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In the Name of God بسم الله

Sadiq Shirazi and Tatbir on Kids ?

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Bismillahir Rahmanir Raheem

Sallallahu Ala Muhammadin wa Ale Muhammad Attayibeen Attahireen

Salam dear brothers and sisters

Recently i have been gravitating around Bashir Najafi , Vahid Khorasani and Sadiq Shirazi . I  respect all mar3ja but i love those 3 in particular because they are very knowledgeable .

my question is knowing Sadiq Shirazi allows Tatbit and even encourages it , does he allow it on kids though ? 

Please no tatbir debate or mar3ja debate for the Love of God.. 

Wasalam

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24 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

Recently i have been gravitating around Bashir Najafi , Vahid Khorasani and Sadiq Shirazi . I  respect all mar3ja but i love those 3 in particular because they are very knowledgeable .

my question is knowing Sadiq Shirazi allows Tatbit and even encourages it , does he allow it on kids though ? 

Would it be fair to say that you are gravitating towards the Marje you have mentioned due to their stance on blood letting rather then any independent assessment of their knowledge.

Not meant as a criticism just an observational question.

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1 minute ago, A true Sunni said:

Would it be fair to say that you are gravitating towards the Marje you have mentioned due to their stance on blood letting rather then any independent assessment of their knowledge.

Not meant as a criticism just an observational question.

i read a lot of your posts and i know youre a staunch anti tatbir lol.

i am actually a convert and i never viewed tatbir in a good light and i never done it  but i dont mind some people doing it 

i actually love these 3 mar3ja especially khorasani and shirazi because they do not live in pro-unity fairyland .

now can you provide an answer to my question ?

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24 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

i read a lot of your posts and i know youre a staunch anti tatbir lol.

i am actually a convert and i never viewed tatbir in a good light and i never done it  but i dont mind some people doing it 

i actually love these 3 mar3ja especially khorasani and shirazi because they do not live in pro-unity fairyland .

now can you provide an answer to my question ?

LOL yes I am very anti-Tatbir. I seem to recall though they dont specifically ban tatbir on kids they dont encourage it.

I hear what you are saying about pro-unity however I think its the definition of unity that is often abused.

For instance the Shirazi lobby is very pro cursing and insulting people revered by the Sunnis.

This is divisive and destructive.

Stopping abuse and cursing is not pro-unity its just common sense.

 

Edited by A true Sunni
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5 hours ago, A true Sunni said:

LOL yes I am very anti-Tatbir. I seem to recall though they dont specifically ban tatbir on kids they dont encourage it.

I hear what you are saying about pro-unity however I think its the definition of unity that is often abused.

For instance the Shirazi lobby is very pro cursing and insulting people revered by the Sunnis.

This is divisive and destructive.

Stopping abuse and cursing is not pro-unity its just common sense.

hum well i mean unity should come from both sides when they kill us all day we cant really unite but thats beside the point lol

Imam Ali(AS) wrote sanam e quraish du3 was that shirazi lobby lol ?

and i mean lets say i dont mind these because some have to apply taqqiya

but to ban azadari for Fatima(SA) and say Radiallahu anha to Aisha ?

Thats too far 

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5 hours ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

hum well i mean unity should come from both sides when they kill us all day we cant really unite but thats beside the point lol

Imam Ali(AS) wrote sanam e quraish du3 was that shirazi lobby lol ?

and i mean lets say i dont mind these because some have to apply taqqiya

but to ban azadari for Fatima(SA) and say Radiallahu anha to Aisha ?

Thats too far 

Who is advocating saying RA to her. I am saying don't accuse her of adultery and murder which is what the Shirazi lobby are doing  

Earlier discussion on the Duas authenticity or not 

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5 hours ago, A true Sunni said:

Who is advocating saying RA to her. I am saying don't accuse her of adultery and murder which is what the Shirazi lobby are doing  

Earlier discussion on the Duas authenticity or not 

lol nasrallah said like at least 20 times in his speeches and call her the mother of believers

and why hide the truth ? what are you so afraid of ? that the sunnis  will hate more than they hate you now ?

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5 hours ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

lol nasrallah said like at least 20 times in his speeches and call her the mother of believers

and why hide the truth ? what are you so afraid of ? that the sunnis  will hate more than they hate you now ?

RA does not mean mother of believers.

Calling her a murderer and adultress is different to missing out RA

So you believe she is an adultress and murderess and believe the Shirazis so I dont expect you to say RA or mother of believers

I dont believe she is an adultress or murderess and choose not to say RA

It is Sayed Hassan Nasrullah's opinion to say mother of believers

Since I am pro Shia unity I will go and unite with the majority on this and this includes Khamenei, Sistani and probably Najafi.

Shia strength is through internal unity not factionalisation and forming splinter groups

If you wish to join a splinter group that is is your perogative but you damage Shia Unity.

As evidence of the power of Shia unity look at Syria and Iraq. It was slow coming but the fightback is happening under the leadership of Agha Khamenei and Syed Hassan Nasrullah.

