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In the Name of God بسم الله

The knowledge of ahlul bayt

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https://www.quora.com/When-converting-to-Islam-how-did-you-choose-between-Shia-and-Sunni-Islam/answer/Majed-Jamaleddine/comment/15503190?__snids__=1496838197&__nsrc__=1&__filter__=all

From Ahmad bin Muhammad bin Isa, from Al-Husain bin Saeed, from Muhammad bin Abi Umair, from Abi Ayub Ibrahim bin Usman Al-Khazaz, from Aban bin Taghlub who said:


“I was in the presence of Abi Abdillah (Imam asSadiq), when a man from Yemen came up to Him.
The Imam said to him, “O Yemeni brother, are there scholars among you?”
He said, “Yes”.
The Imam said, “What do your scholars achieve from their knowledge?”
He said, “He travels in one night the travel distance of two months of the flight of the bird and the effects would remain.”
Abi Abdillah said, “The scholar from Medina [referring to himself] is more knowledgeable then your scholars.”
He said, “What does the scholar of Medina achieve from his knowledge?”
The Imam said, ” He travels in one hour of the day, the travel distance of a year’s travel of the sun, to the extent that he cuts through twelve thousand worlds the like of this world of yours whose inhabitants are not aware that Allah created Adam (as) or Iblees”.
He said, “They recognise You?”
The Imam said, “Yes. There is no obligation upon them except for Our Wilayah and the keeping away from Our enemies.”
[Source: Basaair Al-Darajaat, Vol. 8, Chapter. 12, Hadees. 15]
-All narrators are trustworthy. Hadees is Saheeh.
-There are more narrations with the same meaning, hence making the Matn “Tawattur” (frequently narrated)


Muhammad bin Abdullah Al-Razi Al-Jaamoorani, from Ismail bin Moosa from his father, from his grandfather, from Abd Al-Samad bin Ali who said :

A man came up to Ali bin Husain (as). Ali bin Husain (as) said to him, “Who are you?”.
The man said, “I am an astrologer.” The Imam said, “So you are a fortune-teller.” He then looked at him and then said, “Shall I show you a man who since the time you have come to us, moved through 14 worlds, with each world being 3 times bigger than this world, without having moved from his place?”
The man said, “Who is He?”
The Imam said, “it is I, and if I wish, I can inform you what you ate and what you have stored in your house.”
[Source: Basaair Al-Darajaat, Vol. 8, Chapter. 12, Hadees. 13]

Imam Jafar Sadiq narrates:
We have been given the knowledge of the beginning and the end.
A person from the Imams (as) companions said: “May I be your ransom. Do you have Knowledge of the unseen (Ilm e Ghaib)?”
Imam(as) replied:”Woe unto you. I know what is in the loins of men and womb of women. Woe unto you all. Open us your heart and see with your eyes and accept with your hearts. We are the proof of Allah in his creations. And none can accept this except all those believers whos hearts are as strong as the mount of Tahama and by the will of Allah.”
[Source: Bihar Al Anwar Vol.26]

And so on and so forth. I am sure you would know many more than I know.

Edit: Just got sent this video. Do you guys really believe this stuff? Which Muslim does?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=...

I was arguing with a sunni and he presented these arguments, can a shia please refute these and see where I went wrong with my arguments

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There is a problem in the shia community today, where people simply pick up nahjul balagha or bihar al anwar (not even our main top four books) and pick any hadith and believe it is authentic.

I am not saying the ones quoted are or are not authentic, but how can we know ? We shia's have really got to stop doing this. I see it on social media, on the forums, everywhere. Just posting hadiths - no grade, no idea of telling if a ghali narrated it, or if it's fabricated by someone well known for telling a pack of lies.

With regards to the knowlede of the Prophet pbuh and Imams a.s, i am of the belief that over-exagerrating is not a sign you love the Imams a.s - but a way you're going to push people away from them.

