Some lesser known [untold] facts about 12th Imam

[Fahad Sani]

Assalam-o-Alaikum, wa Rehmatullah, wa Barakatuhu.

ARE THESE NARRATIONS ABOUT 12TH IMAM AUTHENTIC? ANSWER WITH EVIDENCES?

All below narrations are taken from Kitab al-Ghaybah or The Book of Occultation of Sheikh Abu Abdullah Muhammad bin Ibraheem bin Ja'far al-Katib Known as Ibn Abu Zaynab an-Numani, earliest and most important shia work on occultation of 12th Imam. Same book was totaly included by Baqir Majlisi in his Bihar ul Anwar volumes 51, 52, & 53. All prominent shia scholars have narrated from this book. Like Toosi, Hurr Amili etc.

Online: https://www.al-islam.org/kitab-al-ghayba-book-occultation-sheikh-an-numani
Download: http://alhassanain.org/english/?com=book&id=903

About the author (Numani)

Sheikh Numani got most of his knowledge from Yaqoob Kulayni, author of Al-Kafi. He wrote many books, Jami’ul Akhbar, Ar-Radd ala (answering) al-Isma’eeliyya, Al-Ghayba, Al-Fara’idh, Nathrul La’ali. He finished this book till 342 AH, he died in 360 AH, much before Sheikh Sadooq and Sheikh Toosi.

An-Najashi said about him: “He is a sheikh (teacher) from among our companions. He is great in position, noble in rank, loyal in faith and he has narrated many traditions.”

Al-Mahoozi said: “He is praiseworthy, lofty and one of the sheikhs, who give permission (who evidence others’ knowledge or works).”

About the book (Ghaybah)

Al-Hurr al-Aamily said: “It is good and sufficient.”
Al-Mahoozi said: “It has many benefits and unheard traditions.”

 

From Chapter 13: Al-Qaim’s aspects and deeds

(16) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed bin Oqda narrated from Ali bin al-Hasan from Muhammad bin Khalid from Tha’laba bin Maymoon that al-Hasan bin Haroon had said:
Once I was sitting with Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) when al-Mu’alla bin Khunays asked him: “Will al-Qa'im (as), when he appears, act unlike the way, in which Ali (as) has acted?”
He said: “Yes, he will. Ali has acted with leniency and forgiving because he has known that his Shia are going to be controlled after him. But al-Qa'im (as), when appears, will kill and capture because he knows that his Shia will not be defeated after him forever.”

(18) Ali bin al-Husayn narrated from Muhammad bin Yahya al-Attar from Muhammad bin Hassaan ar-Razi from Muhammad bin Ali al-Kufi from Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Abu Nasr from al-Ala’ fro Muhammad bin Muslim that Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) had said:
“If people know what al-Qa'im (as) will do when he appears, most of them will wish he would not appear. He kills great numbers of people. He begins with the people of Quraysh. He kills much many of them until many people say: He is not from Muhammad’s progeny. If he is from Muhammad’s progeny, he will be merciful!”

(19) Ali bin al-Husayn narrated from Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Abu Nasr from Aasim bin Hameed al-Hannat from Abu Baseer that Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) had said:
“Al-Qa'im will rise with a new task, new principles and new judgements. He will be severe with the Arabs. He will do not but killing. He will not forgive anyone and he will not care for any blame because he acts for the sake of Allah.

(22) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed narrated from Yahya bin Zakariyya bin Shayban from Yousuf bin Kulayb from al-Hasan bin Ali bin Abu Hamza from Aasim bin Hameed al-Hannat that Abu Hamza ath-Thimali had heard Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) saying:
“When al-Qa'im of Muhammad’s family appears, Allah will support him with His angels. Gabriel will be in front of him, Michael on the right and Israfel on the left. Terror will precede him about a month-travel before him, behind him, on the right side and on the left side. The close angels will be beside him. The first one to follow him will be Muhammad (as) and the second one will be Ali (as). With his sword he will conquer Rome, Daylam,51 Sind, India, Kabul and the area of the Caspian.

Other sources:
(16). Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.353, Hilyatul Abrar, vol.2 p.628.
(18). Iqd ad-Durar p.227, Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.539, Hilyatul Abrar, vol.2 p.629, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.354, Bisharatul Islam p.263, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.304.
(19). Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.540, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.354, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.253.
(22). Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.540, Biharul Anwar, vol.52, 349, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.183.

From Chapter 16: Forbidding timing and naming al-Qaim

(1) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed narrated from Ali bin al-Hasan from al-Hasan bin Ali bin Yousuf from Muhammad bin Ali from Sa’dan bin Muslim that Abu Baseer had said:
I said to Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as): “Does this matter (the appearance of al-Mahdi) not have an end so that we relieve ourselves?”
He said: “Yes, it does. But you (people) announced it; therefore Allah put it off.”

(10) Muhammad bin Ya'qoob al-Kulayni narrated from Ali bin Muhammad and Muhammad bin al-Hasan from Sahl bin Ziyad and Muhammad bin Yahya from Ahmad bin Muhammad from al-Hasan bin Mahboob that Abu Hamza ath-Thimali had heard Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) saying:
“Allah had timed this matter to occur in the year seventy (A.H.) but when al-Husayn (as) was killed, He became so angry and put it off until the year one hundred and forty. We told you of that and you announced it and uncovered the secret, so after that Allah did not reveal any timing to us concerning this matter. Allah said: (Allah makes to pass away and establishes what He pleases, and with Him is the basis of the Book).15”
Abu Hamza said: “I told Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) of that and he said: “Yes, it was so.”

(15) Muhammad bin Ya'qoob narrated from al-Husayn bin Muhammad from Ja'far bin Muhammad from al-Qassim bin Issma'eel al-Anbari from al-Hasan bin Ali from Ibraheem bin Muhzim from his father that Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) had said when the (Abbasid) rulers had been mentioned before him:
“People21 perished because they hastened this matter (deliverance). Allah does not become hasty just because that people urge on their matters to be achieved. This matter (the appearance of al-Qa'im) has a precise time that it must reach. If it reaches its time, it will occur neither an hour sooner nor an hour later.”

Other sources:
(1). Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.117.
(10). Al-Kafi, vol.1 p.368, Tafseer of al-Ayyashi, vol.2 p.218, Ithbat al-Wassiyya p.131, al-Ghayba by at-Toossi p.,428, al-Khara'ij wel Jara'ih, vol.1 p.178, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.261.6.
(15). Al-Kafi, vol.1 p.369, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.118, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.418.

