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In the Name of God بسم الله

Brothers How Did You Protect Assets In A Divorce?

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I'm asking on behalf a friend  on how to protect mutual funds, property, and assets that were accumulated after marriage. The USA court systems are not fair at all, and they never made a prenuptial agreement. She is already  getting her dowry from sharia law, but she is greedy and plans on draining him through USA court system . He has 7 daughters from her, four of which are minors, which means he'd pay $3,2000 child support. What are ways to stop her from obtaining more through her greed?

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  • Advanced Member

If she's raising 4 kids by herself, she probably needs it! But if that's not the case, he might need a good lawyer (which will still cost money, but might be less than letting her walk all over him in court). There are too many factors that play into whether or not she can go after assets obtained after the divorce (ex. If the family had a high standard of living, he may be obligated to maintain it).

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She schemed to divorce for the money. He doesn't want to divorce. And she doesn't want him to see his children. I wonder why women say there are no women rights in America, when the system is all in their favor. It bothers me that a housewife gets to have half of everything, when she couldn't even cook a proper meal or do proper chores. Everyone we know agrees that she was terrible housewife. What she is doing goes against Islam, as a sister I advise brothers to marry only shariah law, but don't marry civil in usa, otherwise say bye bye to all your hard work.

[Message from moderator: Post edited to be less inflammatory.]

Edited by Haydar Husayn
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Bismehe Ta3ala,

Assalam Alikum.

Your original post was asking about protecting assets, but your reply is uncalled for. You are attaching the woman yet you have no idea what happens inside the household. I hope you are not talking about her in real life, because that is istighaba.

M3 Salamah, FE AMIN Allah

Edited by Laayla
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  • Advanced Member

Laylaa, what do you mean uncalled for? Unless you are her or her family, then I'd so no reason as to why you are offended, but acting all shocked when my post has nothing to do with you is mind boggling. A Muslim woman who suddenly wants a divorce out of the blue, for no reason, other the fact for she wants money is in fact a gold digger. She is not a Muslim anymore. Sabrina, your hope that she takes him to the cleaners, shows what kind of person you are. How disgusting. Seven daughters that he helped make in the process, and she doesn't even want him to see, and yet you still defend her. Anyway does anyone knows tips on how to protect assets during a divorce? And can you have multiple lawyers for a case?

[Message from moderator: Post edited to be less inflammatory.]

Edited by Haydar Husayn
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hmmm..... you mean she bore and raised seven kids for him and then things went wrong all of a sudden? 

 

if she isn't a muslim any more,  shouldn't the father try to take custody of the daughters? instead of letting a non muslim woman (an apostate???) raise them.

 

I don't buy the "suddenly wants divorce for no reason".

 

If he is that rich, didn't she have access to his money or got to enjoy the comforts that money brings while she was living with him? that she had to resort to divorce to lead a  rich  lifestyle?

 

unless the husband is a millionaire she wouldn't have much left over for herself if she has to raise and educate seven daughters.

 

but yes, I agree the western laws are quite biased in favour of women/wife when it comes to divorce and child custody.

 

I can't offer any advice besides praying for the couple and their daughters.

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Bismehe Ta3ala,

Assalam Alikum.

You can state the problem, without resorting to name calling.

Sister, you say she is a Muslim in one sentence and say she isn't Muslim in another. Well, which is it?

Just remember, in every story, there are TWO sides.

M3 Salamah, FE AMIN Allah

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hmmm..... you mean she bore and raised seven kids for him and then things went wrong all of a sudden? 

 

if she isn't a muslim any more,  shouldn't the father try to take custody of the daughters? instead of letting a non muslim woman (an apostate???) raise them.

 

I don't buy the "suddenly wants divorce for no reason".

 

If he is that rich, didn't she have access to his money or got to enjoy the comforts that money brings while she was living with him? that she had to resort to divorce to lead a  rich  lifestyle?

 

unless the husband is a millionaire she wouldn't have much left over for herself if she has to raise and educate seven daughters.

 

but yes, I agree the western laws are quite biased in favour of women/wife when it comes to divorce and child custody.

