[TRASH PIT]Flat Earth

[peace seeker II]

So nobody yet adressing the evidence in the video? Hmmm 

[DigitalUmmah]

1 hour ago, peace seeker II said:

So nobody yet adressing the evidence in the video? Hmmm 

you genuinely believe that the world is flat?

[Ibn Al-Shahid]

6 hours ago, peace seeker II said:

So nobody yet adressing the evidence in the video? Hmmm 

there are no inorganic shapes in nature. Square/Rectangle are inorganic.

[Gaius I. Caesar]

13 hours ago, peace seeker II said:

So nobody yet adressing the evidence in the video? Hmmm 

Sorry, brother. It's just too implausible given how Flat Earth doesn't really fit with the laws of nature or gravity. If were true, it would be too big of a secret to hide, we would have known a long time ago.  Like Ibn Al-Shahid said, squares/cubes/rectangles are inorganic and unnatural. They defy the laws of nature and they wouldn't have good gravity. Allah created the laws of nature and gravity to benefit His creation and for us to understand the creation while glorifying Him.

[DigitalUmmah]

On 5/1/2016 at 4:34 AM, Gaius I. Caesar said:

Sorry, brother. It's just too implausible given how Flat Earth doesn't really fit with the laws of nature or gravity. If were true, it would be too big of a secret to hide, we would have known a long time ago.  Like Ibn Al-Shahid said, squares/cubes/rectangles are inorganic and unnatural. They defy the laws of nature and they wouldn't have good gravity. Allah created the laws of nature and gravity to benefit His creation and for us to understand the creation while glorifying Him.

Also @peace seeker II how do you explain people in the international space station? where has the gravity gone if they are faking it?

also, what is under the flat earth? what are its pillars resting on?

also, are you for real or is this some elaborate hoax?

[Gaius I. Caesar]

1 minute ago, DigitalUmmah said:

Also @peace seeker II how do you explain people in the international space station? where has the gravity gone if they are faking it?

also, what is under the flat earth? what are its pillars resting on?

also, are you for real or is this some elaborate hoax?

He is for real, it's just that he chose to believe some smooth talker on Youtube and get convinced that the earth is flat and encased in a dome.

[DigitalUmmah]

1 minute ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

He is for real, it's just that he chose to believe some smooth talker on Youtube and get convinced that the earth is flat and encased in a dome.

how on earth can anyone believe that rubbish in the 21st century??? does gravity just not exist in their mind?

[Gaius I. Caesar]

1 minute ago, DigitalUmmah said:

how on earth can anyone believe that rubbish in the 21st century??? does gravity just not exist in their mind?

I don't know but if you watch the videos he posted, you'll get an idea how he was convinced.

[DigitalUmmah]

OP what are your thoughts on this gif

 

[alisayyed]

I have seen both the videos.

The second about iss seems convincing. I will research on my own- basically look at the iss videos, to see how they hold up.

I still dont think that the earth is flat.

Edited January 9, 2016 by alisayyed

[Skanderbeg]

46 minutes ago, DigitalUmmah said:

OP what are your thoughts on this gif

 

If a child can understand, Skanderbeg can too.

Edited January 9, 2016 by Skanderbeg

[Haydar Husayn]

How can you start believing in a flat earth based on a 2 hour Youtube video? No matter how 'convincing' the claims might sound to you, you've only heard one side of the story. At the very least, you should have followed it up with several months of investigation.

By the way, the belief in a round earth dates from way before the 1600s. The Ancient Greeks already knew this. Ever heard of Eratosthenes?

[DigitalUmmah]

1 hour ago, Skanderbeg said:

If a child can understand, Skanderbeg can too.

it is impossible for a large body like the sun to be sucked into an orbit by a smaller, less dense body like the earth. if the earth was the centre of the solar system (even saying that makes me cringe as a fully grown man) then amateur astronomers across the earth from the beginning of mankinds history would have immediately noticed the wacky orbits of the planets around our earth (as in the gif).

how on earth could every amateur astronomer with a telescope in the last 3000 years not have noticed the movements of the planets in the sky?

