The Shia Islamic and Orthodox Christian unity

[Hussein_Valerio]

Asalamu aleykum wa rahmatullahi wa baraktuh brothers and sisters

Its have been a while that I was visiting ShiaChat again.

I want share some experience I made between the realtionship of Shia Islam and Orthodox Christianity and especially also in the eastern world.

Orthodox Christians are well know as people from Eastern Europe like Russia, Ukraine, Belorussia, etc. or in the Balkans like Serbia, Romania, Bulgaria, Greece etc. and also in the MIddle East in Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, Palestine, Iran, Armenia, Georgia, Turkey.

I sometimes talk with a friend of Bulgaria and seems to have a very symphathy for Shia Muslims. He told me that both religions share similiarties in many views of practising religion itself and as also the suffer of the crusades (Orthodox Christians suffered from the 4th crusades, there have been in many centuries a conflict between Orthodoxy and Catholicism). Aswell he appreciate the support of shiite militias helping christian minorieties like Hezbollah many times did.

Also take a look into this webpage from a Orthodox community which talk about the relation between the two religions: https://souloftheeast.org/2016/01/22/the-orthodox-shia-alliance/

What text impressed me really of this page was that part:

" From the first, in the Shia-Sunni split, there have been interesting parallels with Christendom amongst the followers of Ali. Martyrdom is treated very seriously by the Shi’ites on account of the martyrdom of Husayn ibn Ali at the Battle of Karbala, which, in particular, is of a Christian type. The seventy-two followers of Husayn, who were hopelessly outnumbered in the fight against an army of five thousand, behaved chivalrously, riding out one at a time to draw the fighting away from their main camp, in order to protect the women and children who were with them; Husayn himself did the same thing, and fought in personal combat against the armies of Yazid, and was killed. His body and those of his followers were mutilated outrageously. But in that battle, they laid down their lives for their friends in the same way many military saints of our Church have done. This is not to say, naturally, that the Islamic theology they held to, with its Arian presuppositions, is correct or justified, or that Husayn (or Sheikh al-Nimr) should be treated as a saint by Christians. Only, rather, that the Shia Muslims have for their own prominent spiritual model, a type which (whether consciously or not) recalls the self-sacrifice of Christ."

It was also a pleasure to read the comments and some are very interesting how they view us:

"Mark Citadel says:

January 23, 2016 at 2:34 pm

Powerful article. I am very much interested in this topic, as Russian Christian Reactionaries are reaching for alliance with the Shia resistance in the Middle East. I think one can also draw a parallel in the semi-aristocratic nature of the priesthood. Sunni Islam is far more akin to Protestantism than anything else, in which anyone can become an Imam. Shia understand the need for the Traditional structures of warrior and priest in a far more authentic way. I was amazed to find the Alawite sect celebrate Christmas as we do!"

"AriusArmenian says:

January 26, 2016 at 5:12 pm

I rejoice in the victories of the Syrian people over the head choppers and liver eaters that are backed by the US and its Anglosphere and EU vassals and its Middle Eastern proxies.

For me it is personal. I will never forget that a Syrian army of mostly Muslim young men fought and died to liberate and protect Christian Kessab after the Turk vermin opened the border to allow the Western backed jihadis to enter and kill Armenians. What did the West do? It backed the Turks and jihadi vermin. The US will back Turkey no matter what it does." Note i dont want to make any conflict because the man metioned Turkey.

 

The relationship between Shia Islam and Orthodox Christianity is very common in the Middle East likewise the relation between Armenia and Iran especially during the time were the Ottomans persecuted the Armenians and they were accepted by the Iranians and also by Syrians and Lebanese. In Lebanon the famous founder of the Amal Movement Musa as-Sadr (R.I.P) had a good relation with Christians. On February 19, 1975, fathers of the Saint Louis Capuchin Cathedral in Beirut was the first time in the history of Islam and Christianity that a Muslim cleric was carrying out a Christian religious rite and that was Musa as-Sadr!

During the disastrous civil war in Lebanon, he said in an interview:

“One of the most important objectives behind the plots that struck Lebanon was to destroy the form of coexistence and national unity in Lebanon. When coexistence is targeted by a plot, the symbols of coexistence will definitely be the first to be attacked."

“I do not suppose anyone in Lebanon to be a symbol of national unity as much as I am, because in addition to the cultural, social, and political contacts and all-out relations I have with all Lebanese sects, I reached a point that, three years ago at Saint Louis Capuchin Cathedral, I preached Christians during the Lent. No one in the world has reached such a position. That was just like a Christian clergyman preaching Muslims during the Friday prayers. So I became the symbol of national unity, and thus, the plot directly targeted me,”

“We have gathered for the human being; the human being for whom religions came; the religious which were of the same origin, and each promised the emergence of the other, and acknowledged each other,”

 

 

"Every bullet that is shot at a Christian town is as if it is shot at my home, heart, & children." - Sayid Musa Sadr

 

A similiar untiy can be also find in Syria between the Alawites or the Shia minority toward the Orthodox Syrians. Since the independence of Syria againt the colonialist power of France, unity was a very important symbol even today with the government of Assad.

