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In the Name of God بسم الله

Is Quran book of guidance alone?

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Quran alone  

7 members have voted

  1. 1. Is Quran alone, without the prophetic progeny, is a book of misguidance?

    • Yes, alone without prophetic progeny, Quran is a book of misguidance.
    • No, it is book of guidance even alone.


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as salam alaykum.

I came across with shia preacher shaykh Abdulhalim al-Ghazzi.

He said: This book. This book! If you take it alone, this is a book of misguidance. Without (prophetic) progeny it is book of misguidance. 

I fully appreciate all objections with reference to the short clip, and possible cherry picking from his words. 

Could you please answer to simple question.

Is Quran alone, without progeny of prophet (saws), is a book of misguidance?

 

 

 

 

 

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49 minutes ago, Abu_Rumaysah said:

as salam alaykum.

I came across with shia preacher shaykh Abdulhalim al-Ghazzi.

He said: This book. This book! If you take it alone, this is a book of misguidance. Without (prophetic) progeny it is book of misguidance. 

I fully appreciate all objections with reference to the short clip, and possible cherry picking from his words. 

Could you please answer to simple question.

Is Quran alone, without progeny of prophet (saws), is a book of misguidance?

 

 

 

 

 

Wa Aleikum Salaam,

Qur'an is an book of guidance and it will guide person to the right path, if and only if Allah (swt) wills. He is very wrong saying that Qur'an alone is misguidance.

“Indeed this Qur’an guides to the path which is clearer and straighter than any other.”  Sura Bani-Israel, verse 9

I would not listen such a guy, because this guy is know for making ridiculous analysis.

Edited by Dhulfikar
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1 minute ago, Dhulfikar said:

Wa Aleikum Salaam,

Qur'an is an book of guidance and it will guide person to the right path, if and only if Allah (swt) wills. He is very wrong saying that Qur'an alone is misguidance.

I would not listen such a guy, because this guy is know for making ridiculous analysis.

Barakallahu fik for your answer.

If Allah wills. Yes, everything happening in this world only if He allows or wills.

Question is, if someone is taking Quran, without progeny. Would it still be a book of guidance for him? Or it will be book of misguidance for him?

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16 minutes ago, Abu_Rumaysah said:

Barakallahu fik for your answer.

If Allah wills. Yes, everything happening in this world only if He allows or wills.

Question is, if someone is taking Quran, without progeny. Would it still be a book of guidance for him? Or it will be book of misguidance for him?

The Quran itself is a book of guidance. The person will be guided as long Allah (swt) guide the person to right path. People can read Qur'an and be unguided too. Prophet (saws) said he is leaving Quran and Ahlulbait, Ahlulbait are much like instructors to understand Qur'an and laws rightly.

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Some additional note to this topic, coming directly from the shia book,  and authenticated by shia scholars.

Kulayni narrated in Kafi, Kitab al-Hujjah, first chapter, hadith 2:  Muhammad ibn Isma‘il has narrated from al-Fadl ibn Shadhan from Safwan ibn Yahya from Mansur ibn Hazim who has said the following. "I said to Imam abu ‘Abdallah (a.s.), ‘Allah by far above Majestic and Gracious to be known through His creatures. In fact, the creatures are known through Allah.’" The Imam (a.s.) said, "You have spoken the truth." I said, "One who knows that he has a Lord, he must also learn that his Lord agrees with certain things and disagrees with certain other things. The only way he would know what his like and dislikes is revelation or a messenger. One does not receive revelation he must find the messengers and when finds the messengers he will know that they the Divine authority and that obedience to them is necessary I say to people, "Do you know that the messenger of Allah was the Divine authority over His creatures?" They say, "Yes, he was the Divine authority." I then ask, "After the messenger of Allah who was the Divine authority over His creatures?" They said, "After the messenger of Allah the Divine authority is the Holy Quran." I considered the Holy Quran and found out that various kinds of people consider this Holy Book as support for their beliefs. For example the Murji’a (people who say Allah has postponed punishment), the pre-determinists and the atheist who even do not believe in it but take it as the basis for their arguments against the others. I then learned that the Holy Quran can not serve as Divine authority without a guardian whose words from the Holy Quran would be the truth. I then ask the people, "Who is the guardian of the Holy Quran?" They say, "Ibn Mas‘ud knew the Holy Quran, ‘Umar knew it and Hudhayfa knew the Holy Quran." I ask them, "Did they know all of the Holy Quran?" The people say, "No, they did not know all of it." I have not found anyone who would know all of the Holy Quran except Ali ibn abu Talib (a.s.). It is a fact that if any issue would emerge that needed a Quranic solution, except for Imam Ali (a.s.) every one of the others would, in many cases, say, "I do not know." Only Imam Ali (a.s.) would say, "I know." I then acknowledge that Imam Ali (a.s.) is the guardian of the Holy Quran and obedience to him is obligatory and he is the Divine authority over the people after the Holy Prophet (s.a.). Whatever Imam Ali (a.s.) has said from the Holy Quran is the truth." The Imam (a.s.) said, "May Allah grant you blessing."
Majlisi in Mirat 2/335, said Unknown like Saheeh.

