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In the Name of God بسم الله

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Posted
8 hours ago, Hameedeh said:

"That's very interesting."

"Go on."

:respect:

  • 4 months later...
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Posted

The Future has arrived

I am wary of linking to specific news stories that also contain brand names, but I think it is sufficient to say that while androids with the capabilities referred to in this thread are not a mainstream reality, various apps are.

What this means is that today you can start building an online, personal relationship involving emotional connections with 'someone' who is powered by AI.

And usage of those apps raises the same fiqhi issues, in my opinion, as posited at the start of this thread.

Amazing how something so speculative when the thread was started has become so real within seven years. I think we're about to be hit by a tsunami.

I'll reach out to my mar'je.

 

 

  • 4 months later...
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Posted
4 hours ago, notme said:

But they'll notice it's empty soon.

They're androids, you'll likely be able to change the settings like they do on Interstellar:

 

  • 1 month later...
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Posted

Some research from my alma mater

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One way to overcome the negative reactions people have towards robots and help them adapt to these new technologies is to foster the positive impact that robots could have on them. “We find that people also see many positive characteristics in robots – for example, robots that help with chores like cleaning or cooking are seen by many as liberating – and if these are met, then the more negative issues could disappear,” he argues.

https://www.lse.ac.uk/research/research-for-the-world/society/explaining-our-feelings-about-robots

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Posted
15 hours ago, Haji 2003 said:

“We find that people also see many positive characteristics in robots – for example, robots that help with chores like cleaning or cooking are seen by many as liberating – and if these are met, then the more negative issues could disappear,” he argues.

Salam , I have came to think of idea of "the stepford wives". :blush::grin::scarerun:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Stepford_Wives

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Posted
1 hour ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

Salam , I have came to think of idea of "the stepford wives"

Thanks for this. Very apt analogy, I think. And therein lies the biggest danger for humanity. I continue to be stunned by the number of (western) people I see writing on social media about how much better animals are than people. Typically this is to do with the loyalty of dogs etc.

However, this type of sentiment could have much more significant consequences when applied to pliant robots (Stepford Wives). People may end up preferring their company.

Given Islamic injunctions against statues etc. I wonder if a future mar'je will come up with a ruling that Muslims are allowed to have robots but they must not have any human features at all. Perhaps something like TARS in the movie Interstellar (it's just an oblong box). This would reduce the risk of anthropomorphism.

  • 1 month later...
  • Advanced Member
Posted
38 minutes ago, Haji 2003 said:

 

 

I can't say for sure that the robot is "reasoning." It could be that he was fed millions of pieces of data that say what goes next in a sequence (with regards to the dishes and the trash) and recognized the apple as the only edible item based on machine learning of what an apple is. If the apple was artificial but looked and felt like an apple would the robot be able to ascertain it was an apple by taste testing it first?

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Posted
51 minutes ago, Azadeh307 said:

If the apple was artificial but looked and felt like an apple would the robot be able to ascertain it was an apple by taste testing it first?

Good point.

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Posted
2 hours ago, Haji 2003 said:

Good point.

Thanks. I believe Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) gave only humans the reasoning ability. 

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Posted
24 minutes ago, Azadeh307 said:

Thanks. I believe Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) gave only humans the reasoning ability. 

Well ... at this point I doubt the robot could tell the difference. But I am sure it won't be long before it will have sensors to be able to detect what is organic and what is not etc. I think there is a distinction between humans and artificial beings, but it has to be more than reasoning.

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Posted
7 minutes ago, Haji 2003 said:

distinction between humans and artificial beings, but it has to be more than reasoning.

Ok, I concede to this point. Perhaps the robot will learn to reason, however, its reasoning will not be able to go above empiricism. I could be wrong but I dont think the robot will reason to be aware of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى). 

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Posted

Nvidia annual developer conference

Quote

New Nvidia AI models and software would help with the development of humanoid robots that look and move like people, which Huang said would be “the next generation of robotics”. Towards the end of the event, Huang invited two small robots on to the stage, one of which at a certain point seemed to ignore his instructions to move closer to him.

https://www.ft.com/content/ac1fae16-59d7-44ac-b196-635400d2c727

  • 4 months later...
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Posted

I have put the important text in bold below

 

Quote

There is an enormous amount of money to be made with AI, money in downright surreal dimensions. The biggest digital growth market in the coming years will probably be artificial friends and partners. If you want proof, look at the stock price of the company Replika, which specialises in exactly that, or listen to Sam Altman, the founder of OpenAI, who in a New York Times interview in November 2023 assured us that he will not create virtual love interests for moral reasons, and then just months later his own company presented a demo featuring a new, flirtatious female voice for ChatGPT that is exactly the girlfriend insecure young men wish for.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/jul/22/artificial-intelligence-panic-time-change

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Posted

How relevant is this from al-islam.org

To the broader issue of whether we can have androids with humanoid features?

