Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله

Incomplete Imamah !

Rate this topic


Al Hashmi

Recommended Posts

Assalaamu alaikum !

Bismillah

(surah al-Ahzab)=(The confederates) revealed at Madina. Section:4, verse:33:- And remain stay in your houses and be not unveiled like that of the unveiling of the former days of ignorance,

(leaving this half verse lets look at the other half verse !)

O ! The members of the family of Prophet ! That he may remove from you every unclean-ness and purify you well after cleaning you thoroughly.

And including ahadiths by umm Salamah, Ayesha ibn Abbas and others, kullul raziAllahu ta'ala anhumeen & hadith al-kisa !

Verse and Hadiths which are famous & well known among few sects "and known as ayah tatheer and tradition of cloak !

Al-kisa: one day Prophet s.a.w came to the house of His Daughter, Fatima al-zahra r.a, and told her he was very tired and he asked her to cover him with his cloak. As she was covering Prophet s.a.w his face lit and shone like the full moon. And Hassan r.a comed and Hussain r.a comed and Ali r.a comed and they all gathered under the cloak of Prophet s.aw, by his permission !

Masha'Allah.

My question is why only 12 imams from progency of Hussain r.a ! Not from Hassan r.a, as he was too purified under cloak and verse was revealed ! And Hussain r.a used to say my elder brother Hassan r.a is my master. All 12 imams from Hussain and not a single from Hassan 'raziAllahu anhumeen' ! Was Hassan r.a was there in cloak or was only Hussain r.a was there, if yes verse and hadiths are contradicting.

Please enlight & clarify so that i can accept complete imamah !

JazakAllah

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Assalaamu alaikum !

Bismillah

(surah al-Ahzab)=(The confederates) revealed at Madina. Section:4, verse:33:- And remain stay in your houses and be not unveiled like that of the unveiling of the former days of ignorance,

(leaving this half verse lets look at the other half verse !)

O ! The members of the family of Prophet ! That he may remove from you every unclean-ness and purify you well after cleaning you thoroughly.

And including ahadiths by umm Salamah, Ayesha ibn Abbas and others, kullul raziAllahu ta'ala anhumeen & hadith al-kisa !

Verse and Hadiths which are famous & well known among few sects "and known as ayah tatheer and tradition of cloak !

Al-kisa: one day Prophet s.a.w came to the house of His Daughter, Fatima al-zahra r.a, and told her he was very tired and he asked her to cover him with his cloak. As she was covering Prophet s.a.w his face lit and shone like the full moon. And Hassan r.a comed and Hussain r.a comed and Ali r.a comed and they all gathered under the cloak of Prophet s.aw, by his permission !

Masha'Allah.

My question is why only 12 imams from progency of Hussain r.a ! Not from Hassan r.a, as he was too purified under cloak and verse was revealed ! And Hussain r.a used to say my elder brother Hassan r.a is my master. All 12 imams from Hussain and not a single from Hassan 'raziAllahu anhumeen' ! Was Hassan r.a was there in cloak or was only Hussain r.a was there, if yes verse and hadiths are contradicting.

Please enlight & clarify so that i can accept complete imamah !

JazakAllah

MashAllah Brother.....U've raised a very good and thoughtful topic...I appreciate

First of all i would like to correct u that there r 9 imams from Hussain(AS)'s progeny....becux first three were Mola Ali(AS)..Imam Hasan(AS) and Imam Hussain(AS) himself..

Now coming to the main point....Mola Hussain(as)'s sacrifice was too great that he(as) secured Islam......laying down the life of his brothers....companions...friends...sons...even himself(as)....and as Allah mentioned in Surah Rehman

"And a good turn deserves another..."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You didnt got it brother syed faraz ! Why imamah has been passed to Hussaini lineage alone ! Why not a single imam from Hassani lineage ! Hassan r.a was purified or not under Prophet s.a.w cloak !

And why infallible purified imam gived khilafah=imamah to muawiyya, is this the reason he ejected out of the cloak according to you ! Or verse is for Prophet s.a.w wives who didnt comed in cloak. As i said its contradicting

please instead of mockery enlight me, if u can !