Kulayni also narrated in al-Kafi (1/188), kitab al-Hujjah, babu fardu taat li aimma, hadith 15, and Majlisi again said: Majhool as saheeh: Muhammad ibn ’Isma‘il has narrated from al-Fadl ibn Shadhan from Safwan ibn Yahya from Mansur ibn Hazim who has the following. "I asked Imam abu ‘Abdallah (a.s.), ‘Allah is the Most Holy, the Most High to be recognized through His creatures. In fact, it is the creature who are recognized through Allah.’" The Imam (a.s.) said you have is very true." I then said, "One who knows that he has a creator he must also know that his creator becomes with certain things and displeased with certain other things. That the only way to know what is pleases the creator and what displeases Him is through divine revelation or a messengers. One who does not receive Divine revelation must find the messenger and when one would find the messengers and upon finding the messenger one would learn that they are the Divine authorities and obedience to them is obligatory. I say it to people, "Do you not acknowledge that obedience to the holy Prophet possessed Divine authority from Allah over His creatures?" They say, "Yes, it is true." I then say to them, "When the holy Prophet left this world who possessed Divine authority over the people?" The say, "The holy Quran." I then looked in the holy Quran and I found out that all kinds of people consider this holy as the basis for their beliefs. The group called al-Murji’a consider it as the basis for whatever it believes. Those who believe in predestination also consider this holy Book as the basis for whatever they believe in. Even the atheists who do not even believe in it at all refer to this holy book to defeat the others. This proves that the holy Quran can not be considered a Divine authority without a guardian whose words about the Quran would be the true ones. I then ask them, "Who is the guardian of the Quran?" They reply, "Ibn Mas‘ud knew the Quran. ‘Umar knew the Quran. Hudhayfa knew the Quran." I then ask them, "Did these people know all of the Quran?" They say, "No, they did not know all of the Quran." I do not find anyone who would say that he knows all of the Quran. The only one who says that he knows all of the Quran is Ali, may Allah’s peace and blessings be upon him. If any question would arise in these people, that one would say that he did not know. The other one would say that he did not know and so on except Ali that would say that he did know. That gives enough proof to say that Ali was the guardian of the Quran. Obedience to Ali was obligatory by the command of Allah and he possessed Divine authority over the people after the holy Prophet (s.a.). Whatever Ali (a.s.) said about the holy Quran is true." The Imam said, "May Allah’s blessings be with you." I then said, "Imam Ali (a.s.) did not leave this world without introducing the person who possessed Divine authority over the people after him just as the holy Prophet (s. a.) had done. The person who possessed Divvine authority over the people after Imam Ali (a. s.)_ was Imam al-Hassan (a.s.). I testify that Imam al-Hassan (a.s.) also did not leave this world without introducing the person who would possess Divine authority over the people after him just as his father and grandfather had done. The person who after Imam al-Hassan possessed Divine authority over the people was Imam al-Husayn (a.s.). Obedience to him was obligatory by the command of Allah." The Imam said, "May Allah’s blessings be with you." I then kissed his head and said, "I testify that Imam al-Husayn did not leave this world without introducing the person who would possess Divine authority over the people after him. That person was Imam ali ibn al-Husayn (a.s.) obedience to whom was obligatory by the command of Allah. The Imam said, "May Allah’s blessings be with you." I then kissed his head and said, "I testify that Imam Ali ibn al-Husayn did not leave this world without introducing the person who would possess divine authority over the people after him. That person was Imam abu Ja‘far, Muhammad ibn Ali (a.s.) , obedience to whom was obligatory by the commad of Allah. The Imam said, "May Allah’s blessings be with you." I then said, "Please let me kiss your head again." The Imam (a.s.) smiled. I then said, may Allah grand you success. I know that your holy father did not leave this world without introducing the person who would possess Divine authrity over the people after him just his father had done. I testify that yourself are the person who possess Divine authrity over the people after your holy father and that obedience to you is obligatory by the command of Allah." The Imam (a.s.) said, "It is true enough, The Imam said, "May Allah’s blessings be with you." I then asked for his permission to kiss hiis head and the Imam (a.s.) smiled. I kissed his head. The Imam (a.s.) then said, "Ask whatever you want. I, from this day on, will never deny you anything."

