Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله
Sign in to follow this  
nusantara

Why a True Muslim will never be a Shia

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

1. Ta'sub towards any Islamic leaders/figures, past, present and future, is not part of Islamic teachings. Moderation is what Islam is all about. Only Allah swt should become the center of a muslim's ta'sub and ta'jub. Ta'sub and Ta'jub towards makhluk is the root for all idolatory and ancestral-based religions. 

2. Islam should be viewed as a non-partisan religion. Past history, good or bad, should be able to strengthen a Muslim's understanding of the spiritual concept or Redha. Sayyidina Ali r.a. was martyred by some acquintances - why don't you just accept (redha) what is written in Luh Mahfuz? Being vindictive only demonstrates your lack of appreciation of one of the core Islamic spiritual value -> Redha. Your level of redha shows your level of acceptance to Allah's work and will. Should the Catholics hate the Romans for 'killing' Jesus pbuh? LOL. Don't tell me Catholics understand the concept of Redha more than you do.
 
3. Muslims see all sahabah as equally important in strengthening the foundation of Islam. Favoritism should not become part of one's iman. Favoritism is for Allah swt to judge. We don't have the rights to say who should be revered or favored over the others by Allah swt simply because we are not Him, the Most Willing, the Most Knowing, the Best Judge.

4. Inventions and liberalization are the enemies of a Muslim's aqeeda. Inventions are the roots of all sub-religions and deviations and of course lead to syirk. Christianity is an example of an invention off Judaism - big one. Ahmadiyya, Sikhism, Bahai'sm and .... are the products of those who failed to understand the true concept of aqeeda, tawheed, iman and ehsan of Islam, or they had other hidden or personal agenda that we are not aware of. If you claimed to have understood the concept of Tawheed, why would you invent something like Bahai'sm off the teaching of Shiism, for example?

5. Karbala: Who are we to judge who's politically wrong and correct in the battle of Karbala? Are you God? Those martyrs are probably enjoying their heavenly liquors right now and you're beating yourselves up with hot rod thinking that something bad happens to Sayyidina Husayn r.a right now? How stupid can one be? Don't you read the Quran about Allah swt's promises to those who died as martyrs? Don't you believe in Allah's promises? True Muslims believe in what is promised by Allah swt in the Quran. Haqqul Yaqin. That's why Allah swt commands us the appreciate Redha to what had happened in the past so that you won't knock your own heads around town, crying like babies, due to your own ignorance of the Quran, Allah's promises and Redha! (You intentionally let yourselves to bleed (najis) and SKIP PRAYERS all day long?)

This is my honest opinion as a Muslim, Asian, non-Arabic speaking.  
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am a Shia and I also don't understand why people mourn for Imam Hussein (as) and his companions. If it wasn't for the martyrdom and all of the sufferings that came with it, they wouldn't be enjoying the glorious statuses that they have today. Think about it. Imam Hussein is probably surrounded by beautiful women, sipping on his heavenly wine with one hand and biting off a chicken shish kabob on his other and here you're crying over his death. Please explain to me the rationale behind it. Thanks.

Edited by Ali666

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think you are joking!!

Thank you to share it. But please study deeply in Shia' beliefs first.

About mourning for Karbala and what happened in that land, is just for refreshing the beliefs and the ideals in the Muslim's minds in an Islamic society.

As great Ayatollah Khomeini said: these are Muharram and Safar which have kept Islam alive.

Regards

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 minutes ago, Ali666 said:

I am a Shia and I also don't understand why people mourn for Imam Hussein (as) and his companions. If it wasn't for the martyrdom and all of the sufferings that came with it, they wouldn't be enjoying the glorious statuses that they have today. Think about it. Imam Hussein is probably surrounded by beautiful women, sipping on his heavenly wine with one hand and biting off a chicken shish kabob on his other and here you're crying over his death. Please explain to me the rationale behind it. Thanks.

If you really are a shi'i then you might want to read this: https://www.al-islam.org/articles/we-cry-husayn-so-did-prophet-islam-s-yasser-al-madani

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The thing with such threads is that one has to start from 'A' again to reach level 'Z'.

