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Wisdom007

Why Do Shia Hate Hafsa (Ra)?

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No as per Islamic Rule of Ahle Tashio Alchohol is prohibited. Neither we ask someone if they are drunk .. bcoz we never ever think about it, i don't know how come you got this habit ?

First tell me who is Hafsa ? Why you are using RA with her ? What is importance of her in Islamic History ?

Then expect answer from us if we hate or not.

Dont feel yourself Clever. I know what is your intention. So first show your knowledge .. later we will show.

If you have no answer don't waste time on stupidity. Thank you

I suggest you grow up and stop thinking of everything as some sort of conspiracy. I'm asking a very simple question which deserves a very simple answer. The reason I opened this thread is because the only thing I can find available as to why Shia hate hafsa (ra) is because something she did during the lifetime of the holy prophet (pbuh) the holy prophet (pbuh) did not divorce her or insult her. So other than that why else to Shia hate her. So I think it's you who shouldn't try to act to clever and calm down and start acting like a grown up. Edited by Wisdom007

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I suggest you grow up and stop thinking of everything as some sort of conspiracy. I'm asking a very simple question which deserves a very simple answer. The reason I opened this thread is because the only thing I can find available as to why Shia hate hafsa (ra) is because something she did during the lifetime of the holy prophet (pbuh) the holy prophet (pbuh) did not divorce her or insult her. So other than that why else to Shia hate her. So I think it's you who shouldn't try to act to clever and calm down and start acting like a grown up.

You are using (ra) with her indicates you have knowledge about her. That is why i asked on first post tell us about her. Then what was your reply ? Do google.  If you rethink what you have posted you will realize you have left no information.

 

We ( Ahle Tashio ) hates none but enemies of Ahle Bait and on basis of Authentic Hadees. Bcoz you have no Authentic Hadees you can't play with us. You left Ahle Bait (as) so your authenticity automatic came into Doubt.

 

Now please provide Detail of Hafsa if she is really valuable personality then why do we hate her ?

 

Hazrat Ayesha also not got divorced. Nor she got insulted by any even Hazrat Ali (as) . She is responsible for many Companion death due to Unnecessary war with Hazrat Ali as Jung-e-Jamal. Not giving importance never means we are hating, Allah is the last Judge. We have enough things left by our Ahle Bait to study and research.

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^Stop beating around the bush. If you can't answer his question don't ask him any. OP is curious about your views on the matter, and wants clarification. Let's assume OP knows everything there needs to be known about her. If you still can't help it, make your own thread and ask your questions there.

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You are using (ra) with her indicates you have knowledge about her. That is why i asked on first post tell us about her. Then what was your reply ? Do google. If you rethink what you have posted you will realize you have left no information.

We ( Ahle Tashio ) hates none but enemies of Ahle Bait and on basis of Authentic Hadees. Bcoz you have no Authentic Hadees you can't play with us. You left Ahle Bait (as) so your authenticity automatic came into Doubt.

Now please provide Detail of Hafsa if she is really valuable personality then why do we hate her ?

Hazrat Ayesha also not got divorced. Nor she got insulted by any even Hazrat Ali (as) . She is responsible for many Companion death due to Unnecessary war with Hazrat Ali as Jung-e-Jamal. Not giving importance never means we are hating, Allah is the last Judge. We have enough things left by our Ahle Bait to study and research.

:wacko:...ok I'll break it down for you since you want to act like a child. I repeat....other than what hafsa (ra) did during the lifetime of the holy prophet (pbuh) what other reasons do Shia hate her for?

^Stop beating around the bush. If you can't answer his question don't ask him any. OP is curious about your views on the matter, and wants clarification. Let's assume OP knows everything there needs to be known about her. If you still can't help it, make your own thread and ask your questions there.

Thankyou brother :)

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Seen this many times when shias discussing mothers of believers. They use to cite ahadeth with clear examples of women jealousy. What is the problem? Jealousy it is a part of human nature. 

 

Answering to question why do shias hate Hafsa (r.a).. Seems to me because her father was Umar (r.a). What is this, if not enough reason for shias to hate her. 

