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Haji 2003

Donald J. Trump [OFFICIAL THREAD]

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What was the purpose of this whole thing (the war on Iraq)? Hundreds and hundreds of young people killed. And what about the people coming back with no arms and legs? Not to mention the other side. All those Iraqi kids who’ve been blown to pieces. And it turns out that all of the reasons for the war were blatantly wrong. All this for nothing.  (Emphasis, JW)

— Donald Trump on Iraq War, August, 2004, reiterated verbatim, August, 2016.

Obviously I have thought about that a lot in the months since (her October 2002 vote in favor of the Iraq war resolution). No, I don’t regret giving the President authority.

— Hillary Clinton on Iraq War, April, 2004.

 

http://dissidentvoice.org/2016/10/donald-trumps-unique-human-decency-on-iraq/

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On 10/18/2016 at 9:53 AM, Haji 2003 said:

800.jpg?w=1920&q=55&auto=format&usm=12&f

From a news website, this highway billboard near Dearborn, Michigan, says ‘Donald Trump can’t read this, but he is scared of it.’

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On ‎10‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 9:57 AM, starlight said:

 

Now, if these were "A-dorable Hillar Glasses" we will see millions of illegal aliens crossing the border in holy pilgrimage, money rains from the sky, and Wall Street plated in gold.

 

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On 10/11/2016 at 11:36 AM, Marbles said:

^ Right now Iran is far less important than his comments about seducing married women.

After the vulgar video of Donald Trump's lewd comments about women in 2005 (talking to Billy Bush then the host of "Access Hollywood"), Trump has lost some voters. NPR has a graph where I notice the state of Georgia is no longer Trump territory but has fallen into the "toss up" grouping. 

Oct 18 electoral votes.jpg

http://www.npr.org/2016/10/18/498406765/npr-battleground-map-hillary-clinton-is-winning-and-its-not-close

 

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This election has great potential to awaken the American populace from its slumber.

 

So far I haven't seen it happen. 

 

Something has to happen. I don't see how anyone could witness this garbage and not be ashamed of the way their country is headed. Morally, politically, culturally, and economically everything has become a complete joke. 

 

Not too long ago people in the States took to the streets to oppose all this nonsense, whatever happened to that?

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19 minutes ago, baradar_jackson said:

Not too long ago people in the States took to the streets to oppose all this nonsense, whao that?

The Roman Empire used to keep peace within the city of Rome by providing wine, bread, and entertainment to the masses so they wouldn't rise up against the few wealthy families in charge. Those who do not learn from history often are doomed to repeat it.  

"Reality" TV and memes for news happened.  Dumbing down happened.  

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3 hours ago, baradar_jackson said:

This election has great potential to awaken the American populace from its slumber.

 

So far I haven't seen it happen. 

 

Something has to happen. I don't see how anyone could witness this garbage and not be ashamed of the way their country is headed. Morally, politically, culturally, and economically everything has become a complete joke. 

 

Not too long ago people in the States took to the streets to oppose all this nonsense, whatever happened to that?

Here is a scary addition. "Scary" as it indicates that the unyielding, self-righteousness attitudes that lead to civil conflict is beginning to emerge.

http://www.theverge.com/2016/10/19/13334608/mark-zuckerberg-peter-thiel-donald-trump 

Silly-con Valley hysteria; breaking business arrangements; uhhhhhh and more...

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37 minutes ago, magma said:

Any predictions for final debate tonight?

Yeah. More lies. More stupidity. 

A vote for either of these two morons is a vote for corruption and oligarchy. 

Edited by notme

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3 hours ago, magma said:

Any predictions for final debate tonight?

I like how this post is worded.

Magma is using that ESPN First Take style of discussion-framing. This is the level of depth that the presidential debate is worthy of.

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The final Presidential debate is less than an hour away. Since I watched the other two, I guess I will watch this one. 

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8 hours ago, magma said:

I couldn't stand Hillary's voice. It makes me cringe. I stopped watching it early.

We are still obligated -in the secular morality sense- to endure before voting.

I do not that whiny pitch of hers, either.

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Vote for Gary Johnson. His tax plan is backwards and unfair, his knowledge of foreign issues is nonexistent, and his views on environmental protection are shockingly cynical - but he's still better than either major party clown and as far as I can tell he's the only other candidate who has even close to a chance. 

The Democratic and Republican parties are broken and can't be fixed. They should be disposed of.

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5 hours ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

I haven't but better her than that orange haired buffoon, still I am voting but for neither of them. 

This is a commonly held view, and I'm not sure where it comes from that Hillary is somehow "better"

One is unpredictable and puts theatrics above substance, with more flexibility and wiggle room for us, while the other is stone cold in substance, calculating, airtight, and consistent, and makes one genuinely scared for poor children in the ME. 

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4 hours ago, notme said:

Vote for Gary Johnson. His tax plan is backwards and unfair, his knowledge of foreign issues is nonexistent, and his views on environmental protection are shockingly cynical - but he's still better than either major party clown and as far as I can tell he's the only other candidate who has even close to a chance. 

Why would I vote for someone who sounds like he hasn't passed a geography test in his life  and doesn't know what or where Aleppo is?

