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In the Name of God بسم الله

Why do you call yourself Shia?

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Salam,

While Imam Ali a.s. was divinely appointed by the Prophet s.a.w.a.s. and therefore following him a.s. is a part of Islam and therefore the name should be muslim?

 

Edited by Faruk
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Alaikas Salaam, 

Tell me one thing if you call everyone who believes in Allah and his prophet as Muslim then how will you distinguish between different sects. How will you denote a particular sect in your day to day life?

Furthermore, holy prophet himself has used the word shia many times while describing about shias of Ali. Allah has used the word shia multiple times in Quran. 

Basically, Shia means follower or partisan and it started at that time as Shias of Ali and Shias of Muawiyah which further evolved as present day Shia and Sunni. 

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3 hours ago, Faruk said:

Salam,

While Imam Ali a.s. was divinely appointed by the Prophet s.a.w.a.s. and therefore following him a.s. is a part of Islam and therefore the name should be muslim?

 

This name of Shia-e-Ali was given to us by our opponents like the name Rafidi. We did not create it for ourselves but we like it. 

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1 hour ago, Lover of Ahlulbait (ams) said:

Tell me one thing if you call everyone who believes in Allah and his prophet as Muslim then how will you distinguish between different sects. How will you denote a particular sect in your day to day life?

Allah named us muslims in Quran. And the sectarian issues are not about shia or sunni but about truth or falsehood.
 

 

1 hour ago, Lover of Ahlulbait (ams) said:

Furthermore, holy prophet himself has used the word shia many times while describing about shias of Ali.

The word Shia just like the word Sahaba is meaningless in itself. It only means something once it is referred to somebody or a group of people.

 

Quote

Allah has used the word shia multiple times in Quran. 

Yes but not reffering to Imam Ali a.s. nor to point at all muslims in a general sense.





 

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4 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

This name of Shia-e-Ali was given to us by our opponents like the name Rafidi. We did not create it for ourselves but we like it. 

You're an honest man.

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1 hour ago, Lover of Ahlulbait (ams) said:

Basically, Shia means follower or partisan and it started at that time as Shias of Ali and Shias of Muawiyah which further evolved as present day Shia and Sunni. 

Exactly!

It reminds of the verse about those calling themselves jews and christians and then pointing to Ibrahim a.s. who was called muslim.

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3 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

Brother, the word Shia is also used by Prophet Ibrahim a.s for himself so it is a good name.

Yes, a Shia of Nuh a.s., not a Shia of Imam Ali a.s.

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1 minute ago, Faruk said:

It reminds of the verse about those calling themselves jews and christians and then pointing to Ibrahim a.s. who was called muslim.

You meant to say that we are like Jews and Christians ? While we did not invent a word with our own tongues but Quran said it. 

If you want to compare as to who resembles with Jews and Christians among Islam, I would request you to please look at Wahabbis who are so near to Jews and Christians as their own brothers. And they consider us Shias who speak for Hussain a.s as to be infidels. But Allah AWJ knows best that who is kafir and who is Muslim. 

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3 minutes ago, Faruk said:

Yes, a Shia of Nuh a.s., not a Shia of Imam Ali a.s.

Was Nuh a.s and Ali a.s differed in Religion ? Both were vicegerents and both were to be obeyed.  So, why is it problem to you to be called as Shian-e-Ali ?

Edited by Sindbad05
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4 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

like Shian-e-Ahlebait a.s is another name for being Muslim.

You follow the Ahl al-Bayt a.s. because you're a muslim.



 

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4 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

Was Nuh a.s and Ali a.s differed in Religion ? Both were vicegerents and both were to be obeyed.  So, why is it problem to you to be called as Shian-e-Ali ?

Was Ibrahim a.s. a Shian-e-Ali?

And why is the name muslim Allah gave to us not sufficient anymore?

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Just now, Faruk said:

You follow the Ahl al-Bayt a.s. because you're a muslim.



 

God has 99 names, so would you limit God by a single name and tell God that yeah you must be called Allah and not God ? 

This is Wahabbi mentality bro who say that it is gunah to call Allah as Khuda. 

