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3 minutes ago, Sen McGlinn said:

I am an unenrolled Bahai. In my case, the Universal House of Justice decided I do not meet the requirements for membership, which means I cannot be on the membership rolls, and therefore cannot vote or be elected to office. I do sometimes give presentations (I am just back from a seminar where I spoke on Abdu'l-Baha's letter to E. Wrestling Brewster, concerning Emanuel Swedenborg. But that is rare, I usually present and publish online which is better in so many ways. If I go to a conference it's mainly to meet old friends. 

I have suffered somewhat from personal jealousies and slanders, but generally speaking, if you find Bahais who are "against" me, it is probably not personal, just different perspective on some matters.

Thank you sen for your reply. Can you please elaborate. It is very important for me. Is taking away of "Administrative Rights" considered a type of punishment... if yes (as i assume it is a punishment)... Do your community members see you differently because of this punishment? As you are not 100% equal to a BIGS. Are there any emotional effects of this punishment? Why did UHJ decided that you are not eligible to vote? What was your mistake (I mean what the Haifa Based Baha'is consider offensive to them)?

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16 minutes ago, Badi19 said:

Thank you sen for your reply. Can you please elaborate. It is very important for me. Is taking away of "Administrative Rights" considered a type of punishment... if yes (as i assume it is a punishment)... Do your community members see you differently because of this punishment? As you are not 100% equal to a BIGS. Are there any emotional effects of this punishment? Why did UHJ decided that you are not eligible to vote? What was your mistake (I mean what the Haifa Based Baha'is consider offensive to them)?

So far as I know, being removed from the membership rolls for "not meeting the requirements of membership" is phrased that way to indicate that it is not a punishment (sanction) for any behaviour. More like a no-fault divorce. Some Bahais may see me as a second-class Bahai, but most I think simply find it confusing and have no opinion. I've explained it by analogy to the coach who decides a player doesn't make the cut: a general qualitative evaluation that takes into account both the player's past performance, and the direction that the coach wants to take the team. Being disenrolled does not affect me emotionally, but it has had an effect on the course of my life, largely for the better.

 

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10 minutes ago, Sen McGlinn said:

So far as I know, being removed from the membership rolls for "not meeting the requirements of membership" is phrased that way to indicate that it is not a punishment (sanction) for any behaviour. More like a no-fault divorce. Some Bahais may see me as a second-class Bahai, but most I think simply find it confusing and have no opinion. I've explained it by analogy to the coach who decides a player doesn't make the cut: a general qualitative evaluation that takes into account both the player's past performance, and the direction that the coach wants to take the team. Being disenrolled does not affect me emotionally, but it has had an effect on the course of my life, largely for the better.

 

Thank you again. Do you mean that this inequality, second class treatment (injustice) did not served as punishment for you? Why do you think that it is better for you? Also can you please write about your action that led the UHJ to dis-enroll you ?

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5 hours ago, Ali6 said:

@Sen McGlinn, take it from me and don't even bother replying to certain individuals on ShiaChat who like nothing more than to spew hatred. 

Dear Ali,

There is one Ali on Reditt who is active in the following sub-reddits - Shia, Bahai and depression. Hope that's not you as you claimed on ShiaChat that you are "Shia". Liars have no credibility. Sen McGlinn is a Baha'i and I respect him for his truthfulness.

"Sincerity is to be admired, whilst lying is despicable." (Abdul Baha).

3858738a09.jpg

You stated : "Living in Canada, as a Shia, I am blessed to live near Shia mosques, community centers, and even a Shia highschool!"

Edited by Badi19

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23 hours ago, Sen McGlinn said:

Bahais in Iran do have cemeteries, but these are frequently vandalized or entirely destroyed by the authorities. On July 14 this year, the Bahai cemetery at Qorveh was completely destroyed: even the trees were cut down. See https://sensday.wordpress.com/2016/07/19/security-forces-destroy-bahai-cemetery-in-qorveh-arresting-one-bahai/
 

Bahais in Iran are not allowed to attend tertiary education, but some slip in by filling in the "religion" field in the application forms with "other" or "of course," or they fill in "Bahai" and some official lets it pass. When these Bahais are discovered, they are expelled.