Question to shias,  How do you accept Quran as a divine authority in the absense of your masoom?

 

Edited by Abu_Rumaysah
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18 minutes ago, Abu_Rumaysah said:

Question to shias,  How do you accept Quran as a divine authority in the absense of your masoom?

no nit picking works here in the  presence of the hadith thaqlayn as mentioned in both sunni and shia sources that we need to follow both quran and Ahl albayt, as to avoid going astray.

The one who claimed that the book of Allah is sufficient for us, he had to admit on many occasions that he could be ruined if imam Alii as( from Ahl albayat as)   was not there. 

WS

 

Edited by skamran110
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With Allah's Name, Ar-Rahman, Ar-Raheem. I seek a refuge with Allah from Shaytan, Expelled.

If we read 42:52 we can find at its end وَإِنَّكَ لَتَهْدِي إِلَىٰ صِرَاطٍ مُسْتَقِيمٍ which means that Muhammad Mustafa sawa guides (tahdee) to the Straight Path (sirat-ul musteqeem) also. This is explained in the next ayat as "Allah's Path" (sirat-ullah), and we can find at its end about 'amr (command). So, this is all explained in 2 ayats:

Ones who are/were doing as Muhammad Mustafa sawa ordered to them will be guided to Sirat-ul Mustaqeem for sure, by submitting (Muslims) to that order(s). We should notice that orders are (part of) deen, so this has nothing with 'iman, this is about deen only. As said in surah Hujurat for some Arabs (beduins) their deeds will be accepted (won't be rejected) if they obey the deen (Islam), even if they're not believers.

We should know that guidance from the Muhammad Mustafa sawa is not about 'iman, it's about deen. Only Allah swt can gift us belief ('iman) from His Mercy.

Obeying the command ('amr) is expressed in the Qur'an with the verb in 3rd person plural form أَطِيعُوا and if we read all the ayats we should know that it was the case with all the rasulullah a.s. But, in the ayat 4:59 it's said that we should obey commands of those who are called Ool-ul-'amr (Possessors of the command), besides obeying Allah's and Rasulullah's sawa commands. Since Allah swt ordered this in the same ayat we should understand that following commands from Ool-ul-'amr can guide us to the Straight Path too.

We should also know that every person will be called with his/her 'imam.

So, before talking about this topic we should know what is "guidance" and what kind of a guidance we're talking.

Obeying Muhammad's sawa and Ool-ul-'amr's commands will permit us to go astray, meaning that we won't do anything bad, our deeds will be accepted as good ones (salihat).

But, "bayan" of the Qur'an is on Allah swt. ONLY HE can give the knowledge, 'iman and all other qualities He claimed that are ONLY FROM HIM. This is very dangerous topic, and a little mistake can lead to shirk. Ask a refuge with Allah swt constantly.

Qur'an cannot be explained (be guidance) by anybody/anything, except by Allah swt. Not even Resulullah sawa can explain it without Allah's swt bayan. The Qur'an itself is bayan for all the things, but we should also know that it's useless without Allah' swt bayan. That's why we should be humble as possible when we're going to read it and to come to it with a wish for the knowledge, not as its teachers. If we read and think about its ayats Allah swt will bayan it to us, if He wills. He is leading from the darkness to the light.

We can see ones with the knowledge from the Qur'an (Allah's bayan) they're crying while they're reading it. They're pondering over its ayats and Allah swt is sending His knowledge from His Mercy to them. Mountains are crushing when Allah swt Shows Himself to them and human's hearts are crying.

Allah's bless and salam.

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Article:

If Quran could be understood just by reading, deep thinking or investigating, why do we have so many different ideas or meanings or interpretations, resulting branches in Islam having so many differences between them?

