Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله
Sign in to follow this  
Little_Socrates

Ukraine Unrest [OFFICIAL THREAD]

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

No doubt there are russian forces that occupied Crimea, without an insignia. Their gear was top notch and brand new.

 

US president said it was ridiculous to suggest that it was not an invasion just because they lacked insignia on their uniforms.

 

The Russians responded by askng why the violent neo-nazis on Maidan and the terrorists that are invading Syria doesnt have a US insignia?

 

Anyway, it's no doubt an illegal move but luckily, the people of Crimea actually wanted to join Russia again. Nevertheless, it's still imperialistic.. Even if Russia many times happens to be the lesser of 2 evils I Think they will suffer alot diplomatically and in the Eyes of the people of the parts of the World where western media inform the nation and western NGO's dictate the policy. It'll be hard for them to remove the stain of having a reputation of performing old-school conquest I Think..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^

Uhhhhh, the ones wearing insignia are Ukrainian naval officers. 

 

All the Best,

David

 

Those are combat uniforms, genius. A lot of countries stopped using insignia on the combat uniforms because it takes away from the camo scheme. And then there are things like flag emblems that blend into the camo scheme. (The IRGC in Iran have these). In any case, insignia on combat uniforms is something that is being phased out at least in some part.

 

You are using nonsense logic.

 

If you want to make this into a picture contest, what about all the pictures all over the internets of people in Crimea posing with Russian troops: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=930_1393855797

 

How menacing.

 

Or the pictures of Russian flags hanging over apartment balconies pre-referendum.

 

Or, I dunno, THE RESULTS OF THE REFERENDUM. DUHHH

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello,

Those are combat uniforms, genius. A lot of countries stopped using insignia on the combat uniforms......

 

Nice to see you are back to your old self and name calling.  I was a bit worried about you.  Were you feeling a bit under the weather?  I hope you are feeling better.  

 

And, as far as "stopped using insignia" goes.  You are incorrect.  I can tell you were never in the military.  Else you would know what a foolish statement that is.

 

In fact, if you look closely, you can see the velcro patches on the "mystery" soldier's uniforms.  This is where their subdued identifying insignia normally goes.  

 

But, as you said, if you are going to rob a bank you don't wear a name tags.

 

All the Best,

David

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I honestly can't say who I think is on the right or wrong side of things.

 

Here are some of my thoughts that have been stimulated...

 

Why the conflict is between U.S. and Putin?

Has the Ukraine asked for anyone's help?

 

I find myself pondering the Russian issue...  Why have Russia and the west always been in opposition?
Has Russia oppressed its people?
Where do people find the least oppressed life?

Who should we support?

 

Why did communism in the USSR eliminate religion?

 

Islam says do not oppress, yet by its very nature, religion is oppressive... it declares that certain behaviors be restricted.  These restrictions depend on which Word of God we accept.  This is why people reject it(religion) as the governing rule of life imposed unilaterally on all people.  People must have free will to choose.  Religion must lead by example, not imposition.
 

My latest quote;

Only history can tell whether we have been on the right side of things. - C.Lynn

Edited by CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The west ALWAYS been opposed to the economical progress of Russia because of historical reasons.

 

Since the founding of Russia, it has faced opposition from western Europe.

Rome swiched capital to Constantinople (2nd Rome) and lost Italy to "barbarians" but the Empire continued until 1450 CE ("Rumi" came from the area whose name is a testimony to its history). The "Holy Roman Empire" and others founded in western Europe invoked the history of "Rome" for its own dynastic legitimacy while the historical Roman's still existed in todays Turkey (not until the 1800's did "Byzantium" become the name of the post-Rome Roman Empire in history books). Russia was founded partly by the Roman Caesar's private guard in Kiev and from day one they were culturally, politically and religiously related to the Eastern Roman Empire and the Russian Czar's (russian for Caesar) intermarried with the imperial family of Constantinople. So when Constantinople fell to the Ottoman Turks, the imperial throne of Constantinople was transfered to Moscow (3rd Rome).