From Chapter 20: The army of anger

(5) Abu Sulayman Ahmad bin Hawtha al-Bahili narrated from Ibraheem bin Iss’haq an-Nahawandi from Abdullah bin Hammad al-Ansari from Abdullah bin Bukayr that Abban bin Taghlub had said:
“One day I was with Ja'far bin Muhammad as-Sadiq (as) in a mosque in Mecca. He said to me: “O Abban, Allah will bring three hundred and thirteen men in this mosque. The people of Mecca know that neither their (those men’s) fathers nor grandfathers have been created yet. They will come with their swords on their shoulders. On each sword the name of its keeper, his father’s name, his aspect and lineage are written. Then a caller will call out: “This is al-Mahdi. He judges with the judgments of Prophet David (as) and Prophet Solomon (as). He is not asked to show evidence for his judgements.”

Other source:
(15). Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.546, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.4 p.11.

From Chapter 21: The Shia when al-Qaim appears

(1) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed bin Oqda narrated from Hameed bin Ziyad from Ali bin as-Sabah from Abu Ali al-Hasan bin Muhammad al-Hadhrami from Ja'far bin Muhammad from Ibraheem bin Abdul Hameed from someone that Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) had said:
“When al-Qa'im (as) appears, those, who have thought themselves as his followers, will apostatize and those, who are somehow like the worshippers of the sun and the moon, will believe in him.”

(3) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed narrated from Ali bin al-Hasan at-Taymali from al-Hasan and Muhammad, the sons of Ali bin Yousuf, from Sa’dan bin Muslim from Sabah al-Muzni from al-Harith bin Haseera from Habba al-Orani that Amirul Mo'mineen (as) had said:
“As if I see our Shia in the mosque of Kufa setting up pavilions to teach the people the Qur'an as it has been revealed but when our Qa’im appears, he will destroy it (the mosque) and level its mihrab to the ground.”

Other sources:
(1). Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.363, Bisharatul Islam p.222, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.501.
(3). Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.364, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.126.

From Chapter 26: The period of al-Qaim’s rule

(1) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed bin Oqda narrated from Ali bin al-Hasan at-Taymali from al-Hasan bin Ali bin Yousuf from his father and Muhammad bin Ali from his father from Ahmad bin Umar al-Halabi from Hamza bin Hamran from Abdullah bin Abu Ya’foor that Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) had said:
“Al-Qa'im (as) will rule for nineteen years and some months.”

(3) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed narrated from Muhammad bin al-Mufadhdhal bin Ibraheem bin Qays from Sa’dan bin Iss’haq bin Sa'eed, Ahmad bin al-Husayn bin Abdul Melik az-Zayyat and Muhammad bin Ahmad bin al-Hasan al-Qatawani from al-Hasan bin Mahboob from Amr bin Thabit that Jabir bin Yazeed al-Ju’fi had said:
“I heard Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) saying: “By Allah, a man from us, Ahlul Bayt, will rule for three hundred and thirteen years and then for other nine years.”
I asked him: “When will that be?”
He said: “After the death of al-Qa'im (as).”
I said: “How long will al-Qa'im rule until he dies?”
He said: “It will be nineteen years since his rising until the day of his death.”

Other sources:
(1). Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.547, Hilyatul Abrar, vol.2 p.640, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.298, ar-Raj’a p.133, Bisharatul Islam p.187, 188, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.4 p.76.
(3). Tafseer of al-Ayyashi, vol.2 p.326, al-khtisas p.257, al-Ghayba by at-Toossi p.478, Mukhtasar Basa’ir ad-Darajat p.38, 49, 213, Muntakhab al-Anwar al-Mudhee’a p.202, al-Eeqadh min al-Haj’a p.337, Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.557, Hilyatul Abrar, vol.2 p.640, Tafseer al-Burhan, vol.2 p.465, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.298, vol.53 p.100, 103, 146, ar-Raj’a p.71, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.329.

JAZAK Allah KHAIRAN.

Edited July 6, 2016 by Fahad Sani

[Ali6]

55 minutes ago, Fahad Sani said:

Imam Sadiq: "Al-Qa'im (as) will rule for nineteen years and some months.”

...

I said: “How long will al-Qa'im rule until he dies?”
He (Imam Baqir) said: “It will be nineteen years since his rising until the day of his death.”

I thought that the Qa'im will rule for 5-9 years. So how authentic are these narrations and do we have others that provide a different number? Jazak Allah

[wmehar2]

44 minutes ago, Fahad Sani said:

Assalam-o-Alaikum, wa Rehmatullah, wa Barakatuhu.

ARE THESE NARRATIONS ABOUT 12TH IMAM AUTHENTIC? ANSWER WITH EVIDENCES?

All below narrations are taken from Kitab al-Ghaybah or The Book of Occultation of Sheikh Abu Abdullah Muhammad bin Ibraheem bin Ja'far al-Katib Known as Ibn Abu Zaynab an-Numani, earliest and most important shia work on occultation of 12th Imam. Same book was totaly included by Baqir Majlisi in his Bihar ul Anwar volumes 51, 52, & 53. All prominent shia scholars have narrated from this book. Like Toosi, Hurr Amili etc.

Online: https://www.al-islam.org/kitab-al-ghayba-book-occultation-sheikh-an-numani
Download: http://alhassanain.org/english/?com=book&id=903

About the author (Numani)

Sheikh Numani got most of his knowledge from Yaqoob Kulayni, author of Al-Kafi. He wrote many books, Jami’ul Akhbar, Ar-Radd ala (answering) al-Isma’eeliyya, Al-Ghayba, Al-Fara’idh, Nathrul La’ali. He finished this book till 342 AH, he died in 360 AH, much before Sheikh Sadooq and Sheikh Toosi.

An-Najashi said about him: “He is a sheikh (teacher) from among our companions. He is great in position, noble in rank, loyal in faith and he has narrated many traditions.”

Al-Mahoozi said: “He is praiseworthy, lofty and one of the sheikhs, who give permission (who evidence others’ knowledge or works).”

About the book (Ghaybah)

Al-Hurr al-Aamily said: “It is good and sufficient.”
Al-Mahoozi said: “It has many benefits and unheard traditions.”

