'ya Allah Madad' Or 'ya Ali Madad' Which Is Better

[Logical Islamic 295]

I understand tawassul, but i am asking:

 

1. If saying Ya Ali Madad with the intention Allah swt will help you through the intercession of Imam Ali a.s , and that this is better than not using this intercession,

 

What then is the use of saying Ya Allah madad ?

 

Is it not safer to say Ya Allah Bihaqqi Ali ? Making sure it is Allah swt whom you address your Dua to?

 

As a shia, this is truly the only thing in our Madhab that gives me sleepless nights.

 

Why do we have people saying our Imams have complete knowledge of the unseen (Sheik Mufeed(r.a) himself condemens this as a Gulaat belief), or that they can control every atom of the universe or say be and it is ?

 

They ate, married, had kids, were ill, had the same biological functions as us.

 

 

Sunnis lag behind in their duty to the ahlulbayt a.s and *some* not all shia's go in excess. Imam Ali a.s himself punished those that attributed divinity to him.

 

 

 

Can anyone provide me a single authentic ahadith where any of our Imams explicitly tell us to use waseelah in this way. We have hadith - authentic using the bihaqqi method in sunni and shia books. But is there even a single authentic hadith stating us to do dua's to mortals without at all having Allah swt as part of the spoken dua?

 

 

In Dua Tawassul, i hear 'Allah' many times. We ask the Imams O imam intercede for us infront of Allah.

 

So Instead of saying Ya Ali madad, why do we not say, O Ali, interecede for us and pray that Allah swt grants our Dua?

 

 

When people wanted their Dua granted, they never said Ya Muhammed Madad! They asked Muhammed O Muhammed pbuh pray to Allah swt for us.

 

 

http://english.bayynat.org/readers_mail/readers4.htm

Website of Grand Ayatullah Sayed Fadullah

Is it ok to say 'Ya Ali help me' or 'Ya Fatima help me'. Pl reply.
Regards,

Our invocations should only be directed to Allah and we should only ask Him for help to fulfill our needs, for Allah says: “So invoke not any one along with Allah,” (72:18), and: “And your Lord says: Call upon Me, I will answer you,” (40:60), and: “And when My servants ask you concerning Me, then surely I am very near; I answer the prayer of the suppliant when he calls on Me…” (02:186).

 

 

 

 

Sunnis are making videos attacking us

 

Edited April 21, 2014 by Logical Islamic

[Ibn Hashmi 45]

^better you also say O Ali O Ali pray for me to Allah, He is spiritually sound and alive

[Logical Islamic 295]

http://english.bayynat.org/readers_mail/readers4.htm

Website of Grand Ayatullah Sayed Fadullah

Is it ok to say 'Ya Ali help me' or 'Ya Fatima help me'. Pl reply.
Regards,

Our invocations should only be directed to Allah and we should only ask Him for help to fulfill our needs, for Allah says: “So invoke not any one along with Allah,” (72:18), and: “And your Lord says: Call upon Me, I will answer you,” (40:60), and: “And when My servants ask you concerning Me, then surely I am very near; I answer the prayer of the suppliant when he calls on Me…” (02:186).

[Invoker 213]

^better you also say O Ali O Ali pray for me to Allah, He is spiritually sound and alive

isnt that shirk?

[Martyrdom 2,124]

Here we go again

[Invoker 213]

I understand tawassul, but i am asking:

1. If saying Ya Ali Madad with the intention Allah swt will help you

through the intercession of Imam Ali a.s , and that this is better than

not using this intercession,

What then is the use of saying Ya Allah madad ?

Is it not safer to say Ya Allah Bihaqqi Ali ? Making sure it is Allah

swt whom you address your Dua to?

As a shia, this is truly the only thing in our Madhab that gives me

sleepless nights.

Why do we have people saying our Imams have complete knowledge of the

unseen (Sheik Mufeed(r.a) himself condemens this as a Gulaat belief), or

that they can control every atom of the universe or say be and it is ?

They ate, married, had kids, were ill, had the same biological functions

as us.

Sunnis lag behind in their duty to the ahlulbayt a.s and *some* not all

shia's go in excess. Imam Ali a.s himself punished those that attributed

divinity to him.