 

I can't offer any advice besides praying for the couple and their daughters.

Why are most of the people answering women? Are you a brother? I don't think so. That's what's wrong with most women. They want to know the story,and not  be useful and answer the question being asked. Besides in shariah law the man is supposed to get custody of the children, so I don't know why all the women are nagging. Sorry to burst your bubble sisters I don't want to go into details of the story, but the man is in the right as he fulfilled all his islamic duties as a husband and father, while the woman IN THIS CASE did not. ( I am not grouping all women-no one is pointing a finger at any of you ladies, just the one in the case I presented.) It should not be your concern about the details but to answer the question if you know it.  Besides the question was directed at brothers whom went through a divorce and what they did to protect their assets in civil law.  Prophet (as) once said, " The worst of women is the one who asks for a high dowry."  And I believe civil law in divorce goes against what the Prophet pbuh said, because suddenly the woman is wanting more than what she had asked in shiarah law and becomes greedy.

Edited by BabyDoll
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Why are most of the people answering women? Are you a brother? I don't think so.

 

I am a sister, this is an online forum, where any one can post. I don't think there are any rules on SC saying sisters cant post in  brothers forum or vice versa.

 

That's what's wrong with most women. They want to know the story,and not  be useful and answer the question being asked. Besides in shariah law the man is supposed to get custody of the children, so I don't know why all the women are nagging.

 

I think you should re read my reply, I didn't say anywhere that the father shouldn't take the custody of the daughters, rather on the contrary.

 

 

Sorry to burst your bubble sisters I don't want to go into details of the story, but the man is in the right as he fulfilled all his islamic duties as a husband and father, while the woman IN THIS CASE did not. ( I am not grouping all women-no one is pointing a finger at any of you ladies, just the one in the case I presented.) It should not be your concern about the details but to answer the question if you know it.

 

Its good to know that he was a good husband and father, May Allah reward him for his good deeds and for fullfilling his responsibilities.

 

 

 

 Besides the question was directed at brothers whom went through a divorce and what they did to protect their assets in civil law.  Prophet (as) once said, " The worst of women is the one who asks for a high dowry."  And I believe civil law in divorce goes against what the Prophet pbuh said, because suddenly the woman is wanting more than what she had asked in shiarah law and becomes greedy.

 

The dowry mentioned in this saying means "haq mehr", the money demanded by the wife at the time of her nikkah. Haq mehr should be paid by the husband to the wife before the marriage is consummated. something entirely different from the maintenance the husband has to pay to wife in iddah and for the children's upbringing in case of divorce. :)

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I am not sure what the issue is.  That he does not want to support his children..???  And how to get out of it??

 

I don't think anyone who is responsible for raising seven daughters is going to be rich on $3200 - they will be struggling - housing alone will eat up 75% of it and then add food, clothing, transportation, education, health care (if this is US), recreation etc etc. - for 7! 

 

Islamic law says that he must support his kids.   The Western laws state that a man must support his kids.

 

All the rest of it - what she did or didn't do - what he did or didn't do - is not part of the discussion about his responsibility to support his children.

Edited by Maryaam
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  • Advanced Member

Instead of acting like a bunch of scorned women, why not just let brothers answer the question about protecting assets? The child support is no problem for him and he's done more for the kids more than most fathers will ever do in their lives. He is not cheap on his kids at all and looks out for their well being, the problem  is her getting half of everything that is unrelated to child support and how he protects himself from against her. The problem is her lying and twisting and manipulation, and screaming that can make the the courts rule everything in her favor. What kind of  woman wants full custody of her kids thru civil law when shariah law says the children belong to the father ? What kind of woman makes up fabrications like these?   And so what  if this online forum? Respect to whom the question is addressed to if you dont want brothers answering in the sister forums. Or take out your feminist  rage out on something else.