 

From Chapter 13: Al-Qaim’s aspects and deeds

(16) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed bin Oqda narrated from Ali bin al-Hasan from Muhammad bin Khalid from Tha’laba bin Maymoon that al-Hasan bin Haroon had said:
Once I was sitting with Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) when al-Mu’alla bin Khunays asked him: “Will al-Qa'im (as), when he appears, act unlike the way, in which Ali (as) has acted?”
He said: “Yes, he will. Ali has acted with leniency and forgiving because he has known that his Shia are going to be controlled after him. But al-Qa'im (as), when appears, will kill and capture because he knows that his Shia will not be defeated after him forever.”

(18) Ali bin al-Husayn narrated from Muhammad bin Yahya al-Attar from Muhammad bin Hassaan ar-Razi from Muhammad bin Ali al-Kufi from Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Abu Nasr from al-Ala’ fro Muhammad bin Muslim that Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) had said:
“If people know what al-Qa'im (as) will do when he appears, most of them will wish he would not appear. He kills great numbers of people. He begins with the people of Quraysh. He kills much many of them until many people say: He is not from Muhammad’s progeny. If he is from Muhammad’s progeny, he will be merciful!”

(19) Ali bin al-Husayn narrated from Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Abu Nasr from Aasim bin Hameed al-Hannat from Abu Baseer that Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) had said:
“Al-Qa'im will rise with a new task, new principles and new judgements. He will be severe with the Arabs. He will do not but killing. He will not forgive anyone and he will not care for any blame because he acts for the sake of Allah.

(22) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed narrated from Yahya bin Zakariyya bin Shayban from Yousuf bin Kulayb from al-Hasan bin Ali bin Abu Hamza from Aasim bin Hameed al-Hannat that Abu Hamza ath-Thimali had heard Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) saying:
“When al-Qa'im of Muhammad’s family appears, Allah will support him with His angels. Gabriel will be in front of him, Michael on the right and Israfel on the left. Terror will precede him about a month-travel before him, behind him, on the right side and on the left side. The close angels will be beside him. The first one to follow him will be Muhammad (as) and the second one will be Ali (as). With his sword he will conquer Rome, Daylam,51 Sind, India, Kabul and the area of the Caspian.

Other sources:
(16). Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.353, Hilyatul Abrar, vol.2 p.628.
(18). Iqd ad-Durar p.227, Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.539, Hilyatul Abrar, vol.2 p.629, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.354, Bisharatul Islam p.263, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.304.
(19). Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.540, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.354, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.253.
(22). Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.540, Biharul Anwar, vol.52, 349, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.183.

From Chapter 16: Forbidding timing and naming al-Qaim

(1) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed narrated from Ali bin al-Hasan from al-Hasan bin Ali bin Yousuf from Muhammad bin Ali from Sa’dan bin Muslim that Abu Baseer had said:
I said to Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as): “Does this matter (the appearance of al-Mahdi) not have an end so that we relieve ourselves?”
He said: “Yes, it does. But you (people) announced it; therefore Allah put it off.”

(10) Muhammad bin Ya'qoob al-Kulayni narrated from Ali bin Muhammad and Muhammad bin al-Hasan from Sahl bin Ziyad and Muhammad bin Yahya from Ahmad bin Muhammad from al-Hasan bin Mahboob that Abu Hamza ath-Thimali had heard Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) saying:
“Allah had timed this matter to occur in the year seventy (A.H.) but when al-Husayn (as) was killed, He became so angry and put it off until the year one hundred and forty. We told you of that and you announced it and uncovered the secret, so after that Allah did not reveal any timing to us concerning this matter. Allah said: (Allah makes to pass away and establishes what He pleases, and with Him is the basis of the Book).15”
Abu Hamza said: “I told Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) of that and he said: “Yes, it was so.”

(15) Muhammad bin Ya'qoob narrated from al-Husayn bin Muhammad from Ja'far bin Muhammad from al-Qassim bin Issma'eel al-Anbari from al-Hasan bin Ali from Ibraheem bin Muhzim from his father that Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) had said when the (Abbasid) rulers had been mentioned before him:
“People21 perished because they hastened this matter (deliverance). Allah does not become hasty just because that people urge on their matters to be achieved. This matter (the appearance of al-Qa'im) has a precise time that it must reach. If it reaches its time, it will occur neither an hour sooner nor an hour later.”

Other sources:
(1). Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.117.
(10). Al-Kafi, vol.1 p.368, Tafseer of al-Ayyashi, vol.2 p.218, Ithbat al-Wassiyya p.131, al-Ghayba by at-Toossi p.,428, al-Khara'ij wel Jara'ih, vol.1 p.178, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.261.6.
(15). Al-Kafi, vol.1 p.369, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.118, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.418.

From Chapter 20: The army of anger

(5) Abu Sulayman Ahmad bin Hawtha al-Bahili narrated from Ibraheem bin Iss’haq an-Nahawandi from Abdullah bin Hammad al-Ansari from Abdullah bin Bukayr that Abban bin Taghlub had said:
“One day I was with Ja'far bin Muhammad as-Sadiq (as) in a mosque in Mecca. He said to me: “O Abban, Allah will bring three hundred and thirteen men in this mosque. The people of Mecca know that neither their (those men’s) fathers nor grandfathers have been created yet. They will come with their swords on their shoulders. On each sword the name of its keeper, his father’s name, his aspect and lineage are written. Then a caller will call out: “This is al-Mahdi. He judges with the judgments of Prophet David (as) and Prophet Solomon (as). He is not asked to show evidence for his judgements.”

Other source:
(15). Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.546, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.4 p.11.

From Chapter 21: The Shia when al-Qaim appears

(1) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed bin Oqda narrated from Hameed bin Ziyad from Ali bin as-Sabah from Abu Ali al-Hasan bin Muhammad al-Hadhrami from Ja'far bin Muhammad from Ibraheem bin Abdul Hameed from someone that Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) had said:
“When al-Qa'im (as) appears, those, who have thought themselves as his followers, will apostatize and those, who are somehow like the worshippers of the sun and the moon, will believe in him.”

(3) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed narrated from Ali bin al-Hasan at-Taymali from al-Hasan and Muhammad, the sons of Ali bin Yousuf, from Sa’dan bin Muslim from Sabah al-Muzni from al-Harith bin Haseera from Habba al-Orani that Amirul Mo'mineen (as) had said:
“As if I see our Shia in the mosque of Kufa setting up pavilions to teach the people the Qur'an as it has been revealed but when our Qa’im appears, he will destroy it (the mosque) and level its mihrab to the ground.”

Other sources:
(1). Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.363, Bisharatul Islam p.222, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.501.
(3). Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.364, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.126.