 

The problem with shias, that they hate too much. I mean not only Hafsa (r.a). They hate each and everyone who differ with them.

 

 

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I hope you know what "mother of believers" truly means...

 

You'd like to enlighten me? I know what Sunnis (majority of Muslims, bihamdilillah) means when they say: Mother of Believers. Shias had other understanding obviously.

Edited by Abu_Rumaysah

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:wacko:...ok I'll break it down for you since you want to act like a child. I repeat....other than what hafsa (ra) did during the lifetime of the holy prophet (pbuh) what other reasons do Shia hate her for?

 

 

First stop using word " Childish " that will not make you informative about Hafsa. I said in very first reply.

 

 

Not giving Importance to someone doesn't mean Hate. We have enough people from Rasool Allah (SAW) who are guiding us in many occasion we are close to them, I am sorry if you feel hurt .. please provide her Life details we will study and will consider her.

 

We have enough knowledge left by Ahle Bait (as) to do research we don't consider other very important. But i am really eager to know why Particular sect people from Ahle Sunnat are very close follower of those who are some how enemies of Ahle Bait ? What make them hate Ahle Bait for Materialistic people ?

 

Quran: 66 - Verse 4 : - If you two (wives of the Prophet saws.gif, namely 'Aishah and Hafsah) turn in repentance to Allah, (it will be better for you), your hearts are indeed so inclined (to oppose what the Prophet saws.gif likes), but if you help one another against him (Muhammad saws.gif), then verily, Allah is his Maula (Lord, or Master, or Protector, etc.), and Jibrael (Gabriel), and the righteous among the believers, and furthermore, the angels are his helpers.

 

But as Hazrat Ali (as) gave respect even after Jung-e-Jamal where Hazrat Ayesha was responsible for Many companion death. So we too dont dis-respect any wife. If someone doing and you consider them Shia then please first check Marja Fatwa for Companion and if someone is not following Fatwa its your fault why you are treating him Shia ?

 

To know more who are actually shia please read this post i wrote : http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235026493-why-the-sunni-and-shia-difference/#entry2751930

^Stop beating around the bush. If you can't answer his question don't ask him any. OP is curious about your views on the matter, and wants clarification. Let's assume OP knows everything there needs to be known about her. If you still can't help it, make your own thread and ask your questions there.

 

That is the main problem Assumptions . Today's dispute in between Shia and Sunni are mostly based on Assumptions, every sect is assuming Shia are doing this and that without asking truth or getting knowledge. So it is duty to ask everyone if they really know some background or just assumptions.

Edited by alirex

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So, can I say you're the "son of `Aîsha"?

Cordially,

(salam)

Al-Bayhaqi in al-Sunan al-Kubra (v,7-p,70) narrated: ... Masrooq narrated from Aisha that a woman once came to her and said "O! Mother" then Aisha said to her "I am the mother of your men (meaning I am mother of men only) I am not your mother"!

From this Hadith you can clearly intrepret that if the Sunni interpretation of what is meant by "mother of believers" is correct then Aisha would have had no problem in the woman referencing her as "mother of believers" because women can also be believers, not just men.

Otherwise, please clarify your question, what exactly are you asking?

Sinceraly,

(wasalam)

Edited by kbsquare

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Ameen. Yes, do remind us all whom the Prophet conceled a private matter too and then disclosed it after asking them not too? :rolleyes:  Indeed, let the damnation of Allah [swt] be on the liars. 

 

 

 

 

how can disclosure of a private matter to someone who shares the same status constitute a lie i.e kazab??   :wacko:

 

 

I am surprised to see that a jahil like u enjoys the status of a mod on the top forum of twelver shias.

 

 

 

It was only a matter of time. Now the Shia are the descendants of Samurai Jews :lol:

 

 

Replica might be the correct word.

Edited by Ali Musaaa :)
You are currently sitting on 9 warning points. Insulting a Moderator isn't the smartest course of action right now.

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(salam)

Al-Bayhaqi in al-Sunan al-Kubra (v,7-p,70) narrated: ... Masrooq narrated from Aisha that a woman once came to her and said "O! Mother" then Aisha said to her "I am the mother of your men (meaning I am mother of men only) I am not your mother"!

