Every human being can make mistake except 124k prophets (ams), Janabe Fatema Zehra (s.a.) and 12 Imam (ams). 

Because ibne Arabi praised enemies of Ahlulbait (ams). Rest you figure out. 

So didn't mujathids knew that ibne Arabi praised enemies of Ahlulbayt as. 

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4 minutes ago, islam25 said:

So didn't mujathids knew that ibne Arabi praised enemies of Ahlulbayt as. 

I already said that mujtahids or any aalim can make mistake. You see so many different scholars with different beliefs. Is everyone correct? 

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55 minutes ago, Sirius_Bright said:

I already said that mujtahids or any aalim can make mistake. You see so many different scholars with different beliefs. Is everyone correct? 

Now who will say where mujathids did mistake and where not. 

May be where we feel he did mistake in reality he was correct and vice versa .

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Maybe it's false claims against ibn arabi that state he praised enemies of ahlulbayt (asws), like how do we know that he actually praised enemies of ahlubayt and that it's not just a made up fallacy by other Islamic schools of thought? 

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5 minutes ago, rinneganMahdi said:

Maybe it's false claims against ibn arabi that state he praised enemies of ahlulbayt (asws), like how do we know that he actually praised enemies of ahlubayt and that it's not just a made up fallacy by other Islamic schools of thought? 

It's not false, read it here:

 

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Maybe that's why many high ranking shia mujhatids praise him because they recognise the fallacy made against his character, because if we see the mujtahids that praise him, they seem to be noble and extremely exceptional such as ayatollah Qahzi, Khomeini, behjet etc, these ayatollahs are known to be far from ordinary and are not typical mujtahids, anyway I'm just assuming here of course so please don't take anything I state awa factual evidence only Allah swt knows best, I'm just trying to put the puzzle together lol, would love an answer and further explanation, wsalam

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8 minutes ago, Dhulfikar said:

It's not false, read it here:

 

This has shed some new light on my perspective thank you so much, it's fascinating tbat mujtahids have a vast opinion on this matter especially surprised by what ayatollah Qahzi thinks since he believes ibn arabi was a shia

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Quote

This has shed some new light on my perspective thank you so much, it's fascinating tbat mujtahids have a vast opinion on this matter especially surprised by what ayatollah Qahzi thinks since he believes ibn arabi was a shia

 

You can also find Scholars who are against Ibn Arabi works, opinions and his position toward Ahlulbait (as).

Edited by Dhulfikar

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1 hour ago, rinneganMahdi said:

Maybe that's why many high ranking shia mujhatids praise him because they recognise the fallacy made against his character, because if we see the mujtahids that praise him, they seem to be noble and extremely exceptional such as ayatollah Qahzi, Khomeini, behjet etc, these ayatollahs are known to be far from ordinary and are not typical mujtahids, anyway I'm just assuming here of course so please don't take anything I state awa factual evidence only Allah swt knows best, I'm just trying to put the puzzle together lol, would love an answer and further explanation, wsalam

These mujtahids whom you named understood Islam from different perspective than others. That is why they praised. Because their definition of Muslim, kafir and momin is different from others. 

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1 hour ago, rinneganMahdi said:

Maybe it's false claims against ibn arabi that state he praised enemies of ahlulbayt (asws), like how do we know that he actually praised enemies of ahlubayt and that it's not just a made up fallacy by other Islamic schools of thought? 

It is said the books of ibne Arabi has different collection's. So in some he has praised some unworthy person. But the scholars suspect it is insertion done latter and ibne Arabi has not himself done .

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5 hours ago, islam25 said:

It is said the books of ibne Arabi has different collection's. So in some he has praised some unworthy person. But the scholars suspect it is insertion done latter and ibne Arabi has not himself done .

And it had happened exactly for Ibn Arabi works, I wonder what is the chance this could occur? Any proof of their conclusion of why they think this could have happened?

Edited by Dhulfikar

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2 hours ago, Dhulfikar said:

And it had happened exactly for Ibn Arabi works, I wonder what is the chance this could occur? Any proof of their conclusion of why they think this could have happened?

Do you think they won't have proof. 

Why should a great mujtahid of shia islam would praise ibne Arabi  if he was enemy of Ahlulbayt. So think over it. 

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38 minutes ago, islam25 said:

Do you think they won't have proof. 

Why should a great mujtahid of shia islam would praise ibne Arabi  if he was enemy of Ahlulbayt. So think over it. 

Same with the great mujtahids that criticize ibn Arabi. We want proof of the claim that later his books were modified by others, because we seek truthfulness.

Edited by Dhulfikar

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16 minutes ago, Dhulfikar said:

Same with the great mujtahids that criticize ibn Arabi, think over it too. We wan't proof of your claim, because we seek truthfulness and not blindly believe in opinions.

Because our standards to declare a person good or bad based on sectarian prejudice. That is why we make error. Otherwise ibne Arabi was true lover and follower of Ahlulbayt as and he done great contribution in Islam particularly about subject Ilahiyat. He clearly declear that Imam Ali as and other imams were true divinely appointed guardians. 

Edited by islam25

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10 minutes ago, SunniBrother said:

Glad we Sunnis have Ibn Arabi. That's one thing which differentiate us from Wahhabis who oppose him.

Yes many great shia scholars have praised ibne most. 

That is true wahhabies oppose him.

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11 minutes ago, islam25 said:

Because our standards to declare a person good or bad based on sectarian prejudice. That is why we make error. Otherwise ibne Arabi was true lover and follower of Ahlulbayt as and he done great contribution in Islam particularly about subject Ilahiyat. He clearly declear that Imam Ali as and other imams were true divinely appointed guardians. 

No. We declare trough his work and action. So far what we know from his own work is that he praises the Ahlulbait (as) and their enemies. 

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7 minutes ago, SunniBrother said:

Most of your "Irfan" comes from Sunni scholars.

I only have readed Irfan works that mostly can be referred to Ahlulbait (as) hadiths. And I don't deny that the scholars who wrote such a books could have not get their original way of thinking from Sunni Scholars.

I personally love and learn so much from Bahjat and Tabataba'i spiritual works, but most of their reference are from Ahlulbait (as).

Edited by Dhulfikar

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11 minutes ago, islam25 said:

Yes many great shia scholars have praised ibne most. 

That is true wahhabies oppose him.

And so many have denounced him. So are those who denounced him wahabis?

All this proves is some Shi'i scholars have a different understanding of tawheed and different opinions on irfani concepts.

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1 minute ago, Dhulfikar said:

I only have readed Irfan works that mostly can be referred to Ahlulbait (as) hadiths. And I don't deny that the scholars who wrote such a books could have not get their original way of thinking from Sunni Scholars. 

Which hadiths? Al-Kafi? Al-Kafi is not a book of Hadiths. It's a book of Fatwas

 

2 minutes ago, Sumerian said:

And so many have denounced him. So are those who denounced him wahabis?

All this proves is some Shi'i scholars have a different understanding of tawheed and different opinions on irfani concepts.

All your "Irfan" rests in Aviccena which was a Hanafi. You Shias had no "Irfan" before Khomeini, Allamah Tabatatei and Mulla Sadra.

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1 minute ago, Sumerian said:

And so many have denounced him. So are those who denounced him wahabis?

All this proves is some Shi'i scholars have a different understanding of tawheed and different opinions on irfani concepts.

Mr. The shia scholar who has written best commentary on Quran has has praised ibne Arabi. Leader of Islamic revolution of Iran and master of irfan has praised ibne Arabi most. 

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