From Chapter 26: The period of al-Qaim’s rule

(1) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed bin Oqda narrated from Ali bin al-Hasan at-Taymali from al-Hasan bin Ali bin Yousuf from his father and Muhammad bin Ali from his father from Ahmad bin Umar al-Halabi from Hamza bin Hamran from Abdullah bin Abu Ya’foor that Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) had said:
“Al-Qa'im (as) will rule for nineteen years and some months.”

(3) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed narrated from Muhammad bin al-Mufadhdhal bin Ibraheem bin Qays from Sa’dan bin Iss’haq bin Sa'eed, Ahmad bin al-Husayn bin Abdul Melik az-Zayyat and Muhammad bin Ahmad bin al-Hasan al-Qatawani from al-Hasan bin Mahboob from Amr bin Thabit that Jabir bin Yazeed al-Ju’fi had said:
“I heard Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) saying: “By Allah, a man from us, Ahlul Bayt, will rule for three hundred and thirteen years and then for other nine years.”
I asked him: “When will that be?”
He said: “After the death of al-Qa'im (as).”
I said: “How long will al-Qa'im rule until he dies?”
He said: “It will be nineteen years since his rising until the day of his death.”

Other sources:
(1). Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.547, Hilyatul Abrar, vol.2 p.640, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.298, ar-Raj’a p.133, Bisharatul Islam p.187, 188, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.4 p.76.
(3). Tafseer of al-Ayyashi, vol.2 p.326, al-khtisas p.257, al-Ghayba by at-Toossi p.478, Mukhtasar Basa’ir ad-Darajat p.38, 49, 213, Muntakhab al-Anwar al-Mudhee’a p.202, al-Eeqadh min al-Haj’a p.337, Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.557, Hilyatul Abrar, vol.2 p.640, Tafseer al-Burhan, vol.2 p.465, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.298, vol.53 p.100, 103, 146, ar-Raj’a p.71, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.329.

JAZAK Allah KHAIRAN.

It's easy to see if a Hadith is authentic by first checking contradictory notions with the Qu'ran, a merciless, unforgiving, killing Mahdi/Qaim (are they the same person?)... probably contradicts the Qu'ran in more ways than 10.   A man cannot live 313 years and rule, no such privilege was granted to our Prophet SAW.  There are some prophet's who have lived a long time and some continue to live (Isa ibn Maryam AS and al Khidr AS).  We all know Prophet Muhammad SAW was the last and final messenger and thus the seal, so no man can take on those qualities according to the Qu'ran.  Also killing those who are ignorant and have not had a chance to repent or learn the error of their ways is against the Qu'ran.  

" (10) Muhammad bin Ya'qoob al-Kulayni narrated from Ali bin Muhammad and Muhammad bin al-Hasan from Sahl bin Ziyad and Muhammad bin Yahya from Ahmad bin Muhammad from al-Hasan bin Mahboob that Abu Hamza ath-Thimali had heard Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) saying:
“Allah had timed this matter to occur in the year seventy (A.H.) but when al-Husayn (as) was killed, He became so angry and put it off until the year one hundred and forty. We told you of that and you announced it and uncovered the secret, so after that Allah did not reveal any timing to us concerning this matter. Allah said: (Allah makes to pass away and establishes what He pleases, and with Him is the basis of the Book).15”
Abu Hamza said: “I told Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) of that and he said: “Yes, it was so "

It doesn't make sense how these narrations could have came from the prophet SAW but none of the other trustworthy companions such as Bilal RA or Suhayb Ar Rumi spoke or mentioned of these, nor does it make sense for Allah SWT to know know an event that is to come, and yet be "angry" and delay something since He's know-er of the Past , Present and Future.   If you study vernacular/word usage and word order between already authenticated Jafar as Sadiq AS hadith, and compare it with these, you can easily tell they're not the same style. 

Truthfully, this all sounds like vengeful rhetoric to stimulate wrongs committed to the Shii' and console them.  The wordage here and style differs vastly from the manner of style in prose coming from Rasool's mouth, and the Qu'ran.   

[S.M.H.A.]

Qur'an Surah 18: al-Kahf (The Cave)

[Al Amir]

(18) Ali bin al-Husayn narrated from Muhammad bin Yahya al-Attar from Muhammad bin Hassaan ar-Razi from Muhammad bin Ali al-Kufi from Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Abu Nasr from al-Ala’ fro Muhammad bin Muslim that Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) had said:
“If people know what al-Qa'im (as) will do when he appears, most of them will wish he would not appear. He kills great numbers of people. He begins with the people of Quraysh. He kills much many of them until many people say: He is not from Muhammad’s progeny. If he is from Muhammad’s progeny, he will be merciful!”

JUST WHEN YOU THOUGHT JUSTICE WILL NOT NEVER BE DONE,Allah (AWJ) SENDS HIS CALIPH TO ESTABLISH JUSTICE IN THE SHARPEST MANNER !

YEAHHHH

Edited July 6, 2016 by Al Amir

[Al Amir]

56 minutes ago, Ali6 said:

I thought that the Qa'im will rule for 5-9 years. So how authentic are these narrations and do we have others that provide a different number? Jazak Allah

Be careful about the wording in the narration it says from the time of his rising ( in mecca) until his death 19 years will have elapsed, the period during which he will be in full control is not indicated here

[S.M.H.A.]

A part of the same sermon about the Imam al-Mahdi

منها:

He will be wearing the armour of wisdom, which he will have secured with all its conditions, such as full attention towards it, its (complete) knowledge and exclusive devotion to it. For him it is like a thing which he had lost and which he was then seeking, or a need which he was trying to fulfil. If Islam is in trouble he will feel forlorn like a traveller and like a (tired) camel beating the end of its tail and with its neck flattened on the ground. He is the last of Allah's proofs and one of the vicegerents of His prophets.

قَدْ لَبِسَ لِلْحِكْمَةِ جُنَّتَهَا، وَأَخَذَهَا بِجَمِيعِ أَدَبِهَا، مِنَ الاْقْبَالِ عَلَيهَا، وَالْمَعْرِفِةِ بهَا، وَالتَّفَرُّغِ لَهَا، فَهِيَ عِنْدَ نَفْسِهِ ضَالَّتُهُ الَّتِي يَطْلُبُهَا، وَحَاجَتُهُ الَّتِي يَسْأَلُ عَنْهَا، فَهُوُ مُغْتَرِبٌ إِذَا اغْتَرَبَ الاْسْلاَمُ، وَضَرَبَ بِعَسِيبِ ذَنَبِهِ وَأَلْصَقَ الاْرْضَ بِجِرَانِهِ، بَقِيَّةٌ مِنْ بَقَايَا حُجَّتِهِ، خَلِيفَةٌ مِنْ خَلاَئِفِ أَنْبِيَائِهِ.

https://www.al-islam.org/nahjul-balagha-part-1-sermons/sermon-182-praise-be-Allah-whom-return-all-creation#part-same-sermon-about-imam-al-mahdi

[S.M.H.A.]

