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In the Name of God بسم الله

Would You Be A Second Wife?

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mina

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The problem with that interpretation is that the number of men and women in the world is roughly equal. (ie. about 50% men and 50% women amoung any population)

This depends on regions and countries.There are regions with more men and regions with more women. Edited by mina313
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For the discussion regarding the "generous spending", thought the following could shed some light:

 

It is narrated from Imam Ja'far-e-Sadiq (a.s.) that decency and cleanliness in one's outfit are highly endearing to God and those who practise otherwise, displease Almighty.

A historical incident reflecting the attitude of the chosen one of God, Imam Ja'far-e-Sadiq (a.s.) is thus narrated. One of the leaders of the Ascetic Sufi school of thought tried to belittle and tease the Imam (a.s.) before the whole congregation while he was seated in Masjid al-Haram, elegantly attired. He approached the Imam (a.s.) and questioned him why he was so decently attired when the Holy Prophet and other ancestors of the Imam (a.s.) never were. The Imam (a.s.) recited the following verse from the Holy Book;

Say: (O Our Messenger Mohammed) "Who hath prohibited the adornment (granted) of Allah, which He hath brought forth for His servants and the good things of the provisions?"

and elaborated that in the days of Prophet there was poverty while at present there was economic prosperity and as such pious people had a better right of spending to display the generosity of God. Further, revealing the clothes he was wearing underneath, he said that the outward attire is just for the view of the world but underneath he was coarsely dressed for the sake of his soul.

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salam

Being raised in the west most of my life, my preferences for wives are of white caucasian female types with fair complexion. I always thought I was never good enough for the good sisters in islamic countries and they would never understand my strong aussie accent. But this never prevented me from helping such sisters through the charities I know and trust. Inshallah I would like my sons and daughters to marry such sisters/brothers if there are any you can recommend for them.

ws

Salam Brother,

That is why , I mentioned needy Ukranian woman who is momin ( the fair complexion and less demanding type like you prefer) or needy African momin ( meaning depending on a persons exterior liking )

Just the priority should be needy momin specially when supporting more than one wife , as Allah has given special preference to some one who he calls momin.

Or as I mentioned some one who is atleast interested in being a momin.

The key words are momin and needy , whatever color and form you prefer them in .

These are for more than one wife.

But the one wife criteria need not be needy but always preferibilty is to those who are momin.What ever skin color.

That is why the prophet mentioned :

“A woman is married for four things: her wealth, her family status, her beauty and her religion. So you should marry the religious woman (otherwise) you will be unsuccessful.”

Hence , in looking for a wife islamicly , it would be religion > beauty> status> wealth.

But when there is the real need to get married and no momins are available than atleast with some one with good nature that would not be of hinderance for you towards the main goal which is Allah.

This is what I meant ,other wise there is no harm in seeking some one you prefer exteriorly more pleasing.

As for your childrens marriage in the future , brother, I think you have better connections , if you are intouch with charity organizations. They may know plenty of the mentioned ,Insha Allah.

Wasalam

Edited by tendersoul
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Salam Brother,

That is why , I mentioned needy Ukranian woman who is momin ( the fair complexion and less demanding type like you prefer) or needy African momin ( meaning depending on a persons exterior liking )

Just the priority should be needy momin specially when supporting more than one wife , as Allah has given special preference to some one who he calls momin.

Or as I mentioned some one who is atleast interested in being a momin.

The key words are momin and needy , whatever color and form you prefer them in .

These are for more than one wife.

But the one wife criteria need not be needy but always preferibilty is to those who are momin.What ever skin color.

That is why the prophet mentioned :

“A woman is married for four things: her wealth, her family status, her beauty and her religion. So you should marry the religious woman (otherwise) you will be unsuccessful.”

Hence , in looking for a wife islamicly , it would be religion > beauty> status> wealth.

But when there is the real need to get married and no momins are available than atleast with some one with good nature that would not be of hinderance for you towards the main goal which is Allah.

This is what I meant ,other wise there is no harm in seeking some one you prefer exteriorly more pleasing.