OP i expect an answer

[Gaius I. Caesar]

1 hour ago, DigitalUmmah said:

OP what are your thoughts on this gif

 

So, according to Geocenterism, Venus and Mercury shouldn't exist anymore because their orbits slammed into the Sun. Yet here they are, still orbiting the Sun just as they done for 4.6 billion years.

[DigitalUmmah]

2 minutes ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

So, according to Geocenterism, Venus and Mercury shouldn't exist anymore because their orbits slammed into the Sun. Yet here they are, still orbiting the Sun just as they done for 4.6 billion years.

illuminati.

[Gaius I. Caesar]

1 minute ago, DigitalUmmah said:

illuminati.

Huh? I don't understand, how is the Illuminati relevant heliocenterism or geocenterism, or anything else for that matter

[DigitalUmmah]

1 minute ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

Huh? I don't understand, how is the Illuminati relevant heliocenterism or geocenterism, or anything else for that matter

its a common answer to questions people cant answer....you totally killed my joke man. why would you do that. WHY DOES NO ONE LAUGH AT MY JOKES

[Gaius I. Caesar]

16 minutes ago, DigitalUmmah said:

its a common answer to questions people cant answer....you totally killed my joke man. why would you do that. WHY DOES NO ONE LAUGH AT MY JOKES

Oops, sorry,I didn't know it was a joke.

[notme]

1 hour ago, Haydar Husayn said:

By the way, the belief in a round earth dates from way before the 1600s. The Ancient Greeks already knew this. Ever heard of Eratosthenes?

Everyone knew the earth was round until the church decreed that it was flat in the 3rd century CE.

[Gaius I. Caesar]

@peace seeker II

Check this video out:

What do you think?

[peace seeker II]

for those who wonder how a person can be convinced by a youtube video that is hours long, i got convinced by the right of imam ali and his wilaya by one hadith. that hadith could have been in a 5 minute youtube. proof is proof, and let us look at what is being said, and not who said it, as imam ali told us to do.

 

here interesting interview on vice

https://www.vice.com/read/flat-earth-society-interview-876

 

i'm kind of surprised that nobody except one person watched the videos. yet we are on page 4 

 

and that one person didn't give reasons to why he/she does or does not believe in them .. 

[iraqi_shia]

2 hours ago, peace seeker II said:

for those who wonder how a person can be convinced by a youtube video that is hours long, i got convinced by the right of imam ali and his wilaya by one hadith. that hadith could have been in a 5 minute youtube. proof is proof, and let us look at what is being said, and not who said it, as imam ali told us to do.

 

here interesting interview on vice

https://www.vice.com/read/flat-earth-society-interview-876

 

i'm kind of surprised that nobody except one person watched the videos. yet we are on page 4 

 

and that one person didn't give reasons to why he/she does or does not believe in them .. 

When you look up to the moon, do you think its a flat disc?

 

[Al-Hassan]

Brother @peace seeker II, have a thought ever occurred to you on how Satellite television and GPS navigation systems work? These networking systems are only established via satellites in space that orbit around the earth. Don't you think that while each satellite can transmit and receive electromagnetic pulses back and forth to allow your GPS to work and your television to receive channels, it's fairly less complicated to attach a cheap camera to one of these satellites and have it take a picture of the earth while it orbits around it to show that it is in fact elliptical in shape and not flat?

[DigitalUmmah]

21 hours ago, peace seeker II said:

for those who wonder how a person can be convinced by a youtube video that is hours long, i got convinced by the right of imam ali and his wilaya by one hadith. that hadith could have been in a 5 minute youtube. proof is proof, and let us look at what is being said, and not who said it, as imam ali told us to do.

 

here interesting interview on vice

https://www.vice.com/read/flat-earth-society-interview-876

 

i'm kind of surprised that nobody except one person watched the videos. yet we are on page 4 

 

and that one person didn't give reasons to why he/she does or does not believe in them .. 

hey man I saw the vid, I don't believe in what the video says because gravity exists, light travels in straight lines, and horizons exist. 

lets just use basic common sense - lets say I live in the UK and you live in australia. firstly lets imagine the earth is a sphere (of sorts). picture a person standing on a globe. think about what they can see. the horizon is an equal distance from that person 360 degrees around their field of view. doesnt matter where you stand. 

now imagine the earth is a disc. 

for a person standing near the edge of the disc, the horizon near the edge will be closer than the horizon closer to the centre of the disc. 

has this ever been observed in all of mankinds history, by anyone, ever? dont you think that would be the sort of thing that someone might notice? 