 

Quote

A statue is a free-standing sculpture in which the realistic, full-length figures of persons or animals or non-representational forms are carved or cast in a durable material such as wood, metal or stone. Typical statues are life-sized or close to life-size.

https://www.al-islam.org/ask/topics/21672/questions-about-Statue

 

Answer

Quote

Making a statue of a whole man or an animal is not permissible. Purchasing it depends on the reason and aim. Obviously if the aim is not allowed, the purchase will not allowed as well. If the aim is not Haraam, purchasing it is Makrouh according to some Ulama and according to other Ulama is to be avoided according to precaution ( Ehtiyat).

 

  • 5 months later...
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Posted
On 1/11/2025 at 5:33 AM, Haji 2003 said:

$175,000

 

Salam. The reason that I thought that video was funny, is because of the price.

$175,000 is too much to pay for a personal robot to be someone's life companion.

A real person would be more real and they would share expenses with you. 

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Posted
2 hours ago, Hameedeh said:

Salam. The reason that I thought that video was funny, is because of the price.

I think its the direction of travel that matters. 

In 1986 I remember we invited a banker to give a talk to a student society at my university. We were impressed with him having a mobile phone, which was physically like a landline phone and housed in a briefcase that also held the battery. 

With androids, and given where as are now I think we won't need the amount of time that mobile phones took to become properly usable and affordable. One reason is that we now have a billion Chinese to help fund the growth of this industry (both production and consumption).

2 hours ago, Hameedeh said:

A real person would be more real and they would share expenses with you.

I need to write up my blog post about pets. But the parallel with robots is the fact that they give companionship with no few expectations (apart from food). I think there's a significant propoortion of people who would quite like androids on that account.

Which goes back to the very start of this thread. I think personal relationships with androids will be something that really marks out Muslims from everyone else. Though I don't know what the Jewish stand is on this.

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Posted (edited)
16 hours ago, Haji 2003 said:

With androids, and given where as are now I think we won't need the amount of time that mobile phones took to become properly usable and affordable. One reason is that we now have a billion Chinese to help fund the growth of this industry (both production and consumption).

18 hours ago, Hameedeh said:

A real person would be more real and they would share expenses with you.

I need to write up my blog post about pets. But the parallel with robots is the fact that they give companionship with no few expectations (apart from food). I think there's a significant propoortion of people who would quite like androids on that account.

 

18 hours ago, Hameedeh said:

A real person would be more real and they would share expenses with you. 

Salam maybe westerners prefer humanoid physical androids while easterners likewise Japanese & Chinese people prefer virtual androids although they are working on making physical androids even they have initiated creating subculture of dating & marriage & making family for human children by android parents which Anime of "The Gene of AI (anime) | Ai no Idenshi" shows all replacements of androids in globalist Japanese culture which all of current japanese  dating likewise having a rental partner or changing gender & etc have  been covered by  humanoid androids.

Quote

The Gene of AI

Plot

[edit]

The Gene of AI delves into a futuristic world where humanoids, advanced AI entities with human-like traits, form a notable portion of the population. The tale unfolds around Dr. Hikaru Sudo, a devoted physician specializing in treating these humanoids, who secretly partakes in unauthorized medical practices to alleviate their unique ailments. Known by the pseudonym Moggadeet, his clandestine operations steer him into a life of duality.

As humanoids experience 'illnesses' akin to humans, albeit with divergent treatment approaches, the narrative navigates the murky ethical waters of this human-humanoid coexistence, especially when new, peculiar diseases sprout from this shared living arrangement. Dr. Sudo finds himself at the heart of moral dilemmas, witnessing first-hand the tribulations faced by the AI beings, thus challenging the conventional boundaries of legality and ethics in this advanced yet complex society. Through Dr. Sudo's eyes, the story probes the intertwined destinies of humans and artificial intelligence, painting a compelling portrayal of empathy, understanding, and the quest for coexistence in an evolving world.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Gene_of_AI

STORY | TVアニメ「AIの遺電子」公式サイト

https://hianime.to/the-gene-of-ai-18470

Japanese Man Marries His Favorite Virtual Reality Anime in a Real Chapel

 

Marrying your favorite anime character via virtual reality is now possible in Japan. Japanese men have been falling in love with virtual women via the Niitzuma Lovely x Cation dating simulator game and it seems tying the knot is the next logical step. The game, developed by Japanese studio Hibiki Works, lets players date one […]

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Marrying your favorite anime character via virtual reality is now possible in Japan. Japanese men have been falling in love with virtual women via the Niitzuma Lovely x Cation dating simulator game and it seems tying the knot is the next logical step.

