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anonymike

Marrying refugee

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As salamu alaikum,

 

With all ghe war going on around the middle east, there a lot of orphaned women. Its sad to say that the gulf countries are only doing mutah marriages to the refugee women, at ages of 15, give or take. Shouldnt muslim men around the world marry these refugee women into all these other countries, except with pure intention to help orphaned women, not just pleasure? Also, I am curious if I wanted to marry, for example a syrian or iraqi refugee, how would I do it? (i am american by the way)

Edited by anonymike

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3 minutes ago, anonymike said:

As salamu alaikum,

 

With all ghe war going on around the middle east, there a lot of orphaned women. Its sad to say that the gulf countries are only doing mutah marriages to the refugee women, at ages of 15, give or take. Shouldnt muslim men around the world marry these refugee women into all these other countries, except with pure intention to help orphaned women, not just pleasure? Also, I am curious if I wanted to marry, for example a syrian or iraqi refugee, how would I do it?

Gulf countries dont marry Mut'ah. They make other forms of deals though.

Marrying someone who came from war zone while the suitor dose not belong to the same background culture is problematic. Unless you are some saint or someone with highly stable psych which is rare these days.

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2 minutes ago, Chaotic Muslem said:

Gulf countries dont marry Mut'ah. They make other forms of deals though.

Marrying someone who came from war zone while the suitor dose not belong to the same background culture is problematic. Unless you are some saint or someone with highly stable psych which is rare these days.

This is a duty i think every muslim should be doing, this is the reason for polygamy in Quran, I only can handle 1, yet not many muslims around the world  are trying to help in this manner.

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4 hours ago, anonymike said:

This is a duty i think every muslim should be doing, this is the reason for polygamy in Quran, I only can handle 1, yet not many muslims around the world  are trying to help in this manner.

Salam brother,

I think as soon as you tell the Iraqi or Syrian family of the girl you hope to marry you are Muslim they should take you in with loving arms.

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4 hours ago, anonymike said:

This is a duty i think every muslim should be doing, this is the reason for polygamy in Quran, I only can handle 1, yet not many muslims around the world  are trying to help in this manner.

Also it would be good to marry an Iraqi or Syrian as it will make it easier to learn Arabic.

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5 hours ago, Enlightened Follower said:

Or just visit a place in Europe, Lebanon, or Turkey where many refugees have fled to.

I remember discussing marriage a while ago with someone, the topic of the orphans in Lebanon (from the last war) came up and how that could always be an option, but all things considered, it isn't a very good idea, for various reasons.

Edited by Ali_Hussain

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11 minutes ago, Ali_Hussain said:

I remember discussing marriage a while ago with someone, the topic of the orphans in Lebanon (from the last war) came up and how that could always be an option, but all things considered, it isn't a very good idea, for various reasons.

Why isnt it a good idea?

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15 minutes ago, anonymike said:

Why isnt it a good idea?

For many reasons, first of all, people don't look too kindly on men traveling to their country to find a wife, even though your intentions may be noble - although admittedly this is a weak objection.

More importantly, you will be going after a women who has undergone severe trauma in her life and there will be a language and cultural barrier that will make it harder for you to 'be there for her', making married life a little tougher.

Of course I'm assuming all these things, I could be wrong, but as an outsider, that is how it looks, I could be wrong.

If you undertake something with a sincere desire, Allah may well give you what you want.

 

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3 hours ago, Ali_Hussain said:

For many reasons, first of all, people don't look too kindly on men traveling to their country to find a wife, even though your intentions may be noble - although admittedly this is a weak objection.

More importantly, you will be going after a women who has undergone severe trauma in her life and there will be a language and cultural barrier that will make it harder for you to 'be there for her', making married life a little tougher.

Of course I'm assuming all these things, I could be wrong, but as an outsider, that is how it looks, I could be wrong.

If you undertake something with a sincere desire, Allah may well give you what you want.

