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In the Name of God بسم الله

As an Alevi why do shia curse omer etc and knife theirselves

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ALL OF YOU ARE WRONG ABOUT ALEVIS

some sunni brothers claim their is no Allah, they drink and even say religion is bad. 

This is a minority; but this does not mean sunnism as a whole is atheist. 

same principle applies to Alevis; a minority kurdish ones dont believe in Allah; however, Turkmens do

 

We alevis call these people as "duskun" they went astray and not count as Alevis; 

They are condemned by "dedeler".

Very powerful game is being played and funded by the west and Turkey to destroy and make it seem we are atheists.

Did you know Germany, eu countries fund this alevi federations;

If you want answers listen to alevi dedeleri; not these federations

 

It is the truth; Alevis in EU are messed up.

We also support shah ismail BECAUSE he was TURK and KIzilbash. 

Be careful also of the PKK alevis, they dont believe in God mostly Armenian converts

We are seyit; which is why they are called dedeler, listen to them, they are from TUrkmen and Hz Huseyin ancestory

ou should know we were before you, and you are an offspring of Alevis.

As Ahlibeyt lived among the Turks, and had Ahlibeyt had given their daughter to a TURK. 

Timur also destroyed muaviyes tomb and yazids. 

If shia means followers of Ahlibeyt than yes

Of course we would love to go Mecca, Kerbala; as a matter of act Alevi Dedeler had the opportunity to go which they did; we dont usually have the luxury to go, as Haci Bektash Veli said, what ever you are looking for look within yourself, meaning turning towards mecca is built by a human however, a human was made by Allah

See video, if the goverment helps we will love to go, but wahabis dont want us 

We also have 4 door 40 authorities

1) Seriat

2) Tarikat

3) Marifet 

4) Hakikat

Alevilikte Üçler: Hz. Allah, Hz. Muhammed ve Hz. Ali'dir.

Beşler: Hz. Muhammed, Hz. Ali, Hz. Fatıma, Hz. Hasan ve Hz. Hüseyin'dir.

Yediler: Bunlar yedi ulu aşıklardır: Hatayi, Nesimi, Fuzuli, Kul Himmet, Virani, Yemini ve Pir Sultan Abdal'dır.

Oniki İmamlar: Hz. Ali Kerramallahü Veche, İmamı-ı Hasan, İmamı-ı Hüseyin, İmam-ı Zeynel Abidin, İmam-ı Muhammed Bakır, İmam-ı Cafer Sadık, İmam-ı Musa Kazım, İmam-ı Ali Rıza, İmam-ı Muhammed Taki, İmam-ı Aliy'yül Naki, İmam-ı Hasan el-Askeri, İmam-ı Muhammed Mehdi.

Alevilikte Kırklar : Alevi inancına göre Kırklar, Tanrının
ruhları yarattığında yaratılan, her devir ve zamanda yeryüzünde bulunduklarına inanılan ermişlerdir. Bu kırk ermiş dünyanın çeşitli zamanlarında insan suretinde yeryüzüne gelmişler, ölümlerinden sonra da değişik donlarda(başka kimlikte) yaşadıkları ve dünya durdukça da yaşayacakları kabul edilmektedir. Kırkların 23'ü erkek 17'si kadındır. Hiçbir kaynakta kırkının isimleri bulunamamaktadır.

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7 hours ago, أبو فاطمة المحمدي said:

Considering that you are an 'Alawi, I would advise that you accept Islam first, before talking about Islam or Muslims.

Where did you get this bad joke?

Cutting yourself in the name of mourning anyone is a bid'ah - pure and simple. Trying to justify a bid'ah is a bid'ah in itself.

The Christians have nothing to do with the heresy of tatbir within Shi'i Islam.

You didn't get what I said. I advise you to read it carefully and do not let your emotions darken your judgments.

Everyone is free to ask questions, you have no right to be harsh on someone whose beliefs are different with yours. If we Shias claim to be the one right religion then we should not fear of being questioned.

If  AleviTurkmenKhorasan ask questions here, it means only one thing: He seeks truth.

Edited by Hidaren
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51 minutes ago, Talut said:

That's true. Shah Ismail I is venerated by them.

But if you ask me this was just because the Safavids were strongly opposed to the Ottomans as well.

Kizilbash is their original name and that was the army of Shah Ismail I and other Safavid Shah's until Shah Abbas replaced them with Georgians and Armenians as he did not trusted them anymore because of their increasing power.