Thanks

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wasalam, 

 

Both Imam Hasan a.s. and Imam Hussain a.s. were children of the Prophet s.a.w.a.s and they were the only children of Imam Ali pbuh and Fatimah al-Zahra pbuh. And because they were the two children of Imam Ali pbuh and Fatimah al-Zahra s.a, both of them had the line of the Imamah after Imam Ali a.s. And because Allah swt willed that Imam Hasan a.s. to be a martyr first, thus it was only Imam Hussain a.s. left and that is why the next 9 Imams pbut until the Qaim atf, were from Imam Hussain a.s. lineage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont see how Ayat Tatheer and Al Kisa has any relevance to your question? INCOMPLETE...

salaam brother, it will be incomplete even for you till 12th imam will reappear ! And will say yep iam the one whom you people awaited for 1100 years and so on with all super powers ! Till then nobody knows him, he's a myth even for you ! For defending and hiding the truth its good to say Imamah is with him, but unfortunately nobody knows him or have any proof, yet he himself is proof thats different method been established. Sry for going lil bit offtopic.

Wasalam, 

 

Both Imam Hasan a.s. and Imam Hussain a.s. were children of the Prophet s.a.w.a.s and they were the only children of Imam Ali pbuh and Fatimah al-Zahra pbuh. And because they were the two children of Imam Ali pbuh and Fatimah al-Zahra s.a, both of them had the line of the Imamah after Imam Ali a.s. And because Allah swt willed that [imam Hasan a.s. to be a martyr first, thus it was only Imam Hussain a.s. left and that is why the next 9 Imams pbut until the Qaim atf, were from Imam Hussain a.s.] !! lineage.

brother but Hassan r.a also left behind his pure progency ! Why not a imam among them, thats what iam keen to know

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know the exact reasons but perhaps these are factors:

 

1) To make most Imams have an Imam and the rest of Imams from their own offspring, it makes sense that most of them would be son after son. This way it's only Hassan and Imam Mahdi that don't have Imams from their offspring. 

2) In can be perhaps in their origin, Imams from offspring of Hussain were attracted to certain beauty from light of Hussain, so it's saying Allah created their lights from attraction to certain beauty and that they are manifestations of beauty, and the reason why beauty was chosen because goodness is obvious, while beauty is less obvious and takes unseen remembrance of beauty of Allah. The beauty of Allah manifests differently but is one and the same in it's inward.

Edited by StrugglingForTheLight
Link to comment
Share on other sites

First, we have to look that they both pbut had the Imamah, because they pbut were both children of Rasulullah s.a.w.a.s. and that is why it was different than the Imams pbut after them where there was only one Imam pbuh and the next one after him pbuh, and not two children having the Imamah of any of the Imams pbut.

 

So, because of that after the martyrdom of Imam Hasan a.s. by the will of Allah, it had to be Imam Hussain a.s. as the next Imam. And that is because nobody from Imam Hasan a.s. lineage could become an Imam, because Imam Hussain a.s. was alive, and the Imamah was passed to him because he was the second child of Imam Ali a.s. and Fatima al-Zahra s.a. of only two.  And if you ask why the fourth Imam pbuh was not from the lineage of Imam Hasan a.s., it is because Imamah is passed from father to son, like it was passed from Imam Ali a.s. to Imam Hasan a.s. in the first place, so that is why the fourth was Imam Ali ibn Hussain a.s. because Imam Hussain a.s. was the third Imam.  And Imam Hussain a.s. having the Imamah after Imam Hasan a.s. was a matter only of them because they were both the only children of the Apostle of Allah s.a.w.a.s.

 

And this was a predetermined matter by Allah swt. 

Edited by Khayat
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

Somewhere in the book kamal al deen wa tamam al nimah it mentions that imam Hassan a.s is superior to imam Hussain a.s but that imamah continued in Hussain a.s progeny. It being like the case of prophet Musa a.s and Harun a.s. Musa a.s is superior to Harun a.s but prophethood continued in Harun a.s progeny.

I would find the exact reference but do not have the time at the moment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

Wa alaykum al-salaam,

 

There are only 12 because the number of Khilafaa' was restricted to being 12 in number by the Prophet . He also said if there were only two people left on the face of the earth, one of them would be the Mahdi and Qurayshi Khalifa. 