 

 
Translated by Brother Nader Zaveri or Islamic Salvation:

حمدويه، قال حدثنا يعقوب، عن ابن أبي عمير، عن شعيب، عن أبي بصير، قال : قلت لأبي عبد الله (عليه السلام) إنهم يقولون قال و ما يقولون قلت يقولون تعلم قطر المطر و عدد النجوم و ورق الشجر و وزن ما في البحر و عدد التراب، فرفع يده إلى السماء، و قال سبحان الله سبحان الله لا و الله ما يعلم هذا إلا الله

532. Hamdawayh who said: narrated to us Ya’qub from Ibn Abi Umayr from Shuayb from Abi Basir who said: I said to Abi Abdillah عليه السلام – they do say, he said: and what do they say? I said: they say that you know the number of the drops in the rain, and the number of the stars, and the number of leaves in all the trees, and the weight of what is in the ocean, and the number of sand particles, so he عليه السلام raised his hand to the sky and said: praise be to Allah, praise be to Allah, no by Allah, no one knows this except for Allah.

Rijal Al-Kash SAHEEH

 

Quran: " And among those around you of the bedouins are hypocrites, and [also] from the people of Madinah. They have become accustomed to hypocrisy. You, [O Muhammad], do not know them, [but] We know them. We will punish them twice [in this world]; then they will be returned to a great punishment."
 

"We do relate unto thee the most beautiful of stories, in that We reveal to thee this (portion of) Qur'an: before this, thou too were among those who knew it not.

 

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2 minutes ago, Qasim_Husayn said:

But can someone refute these hadith for me, and as to what these hadith are actuallly trying to mean assuming that these hadith are authentic

First verify they are authentic. We can't just assume these things. Alhamdullilah we are not akhbari's.

And then show them this authentic hadith i have presented:

Translated by Brother Nader Zaveri or Islamic Salvation:

حمدويه، قال حدثنا يعقوب، عن ابن أبي عمير، عن شعيب، عن أبي بصير، قال : قلت لأبي عبد الله (عليه السلام) إنهم يقولون قال و ما يقولون قلت يقولون تعلم قطر المطر و عدد النجوم و ورق الشجر و وزن ما في البحر و عدد التراب، فرفع يده إلى السماء، و قال سبحان الله سبحان الله لا و الله ما يعلم هذا إلا الله

532. Hamdawayh who said: narrated to us Ya’qub from Ibn Abi Umayr from Shuayb from Abi Basir who said: I said to Abi Abdillah عليه السلام – they do say, he said: and what do they say? I said: they say that you know the number of the drops in the rain, and the number of the stars, and the number of leaves in all the trees, and the weight of what is in the ocean, and the number of sand particles, so he عليه السلام raised his hand to the sky and said: praise be to Allah, praise be to Allah, no by Allah, no one knows this except for Allah.

Rijal Al-Kash SAHEEH

Edited by Tawheed313
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ما رواه الكشي في (رجاله) في الحديث الصحيح عن ابن المغيرة قال كنت عند أبي الحسن (ع) أنا و يحيى بن عبد الله بن الحسن (ع) فقال يحيى جعلت فداك إنهم يزعمون أنك تعلم الغيب؟ فقال: سبحان الله سبحان الله ضع يدك على رأسي فو الله ما بقيت في جسدي شعرة و لا في رأسي إلا قامت قال ثم قال: لا و الله ما هي إلا وراثة عن رسول الله (ص

  
Shaikh Kashi reported (in his Rijal Kashi) in a sahih (authentic) hadith from ibn al Mughirah that he said: I was with abi al Hasan (as) along with Yahya b. Abdullah b. al Hasan, so Yahya said: "May we be your ransom, indeed they believe that you know ghaib (unseen)?" So Imam (as) said: "Glory be to Allah! Glory be to Allah! Place your hand on my head, for by Allah there does not remain a hair on my body or head but that it is standing up*." Imam (as) then continued: "No! By Allah (swt) it is not but inheritance from the Prophet (pbuh).*"
 
*Translator's note: The Imam (as) pointed out that the hair on his head and body are standing on its end to emphasize how frightened he felt by the deviant beliefs of the people that they believed the Imams (as) know ghaib.
 