Shouldn’t these differences awaken us to realize that Quran is not a book to be understood on our own?

Shouldn’t we pay attention to the answer of this question which is already told in the Quran?

According to the Quran, there is only ONE WAY to comprehend the Quran. This is a fact which is always ignored.

This ignored fact is the obvious reason behind all the misunderstandings for readers, investigators and even Muslims.

It is never mentioned in the Quran - not even once - that anyone can comprehend it even if the reader’s mother tongue is Arabic.

The proper way of realizing the Quran is to be TAUGHT by God, the same way that happened for the prophet and then his successor Imams inherited his knowledge. So it cannot be achieved solely by anyone just by reading.

It is also said that if we have a doubt about a topic, we should ask the qualified person who has received the Guidance [16:43], [21:7].

 فَاسْأَلُوا أَهْلَ الذِّكْرِ إِن كُنتُمْ لَا تَعْلَمُونَ

Why no one can comprehend the Quran?

Because divine books consist of two parts; one is the “TEXT”, we call it Torah, Bible and Quran, and the second is called “Furghan - فرقان” which means “Guidance” that holds the comprehension of the text.

Even lots of Muslims say “Furghan” is another name of the Quran, but they are absolutely wrong. This is another proof that they haven’t read the verses carefully.

Because guidance or “Furghan” was also given to Moses together with the Torah [2:53].

وَإِذْ آتَینَا مُوسَى الْكِتَابَ وَالْفُرْقَانَ لَعَلَّكُمْ تَهْتَدُونَ

شَهْرُ رَمَضَانَ الَّذِی أُنزِلَ فِیهِ الْقُرْآنُ هُدًى لِّلنَّاسِ وَبَینَاتٍ مِّنَ الْهُدَىٰ وَ الْفُرْقَانِ

تَبَارَكَ الَّذِی نَزَّلَ الْفُرْقَانَ عَلَىٰ عَبْدِهِ لِیكُونَ لِلْعَالَمِینَ نَذِیرًا

 

So how can “Furghan” only point to the Quran alone?

The Guidance or “Furghan” is exactly the comprehension of God’s words, whether that word is Torah, Bible or Quran. Comprehending the Quran cannot be achieved through our translation or interpretation of the text.

So, when even Muslims cannot comprehend the meaning of verses, how can one expect others to be able to understand the true meaning?

Specially the general public who are trying to realize the true meaning based on their own efforts, or even those who approach this book with a negative view; specially when they rely just on the Arabic text, or simple translation of it, or when they refer to interpretations made by different branches of Islam?

Some critics, specially Iranians who don’t even understand the Arabic text of the Quran, and don’t have a proper translation at hand or just simply use an Arabic dictionary, claim that they fully understood the Quran and could find contradictions in it.

Whereas Allah emphasizes: Are they not going to thoroughly investigate the Quran; had it been from other sources than Allah, they would have found many contradictions for sure [4:82].

أَفَلَا یتَدَبَّرُونَ الْقُرْآنَ وَلَوْ كَانَ مِنْ عِندِ غَیرِ اللَّهِ لَوَجَدُوا فِیهِ اخْتِلَافًا كَثِیرًا

The above verse on the other hand confirms that contradictory conclusions will definitely occur if the Quran is not realized.

It is very strange that these people ignore the fact that even guidance of the Quran had to be taught to the prophet himself, although Arabic was his native language, and then he had to teach it to his followers who would also speak Arabic.

If the Quran was easily understandable for Arab people, there would be no need for the Prophet’s explanation, it would only take him to recite the verses and people would comprehend the meaning.

Based on what is said in the Quran, God is the one who teaches the Guidance (Furghan) to someone who has reached to certain levels of virtue and not just anybody.

This fact proves that the TRUE comprehension of the Quran cannot be achieved through religious schools.

If anyone, living anywhere in the world, is a true believer and has achieved necessary levels of virtue -the virtue is his personality and not as a fakery- then gradually the Guidance (Furghan) will be given to him [8:29].

یا أَیهَا الَّذِینَ آمَنُوا إِن تَتَّقُوا اللَّهَ یجْعَل لَّكُمْ فُرْقَانًا

Result of reading is not comprehending. This is the repeated mistake of vast majority of general public.

Islamic centers in Islamic countries, teach their own regional version of Islam.