Too much wasted energy. I leave this one for the fanatics.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Mohammed Z said:

If you really are a shi'i then you might want to read this: https://www.al-islam.org/articles/we-cry-husayn-so-did-prophet-islam-s-yasser-al-madani

 

 

GET THE HELL OUT OF HERE UNTIL THE DAY OF JUDGEMENT WE WILL MOURN FOR HUSSAIN UNTIL OUR LAST BREATH WE WILL MOURN FOR HUSSAIN WHILE YOU CELEBRATE THE DAY ASHURA WE WILL MOURN WE WILL BEAT OUR CHESTS

Edited by Al Amir

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@nusantara aren't you that same person who got shut up by @shiaman14 correcting you on your failure to acknowledge the 6 of the top 10 countries ranked in lowest in terms of peace? You kind of just floated away from that whole thread to be honest, so that alone goes to show you are really not hear to learn nor understand, but to hate. You are no less different then any other muslim hater-- you stomp blindly on knowledge, you don't care to learn nor see the sides of other peoples beliefs, and everything im probably saying to you will mean absolutely nothing to your unfortunately vacant head. I'm sorry you feel this way, and I only hope you find the truth, that is if you are even looking for it. In the mean time, you can go back to anti-majoos videos like your friend wisom007, i think we are pretty comfortable with where we are; with the prophet and his family.

Your fourth point is super ironic, by the way. Like super.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, Ali666 said:

I am a Shia and I also don't understand why people mourn for Imam Hussein (as) and his companions. If it wasn't for the martyrdom and all of the sufferings that came with it, they wouldn't be enjoying the glorious statuses that they have today. Think about it. Imam Hussein is probably surrounded by beautiful women, sipping on his heavenly wine with one hand and biting off a chicken shish kabob on his other and here you're crying over his death. Please explain to me the rationale behind it. Thanks.

They are mourning for themselves not for Ahlul Bait ! They were not present in Karbala but they want to participate in this event at least by showing their grief and crying, wishing. This way they get their rewards and their participating in this great test and sympathizing helps them to increase their spiritual ranks.  

Let alone that these ceremonies themselves can propagate his message which is nothing but the message of Islam.

Edited by maes

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, Al Amir said:

Ban this nasibi from our site !

give him the benefit of the doubt-- maybe he is trying to aggrovate us or maybe he is genuinely lost and has no idea what he's saying. He's being fuelled by someone and maybe he will end up learning something on this site. He will show us his true self soon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, nusantara said:

1. Ta'sub towards any Islamic leaders/figures, past, present and future, is not part of Islamic teachings. #

 

I stopped reading after this. Allah (s.w.t) protected Islam and the Quraan through the ones HE (s.w.t) chose, not whom the people chose.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Philosophy of Yezeedism has been beaten in every age it rears its ugly head to oppress and its attempt to distort and destroy Al-Islam.

-----

“If the religion of Muhammad cannot be saved except by the sacrifice of my head, Then, O swords, come and take it”. Imam Husain(as)

Over one thousand three hundred and fifty years ago, on the 10th of Muharram, just before 'asr, a man stood on a sand-dune at Karbala’. He was bleeding from several wounds on his body. He had lost everything. Since early morning he had carried several dead bodies into his camp. He had even buried his infant child.

He looked at the bodies of his loved ones. Tears flowed out of his eyes. He looked at the sky and seemed to draw some strength from an unseen source. Then, like a muezzin from a minaret, he raised a call:

Is there anyone who will come to assist us?

Is there anyone who will respond to our call for aid?

He turned direction and repeated the call. He did this four times.

Whom was he calling out to? Surely he was not expecting anyone to come to his aid. Those who wanted to help him had already crossed the lines and laid down their lives for the cause. He knew there was no one left. He knew that there was no other Hurr. And yet, meticulously and laboriously, he made sure that his call reverberated in all directions.

Of course that call was a call to Muslims of every generation in every land. It was a call to us wherever we may be. It was a call for help. Help against Yezeedism which in every age rears its ugly head to oppress justice, truth and morality. Our Imam was calling out to every Muslim of every age and time to combat Yezeedism, both within himself and as an external force.

This was his battle cry for jihad-ul-akbar. He had already demonstrated that his objective had always been to create a spiritual awakening through amr bil ma'ruf and nahyi anal munkar. Now he was calling out for the continuation of this jihad at the individual, social and political levels.”