From this Hadith you can clearly intrepret that if the Sunni interpretation of what is meant by "mother of believers" is correct then Aisha would have had no problem in the woman referencing her as "mother of believers" because women can also be believers, not just men.

Otherwise, please clarify your question, what exactly are you asking?

Sinceraly,

(wasalam)

Hi,

 

You do not understand. May I ask you a question? Is `Aisha Um el-mu'mineen for you al-râfidha

Edited by Ibn Abi Shayba

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So, can I say you're the "son of `Aîsha"?

Cordially,

 

Mother of the believers doesn't mean literally a mother. Did you even bother reading my answer? 

 

When the Holy Quran states "Hands of Allah" does the Holy Quran mean that Allah (s.w.t) has hands? Or when someone states "Sayfullah Al-Maslool" does it mean that the guy is not a human but he's Allah's Sword? (Astaghfirullah).

 

Please understand that not everything is explicit and clear as day. Please understand that classical Arabic was different than modern Arabic.

how can disclosure of a private matter to someone who shares the same status constitute a lie i.e kazab??   :wacko:

 

 

I am surprised to see that a jahil like u enjoys the status of a mod on the top forum of twelver shias.

 

 

I am sorry? The same status? That is your justification? So if I have 2 best friends and I tell one of them a secret, would I expect him to go tell the other friend? Why didn't I get them together and tell them both the secret? They both have the same status to me. And why was the question raised "who told you?" when the Prophet (pbuh) confronted her? In-fact, if it was okay to share what has been told, why did the prophet (pbuh) even bother bringing it up? 

 

There is no need to call someone names. That is not how you debate.

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I am sorry? The same status? That is your justification?

 

 

Both were wives of the Holy Prophet. 

 

 

So if I have 2 best friends and I tell one of them a secret, would I expect him to go tell the other friend? Why didn't I get them together and tell them both the secret? They both have the same status to me.

 

 

So if ur friend tells ur secret to the other friend, does he become a liar? 

 

 

You certainly have no experience with women. 

 

 

 

 

And why was the question raised "who told you?" when the Prophet (pbuh) confronted her? 

 

 

The question was raised in surprisal. Whats ur point?

 

 

In-fact, if it was okay to share what has been told, why did the prophet  (pbuh) even bother bringing it up? 

 

 

Because the prophet saw advised Hafsa [ra] not to tell anyone that honey OR Maria [ra] is now haram on me. However he didnt took a promise though.

 

 

 

There is no need to call someone names. That is not how you debate.

 

I have no intention of debating with a mod.

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how can disclosure of a private matter to someone who shares the same status constitute a lie i.e kazab??   :wacko:

 

 

 

If my mother told me something in secret and requested (either explicitly or implicitly - the latter is implied anyway) that I not tell anyone and I go okay, then I go tell my brother (same status) what Mother dearest told me. Is this not betraying, going against my mother, and lying?

 

The Prophet disclosed a matter to his wife did he not? I don't know about you, but it appears rather likely the Prophet either directly or indirectly requested this not to be shared amongst others and I would assume Ayeesha would of agreed (unless you think she did otherwise?).

 

Moreover why would it be such an enormous deal if the Prophet just mentioned something casually and one wife told another? You'd have to explain this incredible threat issued by Allah in verse 4 of al-Tahreem where Allah states He, Jibreel, the Angels and the Righteous Believers will all back up the Prophet if you two work against the Messenger again. 

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If my mother told me something in secret and requested (either explicitly or implicitly - the latter is implied anyway) that I not tell anyone and I go okay, then I go tell my brother (same status) what Mother dearest told me. Is this not betraying, going against my mother, and lying?

 

 

This is not the case of a mother & his child. Its about a husband who had 3 or 4 wives at a time. Either u have no idea about the psyche of a woman or its just that u r too ignorant to consider it in this case. 

 

 

The Prophet disclosed a matter to his wife did he not? I don't know about you, but it appears rather likely the Prophet either directly or indirectly requested this not to be shared amongst others and I would assume Ayeesha would of agreed (unless you think she did otherwise?).