Can anyone provide me a single authentic ahadith where any of our Imams

explicitly tell us to use waseelah in this way. We have hadith -

authentic using the bihaqqi method in sunni and shia books. But is there

even a single authentic hadith stating us to do dua's to mortals

without at all having Allah swt as part of the spoken dua?

In Dua Tawassul, i hear 'Allah' many times. We ask the Imams O imam

intercede for us infront of Allah.

So Instead of saying Ya Ali madad, why do we not say, O Ali, interecede

for us and pray that Allah swt grants our Dua?

When people wanted their Dua granted, they never said Ya Muhammed Madad!

They asked Muhammed O Muhammed pbuh pray to Allah swt for us.

http://english.bayynat.org/readers_mail/readers4.htm

Website

of Grand Ayatullah Sayed Fadullah

Is it ok to say 'Ya Ali help

me' or 'Ya Fatima help me'. Pl reply.

Regards,

Our invocations

should only be directed to Allah and we should only ask Him for help to

fulfill our needs, for Allah says: “So invoke not any one along with

Allah,” (72:18), and: “And your Lord says: Call upon Me, I will answer

you,” (40:60), and: “And when My servants ask you concerning Me, then

surely I am very near; I answer the prayer of the suppliant when he

calls on Me…” (02:186).

this is because ur religion is full of bidd'ahs. Indeed a reality which is very very hard for shias to accept

[robbenmessi1010 217]

LOLL this debate never ends. Guys, don't even get into the subject and don't post. Mr. Logical Islamic, just go to google.com and search for this subject in old shiachat forums...

[Ibn Hashmi 45]

^invoker it's not shirk or biddah rather offshoot sects that were created 200 yrs back maked this sense of veiw to hide there own munafiqah, know don't tell me barelwi i'am not that

[robbenmessi1010 217]

Allah doesn't need someone to help him hear us, as shown in the verses posted above. Allah says he answers the call of the supplicant when he calls. That's it. He doesn't say at all to call upon someone else to reach it to Allah. Just think of it simply and stop twisting and turning  ;)

[Ibn Hashmi 45]

Taq^yah

[robbenmessi1010 217]

Taq^yah

And how's that?

[kim.tinkerbell 1,253]

Surahat nisa (4:64), " when they were unjust to themselves,come to you and asked forgiveness of Allah and the Apostle had (also) asked forgiveness for them, they would have found Allah oft-returing (to mercy), Merciful."

We dont make up stuff ya invoker...

[Logical Islamic 295]

Surahat nisa (4:64), " when they were unjust to themselves,come to you and asked forgiveness of Allah and the Apostle had (also) asked forgiveness for them, they would have found Allah oft-returing (to mercy), Merciful."

We dont make up stuff ya invoker...

 

Had they asked Muhammed pbuh to ask Allah swt to forgive them right?

 

Sister isn't there  a difference between, O Muhammed Help me?

 

and O Muhammed pray to Allah swt for me?

[robbenmessi1010 217]

Surahat nisa (4:64), " when they were unjust to themselves,come to you and asked forgiveness of Allah and the Apostle had (also) asked forgiveness for them, they would have found Allah oft-returing (to mercy), Merciful."

We dont make up stuff ya invoker...

Like Logical Islamic said....There is a big difference between ''Ya RasulAllah Madad'' and ''Ya RasulAllah, ask God to forgive me''. 

[kim.tinkerbell 1,253]

Had they asked Muhammed pbuh to ask Allah swt to forgive them right?

 

Sister isn't there  a difference between, O Muhammed Help me?

 

and O Muhammed pray to Allah swt for me?

Salam,

The verse is saying if you come to rusalallah (pbuh) and ask for forgiveness from Allah and the propht asked god to forgive them, then god will forgive them. My own understanding of the verse.

It can be different depending on how you say it and what your intentions are. I usually say Allah help me bahak muhammed wa ali. Am not sure how to define bahak in english, maybe the arabic speakers can explain it.

I would say oh muhammed pray to Allah for me,inside of oh muhammed help me because you should seek both Allah and muhammed and not just muhammed (pbuh). It's in gods hands what will happen,he is the most powerful. This is just my opinion.

