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In the Name of God بسم الله

Why do shias do matam

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7 hours ago, QuranandAhlulbayt said:

It is a cultural act, and we have no indication it was done by any of the Imams [asws] as a way to mourn for Imam Hussain a.s. It was probably introduced well after they left this world.

It isn't the matam that is important , but rather, remembering the Messenger of Allah [saw] and the family of the Messenger of Allah [asws].

You are not more or less of a shia if you do or do not do 'Matam'. The likelihood is the Imams asws never did it.

Brother, matam with hands is mentioned in Quran when Bibi Sarah hit her face in grief and wonder. And Quran was revealed in the time of Prophet and when Imam Ali a.s was present. And all other Imams who came after him, also explained same verses to Muslims. So, matam is not which was introduced after Imams and prophet PBUHHP. In the time of Prophet PBUHHP, Prophet used to ask his wives to go to home of his companions including Hazrat Hamza a.s to mourn their deaths. 

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1 minute ago, Sindbad05 said:

Brother, matam with hands is mentioned in Quran when Bibi Sarah hit her face in grief and wonder. And Quran was revealed in the time of Prophet and when Imam Ali a.s was present. And all other Imams who came after him, also explained same verses to Muslims. So, matam is not which was introduced after Imams and prophet PBUHHP. In the time of Prophet PBUHHP, Prophet used to ask his wives to go to home of his companions including Hazrat Hamza a.s to mourn their deaths. 

We don't have any recording from the Ahlulbayt asws which states that a way they mourned for Imam Hussain a.s was by doing one-handed or two-handed matam, or hitting their chests.

This is not the same as saying it is impermissible, or wrong to do.

Hitting ones face in grief is a natural spontaneous human reaction, but synchronised matam done yearly, during poetry, is not a precedent we ever find done by the Imams asws.

Again, there is nothing wrong with it according to ulema,just, it makes you no more or less a shia in and of itself. I could go my whole life without doing it [though i have and do it yearly]. The position some people place the act itself as a special act that must be done is misguided. Our Imams asws never did it.

 

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It is just a natural way to express your grief. Imagine if your loved one passed away (God forbid), then you will naturally beat your head, chest etc

I personally don't agree with taking mattam to the next level where you inflict harm upon yourself (but everyone has their own choice). 

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10 hours ago, Huntress said:

Why is matam important in shia sect? Is matam some sort of trance state?

Matam is an expression of grief. It was very specific in the arabic culture and has been adopted by shias as an expression of grief for the martyrdom of the Prophet's (saw) grandson Imam Hussain (as).

It is not obligatory. It can be done in a variety of ways including slapping ones chest, face, head, thighs.

 

PS. love the DisplayName.

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2 hours ago, QuranandAhlulbayt said:

We don't have any recording from the Ahlulbayt asws which states that a way they mourned for Imam Hussain a.s was by doing one-handed or two-handed matam, or hitting their chests.

This is not the same as saying it is impermissible, or wrong to do.

Hitting ones face in grief is a natural spontaneous human reaction, but synchronised matam done yearly, during poetry, is not a precedent we ever find done by the Imams asws.

Again, there is nothing wrong with it according to ulema,just, it makes you no more or less a shia in and of itself. I could go my whole life without doing it [though i have and do it yearly]. The position some people place the act itself as a special act that must be done is misguided. Our Imams asws never did it.

 

Who says you that Masomeen never did this ?

I request you to please google and search for Hadith, I my self have read hadith in which prophet PBUHHP mourn and hit his hands on his thigh out of grief. Secondly, I provided you a reference from Quran about Hazrat Bibi Sarah a.s, if there is something in Quran which you did not come across in hadith, it is a law in Islam. So, please if you do not do it, it is your way, but Masomeen and Prophets did Matam. 

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2 hours ago, QuranandAhlulbayt said:

We don't have any recording from the Ahlulbayt asws which states that a way they mourned for Imam Hussain a.s was by doing one-handed or two-handed matam, or hitting their chests.

This is not the same as saying it is impermissible, or wrong to do.

Hitting ones face in grief is a natural spontaneous human reaction, but synchronised matam done yearly, during poetry, is not a precedent we ever find done by the Imams asws.

Again, there is nothing wrong with it according to ulema,just, it makes you no more or less a shia in and of itself. I could go my whole life without doing it [though i have and do it yearly]. The position some people place the act itself as a special act that must be done is misguided. Our Imams asws never did it.

 

Besides, this, I would request you to read following link, where some hadiths are mentioned where tatbir and Matam has been explained to be done by our Holy Personalities. 

http://www.islamic-laws.com/tatbir.htm

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56 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

Who says you that Masomeen never did this ?

I request you to please google and search for Hadith, I my self have read hadith in which prophet PBUHHP mourn and hit his hands on his thigh out of grief. Secondly, I provided you a reference from Quran about Hazrat Bibi Sarah a.s, if there is something in Quran which you did not come across in hadith, it is a law in Islam. So, please if you do not do it, it is your way, but Masomeen and Prophets did Matam. 