The Imam (as) then clarified that the knowledge of the Imams is due to inheritance from the Prophet (pbuh), which includes certain prophecies about future events, but they do not know ghaib.
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ويقول الشيخ المفيد في كتابه «أوائل المقالات» (ص 38):
«فأما إطلاق القول عليهم بأنهم يعلمون الغيب فهو منكر بيِّنُ الفساد
 
Shaikh Mufid wrote in his book Awailul Maqalat (page 38): "As for saying that the Imams know ghaib, so it is an extremely evil and corrupt belief."
 
ويقول الشيخ الطوسي أيضاً في كتابه المذكور: «ولم نوجب أن يكون [الإمام] عالماً بما لا تعلُّق له بالأحكام الشرعية
 
Shaikh Tusi wrote in his book Talkhis al Shafi (Volume 1 page 252): "It is not wajib for the Imam to have any knowledge of things which are not directly related to Islamic laws.  


الشيخ رشيد الدين محمد بن شهرآشوب المازندراني المتوفى عام 586هـ  يقول في كتابه «متشابه القرآن ومختلفه» (طبع طهران، ج1/ص211) ما نصُّهُ:

«النبيّ والإمام يجب أن يعلما علوم الدين والشريعة ولا يجب أن يعلما الغيب وما كان وما يكون، لأنّ ذلك يؤدّي إلى أنّهما مشاركان للقديم تعالى
 
Ibn Shahr Ashoob (586 AH) wrote in his book Mutashabih al Qur'an (Volume 1 page 211): "The Prophet and the Imam must have full knowledge of the Islamic laws,but it is not incumbent upon them to have knowledge of ghaib, after all that would then mean that they are partners of Allah
Edited by Tawheed313
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Kamal al Din by Shaikh Saduq

ومن قال: إن الله يبدو له من إحداث رأي وعلم مستفاد فهو كافر بالله. وما كان غير هذا فهو قول المغيرية، ومن ينحل للأئمة علم الغيب. فهذا كفر بالله، وخروج عن الاسلام عندنا
 
And one who professed that "indeed the occurrences become apparent to Allah (swt), through consideration and gained knowledge", so he is a disbeliever (kafir) of Allah (swt). And what was other than this, so it is the belief of the "mughiriah" sect, and one who attributes the knowledge of the unseen (Ghaib) to the Imams (as) so it is disbelief (kufr) in Allah (swt) and expulsion from Islam according to us. (Page 106)
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والامام أيضا لم يقف على كل هذه التخاليط التي رويت لأنه لا يعلم الغيب، وإنما هو عبد صالح يعلم الكتاب والسنة، ويعلم من أخبار شيعته ما ينهى إليه
 
 
And the Imam also did not stop all this confusion which you saw because he does not know the unseen, rather he is just a pious slave of Allah (swt) who knows the Qur'an and the sunnah, and he knows about the affairs of his shias that are not inhibited from him. (Page 110)
 
 
قد أكثرت في ذكر علم الغيب، والغيب لا يعلمه إلا الله، وما ادعاه لبشر إلا مشرك كافر
 
We have expanded a lot about the issue of knowledge of the unseen, and no one knows the unseen except Allah (swt), and no one claims it for a human except for a polytheistic disbeliever (mushrik kafir). (Page 116)
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Musnad Ahmed ibn Hanbal

The Messenger of Allah (S) told me:

You are like Jesus. The Jews hated him so much that they slandered his mother, and the Christians because of their extreme devotion to him placed him in a position which was not his.”

