Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
ShiaChat.com
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله

How Practical Is The Two State Solution?

Rate this topic


Recommended Posts

  • Veteran Member

Is a two-state solution a practical decision or is the best course to push for the right of return? The main issue I have with the right of return is if we were to go with a one state solution and return all land to the Palestinians that was formed into the nation of Israel in 1948 is the implications it would have for the international community. If we say the Palestinians have the right to all the land of the former British Mandate of Palestine, then does that mean Mexico has the right to take back California? Where do we draw the line and is it right to grant this privilege to Palestine if we refuse to grant it to any other state?

 

The problem with the two state solution is the kind of message it sends as well that foreigners from another country can lay claim to any land their ancestors lived  in over 2,000 years ago and it can be theirs if they kick out the inhabitants for the last 1,000 years and just hang in there until people get tired of fighting.

Edited by Saintly_Jinn23
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member

We're covering the Israeili-Arab conflict this week in my Modern Middle East class. Give me a few days and I may contribute. 

 

Just quickly, what I find ironic is the religious claim to the land by the israelites. If one wants to argue they are the rightful inheritors of the land based on Biblical Tradition which states God had promised this land to the descendants of Abraham [a], then the Arab's have just as much of a right to the land as the jews since they too descended from Abraham through Isma'il [a] whereas the Jews came from the line of Ishaq [a].

 

It seems it this notion was pushed by possibly more secular motives than religious. Apparently many other pieces of land were considered (apparently even the Northern Territory and Tasmania in Australia (?) :donno: ). If this was primarily based on Religion than other places shouldn't of been considered.

 

Idk, we had a lecture on it today so am just scratching at the surface here. 

 

The British did a good job at stuffing things up though... 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member

Prof. Stephen M. Walt: ​'The Two-State solution is either dead or on life support, and its failure is going to require us to start thinking about alternatives.'  

 

 

The Future of Israel and Palestine: Expanding the Debate (full dialogue): 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Forum Administrators

There will never be a two state solution.

 

It's game over for the Pals and it has been for years. It's a bit of an insult to the Israelis to imagine that the Pal question exercises their minds in any way - although they may occasionally toss it to U.S. presidents, much as you'd toss a bone to a dog to keep it busy.

 

Given the extent of American support for Israel, for the past several years it has been taking on the regional powers like Iran and Iraq. The question should really be about how the Israelis plan to expand eastwards.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member

It seems that for Palestine there is not a solution any time soon.

Palestine must be not neglected by people of any religion, Christians or Muslims, as it was the birthplace of Jesus, who is holy to Christians and Muslims, and the Messiah of Jews and therefore unites all three religions. Unfortunately the importance of that Holy Place is neglected by all religions, Christians, Jews, Muslims... It is the birthplace of Peace but it is neglected by all people. All politicians and authorities, except for Lebanese Imam Musa Sadr who was deported and kidnapped by Palestinian/Israeli intelligence, in the region have committed major mistakes, that is why all will suffer till a solution is found.

A non-state solution would be best, with all groups there to disarm as a first step. But this is a non-pragmatic and for today’s standards non-realistic approach.

Only God and Jesus Christ will finally be able to solve this issue. Until then just pray and help the people there through humanitarian aid.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member

Unfortunately, you are right. And it's not even one solid peace of land, but a labyrinth of many disconnected little pieces of land with barbed wired Israeli settlements in between.

 

The entire territory of what's known today as Israel/Palestine should become one united society of people who happen to live there at the moment. Jews, Palestinians, Russians, Thai workers should be equal citizens of Palestine or whatever name this place will be called after the end of Zionism...

 

They are planning to deport all palestine (people, culture, history etc) to the western desert of Jordan. That's the 2 state solution that Israel is proposing.

Link to post
Share on other sites

(bismillah)

  (salam)

 

The two state solution does not make any sense. 

 

The only practical solution would be a one state soluton with a country called Palestine. A democratic state where both the jews and arabs can live peacefully and coexist.This should also include the right of return for Palestinans who live abroad. The Israelis have been occupying that land for so long that most of the people who live there including the youth are born with the thinking that it is their country. It is impossible to tell their whole population to just pack up and leave. Sadly though, it seems even that solution is likely dead. Israels political lobbies in other influential countries exerts so much pressure on those governments to support "Israels" security and make it a bigger priority than even their own countries national security. 