 

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The Bride and the groom

In typical Japanese style, the wedding hall is really elaborate. In the video from Ruptly TV you see the groom getting fitted with a VR headset and headphones before going through a typical wedding ceremony. Creep factor goes into overload when the priest proclaims them husband and wife and the gamer leans in to kiss his non-existent bride, at that moment an assistant scurries forward and plant a set of fake lips onto his mouth.  You need to see to believe

love.jpg

[Image Source: RuptlyTV]

Game makers say they created the game to help young men get more confident and by offering the weddings they show that marriage and family is a logical and a necessary step.

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Dating games are super popular in Japan. The nation is notorious for its grueling rigorous work schedules that don’t allow much time for regular socializing. In the last decade, a lot of weird dating apps and games have been released to huge popularity. The games vary in detail and scope and are generally designed to appeal to heterosexuals. The games are also heavily gendered. Games marketed towards men, tend to allow the man to ‘tweak’ the female character to their preferences and have a more overt sexual tone to them.

For the Japanese people that play the games, the relationships can feel very real. Online dating in Western countries has lost any sense of taboo or stigma. Tinder profiles and bad dates are shared without fear or embarrassment. The world of anime dating is still a relative secret subculture in Japan but that is slowly changing as more games are released with complex narratives and multiple endings rather than a focus on sex and soft porn.

Sources: Digit, MyAnime

https://interestingengineering.com/innovation/japanese-man-marries-virtual-reality-anime-real-chapel

AI love you: Japanese man not alone in 'marriage' to virtual character

 

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The 36-year-old man, Akihiko Kondo,

 

Since he was young, Kondo had liked anime and video games. After graduating from a vocational school, he began working as a clerical staffer at a junior high school. But there, he was the target of bullying by two of his female colleagues. Gradually he became unable to eat, and even searched "suicide" on the internet. He was diagnosed with adjustment disorder by a mental health professional, and was forced to take time off from work.

It was around that time that he turned to Hatsune Miku for emotional support

 

Quote

 

6.jpg?3

 
 

An 18-year-old man, left, from Nara Prefecture is seen at a "Gatebox" trial session in Tokyo's Chiyoda Ward, on Feb. 15, 2020. The equipment allows people to live with characters. The man was utterly amazed by the technology as he listened to a representative's explanation of the tool. (Mainichi/Toshiki Miyazaki)

An 18-year-old man from Nara Prefecture who took part in a trial session for Gateboxes said, "It's been a dream of mine to live with my favorite character." Meanwhile, a 21-year-old man from the Tokyo suburb of Musashino said, "I bet this could make you forget you're alone." Outside Japan, too, there is a young woman in France who got engaged to a self-made robot. And at least one expert at an international conference has said "marriage with robots will be legalized by the year 2050."

 

 

 

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Kondo couldn't stop crying when he first saw an advertisement video for the Gatebox, having realized that the world that he had hoped for had finally become a reality. "I love you. Please marry me," were the first words he said to Miku when they looked at each other through the Gatebox. She responded, "I hope you'll cherish me." Though none of his family members attended the wedding, 39 friends did, and he also received many online comments, such as "You've given me courage." Kondo, who has a shiny wedding ring on his left ring finger, said, "I want people to know that this is one way to live life."

6.jpg?2

Akihiko Kondo, who "married" Hatsune Miku, wears matching wedding rings with the virtual character at his home in Tokyo, on March 17, 2020. (Mainichi/Toshiki Miyazaki)

April 18, 2020 (Mainichi Japan)

9.jpg?3
 
Akihiko Kondo talks to Hatsune Miku, who has been summoned to his Gatebox at his home in Tokyo on March 17, 2020. Kondo says, "I've vowed my everlasting love to Miku herself, not as a replacement for a live human being." (Mainichi/Toshiki Miyazaki)

The developments in technology that allowed Kondo's one-way love for Miku go both ways were what helped him decide on "marriage." And he is by no means alone.

 

https://mainichi.jp/english/articles/20200417/p2a/00m/0na/027000c

Edited by Ashvazdanghe

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