There are tight restrictions on employment for Bahais also: they may not work in the civil service or armed services, although they do compulsory military service and were enlisted during the war with Iraq. They may not be employed or have businesses in sectors that involve food, drink or personal services. the list changes from time to time. On May 19, 2015, Saham News published a copy of the previously secret list of sectors from which Bahais are banned (by that time the list was already five years old, and incomplete). It says that Bahais may not work in cultural, educational or financial institutions, and are not to be allowed to work in the sectors of periodicals, jewelry, watchmaking, print-making, tourist agencies, car rentals, publishing and bookshops, photography, film-making, internet gaming, computers, or internet cafes. They may not own printing works or hotels and other accommodation for travellers, or teach tailoring skills. The order refers to the widespread Iranian belief that Bahais are unclean, and requires the police bureaus to block them from restaurants, cafeterias and catering, food ingredients and foodstuff sales, takeaways (Iranian-style), cafes, butchers shops, supermarkets, the production and sale of ice-cream, fruit juice, soft drinks, pastry and sweets, and coffee. At some stage optometry was apparently added to the list, without distinguishing between import and manufacture on the one hand, and prescription and retail sales on the other hand.

Dear Sen,

Regarding Baha'i cemetery I found this piece - How far do you consider it to be true ?

http://bahailiescemeteries.blogspot.co.uk/2015/11/golestan-i-javid-of-tehran-still.html

Do you feel Baha'is exaggerate some stories? Do you feel Baha'is can commit some mistakes / errors ?

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@Badi19, I would share my Reddit account but it's extremely personal and no, it doesn't contain my first name. I already post a thread on why I reject the Baha'i Faith and professed to be a Twelver. If that doesn't convince you, then it's a lost cause. I know that my sympathy for Baha'is raises eyebrows in the Shia community but so does my sympathy for Atheists and other disbelievers who face hardships in an Islamic state. I was equally if not more upset when Hamza Kashgari was deported back to Saudi Arabia to face a possible execution after tweeting about shaking Muhammad (peace be upon him)'s hand as an equal. Anyways, I'll let you have the final say because insha'Allah, I'm marrying a Shia woman soon :muslima: and if you guys stay in your best behavior, I might invite you lol. With love, Ali.

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3 hours ago, Badi19 said:

Dear Sen,

Regarding Baha'i cemetery I found this piece - How far do you consider it to be true ?

http://bahailiescemeteries.blogspot.co.uk/2015/11/golestan-i-javid-of-tehran-still.html

Do you feel Baha'is exaggerate some stories? Do you feel Baha'is can commit some mistakes / errors ?

The Golestan Javid story is incorrect, and probably a deliberate deception. Every Bahai cemetery I know of in Iran is called "Golestan Javid." So the existence of one (actually two) Golestan Javid in Tehran today, is not evidence that the Golestan Javid in Tehran was not destroyed. Bahais keep dying, so a new Golestan Javid is created. Perhaps the authors of this story really did not know that Golestand Javid is a generic name, but it seems unlikely. I think they were calculating the some readers would not know this, and would be deceived.

The Golestan Javid cemetery in Shiraz was destroyed in 2014, by now there must be a new one, somewhere on the outskirts of the city. See http://news.bahai.org/story/993

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4 hours ago, Badi19 said:

Thank you again. Do you mean that this inequality, second class treatment (injustice) did not served as punishment for you? Why do you think that it is better for you? Also can you please write about your action that led the UHJ to dis-enroll you ?

Whoa, all I said was that "Some Bahais may see me as a second-class Bahai..." But not my colleagues in Bahai studies, or the thousands of Bahais who are my facebook "friends" or members of the groups I moderate. Not the Bahais I encounter on Bahai forums. If you can access Delphi forums you will find that Planet Bahai has a thread entitled "Sen" at the moment. http://forums.delphiforums.com/planetbahai/messages/?msg=12563.1

I go away for a few weeks, and they start to worry about me. It's sweet, but so far quite unnecessary, I am in excellent health.