Can you show us hadiths of the infallibles doing matam?

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18 hours ago, Sindbad05 said:

@Hassan- click on link above 

Could you kindly providethe gradings after each narration and post them here?

1. Lady Zainab hitting her head on carriage= Not authentic

2.Owas [ra] breaking his tooth is in sunni books and not authentic.

Imam Mahdi ajfs = no grading given, and even then, that is a natural extension of crying, it isn't hitting yourself with blades.

We are now conflating acceptable matam with tatbir. To make it clear, i have no issues with matam but the Imams asws never did it [ and most importantly, therefore, neither did the prophet [saw].  Tatbir is on another planet in terms of how unacceptable it is. I have to be truthful and solemnly say, it has turned shia's and Imam Hussain a.s and the true message of Kerbala into an absolute laughing stock. You have salafi's claiming tatbir was an adhab inflicted on us by Allah for being deviants, and hence, a way of showing the entire world the invalid/batil sect.

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1 hour ago, QuranandAhlulbayt said:

Could you kindly providethe gradings after each narration and post them here?

1. Lady Zainab hitting her head on carriage= Not authentic

2.Owas [ra] breaking his tooth is in sunni books and not authentic.

Imam Mahdi ajfs = no grading given, and even then, that is a natural extension of crying, it isn't hitting yourself with blades.

We are now conflating acceptable matam with tatbir. To make it clear, i have no issues with matam but the Imams asws never did it [ and most importantly, therefore, neither did the prophet [saw].  Tatbir is on another planet in terms of how unacceptable it is. I have to be truthful and solemnly say, it has turned shia's and Imam Hussain a.s and the true message of Kerbala into an absolute laughing stock. You have salafi's claiming tatbir was an adhab inflicted on us by Allah for being deviants, and hence, a way of showing the entire world the invalid/batil sect.

Please read that Allama Majlisi called it authentic and I provided that from source. And if you take it as unauthentic please refute it by any marajas quote.

Even if all above be unacceptable to you, there is in Quran about Bibi Sarah which is authentic and neither Allah nor Prophet nor Imams called it to be a sin but it showed that it was acknowledged as a natural way to show grief. Imams are called walking Quran, so there is no difference between what Imam says and what Quran says. If you do not accept Quran, I don't think so imams will agree with you.lolz

Secondly,  there is Hadith about Hazrat Rubab a.s where she sat outside under sun as mark of sorrow that should be accepted as both evidence for tatbir and Matam. 

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1 hour ago, QuranandAhlulbayt said:

Could you kindly providethe gradings after each narration and post them here?

1. Lady Zainab hitting her head on carriage= Not authentic

2.Owas [ra] breaking his tooth is in sunni books and not authentic.

Imam Mahdi ajfs = no grading given, and even then, that is a natural extension of crying, it isn't hitting yourself with blades.

We are now conflating acceptable matam with tatbir. To make it clear, i have no issues with matam but the Imams asws never did it [ and most importantly, therefore, neither did the prophet [saw].  Tatbir is on another planet in terms of how unacceptable it is. I have to be truthful and solemnly say, it has turned shia's and Imam Hussain a.s and the true message of Kerbala into an absolute laughing stock. You have salafi's claiming tatbir was an adhab inflicted on us by Allah for being deviants, and hence, a way of showing the entire world the invalid/batil sect.

Do we care about salafis?  Salafis are themselves turned away from smelling the taste of real love. What they know what miracles love of Ahle bait is.This love is fragrance of Heaven which is Haram on those who have hate against Ahle bait a.s.

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16 hours ago, Sindbad05 said:

 

Secondly,  there is Hadith about Hazrat Rubab a.s where she sat outside under sun as mark of sorrow that should be accepted as both evidence for tatbir

For tatbir? How is sitting under the sun the same as slashing your head open?

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3 minutes ago, Ibn Al-Shahid said:

For tatbir? How is sitting under the sun the same as slashing your head open?

Brother, "Tatbir" is a vast topic, I will not comment on this because some Ulemas hold views against it and some ulemas does not hold it wrong. 

But I would say that there is something which world do not understand and that word is of "Ishq". 

When a person gets slashes by enemies in war for the love of Allah AWJ, it is considered as Jihad and when Bibi Sarah hits her hands on his face, it is called matam when Hazrat Yaqob lost his eyes by constant weeping for his son, it is called love for his child, even though hand is a weapon and it hurts when you hit on face and when someone lose his eye sight, it is worst than minor bruises on skin which will get recovered. But what can I say that when a boy writes a name for love of his girl on his whole forearm, it is called love but when a young just hits by remembering Hussain few bruises on his back, it is called as Bidah, while this case is not as severe as case of Yaqoob a.s. 

If it was easy to make people understand what is "Ishq" and "sincerity"  Hussain a.s would not have been martyred. 

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