 

In my opinion the eastern world is more open when its about the dialogue between Islam and Christianity (besides from any secretarian group). Instead in the western world it seems difficult to talk about it since the media and authors are potraying Islam far from Christianity. We really should be open about it instead of giving us judgements which nowadays sadly happen many times.

                    

Thats all what I have to say

Wa aleykum salam

[Sindbad05]

That was a nice post. Jesus a.s is a Prophet of Islam and I as a Muslim believe that our religion is more close to Prophet Jesus a.s than any other religion. I believe that Christians are our brothers in humanity as our Imam Ali a.s told that if someone is not your brother in your faith, he is your brother in humanity.

[SIAR14]

This man also has interesting view regarding Muslim and Christian alliance. 

 

[Qa'im]

This all sounds great in theory, as Shi`a Islam and Orthodox Christianity are very close in beliefs and in modern political identity, but living in a very multicultural society has taught me that Orthodox Christians mostly want nothing to do with any Muslims. Most Serbs, Copts, and Assyrians despise anything remotely Islamic; even cuisines and clothing styles associated with Muslims. Every breath they take is a dissociation from our religion, and they are mostly overrepresented at any anti-Muslim event in the West. Most Russians look at anything south of them as subhuman and backwards gypsies, and let's not forget that they killed one fifth of the Chechen population.

A lot of the Shi`a love for Orthodox Christians has little to do with religion, and more to do with postmodern identity politics, anti-imperialism (unless it's Russian), an inheritance of the millat vs Caliphate tensions, and current Putin-worship. In a word, maslaha (مصلحة). I would love to bridge the gap between Shiism, Catholicism, and Orthodoxy, but I also have some gheera for my Prophet and my Umma.

[Joy-Elizabeth]

I read the " AriusArmenian" with interest, I was unaware of the history mentioned in the post, particularly the assistance of the Syrian military offered to the Armenian minority fleeing from Turkey  early 1900's. I recently saw a fictional-movie-in-historical-context  "The Promise" which gave a glimpse of the suffering of the Armenian genocide of that era.  So much of that event is ignored in normal educational settings.  I will take your post's content and research more of the groups who demonstrated honor and compassion to alleviate the suffering of that event.

[Hussein_Valerio]

1 hour ago, Qa'im said:

This all sounds great in theory, as Shi`a Islam and Orthodox Christianity are very close in beliefs and in modern political identity, but living in a very multicultural society has taught me that Orthodox Christians mostly want nothing to do with any Muslims. Most Serbs, Copts, and Assyrians despise anything remotely Islamic; even cuisines and clothing styles associated with Muslims. Every breath they take is a dissociation from our religion, and they are mostly overrepresented at any anti-Muslim event in the West. Most Russians look at anything south of them as subhuman and backwards gypsies, and let's not forget that they killed one fifth of the Chechen population.

A lot of the Shi`a love for Orthodox Christians has little to do with religion, and more to do with postmodern identity politics, anti-imperialism (unless it's Russian), an inheritance of the millat vs Caliphate tensions, and current Putin-worship. In a word, maslaha (مصلحة). I would love to bridge the gap between Shiism, Catholicism, and Orthodoxy, but I also have some gheera for my Prophet and my Umma.

Wa aleykum salam

I understand what you mean. But i also saw a different view from those people since I was always on contact with Orthodox Christians. About Serbians and Russians its mostly, because of their nationalistic pride that they have such a bad view on Muslims, but we need to understand why they do this? Serbia has suffered with the Ottoman empire and the pride of this nation take the pride to being a Christian also and even the Bosnian war showed many tragedies on any side. About all tragedies during all those conquest and wars we have to learn about it. And I grew up with many people from the Balkan people and the Serbs respect me even as Muslim and they said themselve its pointless to judge other religious people and not to stand to your own mistakes. Serbia as also Croatia and Bosnia did mistakes and some people learned about it and some not. Islam is also the second major religion in Serbia like in the Muslim Sandzak province Novi Pazar. In the Internet you will find Russians who have a good relation with Hezbollah and the SAA as also the Assyrian people and they appreciate the Shia Islamic defendtion of Churches and their religion. Of course what Russians did in Chechnya and other islamic provinces in Russia is a very complicated situation.

