Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله
Ali_Hussain

Pope Francis allows priests to forgive abortion

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

Pope Francis has declared that priests have the permanent right from now on to forgive abortions.

His remarks come at the end of the Catholic Church's jubilee year during which he had temporarily granted priests this power.

In an Apostolic letter the pontiff also restated that abortion was a "grave sin" which ended "innocent life".

Catholics who have or perform an abortion can be immediately excommunicated from the Church.

A Vatican spokesman confirmed that "there is no type of laxness here" regarding the Church's position on the morality of abortion, but that the power given to priests meant God's mercy could cover all sin.

"There is no sin that God's mercy cannot reach and wipe away when it finds a repentant heart seeking to be reconciled [with God]," Pope Francis wrote in his letter.

"Mercy cannot become a mere parenthesis in the life of the church; it constitutes her very existence.

"May every priest, therefore, be a guide, support and comfort to penitents on this journey of special reconciliation."

Previously only bishops or special confessors could hear confessions for abortions and lift excommunication.

Priests in Britain and the US were already able to hear and forgive abortion confessions but in most of the world they did not have this authority.

Experts say that although the declaration may not have a practical impact, it is a shift in the Church's traditional approach to abortion.

Father James Bretzke, a professor of moral theology at Boston College in the US said: "I think it's very significant in the context of Pope Francis' theme of his pontificate, which is going to go down as the pontificate of mercy.

"He sees mercy as absolutely the key."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-38054640

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

bismillah.gif

salam1.jpg

What difference does it make when people have deviated from the right path, whether they have the authority to "forgive abortions"  or when they say "they can see Allah" in heaven with our eye sight?? Only those people who hold on to the book of Allah and the Ahlul Bayt of Mohammad s.a.w will not deviate from the right path and are true worshipers of Allah swt.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's not so different from forgiveness for murder, and that's existed forever. Forgiveness doesn't mean there aren't consequences, and it certainly doesn't mean it's not a sin. It just means the priest tells the person that this sin will not condemn them to hell if they've sincerely repented.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, notme said:

It's not so different from forgiveness for murder, and that's existed forever. Forgiveness doesn't mean there aren't consequences, and it certainly doesn't mean it's not a sin. It just means the priest tells the person that this sin will not condemn them to hell if they've sincerely repented.

Makes it much easier to get around murder than before.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, E.L King said:

Makes it much easier to get around murder than before.

There are few things that Allah will not forgive if repentance is sincere. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Son of Placid said:

Does a priest have the authority to forgive your sins?

 

Asking a priest for forgiveness is a Catholic sacrament. They believe you must already be in sincere repentance before you confess to the priest for the confession to be valid. It's their final step. However, when I was Catholic I was taught that if you sin and intend to confess but die before confessing, you will likely be forgiven for that too. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
59 minutes ago, andres said:

If you did not wish to confess to a priest, would it not also be OK for the catholic God to recieve your prayer for forgiveness directly?

As I was taught, God forgives with or without the priest, but the sacrament of confession is a mandatory act of humility and the final step to removing the sin from a person's life.  A Catholic who does not want to go to a priest to confess his sins and be absolved is intentionally denying himself the blessing of the sacrament.  One would have to wonder whether he or she has sincerely repented, or perhaps he or she is not a truly believing Catholic.  I was raised Catholic, but I was never super knowledgeable.  I only knew what I learned in Catholic elementary school and in catechism class before Confirmation.  Maybe some practicing and knowledgeable Catholic person will come along and provide better answers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, andres said:

In my opinion a custom which purpose originally was to control people. 

Kinda feel that way too. There are many things the religious leaders of the past required for the sheer purpose of seeing how well the people followed. Separating them from the true rituals ordained by God is often difficult because they are so intertwined.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, andres said:

We can all forgive.

Yes. Muslims are encouraged to forgive those who trespass against them, but that forgiveness is in the gift of the person who has been impacted by the sin, not a third party.

I think the difference between the general idea that God can forgive sins and what the Catholic church is dispensing is that the latter is the forgiveness of specific sins by specific individuals.

The Church leaders who are doing this are effectively playing God.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Haji 2003 said:

The Church leaders who are doing this are effectively playing God.