If you had heard the speech of Hassan Nasrullah after his son was martyred you would not be saying 'afraid' in the same sentence as him. You asked me what am I afraid of? but your question is directed at him.

Be careful of the careless words you use. Syed Hassan Nasrullah has probably sacrificed far more then you and definitely more then me       

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43 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

lol nasrallah said like at least 20 times in his speeches and call her the mother of believers

and why hide the truth ? what are you so afraid of ? that the sunnis  will hate more than they hate you now ?

Aisha is the mother of believers, in the sense that we can't marry her because she's to us like our mother. The term 'mother of believers' has nothing to do with someone being pious or higher status.

Brother I know your a new convert, and that's why I really don't want to lead you away from Shiism by pushing and arguing with you about whose right or wrong, whose bad or good and etc. All I'm going to say is please be wise on your decisions and follow what is more logical.

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5 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

RA does not mean mother of believers.

Calling her a murderer and adultress is different to missing out RA

So you believe she is an adultress and murderess and believe the Shirazis so I dont expect you to say RA or mother of believers

I dont believe she is an adultress or murderess and choose not to say RA

It is Sayed Hassan Nasrullah's opinion to say mother of believers

Since I am pro Shia unity I will go and unite with the majority on this and this includes Khameni, Sistani and probably Najafi.

Shia strength is through internal unity not factionalisation and forming splinter groups

If you wish to join a splinter group that is is your perogative but you damage Shia Unity.

As evidence of the power of Shia unity look at Syria and Iraq. It was slow coming but the fightback is happening under the leadership of Agha Khameni and Syed Hassan Nasrullah.

If you had heard the speech of Hassan Nasrullah after his son was martyred you would not be saying 'afraid' in the same sentence as him. You asked me what am I afraid of? but your question is directed at him.

Be careful of the careless words you use. Syed Hassan Nasrullah has probably sacrificed far more then you and definitely more then me       

cry me a river i dont even care about your post that was not even the goal of this post. i do not care about what shirazis say i am just amazed at how clueless some shi3as are while sunnis hate us but hey its ok next step we are going to praise umar and abu baker

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4 minutes ago, Hassan Y said:

Aisha is the mother of believers, in the sense that we can't marry her because she's to us like our mother. The term 'mother of believers' has nothing to do with someone being pious or higher status.

Brother I know your a new convert, and that's why I really don't want to lead you away from Shiism by pushing and arguing with you about whose right or wrong, whose bad or good and etc. All I'm going to say is please be wise on your decisions and follow what is more logical.

lol dont think that because i am a convert im somewhat stupid or clueless about religion. just because you follow someone ex :khamenei or nasrullah dosent mean they are right all the time. do you also want me to kiss the grave of umar also ? there is a difference between unity and interest. Hezbollah and iran are acting out of interest not because they love the sunnis so much. 

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8 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

lol dont think that because i am a convert im somewhat stupid or clueless about religion. just because you follow someone ex :khamenei or nasrullah dosent mean they are right all the time. do you also want me to kiss the grave of umar also ? there is a difference between unity and interest. Hezbollah and iran are acting out of interest not because they love the sunnis so much. 

You are a convert who seems predisposed to put words in peoples mouths.

It seems you have internal issues that need to be resolved.

In your final line you said it all. Hezbullah and Iran are saying and carrying out actions in their own interest.

By criticising and vilifying them by accusations of being afraid you are acting against their interest

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16 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

cry me a river i dont even care about your post that was not even the goal of this post. i do not care about what shirazis say i am just amazed at how clueless some shi3as are while sunnis hate us but hey its ok next step we are going to praise umar and abu baker

As I said you love to put words in other peoples mouths. Seems like you are the clueless one

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Just now, A true Sunni said:

As I said you love to put words in other peoples mouths. Seems like you are the clueless one

youre the one who seem to have internal issues ..talking about putting things in peoples mouth HAHAHA

i havent actually criticized or villyfied anyone lol youre overreacting my post was not even originally about that but ok che guevara however you like it 

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You have implied and misrepresented a lot of what I have said on here.

As to Iran and Hezbullah at one point you imply they are afraid and next moment that they are acting in their own self interest.

Confused thinking on your part, so which is it fear or self interest.

As I said you go join the Shirazi lobby I will join the majority of Shias and remain united with them.

Seems that you are against shia unity as well

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17 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

You have implied and misrepresented a lot of what I have said on here.

As to Iran and Hezbullah at one point you imply they are afraid and next moment that they are acting in their own self interest.

Confused thinking on your part, so which is it fear or self interest.

As I said you go join the Shirazi lobby I will join the majority of Shias and remain united with them.

Seems that you are against shia unity as well

 

ill answer but stop being a beta male please

i said to YOU what are you afraid of ? i was not even talking about hezbollah until you brought it in a topic that has nothing to do with it

you seem to just need attention 

Edited by Ali Emanoil Mustafa
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34 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

ill answer but stop being a beta male please

i said to YOU what are you afraid of ? i was not even talking about hezbollah until you brought it in a topic that has nothing to do with it

you seem to just need attention 

it is you that need to think and read before you write. As I said I am following the dictats of the major ulema followed  by the majority of Shia. As I said I am pro-Shia unity.

