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Tatbir scene in Bollywood film

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16 minutes ago, starlight said:

Why is tatbir the only thing that is a problem

A friend of mine start hating zanjir zani when he was accidently hit by a knife attached with the zanjir of an azadar who was busy in doing zanjir zani.

:) Some times people have a genuine reason to hate something.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

I am against any act that discredits the Shia religion and has no basis in the acts and writing of the Holy Prophet (pbuhahp) or the Imams (as).

& chest beating is one of them!

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10 minutes ago, Engineer73 said:

A friend of mine start hating zanjir zani when he was accidently hit by a knife attached with the zanjir of an azadar who was busy in doing zanjir zani.

:) Some times people have a genuine reason to hate something.

 

 

Hope he got himself tested for hepatitis and other blood borne diseases. 

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11 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

Hope he got himself tested for hepatitis and other blood borne diseases. 

:) He never did that.... He knows the azadar never get infected even if they were putting khak-e-shifa on their wounds.

10 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

In your opinion of one 

Does chest beating has any presence in the acts and writing of the Holy Prophet (pbuhahp) or the Imams (as)? 

Edited by Engineer73

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14 minutes ago, Engineer73 said:

:) He never did that.... He knows the azadar never get infected even if they were putting khak-e-shifa on their wounds.

Does chest beating has any presence in the acts and writing of the Holy Prophet (pbuhahp) or the Imams (as)? 

Good luck with his hepatitis its rife.

Don't selectively quote me it doesnt do you credit. I specifically said 

1) Discredits Shia Islam

2) in the acts and writing of the Holy Prophet (pbuhahp) or the Imams (as).

You then went on to claim chest beating 'discredited' Shia Islam which I said 'only in your opinion'

You cannot then go onto point 2 since you haven't contested point 1.

Simple rules of debate since mine was a 1&2 not a 1or2

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6 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

1) Discredits Shia Islam

2) in the acts and writing of the Holy Prophet (pbuhahp) or the Imams (as).

What do you mean by "discredits" Shia Islam? Can anyone discredits a religion perfected by Allah s.w.t?

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29 minutes ago, Engineer73 said:

What do you mean by "discredits" Shia Islam? Can anyone discredits a religion perfected by Allah s.w.t?

So glad you now understand. Think through your own statement and the truth becomes self evident

To be fair you could have looked up the definition yourself. But I am doing it anyway 

discredit
dɪsˈkrɛdɪt/
verb
 
  1. 1.
    harm the good reputation of.
    "his remarks were taken out of context in an effort to discredit him"
    synonyms:

    disgrace, dishonour, bring into disrepute, damage someone's reputation, blacken someone's name, destroy someone's credibility, drag through the mud/mire, put/show in a bad light, reflect badly on, compromise, give someone a bad name, bring into disfavour; 

     

Edited by A true Sunni

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Last night was too tired So slept but while sleeping one really good incident strikes my mind I hope it help all of us to justify matam Dari 

 In the era of Saddam's power and rule in Iran and Iraq shia their faced really good problems and weren't allowed to do azadari and ziarat properly

But in that era as well ppl witnessed a group if ppl every ashura use to come from somewhere doing matam so loudly with Nara's no body could judge where did they come from on the roads their no official s could stop them them in any manner the group use to go in harams and shrines their was all voice of their matam in air  aloud 

After which nobody knew where did they go where did they disappear

Can someone put some light to this

What would we  can conclude from this

Does this miracle justify anything

I really don't know its open for interpretations like our all acts are

Let's see our shias interpret angels azadari his well ... 

A second incident about yamen wars 

 2 years back I.e last to last moharram when on ashura and 10 days they were not allowed to gather and cry and do matam

Every day and every year in all that situations they use to gather at one place before majlis and matam they use to lighten a candle in the name of imam e zamana ajtf and pray for security

And use to do majlis matam loudly 

U know what the officials standing downstairs could not even hear any noise or voice of anybody crying  or doing matam 

My cousins tale me all this after they got evacuated from Yemen a yar back 

Truly justifies imam e zamans ajtf Hadees

He ajtf says indeed he us the cause if security for us just like how the sky is a course of security for stars 

Well this justifies matam and every form of azadari to me I hope this helps our shia brothers and sisters too  

Hum apana kaam karey azadari nibhana or failana or azadari bachana or badhana unka ajtf  kaam hai Jo gaibat me hai

Edited by Pearl3112

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8 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

So glad you now understand. Think through your own statement and the truth becomes self evident

:) So sad that you missed my point.

What is matam? & how it discredit Islam?

I don't know anything like "Shia Islam", I only know Islam.

"Surely the only religion with Allah is Islam" (3:19)

 

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People do matam (tatbir, zanjeer zani, chest and face beating etc) in order to pay tribute to Sayed ul Shuhda Imam Hussain a.s. Their purpose may be good but their methodology is absolutely wrong. Its totally contrary to the teachings of Quran and Sunnah. In fact all such practices are adopted from Christians and Hindus. The best way to give tribute to Imam is to adopt his way of life. Which is a mirror image of the way of Prophet s.a.w.w.

