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In the Name of God بسم الله

Fadak - Issues In Abridged Form

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  • Advanced Member

(salam)

 

I have often observed that debate on Fadak gets expand on pages thats why I thought to shrink the whole debate into a abridged form in a rather informal way:

 

Events as they happened

 

1.      Fadak was received as Fay property and it became exclusive property of prophet. (Nawawi)

 

2.      Prophet (s) gifted it to Fatima Zahra (as). (Tafsir al Qummi)

 

3.      After prophet’s death, Fatima Zahra (as) demanded Fadak to which Abu Bakr demanded witnesses, Fatima produced witnesses but her witnesses were turned down. (Ibn Hajjar in Sawaiq al Muhriqa, Mir Sharif in Sharah Mawaqif, Razi in Tafsir Kabir, Allamah Halabi in Sirat al Halabiyah. Also Tafsir al Qummi).

 

4.      Then Fatima Zahra (as) demanded Fadak in shape of her right in inheritance left by her father. (Bukhari, Musnad Ahmed, Muslim)

 

5.      To which initially Abu Bakar stated that “he” had decided that although progeny of prophet are his heirs but property left by prophet should be distributed among people.

 

6.      Then a sudden change in stance, Abu Bakar coined a hadith and attributed to prophet the concept of which Hadith is that prophets have a rather different system of inheritance and whoever is born from loin of a prophet brings misfortune for himself/herself and he/she is punished in a way that he/she is deprived of his/her ‘right’ to inherit his/her father which ‘right’ is otherwise enjoyed by each and every individual of the world. He/She is debarred to inherit even a single cheap material possession from his/her father which activity otherwise is considered as an sign of a Muslim being a legitimate child of his/her parents. “ Whatever” and once again – “WHATEVER” prophets leave is to be distributed as charity among poor.  (Bukhari, Musnad Ahmed, Muslim etc)

 

7.      Fatima Zahra (as) cited verse of Quran to prove that prophets did leave inheritance and heirs but since intentions of some people had overcome by Satan therefore those verses were also not accepted.

 

8.      Fatima Zahra (as) got (a.) “angry” with Abu Bakar and (b.) did not talk to him again © died with the same stance. (Bukhari, Musnad Ahmed, Muslim, Tirmidhi etc)

 

9.      Widower Ali bin Abi Talib (as) then  (again) raise the issue and agitates his share from the property left by his wife which she ought to have inherited from her father on the other side Abbas, the uncle of prophet claims his share from inheritance left by prophet. But Abu Bakar remained adamant hence Ali deemed him as (a.) treacherous (b.) dishonest © Lair (d) Sinful. (Bukhari, Muslim etc).

 

[This shows Ali did not believe Abu Bakar to be ‘Sideeq’ and not to mention that lair is cursed in Quran so Ali also deemed Abu Bakar to be an accursed one]

 

 

10.  Abu Bakar died but not before ‘nominating’ net ruler. Umar became incharge. Ali bin Abi Talib (as) and Abbas again present their ‘same case of inheritance’ to him. Ali again deemed Umar as (a.) treacherous (b.) dishonest © Lair (d) Sinful. (Muslim etc).

 

Not to mention that lair is cursed in Quran so Ali deemed Umar to be an accursed one]

 

 

11.  In pursuance of claim of inheritance advanced by Ali and Abbas, Umar handed over the property to both but then some dispute emerged.

 

12.  Fadak remained a football between rulers and the rightful owners. Umar bin Abdul Aziz overruled the decision of pioneer caliphs and handed over it to its rightful owners.

 

Contradiction of coined Hadith to Quran / Hadith / History

 

1.      According to the Hadith which was fabricated at the drop of hat by the ruler of the time viz prophets do not leave inheritance, but we see that inheritance of prophets have been mentioned in Quran.

 

2.      “Majority of Sunni ulema” have been of the opinion that prophet Suleman inherited horses from his father.

 

 

3.      Commentators also believed that prophet Zakria was seeking (in quranic verse) someone to inherit his material possessions.

 

 

4.      Some of the early Hanafi scholars were also of the view that prophets can leave material possessions as inheritance. Thus the picture is not like what present day Sunnis try to paint before Shias according to which there has always been Ijma among scholars that prophets cannot leave inheritance.

 

 

5.      Most of all, Sunnis cannot prove that Abu Bakar and Co. ever had interpreted these verses in the way that they are doing in this age.

 

6.      They cant bring single authentic prove that any of the material possessions of any past prophet was not inherited by his legal heirs but were distributed as Sadqa among poor.