I do not know of any action on my part that led the UHJ to remove my name from the membership rolls, or what effect they intended to achieve. I assume there was a degree of misinformation behind the original decision, since there is not X for which it is true that Sen is eXier than all others, but in the event, they seem happy with their decision.  The decision has led me to concentrate more on intellectual pursuits and the online Bahai community, which is probably where my life was heading anyway. 
 

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9 hours ago, alidu78 said:

Bahaïs really believe that incest is good ?

No - that's just a bit of anti-Bahai propaganda. The current ruling does allow cousin marriages, but note the reservation at the end of this letter:

Quote

 

... it is not permissible for a Bahá’í to marry his or her mother or father and their siblings and forebears, brothers or sisters and their descendents, or sons or daughters and their descendents. It is also not permissible to marry some corresponding categories of relations formed by bonds of marriage—such as the step-mother, step-father, step-daughter, or stepson, or the daughter-in-law, son-in-law, mother-in-law, or father-in-law—or similar categories of relations formed by legal and social bonds that create a shared family life, for example through adoption. Beyond these prohibitions, Bahá’ís should ensure they do not contract a marriage that would violate the customs or laws of the country in which they reside. While the House of Justice has refrained, at this stage, from defining other categories of relations with whom marriage is prohibited, it is important for believers everywhere to be mindful of this clear statement by the Master:

“In marriage the more distant the blood-relationship the better, for such distance in family ties between husband and wife provideth the basis for the well-being of humanity and is conducive to fellowship among mankind.”
(From a letter dated 15 January 2010 written on behalf of the Universal House of Justice to an individual believer)

 

In practice, I am not aware of first-cousin marriages in the Bahai community today. Historically, I think first and second cousin marriages were reasonably common in the Bahai community in Iran, but never a preferred match in the way they are in North Africa. 

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7 hours ago, Badi19 said:

Dear Sen,

Regarding Baha'i cemetery I found this piece - How far do you consider it to be true ?

http://bahailiescemeteries.blogspot.co.uk/2015/11/golestan-i-javid-of-tehran-still.html

Do you feel Baha'is exaggerate some stories? Do you feel Baha'is can commit some mistakes / errors ?

Are you really an ex bahai ?

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12 hours ago, Sen McGlinn said:

Whoa, all I said was that "Some Bahais may see me as a second-class Bahai..." But not my colleagues in Bahai studies, or the thousands of Bahais who are my facebook "friends" or members of the groups I moderate. Not the Bahais I encounter on Bahai forums. If you can access Delphi forums you will find that Planet Bahai has a thread entitled "Sen" at the moment. http://forums.delphiforums.com/planetbahai/messages/?msg=12563.1

I go away for a few weeks, and they start to worry about me. It's sweet, but so far quite unnecessary, I am in excellent health.

I do not know of any action on my part that led the UHJ to remove my name from the membership rolls, or what effect they intended to achieve. I assume there was a degree of misinformation behind the original decision, since there is not X for which it is true that Sen is eXier than all others, but in the event, they seem happy with their decision.  The decision has led me to concentrate more on intellectual pursuits and the online Bahai community, which is probably where my life was heading anyway. 
 

Does your NSA, LSA, ABMs, Counselors see you as a First Class Baha'i? Don't you feel that your "taking away of rights" for some unknown reason (on your part) is some sort of Injustice to you. Or you see all actions of Infallible UHJ as the actions inspired by God (Baha'u'llah)? Also it is quiet difficult to understand that some time you are a "Baha'i with Good reputation" then suddenly some "unknown" things happen and your rights removed and you are rendered a second-class Baha'i - when asked about the reason - you are not made known. How far do you feel this appropriate ?