As for your childrens marriage in the future , brother, I think you have better connections , if you are intouch with charity organizations. They may know plenty of the mentioned ,Insha Allah.

Wasalam

salam dear brother, 

Jazakallah khairul for your words of wisdom, truly remarkable your insight, which such knowledge and dedication in serving our deen, may :Allah swt give you many good momin wives and children inshallah.

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Bismillah

I hope you are all doing well.I'd like to know your views on that question.What can be advantages and problems? I had this discussion with some sisters and decided to get your views here as well.

Thanks in advance.Bless you.

 

It depends on the situation. 

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I'm looking at this strictly as to how this would benefit me & my family.

If a brother wanted to take me as his 2nd and had the ability to give me all my rights (including a separate home, in my name, and maintaining it) yeah, I would go for it.

That means all of my earnings would be for me & my children. 

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A divorced or widowed lady, with or without children, would possibly be a second wife. However, a young never-married woman, who is active on facebook or other social media sites, would not want to be the second wife. As soon as she posted wedding photos, people would gossip that her husband is already married to so-and-so, which would be a criminal offense in countries that do not allow polygamy.

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On 8/24/2015 at 4:49 PM, hameedeh said:

A divorced or widowed lady, with or without children, would possibly be a second wife. However, a young never-married woman, who is active on facebook or other social media sites, would not want to be the second wife. As soon as she posted wedding photos, people would gossip that her husband is already married to so-and-so, which would be a criminal offense in countries that do not allow polygamy.

It would only be a criminal offence if they had the second marriage recognised by the state, though right? As long as they did the Nikka then they are married according to Islam and thats all that really matters. 

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It would only be a criminal offence if they had the second marriage recognised by the state, though right? As long as they did the Nikka then they are married according to Islam and thats all that really matters. 

 

There was a judge in Utah who was disbarred for bigamy without legal registration of the second marriage.  As I recall, there was no criminal prosecution, but I might be mistaken.

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A divorced or widowed lady, with or without children, would possibly be a second wife. However, a young never-married woman, who is active on facebook or other social media sites, would not want to be the second wife. As soon as she posted wedding photos, people would gossip that her husband is already married to so-and-so, which would be a criminal offense in countries that do not allow polygamy.

Why would anyone marry a woman who displays her private life for the world to see. Hijab is not just a piece of cloth that goes over one's head, privacy is part of hijab and marriage between 2 momins is sacred, this holy alliance should be guarded, treated with respect and dignity. Photos of a sister's private life should never be given to sites like CIAbook, so they can sell it to the highest bidder for profit, or to conduct "research" on her private life. I'm sure a good sister don't like "peeping toms", so why expose herself to the many intel spy agencies that use such sites to pry into your private life. This is not hijab in my opinion especially for a momin sister.

Edited by :Sami II
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As for what hameedeh says, it is very common actually for youths, not necessarily females, to be active on social media. We can discuss about tons of conspiracy theories, but social media is nowadays just a tool, and you can use it in many ways. One thing is to expose yourself and another thing is to selectively share some aspects of your life because you think it is appropiate, and probably may actually be. I don't think a Facebook account makes a person less worthy in absolutely any way, generally speaking.

Edited by Bakir
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Sami, hameedeh was not even referring to herself in the first place. Your reply seems to be point out at her personally and honestly it is uncalled for, at least from my point of view.

As for what she says, it is very common actually for youths, not necessarily females, to be active on social media. We can discuss about tons of conspiracy theories, but social media is nowadays just a tool, and you can use it in many ways. One thing is to expose yourself and another thing is to selectively share some aspects of your life because you think it is appropiate, and probably may actually be. I don't think a Facebook account makes a person less worthy in absolutely any way, generally speaking.

I have edited my posts, my apologies to her.

If you read the the rules and conditions of Facebook, anything you post there becomes the property of Facebook and they can do as they please with it.

None of my wives, or kids or myself would expose ourselves to such violation of privacy. I realise these things are the norm today and everyone is doing it, but I'm referring to the momins that value hijab and privacy which is becoming a rare commodity these days especially in the west. I value my privacy and the hijab of my wives and daughters.