 

We could also ask similar hypothetical questions, like: why was there only 12400 prophets? Why not more or less? Or, as pointed out above, why was finality of prophethood given to an Ismailite and not an Israelite? 

 

Imam al-Hassan [as] was the master and Imam of al-Husayn [as]. We also have a hadith which says al-Hassan was superior to al-Hussayn, which isnt an issue considering at one point he was his brother's Imam. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member

Assalaamu alaikum !

Bismillah

(surah al-Ahzab)=(The confederates) revealed at Madina. Section:4, verse:33:- And remain stay in your houses and be not unveiled like that of the unveiling of the former days of ignorance,

(leaving this half verse lets look at the other half verse !)

O ! The members of the family of Prophet ! That he may remove from you every unclean-ness and purify you well after cleaning you thoroughly.

And including ahadiths by umm Salamah, Ayesha ibn Abbas and others, kullul raziAllahu ta'ala anhumeen & hadith al-kisa !

Verse and Hadiths which are famous & well known among few sects "and known as ayah tatheer and tradition of cloak !

Al-kisa: one day Prophet s.a.w came to the house of His Daughter, Fatima al-zahra r.a, and told her he was very tired and he asked her to cover him with his cloak. As she was covering Prophet s.a.w his face lit and shone like the full moon. And Hassan r.a comed and Hussain r.a comed and Ali r.a comed and they all gathered under the cloak of Prophet s.aw, by his permission !

Masha'Allah.

My question is why only 12 imams from progency of Hussain r.a ! Not from Hassan r.a, as he was too purified under cloak and verse was revealed ! And Hussain r.a used to say my elder brother Hassan r.a is my master. All 12 imams from Hussain and not a single from Hassan 'raziAllahu anhumeen' ! Was Hassan r.a was there in cloak or was only Hussain r.a was there, if yes verse and hadiths are contradicting.

Please enlight & clarify so that i can accept complete imamah !

JazakAllah

 

I hope you know that the son of Imam Hussain (as) was married to the daughter of Imam Hassan (as). So in essence the 8 Imams who followed Imam Ali ibn Hussain (as) were also the off-springs of Imam Hassan (as). 

 

 

(wasalam)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

I tried expalining it using comparison once:

 

All tribes of Israel were descendants of Abraham But it was only from the tribe of Judah that great personalities such as David, Solomon and Jesus emerged. Moses himself belonged to the tribe of Levi. A quick conclusion here can be that there was a shift of prophethood from other tribes such as Levi, to Judah and Judah became the exclusive tribe of prophethood at some point.

 

Sons of Aqeel, Ali, Husain, Hasan, and Abbas all were descendants of Muhammad. But since Muhammad asked God to bless his family the exact way that he blessed Abraham, Hasan became Imam but then Imamah stayed with the descendants of Husain much like the tribe of Judah.

 

The reason behind the shift in Imamah was due to the duah of the Prophet himself When he asked God to bless his family the exact same way he blessed Abraham’s family

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know the exact reasons but perhaps these are factors:

1) To make most Imams have an Imam and the rest of Imams from their own offspring, [it makes sense that most of them would be son after son.]! This way it's only Hassan and Imam Mahdi that don't have Imams from their offspring. !!

so how imamah was given to Hussain r.a from his brother Hassan r.a, he was not his son ! Its clear imamah can be directed towards anywhere. And it seems Hassan r.a gived his imamah=khilafah to muawiyya r.a.

Somewhere in the book kamal al deen wa tamam al nimah it mentions that imam Hassan a.s is superior to imam Hussain a.s but that imamah continued in Hussain a.s progeny. It being like the case of prophet Musa a.s and Harun a.s. Musa a.s is superior to Harun a.s but prophethood continued in Harun a.s progeny.

I would find the exact reference but do not have the time at the moment.

Musa a.s and Harun a.s have been cleared=purified by Allah s.w.t in Quran by their names ! And also if this would have been the case of circulating imamah, it should have been given to all brothers first, not from son to son directely ! Example like musa and huran alaihi salamun.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why did the line of Prophets in the Bani Israel stopped and continued with Muhammad s.a.w. in the line of Ishmail a.s.?

