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Did Imam Ali Ridha A.s Live A Lavish Lifestyle?

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Take from: http://www.*******.org/articles/claim-rida-imamate-ii

We find with ar-Rida (and then his successors) a striking contrast in their lifestyle from the preceding Imams, who lived largely simpler, more ascetic (though not extreme) lifestyles. Likely due to their association with the Abbasid court, we find rather a more aristocratic lifestyle, lived in much greater wealth, expense and luxury.

In Mehmet Ali Buyukkara’s PhD thesis we read:

"The historian Abu Baler al-Suli reports that the annual salary of al-Rida was 1,000,000 dirhams. This excludes the extra grants and other gifts. Forexample, the caliph who delighted in listening to al-Rida's poems is said to have granted him as much as 300,000 dirhams on one occasion. This large amount of income seems to have drawn the Imam towards some luxury. Al-Kulayni narrates that al-Rida used to have a special kind of perfume prepared for 700 dirhams. Al-Fadl b. Sahl had to inform him of rumours about such lavish spending. However, al-Rida defended himself by giving an example from the Prophet Joseph who had used to wear silk brocade adorned with gold and sit on a golden throne behaviour which had not damaged his prophethood."

Here is the narration from al-Kafi with ar-Rida's response about the perfume, as told by Muhammad al-Jawad:

عنه، عن أبي القاسم الكوفي، عمن حدثه، عن محمد بن الوليد الكرماني قال: قلت لابي جعفر الثاني عليه السلام: ما تقول في المسك؟ فقال: إن أبي أمر فعمل له مسك في بان بسبعمائة دفرهم فكتب إليه الفضل بن سهل يخبره أن الناس يعيبون ذلك فكتب إليه يا فضل أما علمت أن يوسف عليه السلام وهو نبي كان يلبس الديباج مزررا بالذهب ويجلس على كراسي الذهب ولم ينقص ذلك من حكمته شيئا، قال: ثم أمر فعملت له غالية بأربعة آلاف درهم.

Muhammad b. al-Walid al-Kirmani said: I said to Abu Ja`far the Second (i.e. al-Jawad): What do you say regarding musk? So he said: My father commanded for there to be made a musk for him from the ben-tree by seven hundred dirham. So al-Fadl b. Sahl wrote to him informing him that the people were faulting that. So he wrote to him: O Fadl, do you not know that Yusuf عليه السلام while he was a prophet would wear a silk brocade buttoned with gold and sit on a throne of gold, and that did not decrease anything of his wisdom. He said: Then he commanded for a ghaliyya (a type of mixed musk perfume) to be made for him by four thousand dirham.

In addition to this, we find a number of reports of ar-Rida’s association with court poets, bestowing lavish gifts on them in return for their poems of praise of him, for example the poet Di’bil b. `Ali. Some of this however – as is the case with much of the material about his life – is clearly ahistorical, for example the encounter with Abu Nuwas which could not have happened as the latter would have already been dead by the time it supposedly occurred, and was likely designed in mind to further the reputation of ar-Rida as someone who famous poets would extol.

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Suppose an Imam did live in luxury? So? Do you know about Prophet Solomon A.S? He was a king and was the richest man ever to live, yet he was a prophet of God. What a prophet he was! There is nothing wrong with being rich or living in luxury, when in essence you have total God consciousness. Do you think Imam Reza A.S or Prophet Soloman A.S used their wealth for their own desires of the materialistic world? I would love to see an example from the holy quran. Have you read about the life of Imam Riza A.S? What he did, how he lived? Have you read Prophet Solomon's A.S dua in the holy quran? Or even his story? What do you suppose Allah swt wants to teach us with this prophets life?

 

Thereupon (Solomon) smiled joyously at her words and said: “O my Sustainer! inspire me so that I may forever be grateful for those blessings of thine with which Thou hast graced me and my parents, and that I may do what is right (in a manner) that will please Thee; and include me, by Thy grace, among Thy righteous servants!”.Surah An – Naml, 27:19

Edited by PureEthics

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Why did you start another garbage pro-Sevener thread ?