[Thaqalyn 101]

this is because ur religion is full of bidd'ahs. Indeed a reality which is very very hard for shias to accept

HAHAHAHAHAHA. Full of bid'ahs? You know who your second Caliph was right? 

 

-Altering Adhan (Sunni scholars admit this)

-Adding taraweeh (Sunni scholars admit this)

-Banning both forms of Mut'ah.(some Sunni scholars admit this)

-Folding his hands in prayer.

and sooooo many more.

 

Before you question the Mut'ah one, just look at this

In Saheeh Sunan Al-Nasai, Volume 2, page 268. The hadeeth has also been graded as Sahih(perfect) by Alamah Al-Albani who is your greatest scholar in the grading of hadeeth. Ibn  Abbas narrates, "I heard Umar say, By Allah! I forbid you from mut'ah, even though it is in the book of Allah, and the Messenger of Allah did it also".

 

Your best scholar in hadeeth says this is a perfect narration and proves a couple of things:

-Umar did what he wanted even when he knew it wasn't part of the Quran and the Sunnah. It shows his true colors.

-You can rely on any traditions at all from Umar because this is a clear bid'ah

-Mut'ah is in the Quran and the Prophet himself allowed it.

 

It is graded saheeh by your best scholar of hadith so you cannot argue with the authenticity of it.

 

Ahlul Sunnah= through Umar= Bid'ah.

 

What say you?

 

 

lol. 

 

Think before you post.

 

Ya Allah Madad is of course better, but tawassul is allowed and the companions did it at the Prophets (pbuh) grave when he died.

Edited April 22, 2014 by Thaqalyn

[robbenmessi1010 217]

Tawassul is halal. The problem is asking directly from the prophet(saw) or the imam(as), and Sayyed Fadlullah had that opinion also. I respect him a lot for that. Other than that it's fine I think. 

HAHAHAHAHAHA. Full of bid'ahs? You know who your second Caliph was right? 

 

-Altering Adhan (Sunni scholars admit this)

-Adding taraweeh (Sunni scholars admit this)

-Banning both forms of Mut'ah.(some Sunni scholars admit this)

-Folding his hands in prayer.

and sooooo many more.

 

Before you question the Mut'ah one, just look at this

In Saheeh Sunan Al-Nasai, Volume 2, page 268. The hadeeth has also been graded as Sahih(perfect) by Alamah Al-Albani who is your greatest scholar in the grading of hadeeth. Ibn  Abbas narrates, "I heard Umar say, By Allah! I forbid you from mut'ah, even though it is in the book of Allah, and the Messenger of Allah did it also".

 

Your best scholar in hadeeth says this is a perfect narration and proves a couple of things:

-Umar did what he wanted even when he knew it wasn't part of the Quran and the Sunnah. It shows his true colors.

-You can rely on any traditions at all from Umar because this is a clear bid'ah

-Mut'ah is in the Quran and the Prophet himself allowed it.

 

It is graded saheeh by your best scholar of hadith so you cannot argue with the authenticity of it.

 

Ahlul Sunnah= through Umar= Bid'ah.

 

What say you?

 

 

lol. 

 

Think before you post.

 

Ya Allah Madad is of course better, but tawassul is allowed and the companions did it at the Prophets (pbuh) grave when he died.

I couldn't have said it better.  :D

[Invoker 213]

HAHAHAHAHAHA. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-Altering Adhan (Sunni scholars admit this)

 

Imam Malik stated that on his[umar] suggestion the words "I testify that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah" were added to the adhan, and likewise the words "Prayer is better than Sleep" to the adhan for the dawn prayer. However, the more correct report is that it is Bilal who first inserted the latter formula  in the call to the dawn prayer and the Prophet  retained it. 

Book Reference : 

Abu Nu`aym, Hilya al-Awliya� 1:73-92; al-Dhahabi, Siyar A`lam al-Nubala� 1/2:509-565 #3; Shibli Nu`mani, `Umar The Great 2:336-338. 

 

 

 

-Adding taraweeh (Sunni scholars admit this)

 

 

There are authentic narrations which prove that prophet(Saw) offered taraweeh for 3 days.. then out of fear that it might not be made farz upon his upon he didnt offered it.. 