 

Bias shown – underhand deals – Acting in contradiction to coined Hadith

 

According to the alleged Hadith, “whatever” prophets leave behind it to be distributed among poor but this rule was not applied in cases of:

 

1.      Apartments of wives of prophets. They were not taken over and distributed among the poor and wives of prophet were still allowed to live in them.

 

2.      Sword of Prophet or its sale proceed was not distributed and it was with Imam Zain ul Abdeen. (Bukhari).

 

3.      Prophet’s ring was kept by Abu Bakar and then Umar and Uthman. (Bukhari)

 

4.      Prophet’s garment was kept by Ayesha. (Muslim)

 

5.      Fatima Zahra’s home was broke open by Abu Bakar and Co. to see if there was anything left by prophet do that it can be distributed as Sadqa (Ibn Tamiyah) but no such act was done with anybody else.

 

 

6.      At least there was no dispute about Ahlulbayt’s right to receive Khums but Abu Bakar even stopped Khums to Banu Hashim (Tafsir Ruh al Ma’ani etc)

 

7.      At times, Abu Bakar didn’t ask for witnesses and granted the relief claimed by Sahabi on the basis of his sole testimony. (Bukhari) but he asked for witnesses from  Fatima Zahra’s although her rank was much higher, than those sahaba, being part of  “Ahlulbayt” and Abu Bakar was bound to accept her version in light of “Hadith al Thaqlayn”.

 

Use of Aql

1.      Prophet of Islam did not inform the method of inheritance of prophets to his own daughter but informed about it to an outsider.

2.      Ali bin Abi Talib (as) who according to Sunnis was the most knowledgeable Sahabi and the only one who advanced the challenge of Saluni (to know the Quranic revelations and interpretations) himself didn’t know anything about such an important system of inheritance exclusive to prophets.

3.      Wives of prophets were also didn’t aware of any such thing hence they also advanced their claim of inheritance.

4.      Another stake holder, uncle of prophet was also kept in dark by the prophet on such an important aspect.

 

 

Defenses advanced by desperate advocates of rulers

 

 

One: Nawasib claim that as per Shia hadiths, ulema are the heirs of prophets and prophets leave knowledge in their inheritance.

 

1.      These Hadiths do not debar the “biological progeny” of prophets from inheriting their fathers/prophets and we have authentic Hadith which says that Fatima Zahra inherited prophet's estate (al kafi) which is suffice to water down any attempt to equate shia hadith with that of coined by Abu Bakar.

2.      Unlike Hadith advanced by Abu Bakar, Shia hadiths do not say that ‘whatever’ prophets leave is to be distributed among poor.

 

Two: Imam Ali didn’t regain Fadak during his reign

1.      Okay, and it proves what? It seems nothing but as an attempt to find ‘weakness’ in the arguments of your opponents when you yourself cannot advance any strong defense of your ancestors.

2.      Does it prove that Fatima Zahra and Ali have not been opposing the view formed by Abu Bakar in respect of prophet’s inheritance?

3.      Does it in anyway, altogether and all of a sudden, nullify the stance of Ali about Abu Bakar and Umar being treacherous, sinful, lair and dishonest?

4.      Does it anyway prove that Fatima Zahra did not die angry of Abu Bakar?

5.      If Ali could not get back Fadak from the clutches of his opponents then there were a series of reasons and wisdom behind it some of which we find mentioned in hadith works.

Edited by B-N
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  • Advanced Member

I just want to know if this hadith is authentic?