We do not agree with that ideology. God has millions of names and so we have millions of names. We are Muslims, Shian-e Muhammad, wa Ali, Wa Fatima, Wa Hassan, Wa Hussain, Nokar, ghulam and so on so forth.

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7 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

You meant to say that we are like Jews and Christians ? While we did not invent a word with our own tongues but Quran said it. 

If you want to compare as to who resembles with Jews and Christians among Islam, I would request you to please look at Wahabbis who are so near to Jews and Christians as their own brothers. And they consider us Shias who speak for Hussain a.s as to be infidels. But Allah AWJ knows best that who is kafir and who is Muslim. 

The sectarian issue starts when people start to divide themselves with non-Quranic terms.

And again when Ibrahim a.s. was called a Shia-e-Nuh it has a diffirent meaning.

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Just now, Faruk said:

Was Ibrahim a.s. a Shian-e-Ali?

And why is the name muslim Allah gave to us not sufficient anymore?

Yes, He was Shian-e-Ali, because he was on same path as was Ali. Did not God revealed to him that Allah will raise a final prophet from his progeny ? So, Ibrahim a.s had to believe in that Prophet and Did not Prophet said in various books that Ali and I were from a single Nur that separated in the children of Abdul Mutalib, And what ever has been decided by God including future events such as Qayamah, a Muslims has to believe it and Imamate was also a future event prophesized by Allah so without believing it, Ibrahim's eman would have been incomplete so he believe in Ali till Mehdi a.s and so he was a "Lover of Ali and Mehdi". 

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I know the name itself doesn't have any significance and the more important thing is whether we are a shia from the inside. Having a title of "Shia" won't do us any favour nor having a title of "Muslim".

However, if necessary I would clarify that I am a Shia, so people don't think I am a Salafi or Wahabi.

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Just now, Faruk said:

Was Ibrahim a.s. a Shian-e-Ali?

And why is the name muslim Allah gave to us not sufficient anymore?

Yes, He was Shian-e-Ali, because he was on same path as was Ali. Did not God revealed to him that Allah will raise a final prophet from his progeny ? So, Ibrahim a.s had to believe in that Prophet and Did not Prophet said in various books that Ali and I were from a single Nur that separated in the children of Abdul Mutalib, And what ever has been decided by God including future events such as Qayamah, a Muslims has to believe it and Imamate was also a future event prophesized by Allah so without believing it, Ibrahim's eman would have been incomplete so he believe in Ali till Mehdi a.s and so he was a "Lover of Ali and Mehdi". 

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4 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

God has 99 names, so would you limit God by a single name and tell God that yeah you must be called Allah and not God ? 

This is Wahabbi mentality bro who say that it is gunah to call Allah as Khuda. 

We do not agree with that ideology. God has millions of names and so we have millions of names. We are Muslims, Shian-e Muhammad, wa Ali, Wa Fatima, Wa Hassan, Wa Hussain, Nokar, ghulam and so on so forth.

You're putting words in my mouth.

What I said was:

1) The word Shia in Quran referred to other people than Imam Ali a.s.

2) People who hold fast to the Book of Allah and the Ahl al-Bayt a.s. are muslims

3) The words Shia and Sunni emerged later in use and are a cause of sectarianism used by the enemy to inflame hatred

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4 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

Yes, He was Shian-e-Ali, because he was on same path as was Ali.

You're freaking now.

They were both muslims but Ibrahim a.s. was a Shia-e-Nuh.

 

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Just now, Faruk said:

You're putting words in my mouth.

What I said was:

1) The word Shia in Quran referred to other people than Imam Ali a.s.

2) People who hold fast to the Book of Allah and the Ahl al-Bayt a.s. are muslims

3) The words Shia and Sunni emerged later in use and are a cause of sectarianism used by the enemy to inflame hatred

This is a vague discussion because a Muslim has various names given in Quran. 

Just, Shia, Momin, Muslim, believer, helper, mutaqi are all names of a Muslim.

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4 minutes ago, ali_fatheroforphans said:

I know the name itself doesn't have any significance and the more important thing is whether we are a shia from the inside. Having a title of "Shia" won't do us any favour nor having a title of "Muslim".

However, if necessary I would clarify that I am a Shia, so people don't think I am a Salafi or Wahabi.

Allah named us muslims brother.