“Hal Min Nasirin Yansurna”

"IS THERE ANYONE TO HELP ME"

“Labaik Ya Hussain”

*****

https://www.al-islam.org/nafasul-mahmum-relating-heart-rending-tragedy-karbala-shaykh-abbas-qummi

https://www.al-islam.org/articles/imam-al-hasan-second-imam-brief-look-his-life

https://www.al-islam.org/ghadir/incident.htm

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, Jafar moh said:

@nusantara aren't you that same person who got shut up by @shiaman14 correcting you on your failure to acknowledge the 6 of the top 10 countries ranked in lowest in terms of peace? You kind of just floated away from that whole thread to be honest, so that alone goes to show you are really not hear to learn nor understand, but to hate. You are no less different then any other muslim hater-- you stomp blindly on knowledge, you don't care to learn nor see the sides of other peoples beliefs, and everything im probably saying to you will mean absolutely nothing to your unfortunately vacant head. I'm sorry you feel this way, and I only hope you find the truth, that is if you are even looking for it. In the mean time, you can go back to anti-majoos videos like your friend wisom007, i think we are pretty comfortable with where we are; with the prophet and his family.

Your fourth point is super ironic, by the way. Like super.

Indeed, he showed me the top rank terrorist state right now is Iraq - a shia majority. He helped me a lot. I am starting to doubt that he's a real Shia.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, maes said:

They are mourning for themselves not for Ahlul Bait ! They were not present in Karbala but they want to participate in this event at least by showing their grief and crying, wishing. This way they get their rewards and their participating in this great test and sympathizing helps them to increase their spiritual ranks.  

Let alone that these ceremonies themselves can propagate his message which is nothing but the message of Islam.

Thanks bro! It makes much more sense now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, nusantara said:

1. Ta'sub towards any Islamic leaders/figures, past, present and future, is not part of Islamic teachings. Moderation is what Islam is all about. Only Allah swt should become the center of a muslim's ta'sub and ta'jub. Ta'sub and Ta'jub towards makhluk is the root for all idolatory and ancestral-based religions. 

Yeah this is the rare true words you said.

1 hour ago, nusantara said:

3. Muslims see all sahabah as equally important in strengthening the foundation of Islam. Favoritism should not become part of one's iman. Favoritism is for Allah swt to judge. We don't have the rights to say who should be revered or favored over the others by Allah swt simply because we are not Him, the Most Willing, the Most Knowing, the Best Judge.

This is contrary to the first point. What are you saying man !?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, Al Amir said:

GET THE HELL OUT OF HERE UNTIL THE DAY OF JUDGEMENT WE WILL MOURN FOR HUSSAIN UNTIL OUR LAST BREATH WE WILL MOURN FOR HUSSAIN WHILE YOU CELEBRATE THE DAY ASHURA WE WILL MOURN WE WILL BEAT OUR CHESTS

Redha is a spiritual value of a true Muslim. The mourning of Sayyidina Husayn r.a. shows me that Shia people are full of vengence, vindictive - This is not good. How can you find peace in your heart when you don't understand Redha in the first place? Sabar, Redha, Tawakkal are among the highly regarded spiritual values of Islamic teaching. They build strong characters.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, nusantara said:

Indeed, he showed me the top rank terrorist state right now is Iraq - a shia majority. He helped me a lot. I am starting to doubt that he's a real Shia.

if you can't determine why that is the way it is, and you blame it on shia's... then you're more lost then I thought. Also, you are really bad at discussing things... borderline embarrassing. Try having a little humility, instead of bashing every thing that everybody is saying.

Imam ali (as) used to say:

'Ask in order to understand, and do not ask in order to find fault, for surely the ignorant man who wants to learn resembles a man of knowledge, and surely a man of knowledge who wants to be difficult resembles an ignorant man who wants to find fault. '

maybe you should follow these words.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Ali666 said:

I am a Shia and I also don't understand why people mourn for Imam Hussein (as) and his companions. If it wasn't for the martyrdom and all of the sufferings that came with it, they wouldn't be enjoying the glorious statuses that they have today. Think about it. Imam Hussein is probably surrounded by beautiful women, sipping on his heavenly wine with one hand and biting off a chicken shish kabob on his other and here you're crying over his death. Please explain to me the rationale behind it. Thanks.