H 1414, Ch. 130, h 5 Ali ibn Muhammad ibn ‘Abd Allah has narrated from certain person of our people (that I think is al-Sayyari) from Ali ibn Asbat who has said the following: “In one of the meetings of abu al-Hassan Musa, recipient of divine supreme covenant, with al-Mahdi (one of ‘Abbassid ruler) the Imam found him paying reparations (for the damages caused to people). The Imam said, ‘O Amir al-Mu’minin, what has happened to the reparations due to us?’ He then asked, ‘What damage is caused to you, O abu al-Hassan, recipient of divine supreme covenant?’ He (the Imam) said, ‘Allah, the Holy, the Most High, granted victory to His Holy Prophet, recipient of divine supreme covenant, and the land of Fadak and its surrounding areas came under his control without any armed struggle. Allah sent a message to His Holy Prophet, recipient of divine supreme covenant. It said, “Give the relatives their rights.” The Messenger of Allah did not know who they were. He turned to Jibril to find out and Jibril turned to his Lord for the answer. Allah then sent revelation to him to give possession of Fadak to Fatimah, recipient of divine supreme covenant. Thereupon, the Messenger of Allah called Fatimah, recipient of divine supreme covenant, and said to her. “O Fatimah, Allah has commanded me to give possession of Fadak to you.” She then said, “O Messenger of Allah, I have accepted the offer from Allah and from you.” Thereafter her representatives lived there during the lifetime of the Messenger of Allah. When abu Bakr took control he expelled her representatives therefrom. She went to abu Bakr and asked him to reverse his decision and return Fadak to her but he said to Fatimah, recipient of divine supreme covenant, “Bring to me a black or white person to testify that Fadak belonged to you.” Fatimah, recipient of divine supreme covenant, brought Amir al-Mu’minin Ali, recipient of divine supreme covenant, and ’Umm Ayman who both testified in favor of Fatimah, recipient of divine supreme covenant. He then wrote, “Fatimah must not be disturbed in the matters of Fadak.” Fatimah, recipient of divine supreme covenant, then left with the document. On the way ‘Umar came from the opposite direction and asked, “What is it in your hand, O daughter of Muhammad?” Fatimah, recipient of divine supreme covenant, said, “It is a document that ibn abu Quhafa has written for me.” He said, “Show it to me.” Fatimah, recipient of divine supreme covenant, refused to hand it over to him but he snatched it away from her hand and read it. He then spit on it wiped out its writing and tore it into pieces. He said, “This was not captured by forces of the camels and horses of your father so that you can tie the rope around our necks.’” “Al-Mahdi said, ‘O abu al-Hassan define for me the boundaries of Fadak.’ The Imam said, ‘On one side it borders the mountain of ’Uhud. On the other side is ‘Arish Misr. Also it borders Sayf al-Bahr and on one of it’s sides is Dawmat al-Jandal.’ Then he asked the Imam, ‘All of it?’ He said, ‘Yes, O Amir al-Mu’minin, this is all that came to the Messenger of Allah without the use of the forces of the camels and horses.’ “He said, ‘This is a large area but I will look into it.’”

If it is then this version is a bit different. Seems like umar coined the hadith and asked Abu bakr to say that.

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  • Advanced Member

(salam)

 

I have often observed that debate on Fadak gets expand on pages thats why I thought to shrink the whole debate into a abridged form in a rather informal way:

 

Events as they happened

 

1.      Fadak was received as Fay property and it became exclusive property of prophet. (Nawawi)

 

2.      Prophet (s) gifted it to Fatima Zahra (as). (Tafsir al Qummi)

 

3.      After prophet’s death, Fatima Zahra (as) demanded Fadak to which Abu Bakr demanded witnesses, Fatima produced witnesses but her witnesses were turned down. (Ibn Hajjar in Sawaiq al Muhriqa, Mir Sharif in Sharah Mawaqif, Razi in Tafsir Kabir, Allamah Halabi in Sirat al Halabiyah. Also Tafsir al Qummi).

 

4.      Then Fatima Zahra (as) demanded Fadak in shape of her right in inheritance left by her father. (Bukhari, Musnad Ahmed, Muslim)

 

5.      To which initially Abu Bakar stated that “he” had decided that although progeny of prophet are his heirs but property left by prophet should be distributed among people.

 

6.      Then a sudden change in stance, Abu Bakar coined a hadith and attributed to prophet the concept of which Hadith is that prophets have a rather different system of inheritance and whoever is born from loin of a prophet brings misfortune for himself/herself and he/she is punished in a way that he/she is deprived of his/her ‘right’ to inherit his/her father which ‘right’ is otherwise enjoyed by each and every individual of the world. He/She is debarred to inherit even a single cheap material possession from his/her father which activity otherwise is considered as an sign of a Muslim being a legitimate child of his/her parents. “ Whatever” and once again – “WHATEVER” prophets leave is to be distributed as charity among poor.  (Bukhari, Musnad Ahmed, Muslim etc)

 

7.      Fatima Zahra (as) cited verse of Quran to prove that prophets did leave inheritance and heirs but since intentions of some people had overcome by Satan therefore those verses were also not accepted.

 

(wasalam)

 

2. False. Prophet (saw) never gifted Fadak to anybody. I am aware of the weak and chainless reports on ShiaPen website so before you copy-paste them check the other thread (link in the end of the post) where they have been discussed and answered. 

 

3. Issue of witness is another lie and fabrication not proven from a single authentic report. Check the other thread for more. 