Why do we change that and start to seek 'solutions' that are not from Allah?

 

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Just now, Faruk said:

You're freaking now.

They were both muslims but Ibrahim a.s. was a Shia-e-Nuh.

 

First of all, every good name is allowed in Islam. So, if we call ourselves Shia-e-Ali aur Shian-e-Ahlebait, it is not forbidden. 

Allah has also named us Momin. 

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4 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

This is a vague discussion because a Muslim has various names given in Quran. 

Just, Shia, Momin, Muslim, believer, helper, mutaqi are all names of a Muslim.

The word helper and shia do not have a positive meaning related to Allah in itself.

One could also be a helper of the mushrikin and Shia in Quran was related to persons as I repeated already many times.

Even the word believer and mutaqi can be used by Arab christians as well.

Muslim however covers all and is universally, timeless and directly reffering to Allah.

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24 minutes ago, Faruk said:

The word Shia just like the word Sahaba is meaningless in itself. It only means something once it is referred to somebody or a group of people.

Yes, it is quite convenient to call out a particular group of people having certain beliefs. 

Our Imam had no problem when we were called shias, why do you have? 

Show me hadith where Imam (a.s.) criticized someone for referring someone as shias and not muslims. 

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1 minute ago, Lover of Ahlulbait (ams) said:

Yes, it is quite convenient to call out a particular group of people having certain beliefs. 

Our Imam had no problem when we were called shias, why do you have? 

Show me hadith where Imam (a.s.) criticized someone for referring someone as shias and not muslims. 

Was Muhammad s.a.w.a.s. a Shian-e-Ali as well?

As it is clear by now all these denominations came later on and distance us from the root.

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1 minute ago, Faruk said:

The word helper and shia do not have a positive meaning related to Allah in itself.

One could also be a helper of the mushrikin and Shia in Quran was related to persons as I repeated already many times.

Even the word believer and mutaqi can be used by Arab christians as well.

Muslim however covers all and is universally, timeless and directly reffering to Allah.

It depends upon Usage bro, we call ourselves "Shian-e-Ali", it shows that we are enemy of "his enemy" and friend of "his friends". 

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Just now, Faruk said:

Was Muhammad s.a.w.a.s. a Shian-e-Ali as well?

As it is clear by now all these denominations came later on and distance us from the root.

Did not Prophet Muhammad PBUHHP said that "Ali is my head and I am body". Does it shows love or not ? Shia = Lover. 

Decide for yourself. Ali was undoubtedly "Shia-e-Muhammad" and as well as "True Sunni". 

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1 minute ago, Sindbad05 said:

It depends upon Usage bro, we call ourselves "Shian-e-Ali", it shows that we are enemy of "his enemy" and friend of "his friends". 

You should obey Allah in the first place and you follow Imam Ali a.s. because Allah commanded us through Muhammad s.a.w.a.s. to do so.

Nothing has actually changed while calling yourself a Shian-e-Ali can also have a political meaning as well.

The Khawarij for example were Shian-e-Ali as well. Even Abu Huraira was a Shian-e-Ali in some occasions but was he a muslim?

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Just now, Faruk said:

You should obey Allah in the first place and you follow Imam Ali a.s. because Allah commanded us through Muhammad s.a.w.a.s. to do so.

Nothing has actually changed while calling yourself a Shian-e-Ali can also have a political meaning as well.

The Khawarij for example were Shian-e-Ali as well. Even Abu Huraira was a Shian-e-Ali in some occasions but was he a muslim?

Where did you learn from that "Khawarij" were "Shian-e-Ali" ?

Khawarij believe in first two Caliphs and not Imam Ali a.s, and they fought battles against Imam Ali a.s remember battle of Nehrwan ? 

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Just now, Faruk said:

Was Muhammad s.a.w.a.s. a Shian-e-Ali as well?

As it is clear by now all these denominations came later on and distance us from the root.

Holy Prophet Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå is greater than Imam Ali (a.s.), so Imam Ali (a.s.) can be called shiane Mohammed. 

Also, there wasn't any division at the time of prophet therefore everybody was referred as Muslims. 

These denominations came later but again why do you have problem? Show me hadith from any Imam (a.s.) where he forbade us using the word shia. 

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