Edited by Badi19

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14 hours ago, Ali6 said:

@Badi19, I would share my Reddit account but it's extremely personal and no, it doesn't contain my first name. I already post a thread on why I reject the Baha'i Faith and professed to be a Twelver. If that doesn't convince you, then it's a lost cause. I know that my sympathy for Baha'is raises eyebrows in the Shia community but so does my sympathy for Atheists and other disbelievers who face hardships in an Islamic state. I was equally if not more upset when Hamza Kashgari was deported back to Saudi Arabia to face a possible execution after tweeting about shaking Muhammad (peace be upon him)'s hand as an equal. Anyways, I'll let you have the final say because insha'Allah, I'm marrying a Shia woman soon :muslima: and if you guys stay in your best behavior, I might invite you lol. With love, Ali.

Lol. That's ok - please don't share your "personal Reddit account". I understand that. All the best to you for your marriage to a "Shia Woman". By the way can you write in "short" why do you reject the Baha'i faith?

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13 hours ago, Sen McGlinn said:

The Golestan Javid story is incorrect, and probably a deliberate deception. Every Bahai cemetery I know of in Iran is called "Golestan Javid." So the existence of one (actually two) Golestan Javid in Tehran today, is not evidence that the Golestan Javid in Tehran was not destroyed. Bahais keep dying, so a new Golestan Javid is created. Perhaps the authors of this story really did not know that Golestand Javid is a generic name, but it seems unlikely. I think they were calculating the some readers would not know this, and would be deceived.

The Golestan Javid cemetery in Shiraz was destroyed in 2014, by now there must be a new one, somewhere on the outskirts of the city. See http://news.bahai.org/story/993

Can you please mention the location of both these acclaimed "Cemeteries". The old one that was demolished and the new one. As I understand from your Blog that you have a lot of good contacts in Iran that send you all sort of news and you translate and publish them on your blog and facebook thus doing "a great service to the suffering Humanity". How is it that the "oppressive Iranian regime" that forces (some) Baha'is for Islamic burial and asks them to bury their dead in Muslim graveyards - someday for unknown reasons - demolishes their graveyards then allots them new lands ? Where is Dr. Youness Khan-i-Afrukhtih buried? I am well aware that Baha'is keep track of each and every incident and report even minor incidents to their ABMs which goes to Haifa through the channels made by the Baha'i administration.

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15 hours ago, Ali6 said:

@Badi19, I would share my Reddit account but it's extremely personal and no, it doesn't contain my first name. I already post a thread on why I reject the Baha'i Faith and professed to be a Twelver. If that doesn't convince you, then it's a lost cause. I know that my sympathy for Baha'is raises eyebrows in the Shia community but so does my sympathy for Atheists and other disbelievers who face hardships in an Islamic state. I was equally if not more upset when Hamza Kashgari was deported back to Saudi Arabia to face a possible execution after tweeting about shaking Muhammad (peace be upon him)'s hand as an equal. Anyways, I'll let you have the final say because insha'Allah, I'm marrying a Shia woman soon :muslima: and if you guys stay in your best behavior, I might invite you lol. With love, Ali.

Hi Ali,

You fill find these images interesting. I see here you say that you "Reject" the Baha'i faith but at another place you call it an Abrahamic Religion. Can you shed some light please.

http://o82i.imgup.net/ali3874d.jpg

Also please check these images. Surprisingly the Ali (not you) at reddit is also from Canada.

http://v84i.imgup.net/ali1378c.jpg

And he is a Baha'i trying to find out links to establish that Bab / Baha'u'llah is Imam Mahdi or Manifestation of God or Second return of Jesus or return of Imam Husain etc etc. but this "looser" Canadian Baha'i, failed in all the debates with a Shi'i muslim "investigator919". You can check the debates at /r/exbahai on Reddit.

http://e66i.imgup.net/ali26e32.jpg

 

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13 hours ago, Sen McGlinn said:

No - that's just a bit of anti-Bahai propaganda. The current ruling does allow cousin marriages, but note the reservation at the end of this letter:

You cited a letter claiming incest is forbidden, funny that the letter can only be found on your own weblog in type format. No solid proof or evidence is provided. While on the other hand we have solid evidence of Baha'is asking Shoghi Effendi for permission to perform incestous marriages and they were given permission, for example In Shoghi's Tawqi'at mubaraki (1922-1948) page 177 that you can find here:

http://reference.bahai.org/fa/t/se/TM3/tm3-225.html#pg177

We have the attached image which says:

راجع به ازدواج برادرزاده فرمودند بنویس حکم قطعی راجع به بیت العدل اعظم است در وقت حاضر منع آن جائز نه.