[Mohsin]

*Facepalm*

 

Where's facepalm emoticon when you need it!

[notme]

You know what I find amazing? Google maps traffic data. That info is real time! The only way to do that is with some super precise satellites orbiting the sphere of the Earth. Cool, huh?

[Gaius I. Caesar]

On 1/25/2016 at 2:35 PM, peace seeker II said:

for those who wonder how a person can be convinced by a youtube video that is hours long, i got convinced by the right of imam ali and his wilaya by one hadith. that hadith could have been in a 5 minute youtube. proof is proof, and let us look at what is being said, and not who said it, as imam ali told us to do.

 

here interesting interview on vice

https://www.vice.com/read/flat-earth-society-interview-876

 

i'm kind of surprised that nobody except one person watched the videos. yet we are on page 4 

 

and that one person didn't give reasons to why he/she does or does not believe in them .. 

I noticed the person interviewed said the moon is a "star", where is the proof for that? As far as I am concerned, the moon is not a star because I can look at it without blinding my eyes and I have personally seen moon rocks from the Apollo Mission in 1969.

Did you watch my video? Do you see houses gradually angled in the ground at 90 degrees as you move away from the center, assuming the world is flat? How do you explain gravity, magnetism, tectonic plates and geology? My main reasons for accepting the Flat Earth theory are: 1. The theory seems lacking in aql and flies in the face of our current understanding of nature and science. 2. The guy makes it out to be a conspiracy which to be a big red flag for me. Not everything is a conspiracy. Brother, do you any idea how many shows are like this in the US alone? Quite a few, it's laughable really and while I have no problem with a 500 year old conspiracy, my problem with the theory is the supposedly careful and deliberate attempt to hide the Flat Earth is simply way too big to hide. Somebody would have eventually found out and called out on those responsible for hiding this "fact". Why now? Plus we have satellites now (Japan, China, EU, Iran, US, Australia, Egypt,etc.) Those are my reasons for my reluctance to accept the Flat Earth.

[peace seeker II]

Those talking bout gravity? How does flat earth theory remove gravity?

and the satellite people? How does a satellite prove the earth is round?

 

my video has about 10 - 15 proofs, so if someone tells me they watched it without referring to proofs in them, then i dont believe they watched it! It's like going to a suni and giving him 15 proofs for imam Alis Wilaya, then get totally ignored and have other arguments thrown at you that were discussed on the short thread 4 times already. Anybody else wana say the horizon story?

 

also i suggest ppl google "flat earth horizon" "flat earth satellite" "flat earth gravity" if you are serious about wanting to learn instead of looking like someone who just wants to argue and act childish.

 

what were you doing 12 years ago? I was a science teacher! And even earlier while most of you were in your diapers i was working in nuclear science labs genetically engineering DNA to create mutants, and worked as an engineer as well. So to me you are mostly insulting my intelligence by throwing questions you can answer yourselves while ignoring my proofs. Whether im right or wrong is beside the point! Just have some respect and consider the argument of the person in front of you instead of being prejudice and use your own limited thinking to dismiss other peoples ideas.

 

Gaius:

the size of the conspiracy is no proof or argument. And why should i watch a video of an annoying guy who throws around food while looking like hes on crack cocaine, while you dont bother to watch mine?

 

what about space stations? You guys believe in them too? One heroic member who says he watched it said its a hoax!! Yay!!!! Alhamdulilah

 

ok now lets move on to more proofs!

 

i have proof from quran :

 

it is heavens (plural) and earth (singular)

Allah is the Lord of .. 

Arabic experts might want to check out this 

http://www.maajim.com/dictionary/%D8%A3%D8%B1%D8%B6

or find better sources. 

Nice if you prove me wrong.

 

here a forum deficated for this topic and each subject you can think of is debated there.

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/

many thanks 

wasalaam

 

 

 

[DigitalUmmah]

5 hours ago, peace seeker II said:

 

Those talking bout gravity? How does flat earth theory remove gravity?

and the satellite people? How does a satellite prove the earth is round?