Would you ever ask that question?

you mean (ie; Quraish tribe) ! Read carefully durood ibrahimi, there is peace be upon Muhammad his progency and ibrahim his progency ! Why its been seperated. Now dont say ishaq was imam then ismael becomes imam and ishaq is useless now after taking side of bani israel i.e; case like muawiyya and hassan ! RaziAllahu anhumeen.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And also verse of surah al-ahzab, 33 starts as> and stay veiled and dont unveil yourselves as of ignorants ! Yet jamal, siffin karbala, disobedience of Allah after a clear warning and purifying verse ! This verse contradicts very much 'Allah hu Akbar'. Plz enlight me so that i can believe in complete imamah !

Link to comment
Share on other sites

so how imamah was given to Hussain r.a from his brother Hassan r.a, he was not his son ! Its clear imamah can be directed towards anywhere. 

 

1. Passing of Imamah is predetermined matter by Allah swt.

2. It passes like it was set the first time from Imam Ali a.s. to Imam Hasan a.s.

3. The matter of Imam Hasan a.s. and Imam Hussain a.s. is the only different.

4. Because both are children of Rasulullah s.a.w.a.s

5. If Imam Hasan a.s. was the only child of Imam Ali a.s. and Fatimah al-Zahra s.a. it was going to be passed to his lineage

6. The fourth Imam Ali ibn Hussain a.s. was the son of Imam Hussain a.s. because Imamah continued to be passed, like the first time from Imam Ali a.s. to Imam Hasan a.s.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You didnt got it brother syed faraz ! Why imamah has been passed to Hussaini lineage alone ! Why not a single imam from Hassani lineage ! Hassan r.a was purified or not under Prophet s.a.w cloak !

And why infallible purified imam gived khilafah=imamah to muawiyya, is this the reason he ejected out of the cloak according to you ! Or verse is for Prophet s.a.w wives who didnt comed in cloak. As i said its contradicting

please instead of mockery enlight me, if u can !

Thanks

1) Inded Hasan(AS) was also purified that's why he was given the status of Imam....But All of his(as) sons embraced martyrdom in the event of Karbala....

Moreover...it's the Allah's desire to whom He would think eligible for the Imamat and this tradition is not new...We find that there are more than 70,000 Prophets(as) from the single Yaqoob(as) progeny....not from any other Prophet(as)....Similarly the case with Imamat...

Strengthening my argument...i would further proof that if there would b any son of Hasan(AS) as a Imam..then Mola Hussain(AS) would never get Imamat...

Because as we can see...12th imam is the son of 11th one....11th of 10th...10th of 9th...and the chain continues till 4th imam is the son of 3rd one...Imam Hussain(AS) then here Imam Hasan(AS) and Hussain(AS) are brothers...so tht's is also the reason why Allah put Imamat in Hussain(AS)'s progeny....

2) Mola Hasan(AS) did sign the agreement of peace to make the world aware of Muawiyah's evil deeds and the conditions was quite tough though...If u will read the clauses u'll find that it was merely an agreement not the transfer of Caliphate...

Moreover...Muawiyah started to buy the companions of Mola Hasan(AS)...Mola(AS) knew that there were many hypocrites in his(AS) army and if he(AS) would resist more...there would b threat to his(AS) life and the ummah cannot afford the back to back loses of two imams.....First Mola Ali(AS) then Imam Hasan(AS)...and it is the tradition of Divinely men that for the sake of the Nation...they keep silence...as Prophet(saww) did in the Agreement of Hudebiya....

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

You didnt got it brother syed faraz ! Why imamah has been passed to Hussaini lineage alone ! Why not a single imam from Hassani lineage ! Hassan r.a was purified or not under 

Simple. It's because Allah(SWT) desired so.

Also, if there were imams from imam Hassan's(AS) lineage, then it would have increased the level of confusion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member

My question is why only 12 imams from progency of Hussain r.a ! Not from Hassan r.a, as he was too purified under cloak and verse was revealed ! And Hussain r.a used to say my elder brother Hassan r.a is my master. All 12 imams from Hussain and not a single from Hassan 'raziAllahu anhumeen' ! Was Hassan r.a was there in cloak or was only Hussain r.a was there, if yes verse and hadiths are contradicting.

Please enlight & clarify so that i can accept complete imamah !

