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Aidan

Mohammad's Love For Jesus

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I read this in "The First Muslim" by Lesley Hazleton. When the Holy Prophet conquered Mecca, he ordered all the idols inside the Kaaba to be smashed. This order was carried out for every single idol except one: A statue of Jesus Christ and a painting of Saint Mary. The Prophet(S) held both of these close to his heart when he emerged from the inside of the Kaaba.

 

The details might be a little sketchy as I'm remembering from my memory. I read the book in 2013.

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I read this in "The First Muslim" by Lesley Hazleton. When the Holy Prophet conquered Mecca, he ordered all the idols inside the Kaaba to be smashed. This order was carried out for every single idol except one: A statue of Jesus Christ and a painting of Saint Mary. The Prophet(S) held both of these close to his heart when he emerged from the inside of the Kaaba.

 

The details might be a little sketchy as I'm remembering from my memory. I read the book in 2013.

 

That's hard to believe. Idolatry is not allowed what ever the idol or statue or who it was created to look like/symbolise. But then again it's a new book.

Edited by al-Ibrahimi

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That's hard to believe. Idolatry is not allowed what ever the idol or statue or who it was created to look like/symbolise. But then again it's a new book.

 

statues and idols aren't the same thing.

 

And some of the maraji permit statues.

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statues and idols aren't the same thing.

 

And some of the maraji permit statues.

 

Of course. My bad, they're not the same. But can you tell me which scholars allow statues? And specifically statues of Isa (as) or his Mother (as)? And from what I understand, those which were in Mecca were idols and not statues.

Edited by al-Ibrahimi

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That's hard to believe. Idolatry is not allowed what ever the idol or statue or who it was created to look like/symbolise. But then again it's a new book.

I don't know if it's historically true or not. I read it in the book mentioned. Her source is most likely Ibn Ishaq's account of the prophet's life.

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Of course. My bad, they're not the same. But can you tell me which scholars allow statues? And specifically statues of Isa (as) or his Mother (as)? And from what I understand, those which were in Mecca were idols and not statues.

 

Off the top of my head, I know Ayatollah Sistani permits the drawing of living things and I think two dimensional sculpture and carvings, but not three dimensional sculpture of animals or humans. I think plants or non-living things are okay though for him.

 

Ayatollah Khamenei says sculpture of non living things is fine, but that sculpture of living things is "a problem" though he doesn't say it is haram per se. His view is also shared by Makerem Shirazi, but Makerem Shirazi is more clear on the permissibility of sculpture with regards to children's toys. He just says anything other than this is "problematic".

 

Ayatollahs Sanei and Alozma Jannati permit it or at least say it isn't haram per se to make statues of living things as long as the intention is purely artistic or free of polytheistic or idolatrous motives. I think Fadlallah also permitted it under the same conditions (you'll have to double check that)

 

Ayatollah Wahid Khorasani forbids the depiction of living things altogether as does Ayatollah Hakeem.

Edited by Saintly_Jinn23

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And specifically statues of Isa (as) or his Mother (as)? And from what I understand, those which were in Mecca were idols and not statues.

Salam bro.

Please read this: http://www.sistani.org/arabic/qa/0487/

In summary, according to the Sayed; making physical sculptures, statues and anything of their like to them is not permissible.

Those in Mecca were all idols of the mushrikeen.

Edited by Al-Hassan

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Salam bro.

Please read this: http://www.sistani.org/arabic/qa/0487/

In summary, according to the Sayed; making physical sculptures, statues and anything of their like to them is not permissible.

Those in Mecca were all idols of the mushrikeen.

 

http://www.sistani.org/arabic/qa/search/47387/

 

Brother in the above link, he says he doesn't say it is haram but it is ihtiyat luzumi.

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I read this in "The First Muslim" by Lesley Hazleton. When the Holy Prophet conquered Mecca, he ordered all the idols inside the Kaaba to be smashed. This order was carried out for every single idol except one: A statue of Jesus Christ and a painting of Saint Mary. The Prophet(S) held both of these close to his heart when he emerged from the inside of the Kaaba.

 

The details might be a little sketchy as I'm remembering from my memory. I read the book in 2013.

 

Peace be with you,

 

I would like a source, an authentic narration, etc

 

It is essential to not speak of our prophet pbuh or his purified household a.s until and unless we have authentic evidence.

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Peace be with you,

 

I would like a source, an authentic narration, etc

 

It is essential to not speak of our prophet pbuh or his purified household a.s until and unless we have authentic evidence.

Salam, brother.