I personally think in all those bad cases we should view all sides what those people say, if we even want to understand the reason of those conflicts

[Hussein_Valerio]

5 hours ago, Syed Irtiza Ali Rizvi said:

This man also has interesting view regarding Muslim and Christian alliance. 

 

Yeah I heard about him and he seems a very interesting guy with good views.

[Qa'im]

5 hours ago, Hussein_Valerio said:

Wa aleykum salam

I understand what you mean. But i also saw a different view from those people since I was always on contact with Orthodox Christians. About Serbians and Russians its mostly, because of their nationalistic pride that they have such a bad view on Muslims, but we need to understand why they do this? Serbia has suffered with the Ottoman empire and the pride of this nation take the pride to being a Christian also and even the Bosnian war showed many tragedies on any side. About all tragedies during all those conquest and wars we have to learn about it. And I grew up with many people from the Balkan people and the Serbs respect me even as Muslim and they said themselve its pointless to judge other religious people and not to stand to your own mistakes. Serbia as also Croatia and Bosnia did mistakes and some people learned about it and some not. Islam is also the second major religion in Serbia like in the Muslim Sandzak province Novi Pazar. In the Internet you will find Russians who have a good relation with Hezbollah and the SAA as also the Assyrian people and they appreciate the Shia Islamic defendtion of Churches and their religion. Of course what Russians did in Chechnya and other islamic provinces in Russia is a very complicated situation.

I personally think in all those bad cases we should view all sides what those people say, if we even want to understand the reason of those conflicts

I understand your point, thank you for your kind comment. It will require tons of patience to repair relationships with those who had grievances under the Ottoman empire. I've noticed that many of the Russian converts to Shiism embrace leaders like Shaykh Yasir al-Habib, because it allows them to accept the Prophet and Ahl al-Bayt without disavowing their cultural hatred of Muslim empires. As for Russia and Syria, keep in mind that there are some common interests right now, but on the question of Israel for example, there is a divergence.

[Son of Placid]

16 hours ago, Hussein_Valerio said:

I want share some experience I made between the realtionship of Shia Islam and Orthodox Christianity and especially also in the eastern world.

Interesting. I had a close sharing relationship and experience with a Muslim coworker many years ago.

I had to come here to find out we had things to argue about.

[Son of Placid]

7 hours ago, Joy-Elizabeth said:

I read the " AriusArmenian" with interest, I was unaware of the history mentioned in the post, particularly the assistance of the Syrian military offered to the Armenian minority fleeing from Turkey  early 1900's. I recently saw a fictional-movie-in-historical-context  "The Promise" which gave a glimpse of the suffering of the Armenian genocide of that era.  So much of that event is ignored in normal educational settings.  I will take your post's content and research more of the groups who demonstrated honor and compassion to alleviate the suffering of that event.

Hi Joy-Elizabeth, welcome to the site. Always nice to see another Christian join the group.

What we hear on the news always puts the US in right light, regardless what happens. I have friends who follow the same stories from inside sources and the stories are much different. It's now to the point where American soldiers with conscience are committing suicide, (22 a day?), to get out of killing more innocents, or going back to the States and telling their horror stories.  

[Hussein_Valerio]

On 6.8.2017 at 10:39 PM, Joy-Elizabeth said:

I read the " AriusArmenian" with interest, I was unaware of the history mentioned in the post, particularly the assistance of the Syrian military offered to the Armenian minority fleeing from Turkey  early 1900's. I recently saw a fictional-movie-in-historical-context  "The Promise" which gave a glimpse of the suffering of the Armenian genocide of that era.  So much of that event is ignored in normal educational settings.  I will take your post's content and research more of the groups who demonstrated honor and compassion to alleviate the suffering of that event.

An Armenian friend of me who lives in Britain used to live with his family in Iran then they moved out to Azerbajian. As he said, the Armenians have been always been treated good in Iran except in Azerbajian and Turkey.

A lot of Armenian groups who live in Lebanon, Syria, Iraq and Palestine have been liked accepted by those countries. During the genocide in the Ottoman empire many levantine and iraqi people helped the Armenians from those massacres. Saving the Armenians wasnt only a religious thing, but also something to help someone from the same suffer. The Levant and Iraq fought and suffered as also from colonisation and the Ottomans were part of their enemies too, even if they are muslim also. In the palestinian territories some palestinian Christians arent even real Palestinians, they are Armenian descent. Like I said the minority of those Armenians who live in those countries have a long good relation with them.

[Hussein_Valerio]

On 7.8.2017 at 6:18 AM, Son of Placid said:

Interesting. I had a close sharing relationship and experience with a Muslim coworker many years ago.

I had to come here to find out we had things to argue about.

I personally believe a dialogue between Muslims and Christians is not only about on what we believe and what our critics are toward eachother.

Important is also to find similiarties and informative stuff each other on which we can agree.