2 hours ago, Fahad Sani said:

Assalam-o-Alaikum, wa Rehmatullah, wa Barakatuhu.

ARE THESE NARRATIONS ABOUT 12TH IMAM AUTHENTIC? ANSWER WITH EVIDENCES?

 

Only a learned scholar of Hadith Sciences  and one with complete understanding of the Religion and the last period will be able to respond to your unique inquiry.

As a layman, just curious, you do  not believe in Imam(as), so why the interest , and a particular interest in these type of hadiths dealing with killing and Terror? Just so you know, the words used back then, and the definitions attached with t h e words these days based on what is happening in the geopolitical arena may be very different.

[guest050817]

If you're not qualified, do not reply to the OP.

If you are qualified, i.e know this book, the authenticity, view of our prominent scholars, i.e brothers like Q'aim, then by all means address it.

But i don't see how layman like myself can.

[maes]

It is nonsenses to show Mahdi is a cruel murderer !

You should not believe what the nonsense exist in the book of Biharul Anwar or elsewhere !!

There are some hadithes in Biharul Anwar that means Mahdi is a cruel murderer.

Allah has bestowed wisdom to us !!! and those hadithes are there that we analyse them not to believe blindly.

There are many hadithes fabricated to ruin the reputation of Mahdi. Mahdi revives the Sunnah of Rasulullah, that is it. Rasulullah was the imam of mercy according to the sources of Shias.

 

Edited July 6, 2016 by maes

[Muslim2010]

I consider myself a student of religion and hadith but no authority on the subject in this forum. But  with the hadith quoting Imam Mahdi is that he will kill the people like imam Ali. it means that imam Ali killed only the disbelievers / kufars in the battles of badr, uhud, khandaq, khyber and others.

And imam Al Mahdi will do the same with the unbelievers / kufars or fellow of Dajjal of the time. No ambiguity i can find in it.

Wassalam

 

Edited July 7, 2016 by skamran110

[hadez803]

9 hours ago, maes said:

It is nonsenses to show Mahdi is a cruel murderer !

Definition of Murderer: "the unlawful premeditated killing of one person by another"

Imam Mahdi will only kill those that deserve to die according the ruling of God. This is not called "murder" it is called justice.

9 hours ago, maes said:

You should not believe what the nonsense exist in the book of Biharul Anwar or elsewhere !!

Watch your mouth.

 

9 hours ago, maes said:

There are many hadithes fabricated to ruin the reputation of Mahdi. Mahdi revives the Sunnah of Rasulullah, that is it. Rasulullah was the imam of mercy according to the sources of Shias.

 

Pointless argument. Rasoolallah had a mission and the Mahdi has another mission. The Mahdi will manifest God's mercy like Rasoolallah but he will also manifest his wrath. You think he woud indiscriminately kill people? He would only kill those that stand up against truth and deserve to go to hell anyway.

[Fahad Sani]

On 7/6/2016 at 11:33 PM, Ali6 said:

I thought that the Qa'im will rule for 5-9 years. So how authentic are these narrations and do we have others that provide a different number? Jazak Allah

Yes. There are many narrations on this subject. All give different answer. I think Imam will remain on earth for about 7 to 19 years. Based on most authentic narrations.

Other narrations:

Source: https://www.al-islam.org/an-overview-of-mahdi-s-government-najimuddin-tabasi/government-truth#period-rule

“His rule will be seven years and each year is equivalent to ten of your years. Therefore, the years of his rule will be equivalent to your seventy years.”38

Imam ‘Ali (‘a) said: “Hadrat al-Mahdi (‘atfs) will rule for seven years; every year in that time will be equal to ten years of yours.”39

The Holy Messenger of Allah (S) said: “The Mahdi (‘atfs) is from us… and for seven years he will take charge of affairs.”40

The Prophet (S) also said: “He will rule for seven years over this ummah.”41

The Messenger of Allah (S) also said elsewhere: “The tenure of rule of al-Mahdi (S) will be seven years at the shortest or it will last for eight or nine years at the longest.”42 It has also been reported: “Hadrat al-Mahdi (‘atfs) will rule in this world for nine years.”43

Jabir ibn ‘Abdullah al-Ansari asked Imam al-Baqir (‘a): “How many years will the Imam of the Time (‘atfs) live?” The Imam (‘a) replied: “From the day of the uprising till his demise will be nineteen years long.”44

The Messenger of Allah (S) said: “Hadrat al-Mahdi (‘atfs) will rule for twenty years. He will take out the treasures from the ground; he will conquer the lands of polytheism.”45

He (S) also said: “The Mahdi (‘atfs) is from my progeny and he will rule for twenty years.”46
It has also been reported: “The Imam (‘atfs) will rule for ten years.”47

In answer to the question on how many years the Mahdi (‘atfs) will rule, Hadrat ‘Ali (‘a) said: “He will rule over the people for thirty or forty years.”48

Imam as-Sadiq (‘a) said: “Hadrat al-Mahdi (‘atfs) will be from my progeny and his age will be equal to that of Ibrahim Khalil ar-Rahman (Prophet Abraham) (‘a). He will appear at the age of eighty years and rule for forty years.”49

The same Imam (‘a) also said: “The tenure of Hadrat al-Qa’im’s (‘atfs) rule will be nineteen years and some months.”50

Imam al-Baqir (‘a) said: “Hadrat al-Qa’im (‘atfs) will rule for three hundred and nine years just as the Companions of the Cave stayed in the cave for the same period.”51

On 7/6/2016 at 11:33 PM, wmehar2 said:

It's easy to see if a Hadith is authentic by first checking contradictory notions with the Qu'ran, a merciless, unforgiving, killing Mahdi/Qaim (are they the same person?)... probably contradicts the Qu'ran in more ways than 10.   A man cannot live 313 years and rule, no such privilege was granted to our Prophet SAW.  There are some prophet's who have lived a long time and some continue to live (Isa ibn Maryam AS and al Khidr AS).  We all know Prophet Muhammad SAW was the last and final messenger and thus the seal, so no man can take on those qualities according to the Qu'ran.  Also killing those who are ignorant and have not had a chance to repent or learn the error of their ways is against the Qu'ran.  