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I don't think under any circumstances is one person the only one responsible for a divorce. That is why marriage is not a decision that should be taken so lightly. What I don't agree with is the name calling. You may have opinions of how someone behaved but you are no one to judge others on what they did or didn't do. We don't know the whole story and I doubt you do because of the way you express yourself about her. If she had faults maybe he did too. We are not perfect. As far as the father having to pay child support I only think it's fair. As you said. He did take part in making each one of those 7 kids and he has to continue supporting them. Also if he has not done anything harmful to the children he should be allowed visitation rights. Although I agree courts tend to side with women on custody he should be able to argue that he is supporting them financially and should be allowed to see his children. If she doesn't allow him after it's been mandated by court then she is breaking the law.

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What her side of the story, as long as its not available we can't tolerate the name calling.

Go watch Judge Judy if u want drama stories.

If she's raising 4 kids by herself, she probably needs it! But if that's not the case, he might need a good lawyer (which will still cost money, but might be less than letting her walk all over him in court). There are too many factors that play into whether or not she can go after assets obtained after the divorce (ex. If the family had a high standard of living, he may be obligated to maintain it).

The only person who actually tried to answer the question.

I don't think under any circumstances is one person the only one responsible for a divorce. That is why marriage is not a decision that should be taken so lightly. What I don't agree with is the name calling. You may have opinions of how someone behaved but you are no one to judge others on what they did or didn't do. We don't know the whole story and I doubt you do because of the way you express yourself about her. If she had faults maybe he did too. We are not perfect. As far as the father having to pay child support I only think it's fair. As you said. He did take part in making each one of those 7 kids and he has to continue supporting them. Also if he has not done anything harmful to the children he should be allowed visitation rights. Although I agree courts tend to side with women on custody he should be able to argue that he is supporting them financially and should be allowed to see his children. If she doesn't allow him after it's been mandated by court then she is breaking the law.

The name calling because thats the truth on what she is. No need to go into detail or show people on forum the evidence to why she deserves to be a called a gold digger. Just wanted tips for my friend, and again child support is not the issue. It's when she wants to take properties and funds that he obtained after marriage is the issue. Civil Law is messed up and leaves man penniless. Not fair at all.

[Message from moderator: Post edited to be less inflammatory.]

Edited by Haydar Husayn
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It seems as though  the sisters on here take everything personally, as if its a personal attack on them. Unless you are the guilty culprit in the story that i mentioned, I don't see a reason why any sister should be enraged and feel like its a personal attack. Very Sad.  Allah the Merciful will bring justice to all men who have been wronged  in unislamic civil law system. And the women who use it to drain innocent men whom fulfilled all islamic duties, will be questioned in judgement day.

Edited by BabyDoll
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What are ways to stop her from obtaining more through her greed?

 

As you mentioned, its called the prenuptial agreement, too bad he didn't get her to sign one, thats his own fault.  It is a difficult battle from here on end.  Islamically speaking you have to obey the laws of the land, it is what it is.

Edited by King
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Ok, thread reopened, although if it degenerates again I'm going to lock it for good. Could I ask you to try to stay on topic, and avoid any personal attacks. Also, please remember that this is the brother's forum. While it is not forbidden for sisters to post here, they should only do so if they have something valuable to contribute. Attacking the OP because you don't agree with her views is not a good enough reason.

Edited by Haydar Husayn
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  • Advanced Member

The replies are sad but expected. More reasons to stay away from relationship with women, esp. marriage. Sorry I don't have any good advice but I feel bad for the guy, and many others just like him who suffer in the name of this facade of equality.

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The Sharia for child support was set up as if the father maintained custody of the children. This rarely happens in the West – so the full financial responsibility often, eventually, lands on the mother.  Even if she gets the maintenance amount she is awarded by the court – she and her children are often left destitute and struggling for shelter, food and etc.. and all the accompanying social fallout.

 

In most cases, it would be best if fathers took custody and kept the maintenance moneys and the mother had visitation rights.  I know moms would find this hard and dads too, but they would adjust and their child would be less likely to live in poverty.  The children have a better chance to retain both parents (dads tend to drift away with re-marriage, but moms are more likely to stay attached) and less likely to suffer social stigma.  The mothers would also have a better chance at remarriage. 