9 from alhussain progeny. Ali , Hassan, hussain and 9 from alhussain progeny, the 9 forefathers of almahdi.

Prophet said that almahdi will be from imam hussain progeny which is miraculous considering the massacre the progeny of alhussain been through in Karbala but as Zainab said : did your best o Yazid, by Allah you will not erase our mention.

Prophet said that bani hashim were favored over Quraish by 7 points ,

Allah chose the prophet from bani hashim

and his brother

and the lion of Allah hamza

and the flying with wings in heavens jafar

and the 2 grandsons

and the mehdi

When imam Sajjad made his sermon starting with this Hadith, he didn't mention the mehdi but went on introducing himself. Clearly he was saying the mehdi is from my progeny thus alhussain progeny.

This affair is from Allah . This test and selection is from Allah . As long as we have text to tell us who's the next proof, we shouldn't bring our preferences or silly objections.

I think the example of Musa and haron is very clear.

So why arguing?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

Ive never understood why sunnis keep asking this question as though it is of any significance or that it somehow refutes the notion of imamah. Anyway the best answer I've seen in regards to this is found in i'lal al-Shara'i volume 1 chapter 155 hadith number 10

١٠ - حدثنا علي بن أحمد بن عبد الله البرقي عن أبيه عن جده عن أحمد ابن أبي عبد الله عن محمد بن عيسى عن محمد بن أبي يعقوب البلخي قال: سألت أبا الحسن الرضا " ع " قلت له لأي علة صارت الإمامة في ولد الحسين دون ولد الحسن عليهما السلام؟ قال: لان الله عز وجل جعلها في ولد الحسين ولم يجعلها في ولد الحسن والله لا يسأل عما يفعل

Rough translation: From abi Yaqub al-Balkhi, "I asked abal Hassan Al-Reda (as): I said to him, for what reason did the imamah become in the children of Hussain (as) without the children of Hassan (as)?" He (as) said, "because Allah (awj) made it in the children of Hussain (as) and he did not make it in the children of Hassan (as), and Allah (swt) does not get asked about what he does."

Edited by _twelver
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member

And also verse of surah al-ahzab, 33 starts as> and stay veiled and dont unveil yourselves as of ignorants ! Yet jamal, siffin karbala, disobedience of Allah after a clear warning and purifying verse ! This verse contradicts very much 'Allah hu Akbar'. Plz enlight me so that i can believe in complete imamah !

 

You are very confused individual. Anyway, this particular Ayat  was revealed for the wives, and not  for Ahlul Bayt (as) please check your sources before making such absurd comments.

 

And by the way, Rasulillah had foretold the martyrdom  of Imam Hussein (as) at the plains of Karbala, therefore did Prophet Muhammad (pbuh&hf) contradict the Quran? Moreover, Sunni scholars from the past and present have not stated what you have mentioned?

 

And if you get the chance to study the holy Quran, Allah swt has favored  many of his servants over others.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

you mean (ie; Quraish tribe) ! Read carefully durood ibrahimi, there is peace be upon Muhammad his progency and ibrahim his progency ! Why its been seperated. Now dont say ishaq was imam then ismael becomes imam and ishaq is useless now after taking side of bani israel i.e; case like muawiyya and hassan ! RaziAllahu anhumeen.

The point is that even the Quran doesn't support a line of succession that you claim to be the right one. Some prophets and kings were succeeded by their sons (Jakob a.s.) others by their brother (Moses a.s.) and others by someone who wasn't their brother nor their son (Talut a.s.).

The Imami line of succession doesn't contradict Quran in no way or whatsoever.

Even though you have your proof now you still wont accept Imamate unless Allah leads you,

Edited by Iskandarovich
Link to comment
Share on other sites

salaam brother, it will be incomplete even for you till 12th imam will reappear ! And will say yep iam the one whom you people awaited for 1100 years and so on with all super powers ! Till then nobody knows him, he's a myth even for you ! For defending and hiding the truth its good to say Imamah is with him, but unfortunately nobody knows him or have any proof, yet he himself is proof thats different method been established. Sry for going lil bit offtopic.

 

Wrong. There are thousands upon thousands of letters with answers to questions and communications issued by Mohammad al-Mahdi a.s. during his minor Occultation. His four representitives have met with the Imam a.s. regularly and also there are cases where they had with them regular believers, who saw and talked with the Imam a.s. 