" (10) Muhammad bin Ya'qoob al-Kulayni narrated from Ali bin Muhammad and Muhammad bin al-Hasan from Sahl bin Ziyad and Muhammad bin Yahya from Ahmad bin Muhammad from al-Hasan bin Mahboob that Abu Hamza ath-Thimali had heard Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) saying:
“Allah had timed this matter to occur in the year seventy (A.H.) but when al-Husayn (as) was killed, He became so angry and put it off until the year one hundred and forty. We told you of that and you announced it and uncovered the secret, so after that Allah did not reveal any timing to us concerning this matter. Allah said: (Allah makes to pass away and establishes what He pleases, and with Him is the basis of the Book).15”
Abu Hamza said: “I told Abu Abdullah as-Sadiq (as) of that and he said: “Yes, it was so "

It doesn't make sense how these narrations could have came from the prophet SAW but none of the other trustworthy companions such as Bilal RA or Suhayb Ar Rumi spoke or mentioned of these, nor does it make sense for Allah SWT to know know an event that is to come, and yet be "angry" and delay something since He's know-er of the Past , Present and Future.   If you study vernacular/word usage and word order between already authenticated Jafar as Sadiq AS hadith, and compare it with these, you can easily tell they're not the same style. 

Truthfully, this all sounds like vengeful rhetoric to stimulate wrongs committed to the Shii' and console them.  The wordage here and style differs vastly from the manner of style in prose coming from Rasool's mouth, and the Qu'ran.   

You are right. Some of those narrations are clear fabrications. But for me the most important one is period of Imam's rule:

On 7/6/2016 at 10:38 PM, Fahad Sani said:

From Chapter 26: The period of al-Qaim’s rule

Whatever option may be true. It means Imam Mahdi a.s will remain on earth for a short time. Then what will happen after him? Who will be the hujjah after him? Because earth cannot exist without hujjah, it is both in shia and sunni hadith. And it is very important to know. Because everyone has to recognize Imam of his time, not the previous Imams as per shia belief. That's why I study and research more about 12th Imam as compared to previous Imams.

 

On 7/7/2016 at 0:48 AM, S.M.H.A. said:

A part of the same sermon about the Imam al-Mahdi

منها:

He will be wearing the armour of wisdom, which he will have secured with all its conditions, such as full attention towards it, its (complete) knowledge and exclusive devotion to it. For him it is like a thing which he had lost and which he was then seeking, or a need which he was trying to fulfil. If Islam is in trouble he will feel forlorn like a traveller and like a (tired) camel beating the end of its tail and with its neck flattened on the ground. He is the last of Allah's proofs and one of the vicegerents of His prophets.

قَدْ لَبِسَ لِلْحِكْمَةِ جُنَّتَهَا، وَأَخَذَهَا بِجَمِيعِ أَدَبِهَا، مِنَ الاْقْبَالِ عَلَيهَا، وَالْمَعْرِفِةِ بهَا، وَالتَّفَرُّغِ لَهَا، فَهِيَ عِنْدَ نَفْسِهِ ضَالَّتُهُ الَّتِي يَطْلُبُهَا، وَحَاجَتُهُ الَّتِي يَسْأَلُ عَنْهَا، فَهُوُ مُغْتَرِبٌ إِذَا اغْتَرَبَ الاْسْلاَمُ، وَضَرَبَ بِعَسِيبِ ذَنَبِهِ وَأَلْصَقَ الاْرْضَ بِجِرَانِهِ، بَقِيَّةٌ مِنْ بَقَايَا حُجَّتِهِ، خَلِيفَةٌ مِنْ خَلاَئِفِ أَنْبِيَائِهِ.

https://www.al-islam.org/nahjul-balagha-part-1-sermons/sermon-182-praise-be-Allah-whom-return-all-creation#part-same-sermon-about-imam-al-mahdi

One narration say he will rule for few years. Other narration say he is last of Allah's proofs (hujjah). Then who will be the proof (hujjah) after him. As he will remain on earth for few years. There must be an answer to this both in shia and sunni hadith books. As earth can not exist without hujjah.

May be there will be more Imams after him? If this is true then it is clearly against shia belief that Imams are only 12.

One narration from above book actually confirms this.

(3) Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Sa'eed narrated from Muhammad bin al-Mufadhdhal bin Ibraheem bin Qays from Sa’dan bin Iss’haq bin Sa'eed, Ahmad bin al-Husayn bin Abdul Melik az-Zayyat and Muhammad bin Ahmad bin al-Hasan al-Qatawani from al-Hasan bin Mahboob from Amr bin Thabit that Jabir bin Yazeed al-Ju’fi had said:
“I heard Abu Ja'far al-Baqir (as) saying: “By Allah, a man from us, Ahlul Bayt, will rule for three hundred and thirteen years and then for other nine years.”
I asked him: “When will that be?”
He said: “After the death of al-Qa'im (as).”
I said: “How long will al-Qa'im rule until he dies?”
He said: “It will be nineteen years since his rising until the day of his death.”

(3). Tafseer of al-Ayyashi, vol.2 p.326, al-khtisas p.257, al-Ghayba by at-Toossi p.478, Mukhtasar Basa’ir ad-Darajat p.38, 49, 213, Muntakhab al-Anwar al-Mudhee’a p.202, al-Eeqadh min al-Haj’a p.337, Ithbat al-Hudat, vol.3 p.557, Hilyatul Abrar, vol.2 p.640, Tafseer al-Burhan, vol.2 p.465, Biharul Anwar, vol.52 p.298, vol.53 p.100, 103, 146, ar-Raj’a p.71, Mo’jam Ahadeeth al-Imam al-Mahdi, vol.3 p.329.

Edited July 25, 2016 by Fahad Sani

[certainclarity]

8 minutes ago, Fahad Sani said:

Yes. There are many narrations on this subject. All give different answer. I think Imam will remain on earth for about 7 to 19 years. Based on most authentic narrations.