That could be the main reason for his status in Alevism.

Kizilbash means 'redheads' because of something they weared on top of their heads. 

Edited by Talut
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10 minutes ago, Hidaren said:

You didn't get what I said. I advise you to read it carefully and do not let your emotions darken your judgments.

Everyone is free to ask questions, you have no right to be harsh on someone whose beliefs are different with yours. If we Shias claim to be the one right religion then we should not fear of being questioned.

Yes  but it is disgusting, not Islamic and used as a propaganda tool in the anti-IRI war to make Shia muslims look like lunatics. 

I understand his reaction totally.

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9 minutes ago, Talut said:

Kizilbash means 'redheads' because of something they weared on top of their heads. 

I always wondered that if that could be because they practised tatbir? I don't know if they did but that could be a possibility.

Edited by celestial
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Kizilbash, because we wear read which is the symbol of kerbela and 12 imams are written on it

we name the extremists karabash, who wear dark things. 

As mentioned ALAWI is not alevi, ALAWI believe hz ali is Allah which is wrong!

Edited by AleviTurkmenKhorasan
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If we claim to be followers of 12 imams then we should act like them as much as we can, Seikh Imbrahim Zakzaky is the first Shia of Nigeria. He acted like Imams as much as he could and now in less than 40 years between 20-25 millions of Nigerians are Shias. Harsh actions only worsen things not fixing. 

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5 minutes ago, celestial said:

I always wondered that if that could be because they practised tatbir? I don't know if they did but that could be a possibility.

For real:

The word Qizilbash is Ottoman Turkish (قزلباش; Turkish pronunciation: [kɯ.zɯɫ.baʃ]), meaning "Crimson/Red Head[ed]".

The expression is derived from their distinctive twelve-gored crimson headwear (tāj or tark in Persian; sometimes specifically titled "Haydar's Crown" /تاج حیدر Tāj-e Ḥaydar),indicating their adherence to the Twelve Imams and to Shaykh Haydar, the spiritual leader (sheikh) of the Safaviyya movement in accordance with the Twelver Shi'i doctrine of the Imamate.The name was originally a pejorative label given to them by their Sunni Ottoman foes, but soon it was adopted as a provocative mark of pride.

 

 

Qezelbash.JPG

Edited by Talut
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Brothers the red is the blood of Hz Huseyin and the 12 imams written on it, 

Also just found out we condemn their behaviours too omer osman

but we also say lanet olsun yezide and muaviye

Edited by AleviTurkmenKhorasan
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13 minutes ago, celestial said:

Yeah but i guess we could never know really, that could be a story you know?

Why not? We have historical accounts about that just as we know that the 4-pointed hat of Nader Shah represented the first four sunni caliphs.

Edited by Talut
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5 minutes ago, AleviTurkmenKhorasan said:

Timur Turkish buyuk Hun also wore it, this represents the 12 imams. 

Red also represent the kerbela

Timur the great also destroyed muaviyes tomb 

Was Timur a Mogul king and was he a Shia?

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7 hours ago, أبو فاطمة المحمدي said:

Considering that you are an 'Alawi, I would advise that you accept Islam first, before talking about Islam or Muslims.

Where did you get this bad joke?

Cutting yourself in the name of mourning anyone is a bid'ah - pure and simple. Trying to justify a bid'ah is a bid'ah in itself.

The Christians have nothing to do with the heresy of tatbir within Shi'i Islam.

You do know we chose Islam before you, heck we were born as islam from Turkmen and Ahlibeyt. 

We are not alawi but ALEVI; alawi believe hz ali is god, which is bad but still you have to respect peoples belief.

We believe in Allah THE OMNIPOTENT, HZ MUHAMMED SAW THE MESSENGER, AHLIBEYT THE IMAMS AND QURAN.

Shia are from us after we conquered those areas, otherwise you were pagan worshippers. 

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Timur loved the ahlibeyt and condemned the muaviye, but I think he did not choose islam. 

heck he even destoryed the muaviyes tomb

But he did believe in Allah

You do know turks never had a prophet right? as prophets only come to the ones whom are let to astray etc and show them the path.

We even before islam believed in Allah

Update:

Timur was also Islam and alevi

Edited by AleviTurkmenKhorasan
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3 hours ago, Hidaren said:

If we claim to be followers of 12 imams then we should act like them as much as we can, Seikh Imbrahim Zakzaky is the first Shia of Nigeria. He acted like Imams as much as he could and now in less than 40 years between 20-25 millions of Nigerians are Shias. Harsh actions only worsen things not fixing. 