 

Salam brother,

As they say all wounds heal with time and who knows the brother may receive more swaab for his actions.

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This is the main reason why Imams of Ahl Al Bayt(a.s) had many wives. 

Unfortunately, there are not many men who are 'man enough' to get this thawab. 

There are other issues too, like , for example those brothers who live in the US / Canada / Europe, etc who may want to marry one of these women but have probably a snowball's chance in hell of getting them legal immigration status if they are already married. 

Then there's the problem of the first wife accepting the marriage. 

Then the financial issues. 

I would say that if

A) You have the resources to support one of them plus the children and 

B) It would not destroy the marriage with your first wife and 

C) You can get them into the country where you live legally 

Then it is your responsibility to do it. I would say it is extremely mustahab, but I cannot say it is wajib. These women, especially the Syrian and Iraqi refugees, are suffering tremendously and they are desperate for any sort of assistance. Allah(s.w.a) is generous and rewards people for deeds which are, from our understanding, trivial. 

Can you imagine what the reward would be for doing something like this which is difficult to do ? 

These other issues about language and cultural barriers, trauma, etc all these things can be overcome and go away, and actually evaporate quickly, especially with women, once they know that their husband loves them, is committed to them, and they are safe and their children are safe and have a future. 

Edited by Abu Hadi

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On 3/4/2016 at 4:57 PM, Ali_Hussain said:

For many reasons, first of all, people don't look too kindly on men traveling to their country to find a wife, even though your intentions may be noble - although admittedly this is a weak objection.

More importantly, you will be going after a women who has undergone severe trauma in her life and there will be a language and cultural barrier that will make it harder for you to 'be there for her', making married life a little tougher.

Of course I'm assuming all these things, I could be wrong, but as an outsider, that is how it looks, I could be wrong.

If you undertake something with a sincere desire, Allah may well give you what you want.

 

These are very good and sensible points. If Allah wills it, Ill take on the task.

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Muslim women should help out all of those suffering refugee men and start marrying them too (if their first marriages won't suffer, of course). It would be purely to help them out, since there's no other way to help them out without having intimate relations with them.

Edited by BabyBeaverIsAKit

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12 hours ago, anonymike said:

These are very good and sensible points. If Allah wills it, Ill take on the task.

Perhaps a better course of action for you would be to get a certificate to teach English as a foreign language, and then go and volunteer in an orphanage in Lebanon or Iraq, you get could your foot in the door that way without seeming like you are only there for one reason (I assume the people working there are orphans themselves)

At the very least, it would be a good life experience.

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10 hours ago, BabyBeaverIsAKit said:

Muslim women should help out all of those suffering refugee men and start marrying them too (if their first marriages won't suffer, of course). It would be purely to help them out, since there's no other way to help them out without having intimate relations with them.

With one major difference. 

That is against the law of Allah(s.w.a), if they are already married. 

If they are single, then I agree. 

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3 hours ago, Ali_Hussain said:

experiencePerhaps a better course of action for you would be to get a certificate to teach English as a foreign language, and then go and volunteer in an orphanage in Lebanon or Iraq, you get could your foot in the door that way without seeming like you are only there for one reason (I assume the people working there are orphans themselves)

At the very least, it would be a good life experience.

Thats a reallly good idea

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On 3/6/2016 at 6:26 PM, BabyBeaverIsAKit said:

Muslim women should help out all of those suffering refugee men and start marrying them too (if their first marriages won't suffer, of course). It would be purely to help them out, since there's no other way to help them out without having intimate relations with them.

There is other ways to help besides having intimate relations. Many (probably most)  here are already supporting orphans, widows, children, etc by giving financial support, i.e. contributions or sadaqat. 

But here is my definition of brotherhood and sisterhood in Islam. You want for your brother or sister what you want for yourself. You hate for your brother or sister what you would hate for yourself. 

That is the standard, in Islam. The muslims and muslima in Syria and Iraq are our brothers and sisters.