 

 

 

And it seems Hassan r.a gived his imamah=khilafah to muawiyya r.a.

 

Wrong. Prophet Ibrahim a.s. didn't give his Imamah to Nimrod l.a. despite him being the ruler. And Muawiya was Nimrod of his era, as he cared only about worldy aspirations and used the name of Islam as a means to get to them. Muawiya was let to usurp the Khilafah by Allah swt, as means to see who are the true believers who would side with Imam Hasan a.s. and who would side with the "strong at the time".

 

Plz enlight me so that i can believe in complete imamah !

Unfortunately, you cannot be enlightened, because you come here thinking to yourself, that whatever these Shias tell you, it is a weak point, and you will always refute them.

 

"They have hearts with which they do not understand, they have eyes with which they do not see, and they have ears with which they do not hear."  Holy Quran 7:179.

Edited by Khayat
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member
Salam. @brother al-hashmi. You asked why there was no imamah from the the progeny of Imam Hasan (as) ? If i answered your question you would have asked why was there no imams from X, Y and Z? the list of questions would go on and on. The best answer for your question is from the folliwng ayah:

 

(Quran 33:36) It is not for a believing man or a believing woman, when Allah and His Messenger have decided a matter, that they should [thereafter] have any choice about their affair. 

 

 

Edited by goldenhawk
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

The supporters of Caliphate chose their leaders for their own benefits and that is why they were so treacherous and unreliable. 

While on the contrary the supporters of Imamate obeyed their leaders as commanded by Allah. This is the main diffirence.

The reason some Imams accepted or gave the caliphate away was indeed to preserve the Ummah from destruction and also to let the people know by their own experiences what the true nature of the hypocrit usurpers was which revealed itself in time.

The Caliphate was respected by the Imams although it was not authorized by Allah but by the will of the people.

Because of that it was sometimes not worth enough to keep it (Imam Hassan a.s.) and in other cases precious enough to die for (Imam Hussain a.s.).

The red line was always that which benefitted the Ummah most and the fight against evident opression.

Caliphate was a tool, not an endgoal. Imamate on the other hand is a solid foundation which cannot be changed no matter what the people desire or do because it is firmly set by Allah Himself.

 

Edited by Iskandarovich
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think there are two reasons Imamate shifted to sons of Hussein

1) There was much talk of revenge and Jihad at that time but Shia realized that fighting the might of Umayyad is useless. So they selected a pacifist as an Imam. ZAYN AL-ABIDIN never demanded the qassas of Hussin,which was wajib on him. Imam Zain ul abdin did give his oath of allegiance to Yazid bin Mu’awiyah, after the incident (battle) of Harrah. Kulayni: Al-Kafi, al-Rawdah, p. 196 He refused to lead the Shiites, who were demanding revenge on the murder of his father Imam Husain, who were getting ready for a revolt, nor did he claim the Imamate, or fight for it, as Sheikh Saduq has said, “he withdrew from the people and did not meet anyone, and on one meets him, except his closest companions. He devoted himself to the worship of Allah; only little knowledge has come from him. Saduq: Ikmal al-Din, p. 91

2)Shiaism prospered in Iran and they hated everything Arab, as Imam e zamana will kill every Arab when he appears. So they adopted an Imam with an Iranian wife so the next Imam should be Iranian.

روى ابن عياش في المقتضب، عن الحسين بن علي بن سفيان البزوفري ، عن محمد بن علي بن الحسن البوشنجاني، عن أبيه، عن محمد بن سليمان، عن أبيه، عن النوشجان بن البودمردان، قال: لما جلى الفرس عن القادسية وبلغ يزدجرد بن شهريار ما كان من رستم وإدالة العرب عليه وظن أن رستم قد هلك والفرس جميعا وجاء مبادر وأخبره بيوم القادسية وانجلائها عن خمسين ألف قتيل، خرج يزدجرد هاربا في أهل بيته ووقف بباب الايوان، وقال:السلام عليك أيها الايوان ! ها أنا ذا منصرف عنك وراجع إليك، أنا أو رجل من ولدي لم يدن زمانه ولا آن أوانه.قال سليمان الديلمي: فدخلت على أبي عبد الله عليه السلام فسألته عن ذلك وقلت لهما قوله: ” أو رجل من ولدي “فقال: “ذلك صاحبكم القائم بأمر الله عز وجل السادس من ولدي قد ولده يزدجرد فهو ولده