Indeed brother. Even if he sinned, his grandfather Muhammad s.a.w is full of syafaah and he's an ahlul-bayt too! We don't have to worry about him nor should we hit anything else.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, Al Amir said:

GET THE HELL OUT OF HERE UNTIL THE DAY OF JUDGEMENT WE WILL MOURN FOR HUSSAIN UNTIL OUR LAST BREATH WE WILL MOURN FOR HUSSAIN WHILE YOU CELEBRATE THE DAY ASHURA WE WILL MOURN WE WILL BEAT OUR CHESTS

Hello? Did you open a link? I'm a proud shi'i and I mourn the death of Imam Hussein (as). Learn to read.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

this guy just called the whole forum stupid... 

2 hours ago, nusantara said:

Christianity is an example of an invention off Judaism - big one.

really.. jews? not an invention of Allah?
anyway.. you have alot to learn...

 

Edited by kirtc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Ibn Al-Shahid said:

I stopped reading after this. Allah (s.w.t) protected Islam and the Quraan through the ones HE (s.w.t) chose, not whom the people chose.

I am talking about Ta'sub. Not whom Allah swt chooses. Iblees is one very Ta'sub dude. Confuciusm is another example of people playing ta'sub to makhluk. Ta'sub and Ta'jub to other than Allah swt lead people astray. It's all there in the Quran. Hinduism and Buddhism have similar ta'sub practices.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

("It may be that this act puts you on the road to the Paradise. Feeling sad is only a first step in this journey. So, we can’t be just content with crying, it has to evolve to the next level, try to emulate the personalities we cry for. This emotional connection needs to leads to action (what was the people in Karbala trying to accomplish)  which is the real purpose of crying.

The tongue expresses wisdom and intellect while the eyes express the love that is felt in the heart and dwells in the soul.

Crying and shedding tears is a strong and cutting weapon that can help us tremendously along the way of self-knowledge and self-building

The inner spiritual struggle against our internal enemy (egotism), that is to say the Greater Holy War (ihad Akbar), crying is the weapon used, not the sword. That is to say, in the battlefield of self-building, shedding tears is the tool, not steel blades.

Crying for al-Husayn (as) is a means of repentance. Shedding tears for Imam al-Husayn (as) is a means of returning to that which is all-good and pure.

We cry for Imam al-Husayn (as) because he was oppressed, wronged and martyred on a mission to revive the religion of Allah.

Crying for Imam al-Husayn (as) is a means for a limited human being to get in contact with an infinite being by way of internal intuition.

Shedding tears for Imam al-Husayn (as) is a kind of practical struggle against tyrants; that is to say, by crying we express our disgust with the tyrants’ ways, just like when Fatimah al-Zahra (as) cried a lot after her beloved father (S) passed away. The purpose of her crying was to make the people contemplate the reason for the sadness and tears of the daughter of the Holy Prophet (S) and ask themselves why Fatimah al-Zahra (as) was crying in spite of the fact that the Ahl al-Bayt(as) had been, up to that time, role models of forbearance, firmness and perseverance.

Shedding tears for Ahl al-Bayt (as), especially , Imam al-Husayn (as), is an announcement of support for the continuation and revival of the way of those great people.")

www.al-islam.org

*****

Introduction: The History and Philosophy of Aza’ al-Husayn

https://www.al-islam.org/the-journey-of-tears-bashir-hassanali-rahim/introduction-history-and-philosophy-aza’-al-husayn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, maes said:

Yeah this is the rare true words you said.

This is contrary to the first point. What are you saying man !?

Which contrary point are you talking about. Have you seen a Muslim mourning the death of Usman Ibn Affan r.a or Abu Bakr r.a? No. We Muslims see all of them equally as strong Islamic historical figures. We should learn from them a lot. Mourning only any one of them is clearly an example of a favoritism and a political BS! How can you tell that Allah swt favors Umar r.a over Ali r.a.? Are the Shias playing accomplice / sidekick to Allah's will, work and calculation? HOW BLASPHEMOUS CAN YOU PEOPLE BE for playing accomplice to Allah swt? First you dismiss the concept or Redha, and now you Shias are plaing SHIRK too?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, S.M.H.A. said:

 

 This dude here can't even talk to like a true gentleman.