Other narrations:

Source: https://www.al-islam.org/an-overview-of-mahdi-s-government-najimuddin-tabasi/government-truth#period-rule

“His rule will be seven years and each year is equivalent to ten of your years. Therefore, the years of his rule will be equivalent to your seventy years.”38

Imam ‘Ali (‘a) said: “Hadrat al-Mahdi (‘atfs) will rule for seven years; every year in that time will be equal to ten years of yours.”39

The Holy Messenger of Allah (S) said: “The Mahdi (‘atfs) is from us… and for seven years he will take charge of affairs.”40

The Prophet (S) also said: “He will rule for seven years over this ummah.”41

The Messenger of Allah (S) also said elsewhere: “The tenure of rule of al-Mahdi (S) will be seven years at the shortest or it will last for eight or nine years at the longest.”42 It has also been reported: “Hadrat al-Mahdi (‘atfs) will rule in this world for nine years.”43

Jabir ibn ‘Abdullah al-Ansari asked Imam al-Baqir (‘a): “How many years will the Imam of the Time (‘atfs) live?” The Imam (‘a) replied: “From the day of the uprising till his demise will be nineteen years long.”44

The Messenger of Allah (S) said: “Hadrat al-Mahdi (‘atfs) will rule for twenty years. He will take out the treasures from the ground; he will conquer the lands of polytheism.”45

He (S) also said: “The Mahdi (‘atfs) is from my progeny and he will rule for twenty years.”46
It has also been reported: “The Imam (‘atfs) will rule for ten years.”47

In answer to the question on how many years the Mahdi (‘atfs) will rule, Hadrat ‘Ali (‘a) said: “He will rule over the people for thirty or forty years.”48

Imam as-Sadiq (‘a) said: “Hadrat al-Mahdi (‘atfs) will be from my progeny and his age will be equal to that of Ibrahim Khalil ar-Rahman (Prophet Abraham) (‘a). He will appear at the age of eighty years and rule for forty years.”49

The same Imam (‘a) also said: “The tenure of Hadrat al-Qa’im’s (‘atfs) rule will be nineteen years and some months.”50

Imam al-Baqir (‘a) said: “Hadrat al-Qa’im (‘atfs) will rule for three hundred and nine years just as the Companions of the Cave stayed in the cave for the same period.”51

You are right. Some of those narrations are clear fabrications. But for me the most important one is period of Imam's rule:

Whatever option may be true. It means Imam Mahdi a.s will remain on earth for a short time. Then what will happen after him? Who will be the hujjah after him? Because earth cannot exist without hujjah, it is both in shia and sunni hadith. And it is very important to know. Because everyone has to recognize Imam of his time, not the previous Imams as per shia belief. That's why I study and research more about 12th Imam as compared to previous Imams.

 

One narration say he will rule for few years. Other narration say he is last of Allah's proofs (hujjah). Then who will be the proof (hujjah) after him. As he will remain on earth for few years. There must be an answer to this both in shia and sunni hadith books. As earth can not exist without hujjah.

 

He is the last Hujjah. After him, slowly people will go back to their old ways, and the earth will be only left with disbelievers. This will be time of qiyamah.

This is from some narrations.

[Fahad Sani]

5 minutes ago, certainclarity said:

He is the last Hujjah. After him, slowly people will go back to their old ways, and the earth will be only left with disbelievers. This will be time of qiyamah.

This is from some narrations.

Can you share those narrations?  Also the narrations which talk about Prophet Issa a.s. That what will he do. How long  will he remain. How will he die etc.

In sunni hadith books, it has been narrated from Prophet s.a.w.w, after Imam Mahdi a.s, Prophet Issa a.s will be the caliph for many years. He will also lead the funeral of Imam Mahdi a.s.

Prophet Issa a.s and his followers are not disbelievers? Also earth cannot exist without hujjah in any case.

It has been narrated on the authority of 'Abdullah that the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) said: The Caliphate will remain among the Quraish even if only two persons are left (on the earth), Sahih Muslim Hadith #1820

Similiar hadith is also in shia books. Its well known.

[certainclarity]

17 minutes ago, Fahad Sani said:

Can you share those narrations?  Also the narrations which talk about Prophet Issa a.s. That what will he do. How long  will he remain. How will he die etc.

In sunni hadith books, it has been narrated from Prophet s.a.w.w, after Imam Mahdi a.s, Prophet Issa a.s will be the caliph for many years. He will also lead the funeral of Imam Mahdi a.s.

Prophet Issa a.s and his followers are not disbelievers? Also earth cannot exist without hujjah in any case.

It has been narrated on the authority of 'Abdullah that the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) said: The Caliphate will remain among the Quraish even if only two persons are left (on the earth), Sahih Muslim Hadith #1820

Similiar hadith is also in shia books. Its well known.

Hujjah means proof. The last prominent proof in shii traditions is the Mahdi, after that it is time ticking towards qiyama, and no more proof is required.

Once there is only Kufr on earth, there is no need for proof anymore , as the disbeliever will always deny.

Shia traditions say if there is only ONE DAY left of the world,we shall send our proof. It does not say if there is ONE PERSON left on earth.

~, the Holy Prophet has said, "If there were to remain in the life of the world but one day, God would prolong that day until He sends in it a man from my community and my household, His name will be the same as my name. He will fill the earth with equity and justice as it was filled with oppression and tyranny." 

I will have to search for it.

Edited July 25, 2016 by certainclarity

[hadez803]

1 hour ago, certainclarity said:

He is the last Hujjah. After him, slowly people will go back to their old ways, and the earth will be only left with disbelievers. This will be time of qiyamah.

This is from some narrations.

This is completely wrong. After the Mahdi all the Imams will return in the Raja and will rule over earth for God knows how long and the earth will remain with people that most if not all are believers.

[wmehar2]

5 hours ago, certainclarity said:

He is the last Hujjah. After him, slowly people will go back to their old ways, and the earth will be only left with disbelievers. This will be time of qiyamah.

This is from some narrations.

So Mankind is incapable of being good/righteous  without guidance after having received it more than 100 fold times??.   Are you saying Allah SWT is purposefully forsaking those who will come after the last Hujjah?    That only the chosen people in between are good enough?  It's beginning to sound like egotistical Israeli rhetoric of being God's chosen people.   This is inconsistent, because the Qu'ran has clearly written in the time before the prophet Muhammad SAW and Isa ibn Mariam AS, that there has been in existence those who stand upright and pray to God with good intention, their deeds which are not forgotten. 

Allah SWT gave us a promise that HE will preserve the Qu'ran, if such is the case, there will never be a time on earth where it will only be full with disbelievers.  This is why I'm fed up with reading these hadith and narrations.  If they don't corroborate the word of God, they should be disregarded.  These narrations will never supersede the Qu'ran.  There's a reason the Qu'ran was promised to us to be preserved, and not the Hadith.  