Sunnis teach the Sunni belief.

Shia teaches the Shia belief.

Each one is also divided into branches, which proves its validity and disproves the originality of the other branches from the very same book called the Quran.

So who is right?

Whatever Shia used to know from the Quran is the Prophet or Imam’s interpretations when they were present, plus exclusive explanations gifted to some higher level students. We are fortunate to receive some of those, but it is definitely not all of it.

So the conclusion would be:

if religion is what Shia currently claims,

or what Sunni claims,

or what Wahabi claims,

Then people have the right to refuse Islam, since not only such religion has no value, it ruins our intellect and has brought brutality of mankind. All these are result of illogical believes, superstitions and being close minded towards other views.

 

If we let Islam to be based on original explanations of prophet and his successor Imams, not only there would be no doubts or contradictions, but all the questions would also be answered perfectly.
This brings us unified conclusion and interpretation.

True Islam is so logical that if understood, it overcomes  any other belief or religion. This is why God says it is meant to overcome every other belief [9:33], [48:28], [61:9].

لِیظْهِرَهُ عَلَى الدِّینِ كُلِّهِ

Islam does not need to be proven or defended by disputed with prejudice. Whoever has received the Guidance (Furghan) can easily debate on any topic. Like the way Prophet and Imams used to do by answering in best possible manner.

Only this style is accepted by God.

Invite to the way of God with wise facts and debate them in best possible manner [16:125].

ادْعُ إِلَىٰ سَبِیلِ رَبِّكَ بِالْحِكْمَةِ وَالْمَوْعِظَةِ الْحَسَنَةِ وَجَادِلْهُم بِالَّتِی هِی أَحْسَنُ

 

The prophet says

الاسلام یعلو و لا یعلی علیه

Islam supremes, and nothing comes over its supremacy.

[Nahj-al-fasaha, 1056]

Prophet is definitely talking about the original Islam and not what Muslims are presenting now or during ages. Because this fake fabricated Islam is fundamentally invalid due to its own faults.

 

When Muslims from different branches of Islam are not able to come to a common understanding out of the very same book called the Quran, and the result is lack of respect and even bloodshed between each other, then how can we expect the rest of the world to have no doubts or no anger and show respect towards God and Islam?!

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Another point to think about.

It was narrated from hz Ali (as) in Mostadrak safinatul Bihar and other shia books:

 هذا كتاب الله الصامت وأنا كتاب الله الناطق

"This Book of Allah is dumb (mute), and I am speaking book of Allah".

So, basically, book of Allah Quran is not hujjah without Qayum, and it is mute book. 

 

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2 hours ago, Abu_Rumaysah said:

as salam alaykum.

I came across with shia preacher shaykh Abdulhalim al-Ghazzi.

He said: This book. This book! If you take it alone, this is a book of misguidance. Without (prophetic) progeny it is book of misguidance. 

I fully appreciate all objections with reference to the short clip, and possible cherry picking from his words. 

Could you please answer to simple question.

Is Quran alone, without progeny of prophet (saws), is a book of misguidance?

 

Salamun alaykum.

There are problems in the question and answers.

To make it clear please answer the following question:

 

Is the first 20 Juz' of Quran , without the last 10 Juz', a book of misguidance?

A. Yes! The first 20 Juz' of Quran , without the last 10 Juz', is a book of misguidance.

B. No. it is book of guidance even without the last 10 Juz.

Edited by amirhosein_88
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Based on the prophecy of the noble Prophet of Islam (s.a.w.a) in the Hadith of two weighty things "Thaqalayn", Qur'an without Ahlul-Bayt (AS) or Ahlul-Bayt (AS) without Qur'an could never guarantee guidance. Rather, Qur'an together with the Ahlul-Bayt (AS) must be held together to be guided.

Meanwhile, no one doubted about the Qur'an being a Book of Guidance but what we are saying is that for us to be guided by the Qur'an, we need the interpretations and explanations of the Ahlul-Bayt (AS) as well. They (AS) are indeed the only shield against misguidance.

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There are those who read the Quran and are guided, and there are those who read it and are misguided.  This means for some, it is a book of guidance, but for others - those with a corrupt heart, or those with corrupt background beliefs - it leads to misguidance.  