His foreign policy is simply abysmal, plainly put. 

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Just now, Gaius I. Caesar said:

Why would I vote for someone who sounds like he hasn't passed a geography test in his life  and doesn't know what or where Aleppo is?

His foreign policy is simply abysmal, plainly put. 

You can't bomb a place you don't know about.

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8 minutes ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

You can't make decisions, do international diplomacy or pull out of a place you don't know about. Thanks but no thanks is what I say to Gary Johnson. 

Yeah I know. The media has reduced us to this. Nobody who should be a national leader is willing. Nobody who is willing is qualified, nobody who is willing can be trusted. 

Maybe the presidency should be like jury duty. When your number comes up, your background is checked for eligibility and you have no option to say no and no option to volunteer. After selecting a reasonable pool of candidates without questionable history, then we could put it to vote. No pay or minimal pay while in office, no pay after the term is up, they simply go back to being normal people.

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28 minutes ago, notme said:

Yeah I know. The media has reduced us to this. Nobody who should be a national leader is willing. Nobody who is willing is qualified, nobody who is willing can be trusted. 

Maybe the presidency should be like jury duty. When your number comes up, your background is checked for eligibility and you have no option to say no and no option to volunteer. After selecting a reasonable pool of candidates without questionable history, then we could put it to vote. No pay or minimal pay while in office, no pay after the term is up, they simply go back to being normal people.

I wish we could totally redo the system and implement a Parliamentary systems with at least 6 major parties. 

Except the Presidency has never been, never is and never will be jury duty. There's so much at stake that requires a President's decision;  It's not judging the life of one person, the lives of many, domestic and international. But, if it were to become a reality, where do we pick from? Senate or Congress? We can't have  Joe Schmoes for president anymore. Just look at Trump, he's the reason why. 

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Maybe the eligible selections can be drafted into a training program. The problem with choosing from the existing senate and house is that it would perpetuate the oligarchy of wealth. I know university professors and local government leaders who would make much better national leaders than most of the ones I've seen in my lifetime, even without any political experience. 

I don't know. I'm just thinking out loud. If we (the nation) don't make a change, a change will be made for us. It's imminent, I can feel it. It's not going to be pretty either, but I feel powerless to do anything to make anything better. 

 

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4 minutes ago, notme said:

If we (the nation) don't make a change, a change will be made for us. It's imminent, I can feel it. It's not going to be pretty either, but I feel powerless to do anything to make anything better. 

 

I agree with you on that a hundred percent. I would like to personally leave, there are better places out there to live anyway. I am tired of listening and being told that America is great because it's good or we're going to America great again.

No, America is great because it's powerful and has opportunities for people who wish to come. In that aspect, America is great and never lost it's greatness.

America being great because the people are good? I disagree, as you'll see since the Revolution, the greatness of America came at the cost of the freedom and suffering of others. 

The million dollar question for me is: What in the world are Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump talking about when they say that? 

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In reality, a president is just a pawn and public punching bag for those more powerful, including corporate CEOs, investement bankers, and other powerful state/non state lobbying actors (none of whom are "elected" into their positions of influence). They are the real decision makers of society, and the government merely rubber stamps these decisions. Look at the root, not the branches. 

Edited by magma

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If you have ever seen the president's Press Secretary giving a press conference, he/she has a huge binder with printed pages, on every conceivable topic, and he/she often refers to a page in order to reply verbatim to a question that a member of the press might ask. The White House is scripted on all matters.

No matter who is chosen as president, the bureaucracy is still the same, and the protocol will continue. Each Cabinet department reports to the White House on a weekly basis (if not sooner) regarding issues the government is confronting or that they will be dealing with in the upcoming week. The reports (reams of paper) are condensed down and given to the President with bullet points.

So the president is a figurehead for the government and it matters not whether he is Republican, Democrat, Independent or anything else. The president, whoever he is, only goes where he is told to go, only does what he is told to do, and only says what he is told to say. However, if the president deviates from this plan, and says something impromptu, there is an uproar in the media.

The members of the Electoral College are probably asking themselves which of the four candidates would abide by the script and remain professional at all times. 

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9 hours ago, notme said:

Vote for Gary Johnson. His tax plan is backwards and unfair, his knowledge of foreign issues is nonexistent, and his views on environmental protection are shockingly cynical - but he's still better than either major party clown and as far as I can tell he's the only other candidate who has even close to a chance. 

The Democratic and Republican parties are broken and can't be fixed. They should be disposed of.

Or really go extreme and vote for Jill Stein.

For a list of alternatives, see SC thread "Know your ABCs"

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4 hours ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

Why would I vote for someone who sounds like he hasn't passed a geography test in his life  and doesn't know what or where Aleppo is?

His [Johnson-ed] foreign policy is simply abysmal, plainly put. 

And Obama's is not also?

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4 hours ago, notme said:

Yeah I know. The media has reduced us to this. Nobody who should be a national leader is willing. Nobody who is willing is qualified, nobody who is willing can be trusted. 

Maybe ...

"The Media": I came to post this comment from the NPR radio show today:

That 'we' have Donald Trump because of the media wanting a pump-up in ratings (for the cash sales in advertising)

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