 

I never said it was authentic, which is why I mentioned the book and the author. Her main source of information was Ibn Ishaq's account of the Prophet's life. She also takes from Tabari. As to the authenticity of the content, someone else can do a much better job than I can.

 

I think I also read a similar account in Reza Aslan's "No God but God" but I might be confusing it with something else. I'm not sure if it was Aslan or Karen Armstrong's biography of the prophet. Either ways, I've encountered this story twice. However, all of the biographies that I have read are from the Sunni perspective as I've only recently converted to Shi'ism. I know for a fact that the Sunni establishment did try to make Islam more palatable to the Christians of the Byzantine Empire, so it's not improbable that this account is an artistic embellishment that later theologians, historians and biographers added to make the Syrian Christians sympathetic towards Islam.

This is the best that I can do.

 

Salam,

Mithrandir.

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http://www.sistani.org/arabic/qa/search/47387/

 

Brother in the above link, he says he doesn't say it is haram but it is ihtiyat luzumi.

Yes. This is speaking in a general sense for statues and sculptures other than those representing the Ma'sum. However in fatwa #12 from the link I sent you which related to your initial question about building statues for 'Isa and Maryam, the question was specific on the Ma'sum where the Sayed stated it is not permissible in making any form of Mujasamat to the Ma'sum.

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Salam, brother.

 

I never said it was authentic, which is why I mentioned the book and the author. Her main source of information was Ibn Ishaq's account of the Prophet's life. She also takes from Tabari. As to the authenticity of the content, someone else can do a much better job than I can.

 

I think I also read a similar account in Reza Aslan's "No God but God" but I might be confusing it with something else. I'm not sure if it was Aslan or Karen Armstrong's biography of the prophet. Either ways, I've encountered this story twice. However, all of the biographies that I have read are from the Sunni perspective as I've only recently converted to Shi'ism. I know for a fact that the Sunni establishment did try to make Islam more palatable to the Christians of the Byzantine Empire, so it's not improbable that this account is an artistic embellishment that later theologians, historians and biographers added to make the Syrian Christians sympathetic towards Islam.

This is the best that I can do.

 

Salam,

Mithrandir.

 

I just want to say that yes this story is well-known and recorded in the early histories.

 

It is actually this story or some version of it that is the reason why there is still an icon of Jesus (as) and Mary (as) in the Hagia Sophia. When the Ottomans conquered Constantinople and turned the Hagia Sophia into a mosque, most of the icons were removed except for the one Jesus and Mary. This, I'm pretty sure, is because the Ottoman ulama at the time believed that the story mentioned was accurate and so they left that icon alone in accordance with what they believed was Prophet Sunna.

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I just want to say that yes this story is well-known and recorded in the early histories.

 

It is actually this story or some version of it that is the reason why there is still an icon of Jesus (as) and Mary (as) in the Hagia Sophia. When the Ottomans conquered Constantinople and turned the Hagia Sophia into a mosque, most of the icons were removed except for the one Jesus and Mary. This, I'm pretty sure, is because the Ottoman ulama at the time believed that the story mentioned was accurate and so they left that icon alone in accordance with what they believed was Prophet Sunna.

Thanks for clearing this up! I went through my books last night, and also found this incident mentioned in Karen Armstrong's "Muhammad: A Prophet For Our Time". However, I made one mistake when I initially mentioned this to the OP. It wasn't an idol of Prophet Jesus(pbuh) that was in the Kaaba, but frescoes of him and his mother. A small error on my part, unfortunately.

 

Salam,

Mithrandir.

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Thanks for clearing this up! I went through my books last night, and also found this incident mentioned in Karen Armstrong's "Muhammad: A Prophet For Our Time". However, I made one mistake when I initially mentioned this to the OP. It wasn't an idol of Prophet Jesus(pbuh) that was in the Kaaba, but frescoes of him and his mother. A small error on my part, unfortunately.

 

Salam,

Mithrandir.

 

That makes sense since sculptures of Jesus (as) weren't common among Christians in the East at this time. Much like some of our scholars whom I mentioned, Eastern Churches tended to shun sculpture of religious figures due and believed that only 2-Dimensional icons were permissible according to Christian religion. The idea that Muhammad (pbuh) would have found a statute of Jesus in the Kaaba would be very unlikely.

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It's plain to all that the Prophet had a great love of Lord Jesus. I invites members to post examples of this

 

FYI, in the Holy Quran Jesus (pbuh) is mentioned more than the number of times the prophet of Islam.

 

Prophet not only loved Jesus but also Christians and the prove of it is you can search by The Holy Prophet Muhammad 's Letter to the Monks of St. Catherine in Mt. Sinai.

Edited by Zurich

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