 

oh man. 

I literally have typed and deleted six ful, long replies (this is my seventh). I just don't even know where to begin replying. this level of ignorance has staggered my mind. 

lets start with the basics shall we. 

do you believe light travels in a straight line? do you believe that the earth is smaller than the sun?

if so, why do time zones exist?

why is it day in america but night in asia? if the earth is one flat disc, and the sun spreads light evenly, why doesnt the whole world have day time at the same time, and night time at the same time?

if you think that the sun orbits the earth and only lights the earth a small part at a time, explain to me how light only lights a vertical rectangle as it circles the earth, while the rest of the earth is dark. 

 

 

[iraqi_shia]

The serious lack of scientific knowledge and understand displayed here is really sad. 

 

[Gaius I. Caesar]

6 hours ago, peace seeker II said:

he size of the conspiracy is no proof or argument. And why should i watch a video of an annoying guy who throws around food while looking like hes on crack cocaine, while you dont bother to watch mine?

Akhi, I did watch the video, a whole hour of it and it lacks in aql, plus the guy in your video is an engineer who thinks he is authority on sciences and has the audacity to say "everyone is wrong, the world is flat" because of some technological limitations of the computer displaying flight paths around world. Has it ever occurred to you, that maybe they are set because of secret bases, things meant to be hidden from public view as per agreements brokered in the UN? Technology is limited but it doth not maketh a world as Aegis reflecting light from the heavens above. The guy goes in depth of on a few proofs, which I found ultimately interesting to say the least but once he started jumping around through different proofs, I could not keep up with him and I found troubling that some of his proof contradicted each other. Heck, he never once explained time zones, how do we explain that? How come it is night in Cairo when I get up in the morning in Rhode Island if the Earth is indeed flat? What I mean by the size, it is not scientifically possible to cover up a Flat Earth or politically feasible to do so. You have to ask yourself "Besides controlling the masses and hiding Allah (swt), atasghfirillah, which is impossible do, what benefit do the governments of the world get by concealing this fact?" You do realize that the implications behind the flat Earth if true mean not 500 but a 1000 years worth of science made useless and cast into the proverbial sea.

That is what I want to know, akhi. That is the burning question for me, it is not so much the why as it is the reasoning behind the concealment that is my question.

7 hours ago, peace seeker II said:

what about space stations? You guys believe in them too? One heroic member who says he watched it said its a hoax!! Yay!!!! Alhamdulilah

 

I do not find heroic to call the space stations a hoax it's just people studying in space. Nothing sinister about studying in space is there?

[peace seeker II]

i was hoping that i would bump into people here who could talk on a scientific level like the kids i taught science when they were in 3rd grade and are now getting scholarships and awards from prestigious unis in England for instance. Or perhaps some of the older respectful kids i taught. Or maybe my colleagues at college who could debate scientifically and intelligently!

throwing words like ignorance just shows me your level of intelligence to be frank. i wonder if you'd dare to say that to me if you'd see me in person. i-bet-not!!! that's a cowardly thing to say online and i find that all too often on shiachat. i am writing this for any intelligent individual person who might understand some day. maybe like a message in a bottle.

i don't believe that digital ummah even watched anything as he claims, because if he did, he would actually address anything that is said in that video. instead he throws questions at me while ignoring my proofs. now, why should i let that happen? why should i allow others to ignore my proofs and my videos while i have to answer theirs? who brought their proofs first? i wont even bother to answer any of you until some constructive intelligent rational person comes along. 

 

keep believing all you've been taught guys as much as you like. and gaius! after zuhur knowledge will be incomparable to now. we are living in the dark ages. if the level of science was an alphabet, the level just before imam mahdi will be 2 letters out of 26!  (and you obviously didn't watch the space station video either  )

 

ok enough time on shiachat science section. if i continue talking about science here i would have to treat you all like kids who know nothing about science and make a thread called "Scientific Thinking". I had to take that course, it's amazing!!

 

keep sticking to the ideas and brainwashed preconceptions you've been engrained with  some people question everything and move on towards zuhur in sha Allah.

 

any person who can disprove the proofs in the videos in the OP can go ahead. otherwise it's pointless discussing. 

[notme]

How can you debate science by denying science!