Allah swt says in 2:26:

Verily, Allah is not ashamed to set forth a parable even of a mosquito or so much more when it is bigger (or less when it is smaller) than it. And as for those who believe, they know that it is the Truth from their Lord, but as for those who disbelieve, they say: "What did Allah intend by this parable?" By *it* (i.e. the Qur'anic parable) He misleads many, and many He guides thereby. And He misleads thereby only those who are Al-Fasiqun (the rebellious, disobedient to Allah).

إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَا يَسْتَحْيِي أَنْ يَضْرِبَ مَثَلًا مَا بَعُوضَةً فَمَا فَوْقَهَا ۚ فَأَمَّا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا فَيَعْلَمُونَ أَنَّهُ الْحَقُّ مِنْ رَبِّهِمْ ۖ وَأَمَّا الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا فَيَقُولُونَ مَاذَا أَرَادَ اللَّهُ بِهَٰذَا مَثَلًا ۘ يُضِلُّ بِهِ كَثِيرًا وَيَهْدِي بِهِ كَثِيرًا ۚ وَمَا يُضِلُّ بِهِ إِلَّا الْفَاسِقِينَ {26}

 
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4 hours ago, Abu_Rumaysah said:

 هذا كتاب الله الصامت وأنا كتاب الله الناطق

"This Book of Allah is dumb (mute), and I am speaking book of Allah".

So, basically, book of Allah Quran is not hujjah without Qayum, and it is mute book. 

No this does not mean dumb. He did not say this book of Allah is dumb. He did not say the book of Allah is mute without me. 

If you're an Arabic speaker or know anything about Shia beliefs other than what you copy and paste you'd know the following:

- Shia believe the Prophet and his Ahlul Bayt are talking Qurans. Allah has revelations through 1) words written in a book 2) through talking humans, the Prophet s.a.w.a and his Ahlul Bayt a.s.

- Here, Imam Ali a.s is referring the the Quran as the mute Quran (because you know, it's a book that doesn't speak) and he as the talking Quran. Hadith from the Imam is literally self explanatory.

(This is the silent book of Allah and I am the speaking book of Allah (Quran).)

Hadith less than ten words with a clear meaning. Don't twist and turn.

Edited by Alzaynebia313
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8 hours ago, Abu_Rumaysah said:

as salam alaykum.

I came across with shia preacher shaykh Abdulhalim al-Ghazzi.

He said: This book. This book! If you take it alone, this is a book of misguidance. Without (prophetic) progeny it is book of misguidance. 

I fully appreciate all objections with reference to the short clip, and possible cherry picking from his words. 

Could you please answer to simple question.

Is Quran alone, without progeny of prophet (saws), is a book of misguidance?

Can you add a third option that "Quran can be a book of misguidance".

For example, ISIS, Al-Qaida, Taliban use the Quran to perpetuate violence across the world. Would you say they are rightly guided?

If any book by itself was sufficient, why would there be schools and universities across the world? No doubt that you belong to some madressah. Why didn't you self-teach?

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There is also a heavy veil and a curse upon the hearts of humanity from Iblis and his forces. The Quran while being the cure is also the most impacted by this curse. The curse is specially done to keep people from perceiving the Quran and it's truths.

In time, people will know who the Guide of time is, and what the Quran was calling to.

The Sunnis are the primary tools of Satan to keep the rest of humanity away from Quran. Those who convert to Sunnism are almost handpicked by Satan to continue to perpetuate blindness.

May God save us from blindness and deafness to the light within every soul, the Guide, the Companion of the journey.

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 The holy Quran is a book of miracles. So, my question is: Has there been any person past or present (excluding the Imams of Ahlul bayt as) who have understood the divine miracles of the Holy Quran? This question is for both Shia and the Sunnis. 

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1 hour ago, power said:

 The holy Quran is a book of miracles. So, my question is: Has there been any person past or present (excluding the Imams of Ahlul bayt as) who have understood the divine miracles of the Holy Quran? This question is for both Shia and the Sunnis. 

 

In my view, just like Du'a Semaat says "in which no one fully truly understand their true full meaning and interpretation but you", the same is true of Quran.

Even Imam Mahdi is constantly increasing his knowledge of Quran and reaching new level of understanding which he never imagined before.

It's designed in a way that we cannot limit what is in the Quran. We don't know, because it's a book from God for all intellects for all stages of the journey, it has something for each person at each stage.

 

 

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Thanks God, at least 40% believes that Quran even on its own, isn't book of misguidance. 