 

 

 

Yes, he did & she did tell the other wife about it... but does that mean she apostatized? or u start slandering them? or u speak ill of them? You have no right to pass a judgement  about the wives of the Holy Prophet.  

 

 

 

 

Moreover why would it be such an enormous deal if the Prophet just mentioned something casually and one wife told another? You'd have to explain this incredible threat issued by Allah in verse 4 of al-Tahreem where Allah states He, Jibreel, the Angels and the Righteous Believers will all back up the Prophet if you two work against the Messenger again. 

 

 

So the first time they were caught & as as result these ayah's were revealed. Had they worked again against the prophet it would have been mentioned in the Quran. That obviously means they repented.

 

If you two turn in repentance to Allah, your hearts are indeed so inclined;

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Mother of the believers doesn't mean literally a mother. Did you even bother reading my answer? 

 

When the Holy Quran states "Hands of Allah" does the Holy Quran mean that Allah (s.w.t) has hands? Or when someone states "Sayfullah Al-Maslool" does it mean that the guy is not a human but he's Allah's Sword? (Astaghfirullah).

 

Please understand that not everything is explicit and clear as day. Please understand that classical Arabic was different than modern Arabic.


 

Hi,

 

Would you be offended if I called you "son of 'Aisha"? I mean metaphorically, not literally!

Sincerely,

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Salam my brother Wisdom007

1. Shia don't hate Hafsa and we consider him as mother of believers like other prophet's wive. Of course the wive of prophet were different in their believe. some of them were real believer and they helped prophet very much like Khadija, Omme Salame and ... . On contrary some of them bothered prophet and did sins in their life.

 

2. Also Ahl al-sonna believes that sometimes Hafsa bothered prophet in a way that He was annoyed during the day! (A Prophet who was the prophet of mercy and patient, was annoyed by Hafsa, )

Refer to: الصحیح البخاری ج۶ص۶۹

Pic of page:

http://www.sonnat.net/upload/article/4E3ABE75.AC8C.4CEE/namaye.png?rnd=

 

3. Even Omar bin Khattab says: O Hafsa! You know that Prophet doesn't like you and If I wasn't your father, he will divorce you!

فَدَخَلْتُ عَلَى عَائِشَةَ فَقُلْتُ يَا بِنْتَ أَبِي بَكْر أَقَدْ بَلَغَ مِنْ شَأْنِكِ أَنْ تُؤْذِي رَسُولَ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم فَقَالَتْ مَا لِي وَمَا لَكَ يَا ابْنَ الْخَطَّابِ عَلَيْكَ بِعَيْبَتِكَ. قَالَ فَدَخَلْتُ عَلَى حَفْصَةَ بِنْتِ عُمَرَ فَقُلْتُ لَهَا يَا حَفْصَةُ أَقَدْ بَلَغَ مِنْ شَأْنِكِ أَنْ تُؤْذِي رَسُولَ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم وَاللَّهِ لَقَدْ عَلِمْتِ أَنَّ رَسُولَ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم لاَ يُحِبُّكِ. وَلَوْلاَ أَنَا لَطَلَّقَكِ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم.

صحیح مسلم ج4 ص188

 

So we don't like him, because of these things.

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Salam my brother Wisdom007

1. Shia don't hate Hafsa and we consider him as mother of believers like other prophet's wive. Of course the wive of prophet were different in their believe. some of them were real believer and they helped prophet very much like Khadija, Omme Salame and ... . On contrary some of them bothered prophet and did sins in their life.

 

 

 

Hi,

 

Thanks for the taqya. May I ask you a question? Is Ḥafsa bint `Umar b. al-Khattab b. Nufayl a believer [in Allâh عز وجل]? 

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Hi,

 

Thanks for the taqya.

Salam, I don't know why did you tell this. Because I tell you directly that we don't like Hafasa.

But any way, if you think that I am doing taqya, you cal tell me in a better way.

 

 

Is Ḥafsa bint `Umar b. al-Khattab b. Nufayl a believer [in Allâh عز وجل]? 

I didn't want to add to that numbers, but it seems it is necessary to knows more about Hafsa in Sunni references.