In short. This is Life of Jahiliyyah.

Edited by Fahad Sani

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1 hour ago, Engineer73 said:

:) So sad that you missed my point.

What is matam? & how it discredit Islam?

I don't know anything like "Shia Islam", I only knoThatm.

"Surely the only religion with Allah is Islam" (3:19)

 

Exactly we shias follow Islam true Islam not shia Islam 

1 hour ago, Fahad Sani said:

People do matam (tatbir, zanjeer zani, chest and face beating etc) in order to pay tribute to Sayed ul Shuhda Imam Hussain a.s. Their purpose may be good but their methodology is absolutely wrong. Its totally contrary to the teachings of Quran and Sunnah. In fact all such practices are adopted from Christians and Hindus. The best way to give tribute to Imam is to adopt his way of life. Which is a mirror image of the way of Prophet s.a.w.w.

Yeah  The best way To tribute ahlulbait as is to work on their path and teachings and spend life in correct way

But brother as I said before we just assume thing

How can u assume That a person who performs such forms of azadari doesn't lives his or her life on the path of imams as and prophets as 

Why do u Think he might only pay tribute by azadari and nothing else ?

Its sad to see such Assumptions  

Shias who Believe in imamat in gaibat still Feel  that  A person would get affected of hepatitis and infection by the zanjeer of Azadar while doing azadari sad

And other assuming such Things

Brother    Honestly speaking I watch people around me (shias ) who perform azadari in all forms and rest other 11 months spend life to spread ri8 path Islam prophet Pbuh teachings imams as life and pay tribute to imam as by following ahlulbait as and work to early appearance of imam  Ajtf and make their life worthy       

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1 hour ago, Fahad Sani said:

People do matam (tatbir, zanjeer zani, chest and face beating etc) in order to pay tribute to Sayed ul Shuhda Imam Hussain a.s.

Matam for paying Tribute to Imam Hussain???????? Who told you this??

Matam in any form, is a way of expressing grief. The expressions vary from person to person, this is a pure emotion, not any sort of tribute.

For paying tribute, we offer two rakah namaz, ziarat-e-Imam e Hussain, recite ziarat, recite durood, recite Quran & hadiya it to Imam. Matam is our expression of grief that the grandson of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh), the prince of the youth of Jannah was killed by the so called Muslims. What a great tragedy that was, and the more painful is that majority of these so called Muslims respect people like Muawiya, who fought wars with Imam Ali (a.s).

We beat ourselves in pain, in grief, that the daughter of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was denied for her right.
 

Edited by Engineer73

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1 hour ago, Fahad Sani said:

The best way to give tribute to Imam is to adopt his way of life.

Do you and rest of the ummah unable to see his way of life?

Mix haqq with batil? Respect hypocrite like Muawiya? Just like Moudodi did in the end of his book khilafat or Malookiat. 
 

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2 hours ago, Engineer73 said:

:) So sad that you missed my point.

What is matam? & how it discredit Islam?

I don't know anything like "Shia Islam", I only know Islam.

"Surely the only religion with Allah is Islam" (3:19)

 

 Am confused what are you doing on here. P3rhaps you should go to the trouble of doing research before posing as a person who has some knowledge. I appreciate that English is not everyone's first language so if there as any word you struggling with the definition of you can google it as I did for you already.

it short cts fruitless discussions.

i hope this helps

if you want to know about being Shia, I can always provide you with some links

Edited by A true Sunni

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1 hour ago, A true Sunni said:

Am confused

Yes you are.

57 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

I understood you just as you understood me.

Confused ATS :D.

Enjoy yourself brother. I will continue to disagree with you until you brought any valid logical argument against any form of matam.

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1 minute ago, Engineer73 said:

Yes you are.

Confused ATS :D.

Enjoy yourself brother. I will continue to disagree with you until you brought any valid logical argument against any form of matam.

Oh you are disagreeing with me. You should have said from the outset. I thought maybe you were struggling with the English and terminology. See what happens when you aren't clear

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6 minutes ago, A true Sunni said:

Oh you are disagreeing with me. You should have said from the outset. I thought maybe you were struggling with the English and terminology. See what happens when you aren't clear

What i am watching is that you're unable to say a word in defence of your statement. The question is there, try to bring some logical & valid argument instead of your confusion.

 

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4 minutes ago, Engineer73 said:

What i am watching is that you're unable to say a word in defence of your statement. The question is there, try to bring some logical & valid argument instead of your confusion.

 

Why would I need to defend my position to you. If you want to see my justification for my comments use the search function and look up tatbir and zanjeer.

you will have to forgive me but I didn't see anything in your post that merited a longer reply.

i just saw you as a nit picker and someone looking for a debate rather then someone looking to learn.

would you say that was an unfair assessment of you

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