I sometimes think that what would happen if there was a big war where I live and Takfiris or others were killing right and left(and don't think that this could never happen to you, it could wherever you live) . I died and all my family was gone and there was noone to take care of my wife and children. Although it is now extremely painful and distressing to think of this, but if there was only a choice of my wife getting food shelter and nothing else or having a chance to be part of a family and there would be a good, mumin guy there who would help her and support her and look after my children, I would prefer that to no family and no emotional support for them. I think most brothers would prefer that. The ones who wouldn't are probably only thinking about their own ego because they could not stand the thought of their wife with another man. But the rational ones are thinking a different way. 

It is a question of having the bad or the worse, and I would rather take the bad than the worse. If those are the only two choices. Women (and men also) cannot live with just material things and no family and loving household to come home to. A home where support is given and problems are solved. Where children are taught and raised up right and are given a sense of safety and belonging. I wouldn't want to deprive anyone, either man or women of having an opportunity for that. In Islam, this can only be accomplished thru marriage. 

I think that just because someone went thru a bad situation, like a war or poverty, it doesn't mean that now they have no right to a loving household and security. We should work together as brothers and sisters, within the laws set down by Allah(s.w.a) to give them that opportunity. 

That is what I believe. 

 

Edited by Abu Hadi

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29 minutes ago, Abu Hadi said:

There is other ways to help besides having intimate relations. Many (probably most)  here are already supporting orphans, widows, children, etc by giving financial support, i.e. contributions or sadaqat. 

But here is my definition of brotherhood and sisterhood in Islam. You want for your brother or sister what you want for yourself. You hate for your brother or sister what you would hate for yourself. 

That is the standard, in Islam. The muslims and muslima in Syria and Iraq are our brothers and sisters.

I sometimes think that what would happen if there was a big war where I live and Takfiris or others were killing right and left(and don't think that this could never happen to you, it could wherever you live) . I died and all my family was gone and there was noone to take care of my wife and children. Although it is now extremely painful and distressing to think of this, but if there was only a choice of my wife getting food shelter and nothing else or having a chance to be part of a family and there would be a good, mumin guy there who would help her and support her and look after my children, I would prefer that to no family and no emotional support for them. I think most brothers would prefer that. The ones who wouldn't are probably only thinking about their own ego because they could not stand the thought of their wife with another man. But the rational ones are thinking a different way. 

It is a question of having the bad or the worse, and I would rather take the bad than the worse. If those are the only two choices. Women (and men also) cannot live with just material things and no family and loving household to come home to. A home where support is given and problems are solved. Where children are taught and raised up right and are given a sense of safety and belonging. I wouldn't want to deprive anyone, either man or women of having an opportunity for that. In Islam, this can only be accomplished thru marriage. 

I think that just because someone went thru a bad situation, like a war or poverty, it doesn't mean that now they have no right to a loving household and security. We should work together as brothers and sisters, within the laws set down by Allah(s.w.a) to give them that opportunity. 

That is what I believe. 

 

Very good and obvious points brother. I actually suggested to someone, if a man is anle to take more than 1 family, find a way to do it, even if you must go through loopholes, because lives of muslims are on the line and have been on the line.

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On 2016-03-06 at 6:20 PM, Abu Hadi said:

This is the main reason why Imams of Ahl Al Bayt(a.s) had many wives. 

Unfortunately, there are not many men who are 'man enough' to get this thawab. 

There are other issues too, like , for example those brothers who live in the US / Canada / Europe, etc who may want to marry one of these women but have probably a snowball's chance in hell of getting them legal immigration status if they are already married. 

 

This is one of the reasons why marriage contract is bad.

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On ‎3‎/‎4‎/‎2016 at 8:43 AM, Enlightened Follower said:

Also it would be good to marry an Iraqi or Syrian as it will make it easier to learn Arabic.

I tried this. Does not work. They wwant to speak only English so they can learn it.