. انتهىكتاب بحار الأنوار للمجلسي – الجزء 51 – الصفحة 164 – طبعة مؤسسة الوفاء – بيروت لبنان- الطبعة الثانية 1403هـ – 1983م

TRANSLATION:

When the Persians were defeated at Al-Qadisiyyah (Iraq) and Yazdgerd Ibn Shahryar (the Kisra i.e. king of the Sassanian Majoosi/Zoroastrian evil and oppressive empire) was informed about that and that Rustum (his general) was captured, he thought that Rustum and the Persians are all perished until someone informed him about (the battle) of Al-Qadisiyyah and about the loss of 50.000 (Majoosi soldiers, against a handful Sahaba!!!). Upon that, Yazgerd fled to his household and stood infront of the gates of Al-Iwan (his palace) and said:

“Peace be upon you, o Iwan! This is where I am going to leave you and where I will met you again, me or a man of my progeny […]. Sulayman Al-Dulaimi entered upon Abi Abdillah (Imam Al-Sadiq) and asked him about that. I asked him: ‘What does he (Yazdgerd III) mean with “a man of my progeny”? He (Imam Al-Sadiq) said: ‘It is none other but one who is the arising (Shia Mahdi) by the will of Allah, the sixth (from the progeny) of my father, Yazgerd has given him birth, he is his father’. (Bihar Al-Anwar, vol. 51, p. 164)

Edited by omar111
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

^ What a bunch of nonsense. I'm waiting for the day when these bright Sunnis finally realize that most Shias were not even Iranians. I mean in the time of Safavvids, the government had to literally import Shia Ulamas from Lebanon and other Arab continents. Zaiyids who are Yemenis also consider Ali ibn Husain their Imam and they are not Iranian. So much nonsense it’s laughable.

 

But to hate for the love of Yazid is the way Sunnis have chosen. And to hate for the love of Muhammad al-Mahdi is the way we have chosen. After all we do believe his fathers and himself were tormented at the hands of your precious Quraishi caliphs. If you want to call that hating Arabs then so be it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

I think there are two reasons Imamate shifted to sons of Hussein

1) There was much talk of revenge and Jihad at that time but Shia realized that fighting the might of Umayyad is useless. So they selected a pacifist as an Imam. ZAYN AL-ABIDIN never demanded the qassas of Hussin,which was wajib on him. Imam Zain ul abdin did give his oath of allegiance to Yazid bin Mu’awiyah, after the incident (battle) of Harrah. Kulayni: Al-Kafi, al-Rawdah, p. 196 He refused to lead the Shiites, who were demanding revenge on the murder of his father Imam Husain, who were getting ready for a revolt, nor did he claim the Imamate, or fight for it, as Sheikh Saduq has said, “he withdrew from the people and did not meet anyone, and on one meets him, except his closest companions. He devoted himself to the worship of Allah; only little knowledge has come from him. Saduq: Ikmal al-Din, p. 91

2)Shiaism prospered in Iran and they hated everything Arab, as Imam e zamana will kill every Arab when he appears. So they adopted an Imam with an Iranian wife so the next Imam should be Iranian.

روى ابن عياش في المقتضب، عن الحسين بن علي بن سفيان البزوفري ، عن محمد بن علي بن الحسن البوشنجاني، عن أبيه، عن محمد بن سليمان، عن أبيه، عن النوشجان بن البودمردان، قال: لما جلى الفرس عن القادسية وبلغ يزدجرد بن شهريار ما كان من رستم وإدالة العرب عليه وظن أن رستم قد هلك والفرس جميعا وجاء مبادر وأخبره بيوم القادسية وانجلائها عن خمسين ألف قتيل، خرج يزدجرد هاربا في أهل بيته ووقف بباب الايوان، وقال:السلام عليك أيها الايوان ! ها أنا ذا منصرف عنك وراجع إليك، أنا أو رجل من ولدي لم يدن زمانه ولا آن أوانه.قال سليمان الديلمي: فدخلت على أبي عبد الله عليه السلام فسألته عن ذلك وقلت لهما قوله: ” أو رجل من ولدي “فقال: “ذلك صاحبكم القائم بأمر الله عز وجل السادس من ولدي قد ولده يزدجرد فهو ولده