 

6. The Hadith is also narrated by several other companions including Ali. Check the other thread. 

 

7. Khutba Fadakiya is a Shia source and not even authentic. Check the other thread. 

 

The rest of you points have been discussed in another thread:

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235022627-the-ahlul-bayt-the-family-of-the-beloved/

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  • Advanced Member

(wasalam)

 

2. False. Prophet (saw) never gifted Fadak to anybody. I am aware of the weak and chainless reports on ShiaPen website so before you copy-paste them check the other thread (link in the end of the post) where they have been discussed and answered. 

 

3. Issue of witness is another lie and fabrication not proven from a single authentic report. Check the other thread for more. 

 

6. The Hadith is also narrated by several other companions including Ali. Check the other thread. 

 

7. Khutba Fadakiya is a Shia source and not even authentic. Check the other thread. 

 

The rest of you points have been discussed in another thread:

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235022627-the-ahlul-bayt-the-family-of-the-beloved/

 

1. I haven't seen weakening of tafsir al qummi ref anywhere there.

2.Sunni scholars in their books have discussed that witnesses were produced in fact they have gone to dedicate sentences defending their caliph on the ground that standard of witnesses had not been fulfilled therefore if you have any problem with that historical fact then you may file complainants before your own scholars. 

3. Its sheer disrespect of Ali bin Abi Talib (as) to allege that he opposed the notion advanced by Abu Bakr and Co. even though he was aware of the Hadith.

4. Khutbah Fadak is authentic, one may ref to a booklet written on the authenticity of the sermon by Allamah Aftab Haider Jawadi but that sermon is not my issue in this thread. 

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The biggest mystery about Fadak

 

Salamunalaykum,

 

So it came to my attention recently that not only did Ali a.s ask Abu-bakr for Fadak, but also Umar after his death , and fatima a.s during abu-bakr's life, but also the wives of Muhammed pbuh themselves were asking for their share.

 

Now, lets put it into perspective, how could Aisha be the only wife of Muhammed pbuh who knew he was not leaving behind inheritance - or one of the only wives, when the other wives actually tried to claim inheritance?

 

I find it incredibly difficult to believe the other wives, plus Fatima a.s his daughter, but Ali a.s the closest to him and raised by him since birth, but Ibn Abbas r.a who was by authentic hadith blessed with wisdom, all somehow didn't hear the hadith that prophets pbuh do not leave behind inheritance?

 

Our brothers in the ahle sunnah, without using the this or that fallacy, really do have two choices. Either the rest of the wives, Fatima a.s , Ali a.s Ibn Abbas r.a were so ignorant as to have never heard once that Muhammed pbuh won't leave inheritance - but he somehow managed to tell Aisha and AbuBakr, OR Abu Bakr, Aisha, and Umar were telling a lie - and this would shake the Ummah to it's core and turn it upside down.

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  • 1 month later...
  • Unregistered

(bismillah)

 

(salam)

 

Ahlul Bayth(A.S) merits were clearly recorded in the Holy Quran and reinforced by the Holy Prophet (PBUHAHP).  

 

Surah 3 Verse 61 - This verse refers to the well-known event of mubahilah. Know to ALL Muslims involved in the Fadak issue.

 

Muslims  witnessed the contest and came to know that Ali, Fatimah, Hasan and Husayn were the "Ahlul Bayt" addressed in verse 33 of al Ahzab, known as ayah al tat-hir or the verse of purification.

_________________________________________________________________________


 

(1)  Allah’s Book is sufficient for us.”

 

Was proven to be a false statement made by a Muslim on the occasion of the tragedy of the Thursday night. Since it did not solve the Fadak issue 1400 years ago nor it will solve it in the future. People will keep arguing over the meanings of the verses of the Quran, to prove their particular point view.

 

(2)“I am leaving two precious things among you [for guidance]: the Book of Allah and my Sunnah.

 

Incorrect statement. Did not solve the Fadak issut 1400 years ago nor it will solve it in the future. People did and will keep bringing various hadith, to  prove their particular point view.

 

(3)“I am leaving two precious things among you [for guidance]: the Book of Allah and my Ahlu 'l-bayt.”

 

Correct statement: But, It was not adhered to, so the command of Allah and his Prophet was ignored. If the merits of Ahlul Bayth were acknowledged.  History would not have recorded a tragedy called Fadak incident.

 

Since this tragic incident happened and was recorded, may be there a wisdom in it, for us.

The Incident of Fadak, served as a criterion. If Muslims will continue in their injustice towards the Holy Prophet (PBUHAHP) and the Ahlul Bayth(A.S).

 

Injustice will be done to us, as is the case in the world today.

 

 

(wasalam) 

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