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Salam,

I agree with brother Sami on the Hijab part. It is always better to take caution in keeping pictures to yourselves then uploading them on fb or any social media,even if it were on view for only family members.

It is always better to be cautious . The deeper one realizes the meaning of Hijab the more cautious a lady becomes.

A lady is kaneez of Allah . Kaneez كنيز comes from the word Konz كنز meaning treasure.

Therefore kaneez is in line with being the ***treasurer***

Allah says in hadith Qudsi :

«کنت کنزاً مخفیاً فأحببت أن اُعرف فخلقتُ الخلق لکَی اُعرف»، ...

- “I was a hidden Treasure then I desired to be known so I created a creation .

So a true momin woman has been given this honor to be the Treasurer / guard of the treasurer/ owner of treasure.

Like Virgin Mary .

This is one of the reasons a woman must be in more Hijab than a man.

*** the above is what I have learnt from my teacher***

Edited by tendersoul
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But in saying that FB and others are tools that can be utilised for business purposes, where it is strictly business, my kids have shown me the effectiveness of such a tool, so even an old man like me is learning these days. So much has changed since the good ole days of writing letters by mail to each other and actually meeting to share pics.

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Yeah, absolutely Sami. I deleted my personal FB account when I was 17 if I recall correctly. However, I haf to create one for exclusively business purposes. Facebook has an incredible number of professionals registered and, as twitter or linkedin, it is positive to have a professional profile there. Of course, Facebook won't force you to publish your weddibg photos xD.

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It would only be a criminal offence if they had the second marriage recognised by the state, though right? As long as they did the Nikka then they are married according to Islam and thats all that really matters. 

When you don't register the marriage under the STATE, you are not under their jurisdiction and not effected by their marriage laws. There are also other factors from a legal point that might be required as a precaution;

  • all the "wives" having the same address as the husband, each wife should have their own home and she should domicile that address as hers only
  • using the term "wife" should be avoided, use partner, soulmate, significant other 1/8 or companion is better 
  • the wives should not accept government benefits as this gives the government more reason to get your personal information and enter into contracts with legal obligations of discloser to all parties 
  • each wife should have her own bank account separate to yours with her own credit cards etc 

The kids from each wife are not effected as there are no laws on the limitations of fathering children ironically.

Best set up in my opinion for those intending to have many wives/partners or more significant other 1/8 are the following;

  • Set up a company in which each wife is an equal director and shareholder and you are the secretary 
  • they will all receive an equal wage 
  • take all debts into the company 
  • create private trusts structure for each wife , make the kids the beneficiaries and appoint a trusted lawyer to oversee it 
  • put all the assets into the trust 
  • take out insurances for each wife, this includes partner life, disability, income, trauma and loss of partner business insurance.
  • take out a private superannuation scheme linked to the salary for each wife and pegged that with a portfolio higher then inflation 
  • when the incomes in the company exceed the maximum tax thresholds, take it offshore and divided the revenue equally 
  • and always be generous to the mother in laws by appointing them as CEOs.
Edited by :Sami II
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I personally think it depends on the taqwa of the men who wish to marry more than one wife permanently. If they do it to get closer to Allah and treat their wifes justly then it's probably not such a drama for the wifes if their one and only love is Allah.

Humans are just humans,we should rely on Allah.I think it's possible to learn that step by step,of course it's not easy but what is easy in life?

I also think that sharing the husband is awful but when i thought more about it after the conversation with friends,I wondered how I can feel that awful about smthg that is made halal by Allah.And that made me actually feel even worse.

Imho it's probably the most painful thing for a women,except loosing a kid,but still it's not ok to be totally against smthg halal.

As for western muslims who think that the sec wife is 'a side dish' they clearly don't have the taqwa I mentioned before.

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Lol.