 

 

Narrated 'Urwa: 

That he was informed by 'Aisha, "Allah's Apostle went out in the middle of the night and prayed in the Masjid and some men prayed behind him. In the morning, the people spoke about it and then a large number of them gathered and prayed behind him (on the second night). In the next morning the people again talked about it and on the third night the Masjid was full with a large number of people. Allah's Apostle came out and the people prayed behind him. On the fourth night the Mosque was overwhelmed with people and could not accommodate them, but the Prophet came out (only) for the morning prayer. When the morning prayer was finished he recited Tashah-hud and (addressing the people) said, "Amma ba'du, your presence was not hidden from me but I was afraid lest the night prayer (Qiyam) should be enjoined on you and you might not be able to carry it on." So, Allah's Apostle died and the situation remained like that (i.e. people prayed individually). " 

(Bukhari, Book 32, 3:229) 

So since there is proof that prophet(Saw) offered it , we too can offer it and since after his death there is no possibility of it being made farz it can be offered for the whole of ramzan.. Regarding the statement of hz umar(ra) what he said was in accordance to liguistic sense.. he said its bidah in linguistic manner not in sharai manner since there was already proof from prophet(Saw) that he offered it.. Because bidah of any kind in shariah is not permissible..

 

 

 

-Banning both forms of Mut'ah.(some Sunni scholars admit this)

 

 

Narrated 'Ali bin Abi Talib:

 

 

 

 

On the day of Khaibar, Allah's Apostle forbade the Mut'a (i.e. temporary marriage) and the eating of donkey-meat.

 

Sahih Bukhari Volume 5, Book 59, Number 526

 

 

 

 

-Folding his hands in prayer.

 

 It was narrated from Ibn ‘Abbaas (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “We Prophets have been commanded to delay our suhoor and to break our fast straight away, and to place our right hands over our left hands when praying.” (narrated by Ibn Hibbaan in al-Saheeh, 3/13-14).

 

 

and sooooo many more.

 

 

Speak out!

 

 

 

Before you question the Mut'ah one, just look at this

In Saheeh Sunan Al-Nasai, Volume 2, page 268. The hadeeth has also been graded as Sahih(perfect) by Alamah Al-Albani who is your greatest scholar in the grading of hadeeth. Ibn  Abbas narrates, "I heard Umar say, By Allah! I forbid you from mut'ah, even though it is in the book of Allah, and the Messenger of Allah did it also".

 

 

There are hadith in which the Prophet saw forbid mutah ( one is mentioned above) so any other hadith is irrelevant.

 

 

 

Your best scholar in hadeeth says this is a perfect narration and proves a couple of things:

-Umar did what he wanted even when he knew it wasn't part of the Quran and the Sunnah. It shows his true colors.

-You can rely on any traditions at all from Umar because this is a clear bid'ah

-Mut'ah is in the Quran and the Prophet himself allowed it.

 

 

Really? Lets see a verse of Quran which allows mutah.. hmm?

 

 

It is graded saheeh by your best scholar of hadith

 

 

So??

 

 

so you cannot argue with the authenticity of it.

 

 

 

Anything that contradicts the Quran can be thrown away.

 

 

 

Ahlul Sunnah= through Umar= Bid'ah.

 

 

Rafidism= thru Abdullah ibn saba=  disgrace to Islam

 

 

What say you?

 

 

 

 

 

lol. 

 

Think before you post.

 

 

 

 

 

Ya Allah Madad is of course better, but tawassul is allowed and the companions did it at the Prophets (pbuh) grave when he died.

 

 

Which companions? after the death of the Prophet saw all but 3 became apostates didnt they? bring me a hadees of those 3 saying ya rasullullah madad

Edited April 22, 2014 by Invoker

[Thaqalyn 101]

With regard to your sahih Bukhari quote, lots of it is fabricated (Prophet Soloman boasted that he would impregnate 100 women in one night is one hadith)=rejected

First, answer this,

Before you question the Mut'ah one, just look at this

In Saheeh Sunan Al-Nasai, Volume 2, page 268. The hadeeth has also been graded as Sahih(perfect) by Alamah Al-Albani who is your greatest scholar in the grading of hadeeth. Ibn  Abbas narrates, "I heard Umar say, By Allah! I forbid you from mut'ah, even though it is in the book of Allah, and the Messenger of Allah did it also".