. انتهىكتاب بحار الأنوار للمجلسي – الجزء 51 – الصفحة 164 – طبعة مؤسسة الوفاء – بيروت لبنان- الطبعة الثانية 1403هـ – 1983م

TRANSLATION:

When the Persians were defeated at Al-Qadisiyyah (Iraq) and Yazdgerd Ibn Shahryar (the Kisra i.e. king of the Sassanian Majoosi/Zoroastrian evil and oppressive empire) was informed about that and that Rustum (his general) was captured, he thought that Rustum and the Persians are all perished until someone informed him about (the battle) of Al-Qadisiyyah and about the loss of 50.000 (Majoosi soldiers, against a handful Sahaba!!!). Upon that, Yazgerd fled to his household and stood infront of the gates of Al-Iwan (his palace) and said:

“Peace be upon you, o Iwan! This is where I am going to leave you and where I will met you again, me or a man of my progeny […]. Sulayman Al-Dulaimi entered upon Abi Abdillah (Imam Al-Sadiq) and asked him about that. I asked him: ‘What does he (Yazdgerd III) mean with “a man of my progeny”? He (Imam Al-Sadiq) said: ‘It is none other but one who is the arising (Shia Mahdi) by the will of Allah, the sixth (from the progeny) of my father, Yazgerd has given him birth, he is his father’. (Bihar Al-Anwar, vol. 51, p. 164)

 

Hahahaha...Nyc bunch of Rubbish by Mr.Blind....The illicit son of Yazeed... :P .. That's the difference b/w u and us.....Our Imams are nominated by Allah Himself...as mentioned in Quran .... But ur caliphs were selected by the power of wealth and women....In the courts of profanity... :lol: 

History is a witness...Now please..continue barking.... :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Salaam

woe onto you people, all have devastated my topic ! What i asked for & what were the replies.

Ok 33:33 is ayah tatheer no worries ! But unfortunately imams who get out of houses disobeyed Allah & those remained in houses obeyed Allah ! But again, unfortunately they didnt ruled people and were in houses, after being granted leadership=imamah by Allah, thus they disobeyed too !

Though I thought this ayah was not for them, and again & again i said that. But its your believes regarding imams !

Thanks everybody for sharing opinions.

Ma'assalama

[topic over, its ayah tatheer]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member

Ok 33:33 is ayah tatheer no worries ! But unfortunately imams who get out of houses disobeyed Allah & those remained in houses obeyed Allah ! But again, unfortunately they didnt ruled people and were in houses, after being granted leadership=imamah by Allah, thus they disobeyed too ! Though I thought this ayah was not for them, and again & again i said that. But its your believes regarding imams !

Thanks everybody for sharing opinions.

Ma'assalama

[topic over, its ayah tatheer]

 

I just quote  for clarity that the statement mentioned is highly ridiculous without any concern to the facts.

We don not accept such nonsense. The Imams are from the pure progeny of the prophet with many traditions asking us to follow them, like hadith thaqlayan, Hadith of Ark etc and many more. instead sunni accept the quran and sunna version of thaqlayn that does not exist in their 6 Sahih books but they reject the Quran and ahl lbayat version of hadith thaqlayn even considered mu[Edited Out]er and present in Sahih Muslim,. sahih tirmizi and many more.

 

إِنَّ اللَّهَ اصْطَفَىٰ آدَمَ وَنُوحًا وَآلَ إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَآلَ عِمْرَانَ عَلَى الْعَالَمِينَ
Indeed, Allah chose Adam and Noah and the family of Abraham and the family of 'Imran over the worlds - (3:33)

 

Allah swt sent 1,24, 000 prophets, how many of them actually ruled the kingdom? just a few of them. The way of Allah swt is not changed. Why it becomes objectionable to sunnis when it comes to the Imams from Ahl albayt of the Prophet saww?

 

Think brother prior making any lying statements.

 

 

Regards

Edited by skamran110
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...