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In the Name of God بسم الله
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Ali Baker

Restoring Palestine To The Palestinians, Possible?

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Some people look at the scene and see the power of #America, the support of the west for the #Zionists and the power of Zionists’ financial and propaganda networks in America and in other parts of the world. As a result of this, they think that restoring #Palestine to the Palestinians is an impossible task. But I say that this impossible task will become possible ...

 

What's your opinion?

http://sayyidali.com/viewpoints/restoring-palestine-2544.html

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The lazy, unenployed, subsidized hareidim will destroy israel.

 

 

And what about hard-working Hareidim and serious anti-Zionists who refuse to accept subsidies from the Zionist government? You are repeating Zionist propaganda about the Hareidim. Almost all Hareidi women work and about half of Hareidi men work too. They tend to be poor, because they reject secular education and can't get professional jobs, but that's another story.

 

In many ways. Hareidi lifestyle is similar to Muslim communities in France and other Western countries. Difficulty and unwillingness to cope with the surrounding secular culture does lead often enough to unemployment, living at the expense of government subsidies and involvement in murky businesses. But often it does not, and in both cases large families struggle to make a living in highly unfriendly surroundings.

 

While Israeli government subsidizes full-time Torah study for some - only some - Hareidi men, as a means to control and subvert the level of anti-Zionism among them, it comes with a high price tag, because most Hareidim refuse to serve in the Zionist army and are generally hated by the Israeli population. Large sectors of Hareidi population, especially consistent anti-Zionist types, would be happy to emigrate to North America or Europe, but emigration for people whose level of education only allows them to clean streets or work as a secretary, and whose outlook is decidedly non-Western, tends to be very difficult.

Edited by Yoel

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And what about hard-working Hareidim and serious anti-Zionists who refuse to accept subsidies from the Zionist government? You are repeating Zionist propaganda about the Hareidim. Almost all Hareidi women work and about half of Hareidi men work too. They tend to be poor, because they reject secular education and can't get professional jobs, but that's another story.

In many ways. Hareidi lifestyle is similar to Muslim communities in France and other Western countries. Difficulty and unwillingness to cope with the surrounding secular culture does lead often enough to unemployment, living at the expense of government subsidies and involvement in murky businesses. But often it does not, and in both cases large families struggle to make a living in highly unfriendly surroundings.

While Israeli government subsidizes full-time Torah study for some - only some - Hareidi men, as a means to control and subvert the level of anti-Zionism among them, it comes with a high price tag, because most Hareidim refuse to serve in the Zionist army and are generally hated by the Israeli population. Large sectors of Hareidi population, especially consistent anti-Zionist types, would be happy to emigrate to North America or Europe, but emigration for people whose level of education only allows them to clean streets or work as a secretary, and whose outlook is decidedly non-Western, tends to be very difficult.

The Haredi population is not large enough to cause Israel's downfall, even with Israel being such a small country.

There are communities in the USA who are Christian Amish that refuse to integrate into what they call the world of the "English" (you could be Chinese, they still call you English, btw.). Their refusal to formally contribute to the general society does not stop them from living "well", having the ability comfortably within their ideology.

Also, the US has quite a few Haredi communities already. Obviously, they are able to subsist (although with help from other Jewsish communities).

I forgot to add what I wanted to post (I'm getting old!).

As I see it, Israel is here to stay. What I feel will happen is that Israelis themselves will finally wake up to all the abuse that their government has put Alestinians through and will change their ideology from within. This is already appening, as we see more and more scholars and laypeople alike begin to strongly oppose settlements and restrictions on Palestinians.

I went to a seminar where I discussed this briefly with colleagues, as one of the keynote speakers briefly mentioned his refusal to speak at Ariel University. It is also mentioned here:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2010/oct/04/architects-settlement-freeze-israel

Edited by Cervantes

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Should Palestine ever be 'restored' following the fall of Israel... Such a state would be an immediate threat to the Shias in Syria, Iraq and possibly Iran.
Palestinians have very unfavourable view of Shias and would step up their suicide bomb attacks that they are already carrying out in Iraq against Shia civilians.

They also have a track record for being dishonest; for example how they came out in support of ISIS following their June 2014 insurgency in Iraq; despite (Shia) Iran supporting them vocally, militarily, financially and politically for years and years prior. Not forgetting how Kuwait took them in as refugees, then when Saddam invaded they came out in support of Saddam against the very country that had taken them in; not that I like Kuwait in the slightest, but still the point is they cannot be trusted. You never know, maybe God is punishing them because they don't deserve their own country given their track record.

 

The real question is, who is a bigger threat; Zionist Israel or Nasabi Palestine? Suicide bombing (a common sunni tactic, sanctioned by their doctrine) is extremely effective in bringing a country to its knees and chasing people and businesses away, so I would probably say a Nasabi Palestine is a bigger threat than Israel.

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