Are you from Nigeria? Or do you merely rely upon hearsay?

There are 90 Muslims overall in Nigeria. Are you then claiming that Shi'ah are 27% of Nigerian Muslims? Please stop spreading lies. It does us no good.

3 hours ago, AleviTurkmenKhorasan said:

You do know we chose Islam before you, heck we were born as islam from Turkmen and Ahlibeyt. 

We are not alawi but ALEVI; alawi believe hz ali is god, which is bad but still you have to respect peoples belief.

We believe in Allah THE OMNIPOTENT, HZ MUHAMMED SAW THE MESSENGER, AHLIBEYT THE IMAMS AND QURAN.

Imam 'Ali (peace be upon him) burnt the progenitors of the 'Alawis/Alevis alive. That shows you the attitude of true Shi'ism to those infidels.

3 hours ago, AleviTurkmenKhorasan said:

Shia are from us after we conquered those areas, otherwise you were pagan worshippers.

You sound here like a Turkish supremacist. Anyway, your claim is balderdash.

3 hours ago, AleviTurkmenKhorasan said:

You do know turks never had a prophet right? as prophets only come to the ones whom are let to astray etc and show them the path.

We even before islam believed in Allah

I guess you disbelieve in these verses:

وَلَقَدْ بَعَثْنَا فِي كُلِّ أُمَّةٍ رَّسُولًا أَنِ اعْبُدُوا اللَّهَ وَاجْتَنِبُوا الطَّاغُوتَ فَمِنْهُم مَّنْ هَدَى اللَّهُ وَمِنْهُم مَّنْ حَقَّتْ عَلَيْهِ الضَّلَالَةُ فَسِيرُوا فِي الْأَرْضِ فَانظُرُوا كَيْفَ كَانَ عَاقِبَةُ الْمُكَذِّبِينَ

We sent a Messenger among every people saying: ´Worship Allah and keep clear of all false gods.´ Among them were some whom Allah guided but others received the misguidance they deserved. Travel about the earth and see the final fate of the deniers. (16:36)

وَلِكُلِّ أُمَّةٍ رَّسُولٌ فَإِذَا جَاءَ رَسُولُهُمْ قُضِيَ بَيْنَهُم بِالْقِسْطِ وَهُمْ لَا يُظْلَمُونَ

Every nation has a Messenger and when their Messenger comes everything is decided between them justly. They are not wronged. (10:47)

إِنَّا أَرْسَلْنَاكَ بِالْحَقِّ بَشِيرًا وَنَذِيرًا وَإِن مِّنْ أُمَّةٍ إِلَّا خَلَا فِيهَا نَذِيرٌ

We have sent you with the truth bringing good news and giving warning. There is no community to which a warner has not come. (35:24)

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4 minutes ago, أبو فاطمة المحمدي said:

Are you from Nigeria? Or do you merely rely upon hearsay?

There are 90 Muslims overall in Nigeria. Are you then claiming that Shi'ah are 27% of Nigerian Muslims? Please stop spreading lies. It does us no good.

Imam 'Ali (peace be upon him) burnt the progenitors of the 'Alawis/Alevis alive. That shows you the attitude of true Shi'ism to those infidels.

You sound here like a Turkish supremacist. Anyway, your claim is balderdash.

I guess you disbelieve in these verses:

وَلَقَدْ بَعَثْنَا فِي كُلِّ أُمَّةٍ رَّسُولًا أَنِ اعْبُدُوا اللَّهَ وَاجْتَنِبُوا الطَّاغُوتَ فَمِنْهُم مَّنْ هَدَى اللَّهُ وَمِنْهُم مَّنْ حَقَّتْ عَلَيْهِ الضَّلَالَةُ فَسِيرُوا فِي الْأَرْضِ فَانظُرُوا كَيْفَ كَانَ عَاقِبَةُ الْمُكَذِّبِينَ

We sent a Messenger among every people saying: ´Worship Allah and keep clear of all false gods.´ Among them were some whom Allah guided but others received the misguidance they deserved. Travel about the earth and see the final fate of the deniers. (16:36)

وَلِكُلِّ أُمَّةٍ رَّسُولٌ فَإِذَا جَاءَ رَسُولُهُمْ قُضِيَ بَيْنَهُم بِالْقِسْطِ وَهُمْ لَا يُظْلَمُونَ

Every nation has a Messenger and when their Messenger comes everything is decided between them justly. They are not wronged. (10:47)

إِنَّا أَرْسَلْنَاكَ بِالْحَقِّ بَشِيرًا وَنَذِيرًا وَإِن مِّنْ أُمَّةٍ إِلَّا خَلَا فِيهَا نَذِيرٌ

We have sent you with the truth bringing good news and giving warning. There is no community to which a warner has not come. (35:24)

You don't know what's going on in the world, do u?