 

Your best scholar in hadeeth says this is a perfect narration and proves a couple of things:

-Umar did what he wanted even when he knew it wasn't part of the Quran and the Sunnah. It shows his true colors.

-You can rely on any traditions at all from Umar because this is a clear bid'ah

-Mut'ah is in the Quran and the Prophet himself allowed it.

 

Heres the answer to your question about tawassul. With regard to Sahih Bukhari, lots of it is fabricated and there is a hadith about the Prophet urinating in the street standing up= rejected. 

Moreover, Tabarani, in his al-Mu`jam al-saghir, reports a hadith from ‘Uthman ibn Hanayf that a man repeatedly visited ‘Uthman ibn ‘Affan (Allah be well pleased with him) concerning something he needed, but ‘Uthman paid no attention to him or his need.

The man met Ibn Hunayf and complained to him about the matter - this being after the death of the Prophet (Allah bless him and grant him peace) and after the caliphates of Abu Bakr and ‘Umar - so ‘Uthman ibn Hunayf, who was one of the Companions who collected hadiths and were learned in the religion of Allah said: "Go to the place of ablution and perform ablution (wudu), then come to the mosque, perform two rak’as of prayer therein, and say,

“‘O Allah, I ask You and turn to You through our Prophet Muhammad, the Prophet of Mercy; O Muhammad (Ya Muhammad), I turn through you to my Lord, that He may fulfill my need,’

"and mention your need. Then come so that I can go with you (to the caliph ‘Uthman)."

So the man left and did as he had been told, then went to the door of ‘Uthman ibn ‘Affan (Allah be pleased with him), and the doorman came, took him by the hand, brought him to ‘Uthman ibn ‘Affan and seated him next to him on a cushion. ‘Uthman asked, "What do you need?”and the man mentioned what he wanted, and ‘Uthman accomplished it for him and then said, "I hadn’t remembered your need until just now,”adding, "Whenever you need something, just mention it.”Then the man departed, met ‘Uthman ibn Hunayf, and said to him, "May Allah reward you! He didn’t see to my need or pay any attention to me until you spoke with him.”‘Uthman ibn Hunayf replied, "By Allah, I didn’t speak to him, but I have seen a blind man come to the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and grant him peace) and complain to him of the loss of his eyesight. The Prophet (Allah bless him and grant him peace) said, ‘Can you not bear it?’ and the man replied, ‘O messenger of Allah, I do not have anyone to lead me around, and it is great hardship for me.’ The Prophet (Allah bless him and grant him peace) told him, ‘Go to the place of ablution and perform ablution (wudu), then pray two rak’as of prayer and make these supplications.’ “Ibn Hunafy went on, "By Allah, we didn’t part company or speak long before the man returned to us as if nothing had ever been wrong with him."

This is an explicit, unequivocal text from a prophetic Companion proving the legal validity of tawassul through the dead. The account has been classed as rigorously authenticated (Sahih) by Bayhaqi, Mundhiri, and Haytami.

(Muhammad Hamid - a leading Hanafi scholar of this century:) As for calling upon (nida’) the righteous (when they are physically absent, as in the words "O (Ya) Muhammad”in the above hadiths), tawassul to Allah Most High through them is permissable, the supplication (du’a) being to Allah Most Glorious, and there is much evidence for its permissibility- Your probably a Hanafi cuz your from Pakistan!

 

Go and educate yourself and sort out your akhlaq. 

 

 

 

Maybe we should start calling Ahlul Sunnah 'Ahlul Bid'ah'

Edited April 22, 2014 by Thaqalyn

[Invoker 213]

Your probably a Hanafi cuz your from Pakistan!

 

 

 

 

cuz ur from Pakistan!... What a childish thought! Its no use debating with a guy like u who cannot even judge my beliefs. I dont do taqleed. 

[Thaqalyn 101]

cuz ur from Pakistan!... What a childish thought! Its no use debating with a guy like u who cannot even judge my beliefs. I dont do taqleed. 

What a surprise! You've run away again! Even if your not a hanafi, if you say the Shia are doing shirk, then you're accusing hanafi scholars of doing shirk! Check mate.

[Invoker 213]

What a surprise! You've run away again! Even if your not a hanafi, if you say the Shia are doing shirk, then you're accusing hanafi scholars of doing shirk! Check mate.