 

If something is not done soon, Palestine will unfortunately become latest in a long line of people who have lost their homeland to western colonialists. 

 

(wasalam)

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 months later...
  • Banned

Not practical at all. Our efforts should be on getting Palestinians equal rights, ending discrimination, and ending the attacks on other nations (such as Lebanon). Israel will not be defeated. Palestine will not rise. We must do the best that we can with what we have.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...
  • Moderators

There is no practical solution given the current circumstances, i.e. a group of rabid extremist Zionists with an almost unlimited supply of wealth and political cover from Western Nations to do anything they want on the ground in terms of oppression of Palestinians. 

Once this group is out of the pictures (InShahAllah), it wouldn't be that difficult to set up a government that would give rights to all groups that have traditionally lived in Palestine, Muslims, Christians, and Jews. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Advanced Member

(bismillah)

 

(salam)

 

 

Once this group is out of the pictures (InShahAllah), it wouldn't be that difficult to set up a government that would give rights to all groups that have traditionally lived in Palestine, Muslims, Christians, and Jews.

 

That's almost as unlikely as Israel themselves giving equal rights to citizens. The various faces of Palestinian leadership, despite having few ressources, have still managed to either reduce themselves to puppets (Fatah) or traitors (Hamas) even with the little they have. Should they be given leadership of an entire sovereign state, I doubt they're going to reform themselves. 

 

Removing Israel is a serious challenge, but establishing a new governement will be equally as challenging. Egypt and Tunisia have are still struggling with it, and the signs from Syria show exactly what kind of scenario may play out should the various factions smell blood and the potential of leading a nation.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Moderators

Mahmood Abbas was placed there by the Zionists after the poisoning (now proven) of Yasir Arafat. So he is part of the same Zionist cadre. Abbas is the one who does the bidding of Israel, despite his occasional stunts and whining. He will find a way to sabotage the unity deal with Hamas and then we are back to square 1, with the Zionists free to grab more land. Because the Zionists are in complete control of Palestine, including West Bank and Gaza (they control Gaza by seige), noone can get into top positions in the Palestinian leadership without their consent. Hamas and Fatah play two characters that Zionists can push out on stage anytime they need to. Neither one is real leadership or represents the Palestinian interests.

They are both extensions of the Zionists. Don't be fooled by appearances.  

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 4 weeks later...
  • Veteran Member

Really, both Palestinians and many of the Israelis are closer to each other and other Mediterranean peoples genetically than either are related to Europeans. While the Israeli settlers tend to come from a European Jewish stock, the European Jews did not really breed very much with the European populations and as a result are more Middle Eastern than "white." While the Palestinians are very mixed, they are not quite as Arab as other groups and are largely descended from the Christian and Jewish inhabitants of Palestine from before the Arabs started migrating in addition to various Arab, Greek, Turkish, Armenian and Persian groups that migrated there between the seventh century and the present day. But both the Israelis and the Palestinians are from Hebraic, Canaanite and Samaritan stock.

 

Basically, with some exceptions, you can speak of the Palestinians and the Israelis practically as though they were the same race. Essentially, the Israelis ARE Palestinians genetically, but while the differences between Palestinians and Israelis is hardly genetic and much more cultural and religious, the only real solution I think is that rather than limiting the debate to simply a matter of who deserves the land based on 20th century ideas of connection between racial purity and nationalism, what is perhaps necessary is the creation or natural evolution of a cultural and national identity which possibly unites Israelis and Palestinians into a single community. This seems possible if Palestinians and Israelis begin mixing to a great extent, at which point either a cultural identity that is distinct to the borders of Israel and the Palestinian territories begins to emerge or both the Palestinians and Israelis gradually become part of a larger Levantine state which has been the aim of the Syrian and Lebanese nationalists for years.

 

I think the Israeli government is fully aware of this possibility though and seeks to create preventive measures that would prevent the Palestinians and Israelis from forming a single identity.

Edited by Saintly_Jinn23
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...