To stop Shias of Nigeria they created Boko Haram terrorists founded by Saudi Arabia, yet you don't know even they exist.

There are 60 millions Muslims in Nigeria (here's the proof:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shia_Islam_in_Nigeria

but in Wikipedia the number of Shias is not mentioned correctly and it is intentional.

A Nigerian who came to Karbala this year said there are 20-25 million shias there, you can find his interview with Mr. Raefipour an Iranian apocalypse researcher.

I will translate the interview and put it on youtube soon and post here as well for you to know what's going on in Nigeria.

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13 hours ago, أبو فاطمة المحمدي said:

 

Cutting yourself in the name of mourning anyone is a bid'ah - pure and simple. Trying to justify a bid'ah is a bid'ah in itself.

The Christians have nothing to do with the heresy of tatbir within Shi'i Islam.

Salam,

Christians have nothing to do with encouraging muslims to practise tatbir, but apparently some twisted minded Muslims copied a similar ritual practised by some Christians:

"When the Safavid dynasty assumed the power, they were desperate to create a unique identity which separates them from Ottomans. They needed to transform Ashura to a ritual that laymen could participate in, to be able to use such rituals as a show of force. But they ran out of ideas for how to do that. According to Ali Shariati , Safavids sent a team to Europe in search of new ideas.

That team followed a very simple procedure: they took all the rituals of commemoration of Jesus Christ’s sacrifice, and transformed it to the commemoration of Imam Hussein in Ashura."

http://shakeri.net/1315/blood-shedding-ritual-tatbir-ashura-is-it-islamic

"The Qizilbash, an extreme ghulat Turkish sect, seemingly introduced blood rituals to Imami Shias. He then points out that the Qizilbash took their flagellation rituals from some Christians. Therefore the Shia blood rituals most probably have a Christian origin.

Sufi and Christian elements were fused in the rituals of the Qizilbash.62 As will be seen below, this was also evident in the flagellations, which reenacted the shedding of Husayn’s blood in a manner similar to the reenactment of the shedding of the blood of Christ among Christian Catholics."

http://tatbir.org

And in many other non-English books on the topic.

 

Edited by certainclarity
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8 hours ago, Hidaren said:

You don't know what's going on in the world, do u?

To stop Shias of Nigeria they created Boko Haram terrorists founded by Saudi Arabia, yet you don't know even they exist.

There are 60 millions Muslims in Nigeria (here's the proof:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shia_Islam_in_Nigeria

but in Wikipedia the number of Shias is not mentioned correctly and it is intentional.

A Nigerian who came to Karbala this year said there are 20-25 million shias there, you can find his interview with Mr. Raefipour an Iranian apocalypse researcher.

I will translate the interview and put it on youtube soon and post here as well for you to know what's going on in Nigeria.

In that case, you should know I am a Nigerian, and I am part of the Nigerian Muslim community, and a part of the Nigerian Shi'i community. I do not rely upon Wikipedia for my information about Nigerian Muslims and Nigerian Shi'is, nor do I rely upon hearsay. I live the facts myself. I witness the facts myself. And I definitely know about my country, and my people, better than you can ever do.

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5 minutes ago, أبو فاطمة المحمدي said:

In that case, you should know I am a Nigerian, and I am part of the Nigerian Muslim community, and a part of the Nigerian Shi'i community. I do not rely upon Wikipedia for my information about Nigerian Muslims and Nigerian Shi'is, nor do I rely upon hearsay. I live the facts myself. I witness the facts myself. And I definitely know about my country, and my people, better than you can ever do.

Well your countryman say a different thing watch this:

I don't speak unless I have sth as evidence:

 

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3 minutes ago, Hidaren said:

Well your countryman say a different thing watch this:

I don't speak unless I have sth as evidence:

He is a plain liar. Every reasonable Nigerian Muslim - who does not tell lies for propaganda (or perhaps commercial purposes) knows that Shi'is in Nigeria are far, far less than 10% of Nigerian Muslims.