A Shia claims: Ali r.a is the best of all Sahabah --> what do you call this? You are playing God by putting your own words to Allah swt 'mouth'! SHIRK is when you bring something or someone Allah swt as accomplice. The problem is, you Shias don't see what you are doing is wrong because it is YOU WHO PLAY ACCOMPLICE to Allah swt in deciding who's the best among men in the judgement of Allah swt! Masyallah brothers and sisters, only God who should decide who's more "sacred" among men. Not you and me!! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, nusantara said:

We Muslims see all of them equally as strong Islamic historical figures. We should learn from them a lot. Mourning only any one of them is clearly an example of a favoritism and a political BS! How can you tell that Allah swt favors Umar r.a over Ali r.a.? Are the Shias playing accomplice / sidekick to Allah's will, work and calculation? HOW BLASPHEMOUS CAN YOU PEOPLE BE for playing accomplice to Allah swt? First you dismiss the concept or Redha, and now you Shias are plaing SHIRK too?

1. They are not all 'equally as strong' - Uthman, for example, was an incompetent fool whose actions eventually got him killed.

2. If you know anything about how we view history, then you'd know we don't revere the first three Caliphs, which is why we don't mourn them.

3. There is NOTHING wrong with mourning the death of the man who was slaughtered thirsty by the kelb you pass off as politically incorrect. You have some nerve dismissing the whole ordeal as 'political BS'.

4. If you'd like we can direct you to threads which prove Ali's (as) superiority over all the other sahaba.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@nusantara

An army killed the family of your Prophet(s), a MUSLIM army beheaded the grandson of the Prophet! Are you not curious to know who or why? Once you find out that it is out of pure evil, than you will understand that there is a right and wrong here. We Shia cannot just let the wrong go unnoticed. 
And we are not mut'asbeen ... Shias have never attacked Sunnis, on the other hand the definition of Tas'ub is from the Sunni side, hence wahabis, salafis, qaeda, isis, nusra all target and kill Shias, not the other way around. 

You are lucky all these people here are taking the time to answer you and not just kick you or ban you from this forum. It is one thing to try to unite muslims, and another to come in here and call everyone stupid. Especially people who have studied this issue for a MUCH longer period than you have.

Edited by kirtc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

According to the holy Qur'an, some people will never understand and follow the true path because their hearts have been sealed.

I guess nusantara, is one such person. Its useless explaining to such a person brothers. His fate has been sealed I guess. He is not interested in hearing out the truth. May Allah(swt) guide him in the right path.

@nusantara if you are really interested in finding out the truth, read the book 'THEN I WAS GUIDED' by sheikh Muhammed Tijani who used to be a pro wahabbi sunni early on his life. He has justified the reasons for his conversion to shia faith.

If u are really interested in understanding our faith and beliefs, its more than enough if you read that book. 

And regarding your question about the mourning for imam Hussain(as), I think it'll be painful for you to know that ALLAMA IQBAL a person respected by both shias and sunnis, in fact more by sunni Muslims mourned for imam Hussain and Karbala. Refer allama iqbal's collections, you'll understand his grief for imam Hussain and Karbala in his poems.

 

Edited by Mir Ali

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, nusantara said:

Which contrary point are you talking about. Have you seen a Muslim mourning the death of Usman Ibn Affan r.a or Abu Bakr r.a? No. We Muslims see all of them equally as strong Islamic historical figures. We should learn from them a lot. Mourning only any one of them is clearly an example of a favoritism and a political BS! How can you tell that Allah swt favors Umar r.a over Ali r.a.? Are the Shias playing accomplice / sidekick to Allah's will, work and calculation? HOW BLASPHEMOUS CAN YOU PEOPLE BE for playing accomplice to Allah swt? First you dismiss the concept or Redha, and now you Shias are plaing SHIRK too?

What is this mischief making? and in Ramadan too, as if it wasnt bad enough at any other time. Shi'i's do not take others as lords instead of Allah any more than Sunni's take certain members of the sahaba as lords instead of Allah. You are shameless in the way you throw around accusations of polytheism. Even the Christians, who have a triune Godhead, are distinguished from polytheists in the Quran (2:105), so where you get off accusing people on a Shia Muslim forum of such things i dont know.

Please go and do something that befits the month.

Wasalam.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can't believe you guys are actually replying to this. As they say, dfttroll.gif 

Keep in mind that it's still Shahr Ramadhan. You can see when someone's here to learn and when someone's here to cause mischief. Engage in debates where you believe there will be benefits, not in arguments that won't lead to anything but resentment when you can focus on more important things. May Allah's blessings and mercy be upon all believers in this most Holy Month! 

Ma`asalam.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...