It is you who went on to suggest that my position was generated by fear. Since I am only 'following orders' I can only assume you are accusing my 'commanders' of being afraid.

It is you who introduced Sayed Hassan Nasrullah who is the leader of Hezbullah into the discussion not me

and went on to bracket his name with being afraid 

Edited by A true Sunni
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2 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

it is you that need to think and read before you write. As I said I am following the dictats of the major ulema followed  by the majority of Shia. As I said I am pro-Shia unity.

It is you who went on to suggest that my position was generated by fear. Since I am only 'following orders' I can only assume you are accusing my 'commanders' of being afraid.

It is you who introduced Sayed Hassan Nasrullah who is the leader of Hezbullah into the discussion not me

and went on to bracket his name with being afraid 

HAHAHAHA 

Beta male at its finest

go cry somewhere else

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6 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

HAHAHAHA 

Beta male at its finest

go cry somewhere else

I see you have not grasped the finer points of logical thinking.(MANTAQ) Your grasp of things could be called 'sloganeering' without understanding.

This is not a commentary on you being a convert since the skill I am talking about is one that transcends religions. So you are excused

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Just now, A true Sunni said:

I see you have not grasped the finer points of logical thinking.(MANTAQ) Your grasp of things could be called 'sloganeering' without understanding.

This is not a commentary on you being a convert since the skill I am talking about is one that transcends religions. So you are excused

youre still a beta male and a punk 

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19 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

ok i did a mistake but for the love of God bro/sis this guy just diverted the original topic in a useless debate lol 

Shaykh wahid is pro unity if that's your criteria for who is less knowledgeable he just is not open about I will try and see if I can find the book were he says it but I did read it though for sure. So is sayed saeed al Hakeem. 

also your criteria for following a marja should be knowledge in fiqh and usool not who is more pro unity and who is less. You get that idea by asking ahlul khibra and by asking knowledgeable shaykhs who have studied Kharij and at the same time you also get that by reading their works on fiqh and their biographies using anything their to indicate he is more knowledgeable than others like for example which teachers he studied under how quickly he reached ijtihad etc... 

lastly you should also make sure a marja is adil not just knowledgeable that is also important. Checking the scholars to make sure the are reightious keeps us from being like bani Israel who followed their scholars blindly without checking them then killing the prophets(as) with the guidance of those scholars. To not be like that we have to check the scholars of today's age by looking at their followers how do they carry themselves asking other just people who can say for certain he isn't adil and seeing what the scholar himself does and says and the way he talks.

Edited by Al Hadi
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3 minutes ago, Al Hadi said:

Shaykh wahid is pro unity if that's your criteria for who is less knowledgeable he just is not open about I will try and see if I can find the book were he says it but I did read it though for sure.

oh is he ? i guess publicly saying that the graves of abu bakr wa umar should be digged is very much pro unity isn't it ? 

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4 hours ago, A true Sunni said:

Would it be fair to say that you are gravitating towards the Marje you have mentioned due to their stance on blood letting rather then any independent assessment of their knowledge.

Not meant as a criticism just an observational question.

This is a question for knowledge. Why do you think it's out of the sphere of knowledge? 

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13 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

oh is he ? i guess publicly saying that the graves of abu bakr wa umar should be digged is very much pro unity isn't it ? 

Had no clue he said that honestly but he is for uniting with Sunnis let me see if I can find his statement. As in he isn't as anti unity as shirazi is. 

Edited by Al Hadi
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8 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

indeed lol this guy just try to create conflicts for nothing

Just out of curiosity though tell me where he said we should dig the graves in which lecture exactly?

https://www.al-islam.org/mutual-respect-peaceful-co-existence-among-muslim/2-abusing-insulting-leaders-sunni-madhhab

 

the above link contains statements of many of our great maraji on unity. 

Also I'm not sure if sayed hassan said ra after Aisha's name I heard um al Mumineen but not ra.

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6 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

indeed lol this guy just try to create conflicts for nothing

But I think that Ayotullahs do not encourage it for children that do not possess discretion for children may cry seeing little blood. This is common rule a person actions having no capacity no value until it is conducted by its guardian who is sane and baligh and differentiate between right and wrong.

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1 minute ago, Sindbad05 said:

But I think that Ayotullahs do not encourage it for children that do not possess discretion for children may cry seeing little blood. This is common rule a person actions having no capacity no value until it is conducted by its guardian who is sane and baligh and differentiate between right and wrong.

Elhamdulilah !Mashallah ! Finally got my answer thats all i needed lol

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17 minutes ago, Ali Emanoil Mustafa said:

oh is he ? i guess publicly saying that the graves of abu bakr wa umar should be digged is very much pro unity isn't it ? 

He said that on behalf of Syeda Zahra a.s. sunnis say Prophets do not have heirs so Ayotullah asked why are Abu Baker and Umar in Prophet's house where Ummi Ayesha lived? 

He asked to dig the graves and shift them elsewhere since Prophet do not have inherents.

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