Then (Imam) ‘Ali (‘a) said:

Two persons [groups] are doomed concerning me; the devoted extremist exalting me to what I am not, and the spiteful hater bearing malice towards me and slandering me).1

 

Smoked-salmon-plant-fire.jpg

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1 minute ago, Qasim_Husayn said:

I`m sorry I can`t read Arabic can you please go thorugh the troubles of reading through this book

http://ia600401.us.archive.org/21/items/98753479537489543/bsair-aldrjat.pdf

 

I gave you the translations, taken from the tashayyu website - what seems to be the problem brother ?

I would rather you posted the contents of that book on shiachat, i don't usually go on links like that.

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I agree that no one has Knowledge of ghayb except Allah...  But yhe prophets of Allah were able to do miracles, and even see jinns and angels. They story with prophet suleiman AS, the man named asef teleported or manefested the throne of queen sheba. Quran says he had a little knowledge of the book... There is also al khidr as well... No of these are Allah, but it seems like they have been given a different type of knowledge no one else has been given unless chosen by Allah. Can someone elaborate with this in mind?

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6 hours ago, Qasim_Husayn said:

How do you verify if a hadith is authentic

There are many ways, the minhaj may differ from scholar to scholar. The above hadiths which were posted by @Tawheed313 were authenticated via the seemingly traditional "rijali" method.

Edited by The Batman
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3 hours ago, anonymike said:

I agree that no one has Knowledge of ghayb except Allah...  But yhe prophets of Allah were able to do miracles, and even see jinns and angels. They story with prophet suleiman AS, the man named asef teleported or manefested the throne of queen sheba. Quran says he had a little knowledge of the book... There is also al khidr as well... No of these are Allah, but it seems like they have been given a different type of knowledge no one else has been given unless chosen by Allah. Can someone elaborate with this in mind?

this is true

 

 

http://www.al-islam.org/shiite-encyclopedia-ahlul-bayt-dilp-team/knowledge-unseen-knowledge-book

http://www.islamquest.net/en/archive/question/fa3259

 

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2 hours ago, Qasim_Husayn said:

 Please provide me a refutation

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From Sheikh Mufid's Amali.

Translation:

I asked Abul Hasan (as): Some people think that you have knowledge of the unknown? He said: Subhanallah! Put your hand on my head and see that all the hairs on my head and on my body have risen (because of what you claimed). Then he said: No. What we know is nothing except what we inherited from the Prophet of God (pbuh).

EDIT: I just realized that brother Tawheed had already posted the exact same hadith. Mashaallah. There you have it brother Qasim Husain. What more needs to be said?

Edited by Abu Nasr
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Also, can anyone confirm the credibility of Basaair al-darajat? Its Wikipedia page says it is the oldest Shia hadith collection and yet I had never heard of it until now. And I don't remember any of our scholars ever mentioning it.

As for Bihar, unfortunately there's no way to check the authenticity of its ahadith except by going through its chains. Unlike Kafi which has been given gradings by Al-Majlisi himself.

Edited by Abu Nasr
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فَسَخَّرْنَا لَهُ الرِّيحَ تَجْرِي بِأَمْرِهِ رُخَاءً حَيْثُ أَصَابَ {36}

[Shakir 38:36] Then We made the wind subservient to him; it made his command to run gently wherever he desired,

[Pickthal 38:36] So We made the wind subservient unto him, setting fair by his command whithersoever he intended.

[Yusufali 38:36] Then We subjected the wind to his power, to flow gently to his order, Whithersoever he willed,-

Please read the words of the verse, and reflect. Allah[AWJ] gives the power to His Hujjat to excersice.[ at will, or not , up to you to determine ]. Above is the station of a Prophet[as].

The status of the Seal of the Prophet[pbuhah] and Ahlulbayth[as] is upto you to determine…

 

فَكَانَ قَابَ قَوْسَيْنِ أَوْ أَدْنَىٰ {9}

[Shakir 53:9] So he was the measure of two bows or closer still.

