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In the Name of God بسم الله
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Ruq

Trinity language (question)

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Salams to all,

I guess this is a question im hoping Christians on the forum will be able to help me with, but anyones help would be welcome. In the statement of the Council of Chalcedon it says that Jesus(as) was/is:

'perfect in manhood; truly God and truly man, of a reasonable [rational] soul and body... begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead,'

My question is: isnt that which distinguishes Jesus as a person of the Trinity (his being uncreated) the very thing that disqualifies him from being fully human?

The word 'man' points to a certain kind of being does it not? In the Abrahamic religions 'man' is a created being by definition (as established in genesis) and so is his soul (Jeremiah 38:16), so in what way can the use of the word 'man' be said to be appropriate if the established criteria for what that word points towards is not being met?

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12 minutes ago, Ruq said:

Salams to all,

I guess this is a question im hoping Christians on the forum will be able to help me with, but anyones help would be welcome. In the statement of the Council of Chalcedon it says that Jesus(as) was/is:

'perfect in manhood; truly God and truly man, of a reasonable [rational] soul and body... begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead,'

My question is: isnt that which distinguishes Jesus as a person of the Trinity (his being uncreated) the very thing that disqualifies him from being fully human?

The word 'man' points to a certain kind of being does it not? In the Abrahamic religions 'man' is a created being by definition (as established in genesis) and so is his soul (Jeremiah 38:16), so in what way can the use of the word 'man' be said to be appropriate if the established criteria for what that word points towards is not being met?

Pretty much...

You know I won't give you a mainstream answer.

I have a feeling that anyone who met Jesus would consider Him more than a mere man, and in some explanations would convey a message He was just like meeting God, or whatever. You know how people can be with association.

When the Quran says God would not have a mortal son, it's stating the obvious, and shouldn't even be a topic for discussion.

Jesus never called Himself "God" and for a good reason. He did however call God His father on many occasions, but it was usually followed by "Who is in Heaven" which kinda says God is not on earth. If People spend more time understanding "Father" as "Creator" that wouldn't be a topic either.

The one thing Jesus did call Himself was "The light of the world" It's like the second of the seven "I AM's" recorded quotes of Jesus. People have speculated, and of course argued what that meant, (like just about everything else Jesus said) but it's as simple as going back to Genesis 1:1,2,3 

Quote

 

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

 

Note Verse 1 speaks of God already "being". Second verse The Spirit of God as already "being" The third verse said "Let there be light" but note the sun isn't even created yet, so who/what was that light, and was it begotten or created? (or are they in golden olden Hebrew kinda the same thing?)

 

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Well, Jesus not being fully human was a position that Gnostics and other heresies took...hence, Councils were called to clarify that.

Jesus is, in all mainstream Christian Churches, fully human and fully God...two natures joined in one hypostasis  in one person. The Orthodox, Catholic, and Protestant Churches all accept the Council of Chalcedon. It's a mystery of the power of God.

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