 

There is no checkmate in this game kid. All the answers to questions are available on HCY forum. Its no use that i paste them over here like u do from shiapen or any other shia website.

[Thaqalyn 101]

Lol

 

There is no checkmate in this game kid. All the answers to questions are available on HCY forum. Its no use that i paste them over here like u do from shiapen or any other shia website.

Thats the same forum that thinks the Quran and Sunnah hadith is reliable even though it has no chain. If you rely on that may Allah guide you. Anyway, as Imam Ali (as) , said 'If a Jahil comes and argues with you ignorantly, say Salaam as there is no turning in him, leave him and the rest is to Allah' As ibn Abbas said, 'My knowledge and the knowledge of all the companions is but a drop in the seven oceans compared to that of Ali". So I'll take on my Imam's advise.

 

 

Salaam.

Edited April 22, 2014 by Thaqalyn

[Invoker 213]

 Imam Ali (as) , said 'If a Jahil comes and argues with you ignorantly, say Salaam as there is no turning in him, leave him and the rest is to Allah'

 

 

 

Yes...  i followed it  and  that guy named thaqalyn said "You've run away again!"

Edited April 22, 2014 by Invoker

[Thaqalyn 101]

Yes...  i followed it  and  that guy named thaqalyn said "You've run away again!"

Salaam

[Thaqalyn 101]

To all others, it is actually clear that normal Sunnis say it is permissible to do tawassul, it is just the wahaabis that have a real problem. In this video, regular Sunni scholars hit back at wahabis like Bilal Phillips and Invoker.

 

 

And in this one Kamal al Haydari demolishes Adnan Ibrahim in a debate about this (if you understand arabic)

 

[Logical Islamic 295]

To people saying 'Well if you see a passer by and say 'O passer by help me' is it not shirk? I feel this is just an extremely simplistic argument.

 

1. The Quran forbids us from calling on any other than Allah, so it is illogical for this to mean those we must call in our day to day life in terms of our day to day neccesities.

2.What the Quran is talking about, the ENTIRE point of sending Muhammed pbuh is so we know Allah swt, so we obey him, so we rely only on him, not in the way you rely on a doctor, not in a corporeal way, but in a way that, AFTER this world, you ULTIMATELY only rely on Allah swt.

 

So i can say, Doctor please help to cure me. But then i can't go home and say O Doctor cure me, i'll say O Allah, i have used the logical means to get better, now i only call upon YOU and ultimately rely on YOU.

 

The verses in the Quran are so explicit in clearly forbidding us from calling on any other than Allah swt for our ULTIMATE needs.

 

If you call on the Imams a.s directly and BELIEVE they were given the power to not only hear, but grant your dua by Allah swt...what is the use of ever calling upon Allah swt? And how does this not CLEARLY go against the Quran where Allah swt asks us to EXPLICITLY only call upon him?

 

I heard a hadith i can't reference(sorry) but it goes something a long the lines of , Muhammed pbuh told Ali a.s, two groups will be destroyed because of you, your extreme hater, and your extreme lover.

 

What's the difference between the idols  ? Many Idol worshippers believe their Idols are given power by God and to supplicate to those Idols directly. I am not calling ANY shia an idol worshipper God forbid, i am merely saying, why did Muhammed pbuh and Allah swt spend so much of the Quran saying, Only call upon me, only Call upon me, associate no-one with me.

 

"We worship them (i.e. the idols) only so that they may bring us nearer to Allah." (39:3)

 

 

1. There isn't a single hadith in our shia books where the Imams say 'Call upon me directly'.

2. Why were people not constantly making dua's directly to Muhammed pbuh all the time? to Ali a.s? during their life-time? I don't mean a one-off dua asking for forgiveness after they wronged the messenger, but ALL the time?

3. If Ya Ali a.s madad is better, why would you ever use Ya Allah madad, and if Ya Allah madad is equal to Ya Ali madad in your prayer being answered, why would you ever prefer the name of Ali a.s to that of Allah swt?

4. Why don't you say O Allah FOR THE SAKE OF ALI? - we have plenty of hadith justifying this.

 

 

How Ayatullah Fadlalah is the only ayatullah i have come across, with all due respect, who forbids saying YA Ali Madad i don't know.