This must be a joke

My dearest handsome brother of mine,

you will learn that this is no joke when you get married one day inshallah, you will learn that the mother in laws are the most important component in a marriage which determines the happiness and peace in the family. The formula is simple:

 

"when the mother in laws are happy, the wives are happy and you are happy and there is peace in all the homes"

Edited by :Sami II
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Some days back I was reading hadith collection related to marriage in which there is a chapter called "jealousy in women". As you probably know, jealousy in women is looked down upon and so I don't want to post any hadith related to that. Here's a hadtih though whereby the Imam asked his follower to test his wife's faith by way of marrying another, which I found as an interesting approach:

And from them from Ahmad from his father from Muhammad b. Sinan from Khalid al-Qalanisi.  He said: A man mentioned his wife to Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام praised her much.  So Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام said to him: Have you made her jealous (i.e. by another woman)?  He said: No.  He said: Then make her jealous.  So he made her jealous and she remained (steady, firm).  So he said to Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام: I have made her jealous and she remained.  So he said: She is as you say.

Jihad of a woman:

Muhammad b. `Ali b. al-Husayn by his isnad from Muhammad b. al-Fudayl from Sharis al-Washibi from Jabir [from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام].  He said: Allah has written jihad upon the men and jihad upon the women.  So the jihad of the man is that he expend his property and his blood until he is killed in the path of Allah.  And the jihad of the woman is that she be patient upon what she sees of the annoyance of her husband and his jealousy.

Here's a direct link to the chapter if you'd like to read the other hadith:

http://www.*******.org/hadiths/marriage/preliminaries/chapter-78

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My dearest handsome brother of mine,

you will learn that this is no joke when you get married one day inshallah, you will learn that the mother in laws are the most important component in a marriage which determines the happiness and peace in the family. The formula is simple:

 

"when the mother in laws are happy, the wives are happy and you are happy and there is peace in all the homes"

 

My in-laws always tend to take my side when my wife complains to them about certain (and limited) things. Worse case, they say to her to be patient. Lucky me I suppose.

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In terms of treating justly/fairly, would one have thought that the man is being unjust if he was spending more nights with one wife than his other? According to a collection of ahadith in the chapter of Distribution of nights, man is allowed to favour one wife over another: http://www.*******.org/hadiths/marriage/distribution-and-disharmony/chapter-1

 

And from him from Safwan b. Yahya from `Abdullah b. Muskan from al-Hasan b. Ziyad from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام in a hadith wherein he said: I asked him about the man who has two wives, one of them being more beloved to him than the other, is it (allowed) for him to favor her with something?  He said: Yes, (it is allowed) for him to come to her three nights and (to) the other one a (single) night, for it is (allowed) for him to marry four women.  So (as to) his two nights, he puts them wherever he wants – until he said: And it is (allowed) for the man to favor his women, some of them over some, so long as it is not four.

And as-Saduq narrated it in al-`Ilal from his father from Ahmad b. Idris from Ahmad b. Muhammad from his father from Safwan likewise.

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On 8/26/2015 at 5:16 AM, StayingHalal said:

I spend much time reading hadith on *******.org (awesome website). Some days back I was reading hadith collection related to marriage in which there is a chapter called "jealousy in women". As you probably know, jealousy in women is looked down upon and so I don't want to post any hadith related to that. Here's a hadtih though whereby the Imam asked his follower to test his wife's faith by way of marrying another, which I found as an interesting approach:

And from them from Ahmad from his father from Muhammad b. Sinan from Khalid al-Qalanisi.  He said: A man mentioned his wife to Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام praised her much.  So Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام said to him: Have you made her jealous (i.e. by another woman)?  He said: No.  He said: Then make her jealous.  So he made her jealous and she remained (steady, firm).  So he said to Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام: I have made her jealous and she remained.  So he said: She is as you say.

Jihad of a woman:

Muhammad b. `Ali b. al-Husayn by his isnad from Muhammad b. al-Fudayl from Sharis al-Washibi from Jabir [from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام].  He said: Allah has written jihad upon the men and jihad upon the women.  So the jihad of the man is that he expend his property and his blood until he is killed in the path of Allah.  And the jihad of the woman is that she be patient upon what she sees of the annoyance of her husband and his jealousy.