 

MODS: Please move this to the confines of hadith science forum. Let the doctors deal with their frankenstein in there.

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Suppose an Imam did live in luxury? So? Do you know about Prophet Solomon A.S? He was a king and was the richest man ever to live, yet he was a prophet of God. What a prophet he was! There is nothing wrong with being rich or living in luxury, when in essence you have total God consciousness. Do you think Imam Reza A.S or Prophet Soloman A.S used their wealth for their own desires of the materialistic world? I would love to see an example from the holy quran. Have you read about the life of Imam Riza A.S? What he did, how he lived? Have you read Prophet Solomon's A.S dua in the holy quran? Or even his story? What do you suppose Allah swt wants to teach us with this prophets life?

 

Thereupon (Solomon) smiled joyously at her words and said: “O my Sustainer! inspire me so that I may forever be grateful for those blessings of thine with which Thou hast graced me and my parents, and that I may do what is right (in a manner) that will please Thee; and include me, by Thy grace, among Thy righteous servants!”.Surah An – Naml, 27:19

. Peace be upon you. Did the imam a.s really spend so much money on perfume , and why live in luxury when there were poor Shias, when Shiism was still under attack. Are the claims and Hadith even true. Can you confirm it ?

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. Peace be upon you. Did the imam a.s really spend so much money on perfume , and why live in luxury when there were poor Shias, when Shiism was still under attack. Are the claims and Hadith even true. Can you confirm it ?

 

I do not know much about the authenticity of the hadith. Your analogy is flawed. Its like me telling you why do you live when others are dead? Or why do you eat food when others are starving? That doesnt make any sense. Now if you can prove Imam Reza A.S was like the "agha khan" or "saudi king" of his time, in both character, faith, and everything all together then you would have a valid argument. Saying someone is wealthy or buys wealthy things doesnt degrade the faith or status of a person, in any way what so ever.

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I do not know much about the authenticity of the hadith. Your analogy is flawed. Its like me telling you why do you live when others are dead? Or why do you eat food when others are starving? That doesnt make any sense. Now if you can prove Imam Reza A.S was like the "agha khan" or "saudi king" of his time, in both character, faith, and everything all together then you would have a valid argument. Saying someone is wealthy or buys wealthy things doesnt degrade the faith or status of a person, in any way what so ever.

brother I understand you can be rich yet generous but the OP depicts the Imam a.s as being VERY lavish

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brother I understand you can be rich yet generous but the OP depicts the Imam a.s as being VERY lavish

The OP is you, yourself. Do you mean the person running the website [that you copy and pasted that from] depicts the 8th Holy Imam AS as being VERY lavish? The webmaster just quoted the PhD thesis of a man who is now a Turkish professor.

Edited by hameedeh

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The OP is you, yourself. Do you mean the person running the website [that you copy and pasted that from] depicts the 8th Holy Imam AS as being VERY lavish? The webmaster just quoted the PhD thesis of a man who is now a Turkish professor.

 

Peace be with you,

 

I meant the webmaster , who is a musawi waqifi.

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I think if a muslim is paying his share of zakaat he is no longer questionable on how he spent his rest of money... unless it some thing haraam like alcohol or drugs, Imam spent on perfume is perfectly halaal. this simply says if I am paying my share of zakaat then I have rights to spend my other money on any thing I like. wallah ho alam. Imam Rida was getting a salary and after paying his zakaat he was free to use rest of money the way he wants to use.

 

btw this is really interesting subject thanx for posting it.

Edited by ShiaHashmi

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I've moved this into the 'other sects' forum, since denigrating some Imams (a.s.) appears to be part of Severer beliefs.

 

If the OP posts again from Sevener sites on the main forums, their account will be closed.