The Hadith can all be burned, forgotten and as such it will be irrelevant to being a follower of Islam.   God isn't a petty being such that he'd torment mankind over ambiguous and arbitrary sectarian differences.  You interpret the book, if you interpret it differently, then believe in God and the Day of judgement and that is better for us. This was told to us in the Qu'ran.  We were also told in the Qu'ran that God would not place a burden on us greater than we can bear, and determining/sifting out the garbage from not garbage in the Hadith in the year 2016+, I think qualifies as a burden than we can bear.   

 

Edited July 25, 2016 by wmehar2

[certainclarity]

57 minutes ago, wmehar2 said:

So Mankind is incapable of being good/righteous  without guidance after having received it more than 100 fold times??.   Are you saying Allah SWT is purposefully forsaking those who will come after the last Hujjah?    That only the chosen people in between are good enough?  It's beginning to sound like egotistical Israeli rhetoric of being God's chosen people.   This is inconsistent, because the Qu'ran has clearly written in the time before the prophet Muhammad SAW and Isa ibn Mariam AS, that there has been in existence those who stand upright and pray to God with good intention, their deeds which are not forgotten. 

Allah SWT gave us a promise that HE will preserve the Qu'ran, if such is the case, there will never be a time on earth where it will only be full with disbelievers.  This is why I'm fed up with reading these hadith and narrations.  If they don't corroborate the word of God, they should be disregarded.  These narrations will never supersede the Qu'ran.  There's a reason the Qu'ran was promised to us to be preserved, and not the Hadith.  

The Hadith can all be burned, forgotten and as such it will be irrelevant to being a follower of Islam.   God isn't a petty being such that he'd torment mankind over ambiguous and arbitrary sectarian differences.  You interpret the book, if you interpret it differently, then believe in God and the Day of judgement and that is better for us. This was told to us in the Qu'ran.  We were also told in the Qu'ran that God would not place a burden on us greater than we can bear, and determining/sifting out the garbage from not garbage in the Hadith in the year 2016+, I think qualifies as a burden than we can bear.   

 

Humans are humans , the bani Israel saw the ocean split, and many other miracles but went back to their old ways.

There is no burden on disbelievers, disbelievers chose disbelief over belief. 

This is nothing got to those who chose to belief.

Why would any one be worried what will happen to those who chose not to belief ?

Is the time of the hour, which is the most difficult time, to befall on a Momin also ?

The Quran explicitly says the hour would be a dreadful one, so if a person is. Momin, which means someone who is under the safety of Allah should atleast not experience such terror,wrath, and calamity.

Edited July 25, 2016 by certainclarity

[certainclarity]

4 hours ago, hadez803 said:

This is completely wrong. After the Mahdi all the Imams will return in the Raja and will rule over earth for God knows how long and the earth will remain with people that most if not all are believers.

The Hadith of full raja may or may not be true.

So the calamity of qiyama which will happen is for the believers? 

if the world is full of believers before qiyama, why would Allah befall such a huge calamity on momins?

Any direct calamity from Allah is for the disbelievers only.

Similarly Noah and a few, Lut and a few who were believers were saved and the disbelievers had to face the wrath of Allah, in a mini scale of the last hour.

Holy Quran:

O mankind, fear your Lord. Indeed, the convulsion of the [final] Hour is a TERRIBLE thing.(22:1)

On the Day you see it every nursing mother will be distracted from that [child] she was nursing, and every pregnant woman will abort her pregnancy, and you will see the people [appearing] intoxicated while they are not intoxicated; but the PUNISHMENT of Allah is SEVERE. (22:2)

 

 

Edited July 25, 2016 by certainclarity

[wmehar2]

7 minutes ago, certainclarity said:

Humans are humans , the bani Israel saw the ocean split, and many other miracles but went back to their old ways.

There is no burden on disbelievers, disbelievers chose disbelief over belief. 

This is nothing got to those who chose to belief.

Why would any one be worried what will happen to those who chose not to belief ?

There's  a difference between choosing not to believe, and being ignorant of belief. 

[certainclarity]

21 minutes ago, wmehar2 said:

There's  a difference between choosing not to believe, and being ignorant of belief. 

Well my point exactly, those who face the "calamity" of the hour will be people who will deliberately choose not to believe , the likes of Abu lahab, and hypocrites.

O mankind, fear your Lord. Indeed, the convulsion of the [final] Hour is a TERRIBLE thing.(22:1)

On the Day you see it every nursing mother will be distracted from that [child] she was nursing, and every pregnant woman will abort her pregnancy, and you will see the people [appearing] intoxicated while they are not intoxicated; but the PUNISHMENT of Allah is SEVERE. (22:2)

 

Edited July 25, 2016 by certainclarity

[hadi313]

Three important points:

1. As our Imams PBUH told us, their narration is not understandable for every one, then this is not a true expectation for every one to understand all the narration, as we know that we are expert in our field like math , physics, etc. not all other fields, understanding narration has his own expert.

2.we(Shia) do not see authenticity of a narration by book or author, even if all scholars mention a narration in their book, this never guarantee the authenticity of a narration، then making a list of shia book never help till one can prove the authenticity of a narration.

3.  Beside authenticity of those narrations, may we can find three strange point, first one about Imam's deed, second  one about the time, third one about the position of Shia.

about Imam Mahdi's(عجل الله تعالی فرجه) deed like killing enemies I have to say when I was younger I have been asking my self would it be necessary to kill enemies to have peace on earth and this was my main question till I saw Isis and their supporter like Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Turkey and other Muslim supporter( let alone to Western supporter) I've found these narration got their real meaning, if we have some brutal people like Isis who just think of killing people or if we have one army like Saudi Arabia who are willing by killing other Muslim in Syria and Yemen, I concluded may killing is not always bad even if number is numerous, when we want to kill bad people.

About the time of appearance, actually occulatation is a real exam for all believer precisely Shia, then knowing the time of arrival would make all this exam nonsense,then the appearance would happen in its time but as we have in our narration our DOA helps us to become stronger and when God sees our supplication will make arrival sooner.

About the Shia position in that time, what we have to notice here is conversion in idea in any time is possible, when we see narration like what mentioned above talk about conversion, these narrations want to warn us about a possible danger, and that make us to study more, to think more about our duty toward Imam Mahdi.(عجل الله تعالی فرجه)