1. Prophet  (pbuh)  says: you (Hafsa  and Ayesha) are seditious, like women those who were in the Joseph era.

(تاریخ الطبری ج۲ص۴۳۹ وسیرة ابن هشام ج۴ص۳۰۱.)

 

2. Allah says to wives of prophet Stay in your houses (وَ قَرْنَ في‏ بُيُوتِكُن) in Qur'an 33: 33. But Ayesh made a war against Ali bin Abi Talib and Hafsa wanted to help her and Obaydullah (Hafsa's brother) prevent her. (شرح نهج البلاغه لابن ابی الحدید ج۲ص۸۰ و تاریخ الطبری ج۳ص۴۷۷ و معجم البلدان ج۲ ص ۳۶۲ )

But still Ayesha inform Hafsa the news of Jamal war while even Ahl al-sonna says: making war against caliphate is forbidden!

 

and ....

 

 

So I ask you a question,

Can we like a person Prophet didn't like him?

 

Do you like a person Prophet named her as "seditious" in the last days of his life?!

 

Is it obligatory to like a person bothered Prophet Muhammad the prophet of mercy and forgiveness in a way that Omar bin Khattab says: If I wasn't your father, he will divorce you!!!

 

Thank you

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Hi,

Salam, I don't know why did you tell this. Because I tell you directly that we don't like Hafasa.

But any way, if you think that I am doing taqya, you cal tell me in a better way.

 

You said: 

 

 

 

Shia don't hate Hafsa 

Is it a play on (or with) words and their meanings?!  Shia do not hate Yazid; is it true?! Yes or no?

 

 

I didn't want to add to that numbers, but it seems it is necessary to knows more about Hafsa in Sunni references.

Please answer the question. My question is clear. Thank you.

Sincerely,  

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Let me clarify our postion for you,

 

 

Hi,

 

Would you be offended if I called you "son of 'Aisha"? I mean metaphorically, not literally!

Sincerely,

 

No, I wouldn't, if it is in the sense that I cannot marry her after Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وآله‎ dies. Is it in the sense that I love her and respect her as one would feel with their biological mother? Absolutely not.

 

 

Hi,

 

Thanks for the taqya. May I ask you a question? Is Ḥafsa bint `Umar b. al-Khattab b. Nufayl a believer [in Allâh عز وجل]? 

 

No.
 

Cordially,

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Hi,

Let me clarify our postion for you,

Thanks.

 

 

No, I wouldn't, if it is in the sense that I cannot marry her after Rasul Allah صلى الله عليه وآله‎ dies. Is it in the sense that I love her and respect her as one would feel with their biological mother? Absolutely not.

It's interesting that all of your classical scholars never called `Aisha or Hafsa Um el-mumineen. More than this. `Ali al-Nabâti al`amilî called `Aisha the mother of evils. For example, the extremist `Ali al-Milani alrafidhi said clearly that `Aisha is not Um el-mumineen...perhaps are you more knowledgeable than him?!

 

 

 

No.

Is she in Hell like Yazid? Yes or no?

Sincerely,

 

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Hi,

Thanks.

 

It's interesting that all of your classical scholars never called `Aisha or Hafsa Um el-mumineen. More than this. `Ali al-Nabâti al`amilî called `Aisha the mother of evils. For example, the extremist `Ali al-Milani alrafidhi said clearly that `Aisha is not Um el-mumineen...perhaps are you more knowledgeable than him?!

 

Is she in Hell like Yazid? Yes or no?

Sincerely,

 

 

If Allah have hands ? Yes/No

 

What Non sense ? Islam if was so easy to be in between Yes/No every one become Muslim.

 

One Student of Islamic Studies said " If today's muslim left Islam , Whole world will accept Islam "

 

Un-necessary you want Shia to hate. Even though they have Fatwa from Marja not to Curse any Sahaba or Wife. Why you want us to go against Fatwa ? Are you Iblees ? Same Iblees who was provoking Wife of Hazrat Ibraheem (as) to go out of house to protect Islamail (as) , not to get slaughter for the dream shown by Allah.

 

Are you Ibleess ? Yes / Ya / May Be :P ( i gave you 3 good options )

Edited by alirex

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