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Who cares what a unknown professor's PhD thesis said. A man belonging to a nation only as good as their horse and their savagery. Its not the gospel. There are countless phds out there. Couldn't you find lamer excuse to attack our blessed Imam the dirt under the feet of him being better than your lineage all combined and forever? And where is the reference to the hadith of Kafi, not that it matters since the example of king solomon has been given. Even if he built a million castles of gold, so what. What a idiotic new subsect made by an idiot of idiots.

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^^^ Macisaac is actually an expert in hadeeth.

 

Says who?

 

IIRC based on his posts on this forum, even when he was a 12er Shia, he was not in favour of a traditional Islamic scholarly education. If he had been, then the appellation of an 'expert' would have been conferred by his teachers.

 

That is the only instance in which being called an expert makes any sense.

 

If someone has to rely on being called an expert by the under and unqualified, it becomes more of a term of insult.

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Salamalaikum

[1759] 1 ـ محمد بن يعقوب ، عن محمد بن يحيى ، عن محمد بن الحسين ، عن سليمان بن محمد الخثعمي ، عن إسحاق الطويل العطار ، عن أبي عبدالله ( عليه السلام ) قال : كان رسول الله ( صلى الله عليه وآله ) ينفق في الطيب أكثر ممّا ينفق في الطعام.

1 – Muhammad b. Ya`qub from Muhammad b. Yahya from Muhammad b. al-Husayn from Sulayman b. Muhammad al-Khath`ami from Ishaq at-Tawil al-`Attar from Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام.  He said: The Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وآله used to spend more in perfume than what he would spend in food.

[1760] 2 ـ وعن عدة من أصحابنا ، عن سهل بن زياد ، عن محمد بن عيسى ، عن زكريا المؤمن رفعه قال : ما أنفقت في الطيب فليس بسرف.

2 – And from a number of our companions from Sahl b. Ziyad from Muhammad b. `Isa from Zakariyya al-Mu’min going up to him.  He said: What is spent in perfume is not extravagance.

It's from the same website as the Op quoted. I apologise to adminis but my only intention is to expose a munafiq.

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Salaam, 

It seems many an untrained Muslim may come to mock such dealings, but we must take into account dirhams are only coins. Supply and demand is what often runs the economies of the time. Musk is highly sought after, according to our ahadeeth. When one comes to know that an Imam of Ahlul Bayt [as] seeks something, the society may want to charge an arm and a leg, so to speak. 

Also, perhaps the Imam [as] gave such money to the poor among the merchants. Is that bad? No. Keep in mind that we have other narrations where our A'immah [as] tell others that they [as] know where to get such riches and jewels, etc., but they don't chase dunyaa. 
------
As for MacIsaac, he seems to jump from faith-to-faith as if it's a flavor of the month.

Edited by NaveenHussain

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Abu Bakr Suli said that his grandmother used to narrate: Imam Ridha’ (a.s) had purchased me and some other slave-girls for Mamun. When we entered Mamun's palace, we saw numerous luxuries and comforts and our life passed in a peaceful way. But after some days Mamun gave me in the service of Imam (a.s). When I arrived at his place, I saw that here everything was different. In spite of the fact that the Imam was the heir-apparent of the kingdom, there was nothing royal in his house. He lived a very simple and ordinary life. Once a slave-girl talked in a taunting way that we all disliked, but the Imam observed forbearance and did not say anything to her. At last she was herself ashamed and then the austere life of the Imam had such a deep effect on her that she gave up all worldly things.

 

http://www.al-islam.org/akhlaq-al-aimma-morals-manners-holy-imams-maulana-sayyid-zafar-hasan-amrohi/forbearance-holy-imams#forgiveness-imam-husayn

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Is this a non-Shia site?

The site may provide some Shia ahadeeth, but we truly cannot consider those who reject any of our A'immah [as] as Shia of the Ahlul Bayt [as]. 

Edited by NaveenHussain

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