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Aabiss_Shakari

Why Wilayat Must Be Divine?

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Asslamoalaikum, 

Allah Almighty says in Quran:-

In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful

1. By the star when it goes down.
2. Indeed, your companion [Prophet Muhammad (S)] has neither gone astray nor has erred.

After this Allah presented a strong argument that why Prophet PBUH never go astray.

3. Nor does he speak of concupiscent desire.
4. His word is only a Revelation revealed to him.

So the Prophet never went astray because He PBUH never speaks of his desire and his word is only revelation revealed to him.

According to Shia school of thought the appointment of successor of Prophet PBUH was done through revelation. When Quran 5:67 revealed, Prophet PBUH declared Ali a.s as His successor.

Sunni side is already in defensive mode. They straightway admit that Abu Bakar was not divinely appointed (because they have no other choice). But is this a strong stand? The answer is "no" because if something in religion is not in line of revelation from Allah, that is beyond any doubt a path of destruction and astray. Now we have two choices:-

1. Prophet PBUH did not appoint a successor. It means any appointment made afterwards is not in line with revelation of Allah hence is wrong and unislamic and path of astray.

2. Prophet PBUH did appoint a successor as per Allah's revelation. Then it will mean going against that revelation is against Islam.

At the end one can safely say that anything in religion without divine revelation is a path of astray and deviation.

Edited by Aabiss_Shakari

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18 minutes ago, Aabiss_Shakari said:

 

19 minutes ago, Aabiss_Shakari said:

Sunni side is already in defensive mode. They straightway admit that Abu Bakar was not divinely appointed (because they have no other choice). But is this a strong stand? The answer is "no" because if something in religion is not in line of revelation from Allah, that is beyond any doubt a path of destruction and astray.

At the end one can safely say that anything in religion without divine revelation is a path of astray and deviation.

So as per your definition Wilyat-e-Faqih by Iranian scholars is also a path of destruction and astray since it is also not divine in nature?

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4 minutes ago, investigating said:

So as per your definition Wilyat-e-Faqih by Iranian scholars is also a path of destruction and astray since it is also not divine in nature?

Wilayat ul Faqih is a concept based on saying of Imams a.s that "We are hujjat from Allah on you and our scholars are hujjat on you from us".

We must keep on mind that Wilayt has different stages. Even a father is Wali for his children. When we talk about " Wilayat must be divine", we actually mean wilayat of Prophet PBUH. In the presence of Imam a.s there is no wilayat superior to him. Because he is having divine status of wilayat. However he may appoint his wali at different parts of his state.

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27 minutes ago, Aabiss_Shakari said:

Wilayat ul Faqih is a concept based on saying of Imams a.s that "We are hujjat from Allah on you and our scholars are hujjat on you from us".

We must keep on mind that Wilayt has different stages. Even a father is Wali for his children. When we talk about " Wilayat must be divine", we actually mean wilayat of Prophet PBUH. In the presence of Imam a.s there is no wilayat superior to him. Because he is having divine status of wilayat. However he may appoint his wali at different parts of his state.

Have a look on your statement again:

Sunni side is already in defensive mode. They straightway admit that Abu Bakar was not divinely appointed (because they have no other choice). But is this a strong stand? The answer is "no" because if something in religion is not in line of revelation from Allah, that is beyond any doubt a path of destruction and astray.

Sunni doesn't consider the system of Caliphate to be divine in nature because there is no revelation of Qur'an talking about divine appointment of anyone after Prophet (saw). In the same way Shia brothers don't consider the Wilayat-e-faqih to be Divine in nature .. So if the NON-DIVINE leadership system leads to path of destruction and astray it should apply to Wilayat-e-Faqih as well.

Edited by investigating

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MUHSIN KHAN - Say: "Allah knows best how long they stayed. With Him is (the knowledge of) the unseen of the heavens and the earth. How clearly He sees, and hears (everything)! They have no Wali (Helper, Disposer of affairs, Protector, etc.) other than Him, and He makes none to share in His Decision and His Rule." [al-Kahf: 26]

Allah's divine rule encompasses the authority of his Hujjaj on earth, whether it's the authority of the prophets or their successors (Khulafah). This includes the Khalifate of prophet Muhammad (saw) because based on Ahadith and Ayah 59 of Surat an-Nisa, the successor of the prophet is the Hujjah of Allah on earth and we must obey him just as we must obey the prophet and Allah. He inherits the authority of the prophet and acts as the representative of Allah on earth and judges only based on what Allah orders him and not via his fallible Ijtihad. This can only be an infallible person like the Prophet whom Allah Himself appoints on His behalf to govern the affairs of the people of his time.

 

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On 29/09/2016 at 5:03 PM, Al-Hassan said:

MUHSIN KHAN - Say: "Allah knows best how long they stayed. With Him is (the knowledge of) the unseen of the heavens and the earth. How clearly He sees, and hears (everything)! They have no Wali (Helper, Disposer of affairs, Protector, etc.) other than Him, and He makes none to share in His Decision and His Rule." [al-Kahf: 26]

Allah's divine rule encompasses the authority of his Hujjaj on earth, whether it's the authority of the prophets or their successors (Khulafah). This includes the Khalifate of prophet Muhammad (saw) because based on Ahadith and Ayah 59 of Surat an-Nisa, the successor of the prophet is the Hujjah of Allah on earth and we must obey him just as we must obey the prophet and Allah. He inherits the authority of the prophet and acts as the representative of Allah on earth and judges only based on what Allah orders him and not via his fallible Ijtihad. This can only be an infallible person like the Prophet whom Allah Himself appoints on His behalf to govern the affairs of the people of his time.

 

 

Nicely done!

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Whatever palm-tree you cut down or leave standing upon its roots, It is by Allah's command, and that He may abase the transgressors. 59:5

When Prophet(saw) didn't cut even  the palm-tree or leave standing it  without the command from Allah.

What enabled the Messenger of Allah(saw) to stop at ghadeer and deliver a sermon?

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2:124..And when his Lord tried Ibrahim with certain words, he fulfilled them. He said: Surely I will make you an Imam of men. Ibrahim said: And of my offspring? My covenant does not include the unjust, said He.

What could be more divine than this where even the Prophet does not have a choice, yes he can make a request but the way Allah(swt) wants to fulfil the request is entirely up to Him.

Where did choice ever come from?

The WF concept is based on sayings of the Imam(as) in his capacity as the Divine Guide. 

Would you rather be ruled by a person who is unaware of the rules of halal/haram or by someone who is and has piety to go with it, this is not a choice but based on ILM.

As long as there is the shaytan to misguide you there should and has to be a Hujjah, the Wali( I am talking of the infallible Imam(as) here) to be a guide. What you follow is your choice.

And please don't even go down the ghayba route for have you ever seen Iblees, yet you believe in him.

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WF is an effort by people to implement Islam. However, in my understanding of Quran, it commands all people to be Rabaniyoon, so the model that some should be Fuqaha and that Fuqaha rule over others, is wrong in my view. It's perhaps the most destructive thing in religion, and I disbelieve in Taqleed and also believe in an organized democratic anarchy with whole society being fuqaha and coming together to judge by what God reveal through sincere council to one another.

This system is true with Imam or not with Imam present, because even when Imams are present, without this structure, truth would be mixed with falsehood, liars attributing things to Imams would be followed, and ignorance would not be distinguished from knowledge.

The difference when an Imam is present, it is easier for people to achieve this guidance and come to the door that Allah entered.

However, it is possible without him present as well, because he is still the eyes to see and ears to hear the Quran by, and understand the wisdom/sunnah.

 

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