[Pickthal 53:9] Till he was (distant) two bows' length or even nearer,

[Yusufali 53:9] And was at a distance of but two bow-lengths or (even) nearer;

“..Then the Holy Prophet drew near to Allah "till a distance of two bows or still nearer." The nearness described by "still nearer" cannot be imagined by human mind. It is the nearest nearness possible between the finite and the infinite. Arabic idiom qaba qawsayn indicate extreme nearness. "The drawn bows, with their chords touching," make a circle of union, yet the Holy Prophet is not to be considered as totally absorbed into divinity. The nearness stands for the highest position of the Holy Prophet in the order of creation-the nearest to Allah. It was a custom among the Arabs that when two individuals joined their bows it implied that both of them were united or bound by an agreement to shoot their arrows simultaneously in one direction…”

[Pooya/Ali Commentary 53:6] http://quran.al-islam.org/



 

قَالَ الَّذِي عِنْدَهُ عِلْمٌ مِنَ الْكِتَابِ أَنَا آتِيكَ بِهِ قَبْلَ أَنْ يَرْتَدَّ إِلَيْكَ طَرْفُكَ ۚ فَلَمَّا رَآهُ مُسْتَقِرًّا عِنْدَهُ قَالَ هَٰذَا مِنْ فَضْلِ رَبِّي لِيَبْلُوَنِي أَأَشْكُرُ أَمْ أَكْفُرُ ۖ وَمَنْ شَكَرَ فَإِنَّمَا يَشْكُرُ لِنَفْسِهِ ۖ وَمَنْ كَفَرَ فَإِنَّ رَبِّي غَنِيٌّ كَرِيمٌ{40}

[Shakir 27:40] One who had the knowledge of the Book said: I will bring it to you in the twinkling of an eye. Then when he saw it settled beside him, he said: This is of the grace of my Lord that He may try me whether I am grateful or ungrateful; and whoever is grateful, he is grateful only for his own soul, and whoever is ungrateful, then surely my Lord is Self-sufficient, Honored.

[Pickthal 27:40] One with whom was knowledge of the Scripture said: I will bring it thee before thy gaze returneth unto thee. And when he saw it set in his presence, (Solomon) said: This is of the bounty of my Lord, that He may try me whether I give thanks or am ungrateful. Whosoever giveth thanks he only giveth thanks for (the good of) his own soul; and whosoever is ungrateful (is ungrateful only to his own soul's hurt). For lo! my Lord is Absolute in independence, Bountiful.

[Yusufali 27:40] Said one who had knowledge of the Book: "I will bring it to thee within the twinkling of an eye!" Then when (Solomon) saw it placed firmly before him, he said: "This is by the Grace of my Lord!- to test me whether I am grateful or ungrateful! and if any is grateful, truly his gratitude is (a gain) for his own soul; but if any is ungrateful, truly my Lord is Free of all Needs, Supreme in Honour !"

“....After the embassy had departed he asked his chiefs: "Who can bring me her with her throne, before they come to me in submission." A large, powerful jinn offered his services and assured Sulayman that he would do it before he would rise from his council. However strong and big a creature might be, it was not possible for him to go to a distant land and bring her and her throne in a few moments, unless the jinn had supernatural powers to do it. Although the jinn had boasted of his strength and supernatural power, yet when a man who had knowledge of the book said that he would bring them to him within the twinkling of an eye, Sulayman gave him permission. Soon the Queen, with her throne, was before him. See commentary of Rad: 43 to know about him who had the knowledge of the book. …”

Commentary for verse 40 is under the commentary of verse 20.

[Pooya/Ali Commentary 27:20]http://quran.al-islam.org/

The Knowledge of the person with the knowledge of the book in Prophet Sulayman[as] court, matter is at his disposal.

Wasi of the Last Prophet Muhammad[pbuhahp] has what powers , it for you determine.

Here is some info on the Unseen issue, for your research. [advice is not to get caught up in the Arabic words,]

http://www.al-islam.org/shiite-encyclopedia-ahlul-bayt-dilp-team/knowledge-unseen-knowledge-book#knowledge-unseen

Layman. 

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