Website of Grand Ayatullah Sayed Fadlullah

Is it ok to say 'Ya Ali help me' or 'Ya Fatima help me'. Pl reply.
Regards,

Our invocations should only be directed to Allah and we should only ask Him for help to fulfill our needs, for Allah says: “So invoke not any one along with Allah,” (72:18), and: “And your Lord says: Call upon Me, I will answer you,” (40:60), and: “And when My servants ask you concerning Me, then surely I am very near; I answer the prayer of the suppliant when he calls on Me…” (02:186).

Tawassul: The dua itself begins with O Allah

 

Ya Ali Madad =/= like tawassul

 

I beleive in tawassul, Oh Allah, accept the intercession of Muhammed pbuh for me. O Muhammed pbuh, pray to Allah swt that he may grant my dua.

[Logical Islamic 295]

Nahjul Balaga, saying 116

Imam Ali a.s:
"Two kinds of people will be damned on my account. Those who form exaggerated opinions about me, and those who under-estimate me because they hate me"

[robbenmessi1010 217]

Nahjul Balaga, saying 116

Imam Ali a.s:

"Two kinds of people will be damned on my account. Those who form exaggerated opinions about me, and those who under-estimate me because they hate me"

Thanks a lot for sharing this brother.

[Logical Islamic 295]

Thanks a lot for sharing this brother.

 

Salamunalaykum brother, thank our Imam a.s not me!

 

Imam Ali a.s

Do not seek help or protection from anybody but Allah. Reserve your prayers, your requests, your solicitations, your supplications, and your entreaties to Him and Him alone because to grant, to give, to confer and to bestow, as well as to withhold, to deprive, to refuse, and to debar, lies only in His Power. Ask as much of His Blessings and seek as much of His Guidance as you can.

 

Nahjul Balagah Letter 31- in his will to Imam Hassan a.s

 

 

Spread this to every living breathing shia and sunni you know, quote it in every debate about praying or asking Allah swt!

[Thaqalyn 101]

I think you are wrongly interpreting those quotes from Imam Ali (as) . Tawassul is very much allowed. In fact, Abu Hanifah, Malik ibn Anas, al Shafi'i and Ahmed ibn Hanbal all allowed it. It is only the salafis and wahabis that disagree and we should not be influenced by them. When he said, 'exaggerate' that was when people began to bow down to Imam Ali (as) like the alawis of today do, and the narrations tell us that he burned them for it.

Edited May 4, 2014 by Thaqalyn

[Logical Islamic 295]

I think you are wrongly interpreting those quotes from Imam Ali (as) . Tawassul is very much allowed. In fact, Abu Hanifah, Malik ibn Anas, al Shafi'i and Ahmed ibn Hanbal all allowed it. It is only the salafis and wahabis that disagree and we should not be influenced by them. When he said, 'exaggerate' that was when people began to bow down to Imam Ali (as) like the alawis of today do, and the narrations tell us that he burned them for it.

 

Salamualaykum brother,

 

I have no issues with saying, O Ali, pray to Allah swt that he may grant our Dua. If this was shirk, asking your mum or dad to pray for you would be shirk, and every muslim would be comitting shirk.

 

I do have an issue saying O Ali Help me, or Ya Ali Madad etc Because you are saying Ali a.s has been given power to not only hear, but grant your dua, and no hadith supports this, hadiths by Imam Ali a.s himself go against it, and it leaves no room or space for Allah swt - why call on Allah when you can just call on Ali a.s?

Edited May 4, 2014 by Logical Islamic

[robbenmessi1010 217]

'Tawassul is very much allowed"...The quotes from Imam Ali(as) are quite clear. 

[Logical Islamic 295]

'Tawassul is very much allowed"...The quotes from Imam Ali(as) are quite clear. 

 

Salam!

 

Tawassul is allowed - if you say O Imam, pray to Allah swt for us - according to most maraja's

 

I disagree when people say YA ALI MADAD etc

[robbenmessi1010 217]

Salam!

 

Tawassul is allowed - if you say O Imam, pray to Allah swt for us - according to most maraja's

 

I disagree when people say YA ALI MADAD etc

Tawassul is allowed, but it depends on how you define it. I agree with you on this