 

Any woman who has been an at home mom and has borne and raised 7 children, is entitled to compensation for her long years of work.  She could have been out working and making an income and gaining seniority but she was working in the home 24/7. Maybe this compensation agreement could be drawn up in a pre-nup contract when everyone is still friendly. 

 

A pre-nup is also highly advisable for a woman, as well, as many women enter marriage with holdings/earnings/properties that increase in value over the time of the marriage, are inheritors of her family's holdings, etc, during marriage.  These amounts can be significant, and without a pre-nup, the husband is entitled to ask for half as well.

Edited by Maryaam
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Islamic law says that he must support his kids. The Western laws state that a man must support his kids.

Actually, Islamic law says a man must support his children 100% and western law only usually requires him to pay 50% of the child raising expenses if both parents have equal income.

If he doesn't want his ex-wife to receive money to raise his children, he needs to apply for and win full custody and raise them himself. Heck, if he has full custody, his ex will have to pay child support to him under western law.

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Actually, Islamic law says a man must support his children 100% and western law only usually requires him to pay 50% of the child raising expenses if both parents have equal income.

If he doesn't want his ex-wife to receive money to raise his children, he needs to apply for and win full custody and raise them himself. Heck, if he has full custody, his ex will have to pay child support to him under western law.

 

I wonder how they determine the expenses for a child - kids are pricey!  Yes, moms would have to pay child support to the father (under Western law) if he had full custody - is that dependent on how much she makes? And under Islamic law - she would have no financial responsibility.

 

Also, found out recently, that if a divorced working spouse (husband or wife) has a pension plan - the other spouse is entitled to half of it for the number of years they were married.  Soo.. that means that if a person worked for 35 years and was married for 25 of them and then divorced, that the his or her former spouse is automatically given half of 25/35 times the monthly pension amount of the working spouses pension each month - at pension time.  

Edited by Maryaam
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  • Advanced Member

If he is "religious" then let him know that world is a short stay... he won't be able to take any of his material accumulation with him. 

 

On more practical side:

1. He can let go of property to his near and dear before they hit court

2. He can transfer properties to kids and it will not be taken as property which has to be divided between parents.

 

However one with custody will be guardian until they are big enough to decide on their own or court can appoint a third party overseer.

 

 

 

Some more resources you can check:

http://www.divorcenet.com/states/arizona/sixteen_financial_mistakes

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  • 4 weeks later...
  • Veteran Member

When I married I already had everything protected. Property in my name, we had separate bank accounts, kept track of any money I gave her or her family,(she was/is from 3rd World)...

 

Also, several years ago in one US Islamic publication was a report about the New Jersey judge up holding the marriage contract. If they married in a mosque this helps, too.

 

Child support he is going to pay. Federal law. But what he can do is get the court to order her to provide receipts for everything and she pays half. No receipt, no pay.

 

One thing I saw happen to a man I worked with was his ex-wife, to be vindictive, kept taking their son to the doctor and he get stuck with the bills. This poor guy worked 3 jobs -2 full time and one part time- and still could not keep up. He got haul into court for not paying and --as one of the women we worked with who was there on other business said-- when he told the judge how much he worked as it is, she -the judge-said "get another job".

 

So declare an inability to pay and the children go on welfare.

 

And to help that, try applying for social assistance, himself.

Edited by hasanhh
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  • 1 year later...
On 7/31/2014 at 3:08 PM, Miss Wonderful said:

Instead of acting like a bunch of scorned women, why not just let brothers answer the question about protecting assets?

Honest to God, there is only one way to protect one's wealth from a greedy spouse...charity! That's right. If a wife works, let her pay her share of expenses and if she is a stay-at-home mom, then her husband should provide the financial support for a modest lifestyle. Whatever surplus is best invested with God. Unfortunately, some men spend their whole lives hoarding money. They just save for the sake of saving. It's like they can take any of this money to their grave and yet, they have almost a heart attack when their wives end up taking half of it. Money comes and goes and if a man truly wants to save it, he should spend it in the way of God with or without his wife's permission.

P.S. He should also get a prenup and require her to work and pay her share of expenses if she isn't a stay-at-home mom.

Edited by Ali6
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