Allah said: “This is the Book. In it is guidance surely without any doubt, to those who fear God, who believe in the Unseen, are steadfast in prayer, and spend out of what we have provided for them.”(Sura Baqarah, verse 2 and 3)

And He said  in the Qur’an in Sura Bani-Israel, verse 9: “Indeed this Qur’an guides to the path which is clearer and straighter than any other.”

And He said: in Sura Luqman, verse 2-4:“These are the verses of the wise Book. A guide and a mercy to those who do good, those who establish regular prayers, and give regular charity, and have in their hearts the assurance of the hereafter.”

But it is really scary that even some known shia scholars of the present time, beliefs that not Quran neither Sunnah is a source of guidance.

Tijani said in “Shia hum Ahle-Sunnah” (p 123):

القرآن والسنة لايعصمان من الضلالة فهما صامتان لايتكلمان ويحملان عدة وجوه

Translation:

the  Qur’an and Sunnah do not  protect (anyone) from straying; they both are silent; they do not speak and they permit many interpretations

 

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1 hour ago, Abu_Rumaysah said:

Translation:

the  Qur’an and Sunnah do not  protect (anyone) from straying; they both are silent; they do not speak and they permit many interpretations

The message is clear . That's why we have purified Imams from Ahl albayat AS to provide the complete guidance to the people after the prophet saww as per hadith thaqlyn  and they are not separated from quran. 

Edited by skamran110
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1 hour ago, Abu_Rumaysah said:

Thanks God, at least 40% believes that Quran even on its own, isn't book of misguidance. 

Allah said: “This is the Book. In it is guidance surely without any doubt, to those who fear God, who believe in the Unseen, are steadfast in prayer, and spend out of what we have provided for them.”(Sura Baqarah, verse 2 and 3

 

Your answer is right in the surah. However there is a mistranslation. Taqwa is not fear of God, but being precisely God conscious . The word for fear is khouf خوف

Hence only if you have passed the initial stages of , Islam and iman, and entered the state of Taqwa, you wont be guided. 

Hence you have to reach a certain level of virtue, to be guided by Allah's words.

Which is indicated in the verse, This is book of GUIDANCE for the MOTAQI.

Just like the prophet, if he had not reached a certain level of virtue, he would not have been chosen for prophecy , specially receiving the Quran ALONG with FORQAN, which is the guidance behind the words and text of the Quran.

Without the Forqan,the Quran is only the recitable text of the book.

The purpose of reaching a certain level of virtue which is called Taqwa in the Quran is to gain the guidance in the Holy Quran, which is called Forqan.

Which can only be given by Allah.

This is clear by this verse:

يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا إِن تَتَّقُوا اللَّهَ يَجْعَل لَّكُمْ فُرْقَانًا وَيُكَفِّرْ عَنكُمْ سَيِّئَاتِكُمْ وَيَغْفِرْ لَكُمْ ۗ وَاللَّهُ ذُو الْفَضْلِ الْعَظِيمِ

 O you who believe! If you remain ***conscious of Allah( Taqwa), HE WILL MAKE THE FORQAN FOR YOU***, and will remit from you your sins, and will forgive you. God is possessor of infinite grace (8:29)

So whether you associate yourself with the sunni or shia school of thought, if you have not reached a certain level of virtue from Allah'S POINT OF VIEW, we will not receive the Forqan which is the Guidance of the Quran, as Allah makes the Forqan for a person himself and guides him according to the level of his virture.

Hence the higher the virtue the more Forqan / guidance you receive.

The true documentry provided in your thread is proof to this fact. The person was an illitrate villager who lived not too long ago,received the full text of the Quran along with Forqan according to his capacity from Allah.

Edited by certainclarity
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Ool-ul-'Emr are only to explain deen and to rule (be khalifas) with it. Guidance to deen is possible without the Qur'an, incase there's someone of Ool-ul-'Emr whose command ('emr) we should obey. This should be done personally.

For the matter of 'iman (belief), nobody and nothing can guide us, except Allah swt.

We should also know that bayan (explanation) of the Qur'an is on Allah swt, so Qur'an itself cannot be guidance in any sense (deen and 'iman) without Allah's swt bayan.

So, when, for example, 'Ali a.s. said that Qur'an is dead and he's a live Kitab-ul-llah, he was right, but when some of "ulema" says same or similar they're wrong, because they're not Ool-ul-'Emr, except they have Sultan for it. Once more, this is only in deen matter, not in 'iman. 'Iman guidance is only from Allah swt.