Forget the video. Use your own mind to state what compelling evidence you have. If you must, link the video to back yourself up. This is a discussion site so discuss.

So far this discussion has been a colossal waste of time. I had hoped you would present arguments for your claims so that we can discuss them. 

What is your purpose here? Just to persuade people to watch a video? Does YouTube pay you for that?

[peace seeker II]

you go ahead and forget the videos, why should i? if you can't comment on them, then don't waste your own time by commenting about anything else. I started this discussion with those videos, so please respect that. If, for any reason you have problems watching lectures and presentations on youtube, then just go to another thread. 

 

this discussion site uses different medias for communication. Finding out who are intelligent enough to be able to watch a presentation and analyzing it, is what i was fishing for. So far this site gets a zero for this capability.

 

you did the same notme .. ignore the proofs i presented in form of a video and expect me to answer your proofs, which i did actually. But anyway, shame that a scientific discussion turns out to be everything but scientific .. because of whatever excuses .. youtube, conspiracy, blabla ... 

 

anybody too lazy to watch the video, or too busy, or not interested, go talk about mutah marriage or anything else that might interest you. Or don't talk at all. I think that's what i'll do soon. i 99% of the time regret talking here to be honest.

[DigitalUmmah]

1 hour ago, peace seeker II said:

anybody too lazy to watch the video, or too busy, or not interested, go talk about mutah marriage or anything else that might interest you. Or don't talk at all. I think that's what i'll do soon. i 99% of the time regret talking here to be honest.

lets do this. I will do it in parts because you really arent that important to me, and I am quite a busy man.

45 seconds: "for the first 4000 years of our civilisation, we believed that the earth was a flattish disc.

simply not true at all. wow not even a minute into the video and the first mistake. so I guess Eratosthenes, Aristarchus of Samos or anazagoras never existed huh. copernicus was the first to state the earth was round. awesomesauce.

1 Min 19: the technology to prove copernicus right wasnt there

lol wut

its really not that difficult,

step 1: you have greek calculations of relative sizes of earth and moon:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Aristarchus_working.jpg#/media/File:Aristarchus_working.jpg

step 2: you can measure how long it takes for the sun to cross the sky

step 3: you can extrapolate mathematically!

voila! you know the earth performs 1 full rotation every 24 hours. you know the earth is X miles across. if it takes 24 hours (time) to cross a certain distance....speed = distance over time, bobs your uncle!

what fancy technology was needed???

2 min 10: people believed the earth was round because there was a globe in every classroom

lol wut

no, i believe that the earth was round because i used to mountain climb a lot and saw horizons change depending on where i stood, and i could ring my family in pakistan and they would be hours ahead of me.

2 min 40: the us and russia fired nukes straight up for 4 years

lol wut

we have a record of every single nuke ever detonated.

 

 

show me which were fired "straight up" lol (as opposed to how normal missiles fire, i presume)

3 min 10

the cold war never existed. everyone was firing nukes at the sky because they were scared #logic

3 min 30: antarctica treaty has never been broken, so obviously something dodgy is going on

no, there is literally nothing stopping adventurers from travelling to antarctica, so long as they can afford it. if there was something dodgy going on, someone would have noticed.

6 min 45: astronauts are sworn to secrecy

how do you know, if they are sworn to secrecy?

8ish minutes: why no panning shots of the earth from space?

lol wut. you think they allow iphones in space? have you seen space cameras? they have only recently (in the ISS) started using go pros and other video cameras. i guess it is only a matter of time now till someone does a panning shot in space outside the ISS (bear in mind how super rare space walks are)

so to summarise: still photographs were mostly taken, no one goes outside the ISS any more, and when they do its not to take selfies.

8 mins 50 ish: you cant get the altitude to take a full picture of the earth

yeah...cos all the pics are from the ISS which is much closer to the earth you donut! who has been further out than the ISS in recent decades?

9 minute 23: why cant you go in a straight line from australia to south america?

because airplanes have limited fuel capacity and need to refuel, and pilots need to rest as a safety precaution, and it means you can double the number of potential customers if you make a stop.

also: you realise thats a LOT of water yeah? and its easier to get emergency services when a plane has a problem over land, as opposed to sea?