Here's a direct link to the chapter if you'd like to read the other hadith:

http://www.*******.org/hadiths/marriage/preliminaries/chapter-78

Just be aware that the hadiths are not necessarily always authentic, as the site owner says himself.

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On 8/26/2015 at 5:16 AM, StayingHalal said:

I spend much time reading hadith on *******.org (awesome website). Some days back I was reading hadith collection related to marriage in which there is a chapter called "jealousy in women". As you probably know, jealousy in women is looked down upon and so I don't want to post any hadith related to that. Here's a hadtih though whereby the Imam asked his follower to test his wife's faith by way of marrying another, which I found as an interesting approach:

And from them from Ahmad from his father from Muhammad b. Sinan from Khalid al-Qalanisi.  He said: A man mentioned his wife to Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام praised her much.  So Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام said to him: Have you made her jealous (i.e. by another woman)?  He said: No.  He said: Then make her jealous.  So he made her jealous and she remained (steady, firm).  So he said to Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام: I have made her jealous and she remained.  So he said: She is as you say.

Jihad of a woman:

Muhammad b. `Ali b. al-Husayn by his isnad from Muhammad b. al-Fudayl from Sharis al-Washibi from Jabir [from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام].  He said: Allah has written jihad upon the men and jihad upon the women.  So the jihad of the man is that he expend his property and his blood until he is killed in the path of Allah.  And the jihad of the woman is that she be patient upon what she sees of the annoyance of her husband and his jealousy.

Here's a direct link to the chapter if you'd like to read the other hadith:

http://www.*******.org/hadiths/marriage/preliminaries/chapter-78

You can read it, but don't act on it unless you have several other hadith that you know to be authentic that say the same thing. And the hadith doesn't contradict Holy Quran. Rule of Thumb

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^ Agreed. In fact, in some categories you'll come across a set of hadith that allow something then another set of hadith that forbid it. So yes, these hadiths are really just the stepping stone to one's research on a matter. Would be good to read about the reactions of the wives of Imams whenever they married another.

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Unfortunately, nowadays some men may not have honorable intentions when wishing to have more than one wife.  The great men of Islam, the most honorable and just, all had more than one wife with the most esteemed of intentions: they married widows, poor women, or women in desperate need of protection and care.  I am already married; however, in theory, I would have no problem, say if I was widowed and met a man who wished to marry me solely to aid me.  On the other hand, if my husband wished to marry another woman (I know he is against the idea), I would do so, say if one of my friends lost her husband and was left with no home or money.  I only know of one Shiite man who has a second wife, and he did so because his friend had passed away and hoped to help this woman.  This is very honorable, and a woman who consents (I know this not required) to aid this other woman has great patience and a warm heart.  

Sad to say though, some men only yearn to marry another woman to quench his desires, which is the most ill of intentions, in my opinion.  I am not opposed as I know my husband is a great, selfless man who would only do so in the best of situations.  I wouldn't mind having another "sister" to help me around the house  :lol:

*Plus: women make great companions, they are great resources especially for women who just converted or in need of religious information

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Guys why make it complicated. If half of men married more then one women, half of men would be non-married. Obviously the norm is 1 to 1. And God purpose created men and women to want just one to one, or we would have serious problems.

We read in Quran it's in context of helping orphans and to be just towards wives as a condition. How is it just if you marry another woman without carrying about your wife feeling and for no other reason but your personal lust? You obviously don't care about her as you should.

However in times when there was many widows, then it makes sense that quite a few men marry more then one woman to take care of orphans.

However Quran emphasizes he put rahma between wife and husband. How can it be rahma to disregard the feelings of one woman simply out of lust for another?

I believe there is a major problem when people miss out on the spirit of the law and just pick up on laws. Sometimes laws are meant to be ignored and sometimes even broken.

Nothing is black and white, and our hearts is what is being taken account. If you have cold heart towards your wife even while she hasn't done anything wrong you, you will be responsible for that. An example where a person outwardly obeys the Shariah is Salah:

Yet we read "woe to those who do salah, Those who are heedless in their Salah."

So yeah you can be halal and it's all ok by the books, but it doesn't mean your heart is in the right place if it's out of dark intention.

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