For someone to be guided to 'iman, they need to think about ayats (not only Qur'anic ayats, all of Allah's swt ayats) and that can lead them to 'ilm (knowledge) which can lead to 'iman, with Allah's Help and 'izn. Reading the Qur'an without thinking means nothing.

Allah's bless and selam.

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Yusuf Ali: He it is Who has sent down to thee the Book: In it are verses basic or fundamental (of established meaning); they are the foundation of the Book: others are allegorical. But those in whose hearts is perversity follow the part thereof that is allegorical, seeking discord, and searching for its hidden meanings, but no one knows its hidden meanings except Allah. And those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say: "We believe in the Book; the whole of it is from our Lord:" and none will grasp the Message except men of understanding.

 

No one knows its hidden meanings except Allah. And those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say:

Can someone elaborate what is meant by: HIDDEN MEANINGS IN THE QURAN? And who are those that are grounded in knowledge? 

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What Yusuf Ali translated as "foundation of the Book" is "Mother of Kitab". Allah swt wants us to think about His ayats. So, we have to think about every word. If we think about His Words only we'll find how each of them is used perfectly. This is the case with the word "Mother" too, of course.

We should think: what is mother? We know for sure that it's a human, right? But Allah swt didn't use "human". Then we know it's a female human, and this is not the word used also. Mother is adult female human, but this is not the word either. Mother is adult female human who gave the birth. And this is the correct information we need to understand this. So, "ayats of established meaning" are those ayats who're in Kitab and they are "giving birth". To what? To other ayats, which Yusuf Ali incorectly translated as "allegorical".

Those who're "grounded in knowledge" are those who accepted whole Kitab (as said in ayat) and they're using their 'aql (thinking). When they think about the first group of ayats, Allah swt is giving them (getting them near-er to) the knowledge about the other group of ayats.

If we discard all what is not haqq (proven truth) and think about His ayats (from Qur'an and all others) we'll get the knowledge of all ayats, with His Help and 'izn. But, it's crusial to recognize all ayats as "from Him" and to believe and accept whole Kitab, before anything else. Otherwise, we'll go to shirk or kufr, may Allah swt protects us from falsehood.

Allah's bless and selam.

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5 hours ago, power said:

 

*and none will grasp the Message except men of understanding.*

Can someone elaborate what is meant by: HIDDEN MEANINGS IN THE QURAN? And who are those that are grounded in knowledge? 

Those who are grounded in knowledge are people of remembrance whose lobes have been opened

وَمَا يَذَّكَّرُ إِلَّا أُولُو الْأَلْبَابِ  3:7

3:7- It Should be , " And none will remember/recollect it except people of understanding 

People of understanding = Ulel al bab= People whose lobes have been opened

كِتَابٌ أَنزَلْنَاهُ إِلَيْكَ مُبَارَكٌ لِّيَدَّبَّرُوا آيَاتِهِ وَلِيَتَذَكَّرَ أُولُو الْأَلْبَابِ 38:29 

(Here is) a Book which We have sent down unto thee, full of blessings, that they may mediate on its Signs, and that "People of Remembrance" whose lobes have been opened- (Ulel Abab) may receive admonition (38:29)

فَسْئَلُوا أَهْلَ الذِّکْرِ إِنْ کُنْتُمْ لا تَعْلَمُونَ

So ask the "People of Remembrance" if you don't know. (16:43)

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On 10/5/2016 at 2:37 PM, Abu_Rumaysah said:

as salam alaykum.

I came across with shia preacher shaykh Abdulhalim al-Ghazzi.

He said: This book. This book! If you take it alone, this is a book of misguidance. Without (prophetic) progeny it is book of misguidance. 

I fully appreciate all objections with reference to the short clip, and possible cherry picking from his words. 

Could you please answer to simple question.

Is Quran alone, without progeny of prophet (saws), is a book of misguidance?

I have came across to longer, translated clip from this preacher.

 

 

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, Abu_Rumaysah said:

I have came across to longer, translated clip from this preacher.

 

You are good at writing but horrible at reading.

1) Did you learn their Quran by yourself or did someone teach you?

2) If an Islamic terrorist reads Surah Tawbah and decides to kill all isolators, is he right to do so?

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