"Regarding the matter of marrying the son of (your) brother, he said write:'The definite decree lies upon the UHJ, but currently it is not allowed to prohibit it'"

You see my dear friend, Baha'is have been allowed to perform incest ever since the cult was created, and the only person making up propaganda here is you trying to whitewash these sick laws.

177.gif

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Just sharing these here, for whomever may be interested (I have not verified all the information here): 

http://bahaicultfaq.blogspot.ca/

http://bahailiescemeteries.blogspot.ca/2015/11/golestan-i-javid-of-tehran-still.html

Sayyid Muhammad Rizvi (of Toronto), discusses them here as well: 

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9 hours ago, Badi19 said:

Hi Ali,

You fill find these images interesting. I see here you say that you "Reject" the Baha'i faith but at another place you call it an Abrahamic Religion. Can you shed some light please.

http://o82i.imgup.net/ali3874d.jpg

Peace be upon you,

To me, calling a religion, Abrahamic, doesn't validate it. Druze is also an Abrahamic faith and I would have added it to my list if I knew about their views on Satan. It is unfortunate that you and a handful of other members promote a dichotomy whereby if one disagrees with a religion, he or she must vehemently oppose it in every way possible. For example, I was admonished by a member that instead of "Baha'i Faith", I should call it, "Baha'i False Faith" just so everyone would know that it is false. What is also equally childish is that to use the term, "Baha'i Faith", instead of "Bahaism", would raise eyebrows among Muslims. I can't imagine a Christian having to use the term, "Muhammadanism", instead of "Islam", just so his or her co-religionists wouldn't raise suspicions. In short, disagreeing with a faith doesn't mean I should stand idle if members of my own faith were to spread misconceptions about it. Think about how angry you would become when Sunnis call us, turbah-worshippers, or accuse us of ascribing divinity to our Imams. Wouldn't you want other Sunnis to call out their nonsense? Or do you expect them to stand idle out of fear of being associated with Shias? It's all childish, I tell you, and as followers of Ahlulbayt, we should have the best of akhlaq. 

P.S. If you really want to see my topic against the Baha'i Faith, go find it. It shouldn't be that hard, especially with your outstanding searching skills. :pushup:

Edited by Ali6

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15 hours ago, Ali6 said:

Peace be upon you,

To me, calling a religion, Abrahamic, doesn't validate it. Druze is also an Abrahamic faith and I would have added it to my list if I knew about their views on Satan. It is unfortunate that you and a handful of other members promote a dichotomy whereby if one disagrees with a religion, he or she must vehemently oppose it in every way possible. For example, I was admonished by a member that instead of "Baha'i Faith", I should call it, "Baha'i False Faith" just so everyone would know that it is false. What is also equally childish is that to use the term, "Baha'i Faith", instead of "Bahaism", would raise eyebrows among Muslims. I can't imagine a Christian having to use the term, "Muhammadanism", instead of "Islam", just so his or her co-religionists wouldn't raise suspicions. In short, disagreeing with a faith doesn't mean I should stand idle if members of my own faith were to spread misconceptions about it. Think about how angry you would become when Sunnis call us, turbah-worshippers, or accuse us of ascribing divinity to our Imams. Wouldn't you want other Sunnis to call out their nonsense? Or do you expect them to stand idle out of fear of being associated with Shias? It's all childish, I tell you, and as followers of Ahlulbayt, we should have the best of akhlaq. 

P.S. If you really want to see my topic against the Baha'i Faith, go find it. It shouldn't be that hard, especially with your outstanding searching skills. :pushup:

Hi Ali,

Ok. Thank you. So you are not sure about the falsity of Baha'i faith ? Am i correct? And you will not share your opinion for rejecting it. Ok as you wish.

You may be interested in this.

5d9c36edd7.jpg

Edited by Badi19
This is by "Baha'i Ali" on reddit

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