Right. They are standing in for God. What I was taught as a Catholic child is that first a person must seek forgiveness from anyone they have wronged first, then confess to the priest. At the time when the person confesses to the priest he or she must be in sincere repentance, then the priest will assign certain tasks to do and prayers to say and the sin is absolved. I always assumed the repentance is to God, and the priest just assigns a little purgatory, but I really was never a very good Catholic. I did the minimal so that my mother and teachers would be satisfied. If there are any knowledgeable Catholics here, perhaps they can explain better, but my understanding was always that the priest was standing in for God in the sacrament of confession. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Haji 2003 said:

The Church leaders who are doing this are effectively playing God.

John 20:23 is a difficult one. It speaks only about the Apostles. Not Catholic priests, so if meant not only of the 11 remaining apostles, to me all followers of Christ would make more sense. And is it forgiving on Gods behalf as a comfort to the sinner from a religious authority? I hope this is so. If not I agree with you the priest is playing God.

Maybe what lies behind the Popes descision is whether a girl that has made abortion skall be allowed to participate in the holy communion. Sometimes authorities must make judgements. Somtimes innocent humans by error are executed. Was Khomenyi playing God when ordering a fatwa against Rushdie? The final judgement belong to God.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, andres said:

Was Khomenyi playing God when ordering a fatwa against Rushdie? The final judgement belong to God.

Khomeini wasn't because he was simply recommending what his understanding was of religious texts and the punishments they prescribe what happens on this planet.

AIUI he made no claims about what would happen to Rushdie in the hereafter, though sending curses is an option open to all of us.

IIRC the Pope is promising these people that they'll face no repercussions in the afterlife. I think this is a good example of taking a wonderful concept such as mercy and making it a liability.

Sad to see the Catholic church going down the same route as the Protestant churches, soon it will be only us, the Orthodox church (?) and the Orthodox Jews left.

Edited by Haji 2003

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am certain that both Khomeini and the Pope knows that God is the final judge. But they act according to what they believe is Gods will. One issued the fatwa, the other forgave abortion. Powerful leaders must consider many difficult questions.

The Orthodox Church, Jews and "us"=Shias?  So Protestants, Catholics, Sunnies, Wahabis and Salafis will all become extinct? Dont think so.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 16/12/2016 at 2:15 AM, andres said:

John 20:23 is a difficult one. It speaks only about the Apostles. Not Catholic priests, so if meant not only of the 11 remaining apostles, to me all followers of Christ would make more sense. And is it forgiving on Gods behalf as a comfort to the sinner from a religious authority? I hope this is so. If not I agree with you the priest is playing God.

Maybe what lies behind the Popes descision is whether a girl that has made abortion skall be allowed to participate in the holy communion. Sometimes authorities must make judgements. Somtimes innocent humans by error are executed. Was Khomenyi playing God when ordering a fatwa against Rushdie? The final judgement belong to God.

John 20:23 is an easy one not difficult. Jesus gives authority to the Apostles to forgive or retain sins. So how are they to forgive sins *unless* someone confessed to them?

Apostles were the early leaders of the Church, with Peter the pre-eminent one. These Apostles appointed Bishops and others as successors to them (as mentioned in the Bible) by the laying on of hands. 

As the Father sent Jesus, so Jesus sends the Apostles. He gives them the same Authority, and this Authority was passed down. 

So Yes, ofcourse God forgives sins, But God instituted a Priesthood (just like in the OT) in order to be the vehicle for the forgiveness of Sins. Denying this would be denying Jesus' wishes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, shreek said:

 

As the Father sent Jesus, so Jesus sends the Apostles. He gives them the same Authority, and this Authority was passed down. 

So Yes, ofcourse God forgives sins, But God instituted a Priesthood (just like in the OT) in order to be the vehicle for the forgiveness of Sins. Denying this would be denying Jesus' wishes.

 It does not say it should be passed down, but it has, which seems reasonable. But who says it nesessarily needs to be only priests? A priest is not nesessary for God to forgive a sinner. Evety Christian can go directly to God and ask for forgiveness. A priest, an authority in religious matters, can be of moral support should the repenter be uncertain if God will forgive.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 15/12/2016 at 6:47 PM, andres said:

The Orthodox Church, Jews and "us"=Shias?  So Protestants, Catholics, Sunnies, Wahabis and Salafis will all become extinct? Dont think so.

 

I wasn't talking about extinction, I was talking about faiths that had stuck to the more fundamentalist aspect of the Abrahamic creed.

And in that respect I wasn't making any distinctions between Shias and Sunnis.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...