OPine: Many above spoke of marrying "orphan" girls. Why not marry a widow with children and take care of several children.

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1 hour ago, hasanhh said:

I tried this. Does not work. They wwant to speak only English so they can learn it.

OPine: Many above spoke of marrying "orphan" girls. Why not marry a widow with children and take care of several children.

It depends on what I would be able to handle.

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I know one such person who lives nearby who is a converted Muslim and has three wives, all from distressed regions of ME and is among one of the finest Shia that I know of. 

As far as wajoob of 2nd marriage, the ayat which comes right after the ayat of taking another wife (up to four), is the ayat about caring for orphans. Yes, this is one of the most critical of the needs of Muslim nations worldwide, to have fathers for the millions of orphans these wars caused by GCC greed and subservience. 

Marrying those war victims is important, but more important is be the father of their orphan children because kids raised without a father in a single mother household grow with a huge void in their personalities. Ever wonder why Afghanistan and bordering areas of Pakistan produce the highest number of Salafi foot soldiers? These are war orphans without fathers who then look up to GCC paid Salafi mullas as father figures and get to become the cannon fodder of ISIS and Qaedas etc.

A solution could be, and I know a few people do that, is they marry permanent (not mutah) two or more in Iraq or Afghanistan and keep them there. But they also support them financially and make frequent travels to their wives.

 

 

Edited by Irfani313

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2 hours ago, Irfani313 said:

I know one such person who lives nearby who is a converted Muslim and has three wives, all from distressed regions of ME and is among one of the finest Shia that I know of. 

As far as wajoob of 2nd marriage, the ayat which comes right after the ayat of taking another wife (up to four), is the ayat about caring for orphans. Yes, this is one of the most critical of the needs of Muslim nations worldwide, to have fathers for the millions of orphans these wars caused by GCC greed and subservience. 

Marrying those war victims is important, but more important is be the father of their orphan children because kids raised without a father in a single mother household grow with a huge void in their personalities. Ever wonder why Afghanistan and bordering areas of Pakistan produce the highest number of Salafi foot soldiers? These are war orphans without fathers who then look up to GCC paid Salafi mullas as father figures and get to become the cannon fodder of ISIS and Qaedas etc.

A solution could be, and I know a few people do that, is they marry permanent (not mutah) two or more in Iraq or Afghanistan and keep them there. But they also support them financially and make frequent travels to their wives.

 

 

Thats a major task marrying over seas and traveling back and forth. Going to have to have serious deep pockets. Marry from there, but I would have to find a way to get them to me.

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Marrying someone for charity doesn't work. Marriages need a solid foundation and the two people need to be mature and likes each other enough to start a relationship that has the potential to produce a. New life.

Girls after going through wars and so much violence don't need to be married off. They need to go to school, acquire employable skills and find a new place to began life.

the reason they are getting multiple short term offer for marriages is because these women are very desperate and they are being preyed upon

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1 hour ago, Gypsy said:

Marrying someone for charity doesn't work. Marriages need a solid foundation and the two people need to be mature and likes each other enough to start a relationship that has the potential to produce a. New life.

Girls after going through wars and so much violence don't need to be married off. They need to go to school, acquire employable skills and find a new place to began life.

the reason they are getting multiple short term offer for marriages is because these women are very desperate and they are being preyed upon

This is true as well, and i would have similar intentions.

Edited by anonymike

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1 hour ago, Gypsy said:

Marrying someone for charity doesn't work. Marriages need a solid foundation and the two people need to be mature and likes each other enough to start a relationship that has the potential to produce a. New life.

Girls after going through wars and so much violence don't need to be married off. They need to go to school, acquire employable skills and find a new place to began life.

the reason they are getting multiple short term offer for marriages is because these women are very desperate and they are being preyed upon

I think also mixed in with the brother's thinking is that those women would be far less demanding than women in the west (in terms of scrutinising your cv before marriage), coupled with the possibility of doing a good deed it makes it a decent route to go down, other issues aside.

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