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I am sure you didn't even watch what i linked up there because the clip is 5 minutes and you answered me in 3 minutes. And calling someone a liar without hearing his word is not rational.

I am disappointed from you because you don't want to speak in a rational way.

My word is the other guys who are reading this i tell you guys watch this and judge:

 

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3 minutes ago, Hidaren said:

I am sure you didn't even watch what i linked up there because the clip is 5 minutes and you answered me in 3 minutes. And calling someone a liar without hearing his word is not rational.

I am disappointed from you because you don't want to speak in a rational way.

My word is the other guys who are reading this i tell you guys watch this and judge:

I am not dumb. I know a lie when I see it. And, perhaps, you have not noticed my manhaj. I do not say, or agree with, things simply because they sound sweet. I go with what is truth only - whether it is accepted by others or not.

Claiming that Nigerian Shi'is - who are most probably only between 6-10 million - are 25-30 million is a very huge lie. That is plain obvious.

And, another lie is your claim that Boko Haram was created by the US or whoever to target Shi'is. That is another blatant lie, which you probably got again from that liar. At least 96% of Boko Haram victims have been Sufi Sunni Muslims. How does that tally with the claim of that liar?

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Your words prove that you didn't watch that clip again.

No one said between 25-30 millions i said between 20-25 millions. Terrorism of this kind is a new thing in Nigeria but in Iran we are dealing with it for 37 years. First they came and began killing people of another kind then they slowly cause hatred among different religions, and different tribes and ... then the final target would be Shias. In this case they are patient. Creating Isis is not for past few years at least two decades they have worked on it.

Again I say: " Watch that clip before denying it."

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9 minutes ago, Hidaren said:

Your words prove that you didn't watch that clip again.No one said between 25-30 millions i said between 20-25 millions.

The exaggeration is still staggering!

Quote

Terrorism of this kind is a new thing in Nigeria but in Iran we are dealing with it for 37 years. First they came and began killing people of another kind then they slowly cause hatred among different religions, and different tribes and ... then the final target would be Shias. In this case they are patient. Creating Isis is not for past few years at least two decades they have worked on it.

Again I say: " Watch that clip before denying it."

If that laughable theory makes you happy, go with it.

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23 minutes ago, أبو فاطمة المحمدي said:

The exaggeration is still staggering!

If that laughable theory makes you happy, go with it.

It seems I  have to dig the grave of your words.

First you said there are 90 Muslims over all in Nigeria and you accused me at the same place that I claim that 27% of Nigerians are Shias here is the the screenshot:

vyrefq1xlm8vj1sf2oga.jpg

I googled the population of Nigeria and I saw this:

7vmcvdatwa3xega3cani.jpg

Then I used a calculator to see how many would be the 27% of this population:

3x9uk7xr17jucigp9wrf.jpg

46,710,000 is the 27% of Nigeria.

I said between 20-25 millions. which is definitely less than 20% of Nigerian.

I also searched for the Muslim population Nigeria:rzuhdkb47wcuh5i2uogy.jpg

121.52 millions of Nigerians are Muslim while you claim 90.

I live the judgement to those who are reading this post.

The holy prophet Muhammad(sa) caused 90% of Hijaz population to become Muslims in less than 3 decades, so it is possible that a person who acts like him cause less than 20% people of a country to become Shias.

The fact that most of the people don't know their own country well and these numbers and the clip below show me the truth:

 

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2 hours ago, Hidaren said:

46,710,000 is the 27% of Nigeria.

I said between 20-25 millions. which is definitely less than 20% of Nigerian.

I can see your panic. And the fact that you dared to lie so openly here again, confirms the old saying that liars follow liars.

Let me ask you? What is the official population figure of Nigeria? To answer this, you need to go to official Nigerian websites. Please forget Wikipedia or google for now. A serious fellow never takes his serious information from liars and Wikipedia.

When you find out what the official population of Nigeria is, then find out what 50% of that is. It is officially believed that Muslims are only 50% of the population. When you do that, tell us your figures.

And, as for your calculation above, you deliberately lied, which is unfortunate. I said that you were claiming that 27% of NIgeria's 90 million Muslims are Shi'ah. But, when you wanted to calculated that, you first inflated the figure through Wikipedia. Then, you calculated 27% of Nigeria's entire population. Then, you claimed what you claimed. Shame upon you! Lying boldly in broad daylight like this, just to defend some other huge lies.

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