 

Russia wants to establish a eurasian trade union that is outside the institutions of the west. If this were to succeed it would be a threat to the economies of the USA and the EU and the Russian's Believe that's the reason the west plans to have permanent bases in Afghanistan, Azerbaijan and missile's in Eastern Europe etc.

The west promised the russians that if they disbanded the Soviet Union they would not expand NATO on to the russian borders and eventually disband it.

 

Now the russians say that the west is lying because they're surrounding Russia with military bases but the west say they're paranoid. I Think the Ukraine "coup" was the Nail in the coffin; now there's no doubt in the russian mind that the west actually wants to surround them with military bases and that's why they felt the need to act, because if true, they would've lost their ancient naval base in the Black Sea.

Edited by Shamati

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello,

Nice to see you are back to your old self and name calling. I was a bit worried about you. Were you feeling a bit under the weather? I hope you are feeling better.

And, as far as "stopped using insignia" goes. You are incorrect. I can tell you were never in the military. Else you would know what a foolish statement that is.

In fact, if you look closely, you can see the velcro patches on the "mystery" soldier's uniforms. This is where their subdued identifying insignia normally goes.

But, as you said, if you are going to rob a bank you don't wear a name tags.

All the Best,

David

hey, he said you are genius, we, backward people, are not genius obviously only you.

it's quite surprising that people think the word "genius" as offensive word rather than complimentary word.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Insignia use is governed by law an treaty.

 

If I wear an old army jacket and it still has my patches on it, as long as it doesn't look like I am "in uniform" then this is passable.

 

If I wear a complete uniform, then I can have NO patches or markings on it unless I am in the unit so marked and lawfully a member of that branch of service.

 

That is why Crimea's "self-defense forces" do not have patches. It is illegal under internat'l  treaty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello,

 

 

 

That is why Crimea's "self-defense forces" do not have patches. It is illegal under internat'l  treaty.

 

Do you think anyone believes this?  First, it is a nonsensical explanation.  Second, their patches are removed because they are Russian soldiers.  And, Russian does not want the world seeing it's soldiers take over another country.  Bad PR don't ya know.

 

 

 

 

If I wear a complete uniform, then I can have NO patches or markings on it unless I am in the unit so marked and lawfully a member of that branch of service.

 

 

 

Even more nonsensical than the first sentence.  If you were not "in the unit so marked and lawfully a member" why would you be in uniform in the first place?  Better hit the international law books again.

 

And, in those international law books, for these "mystery" soldiers in Crimea,  I think you will find them classified as unlawful combatants.  Do a little research and let us know what you find.

 

All the Best,

David

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think Russia and US are against each other.

Russia has been under Zionist influence for quite some time.

The chances are low an anti imperialist got elected somehow( Putin) , has maintained power without being attacked by Zionist agents, and is single handedly removing Zionist influence from Russia. It's unlikely.

It seems more like a charade

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think Russia and US are against each other.

The chances are low an anti imperialist got elected somehow( Putin) , has maintained power without being attacked by Zionist agents, and is single handedly removing Zionist influence from Russia. It's unlikely.

It seems more like a charade

 

Interesting.  I share some of these thoughts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Found some info on those "invading Russian forces" that Yatsenyuck gets hysterical about.

 

There are 60,000 to 80,000 troops 50 km back from the border.

 

And since 12March14, Ukraine has been permitted security surveillance flights as permitted under a Russo-Ukrainian treaty. So these Suhois, Su-27 usually, fly over Russia.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Most of the Rukrainian Navy has switched sides.

Former members are being given 6000 in currency and three choices:

-leave mlty service all together,

-free trip to anywhere in Rukraine

-to enlist in the Russian armed services.

So many servicemen are discussing this with their wives and then decide.

Also: did you all see the wedding on the former Rukrainian Navy base. The ceremony had gotten to the toast as the Self-Defense Forces entered the navy base. You can see the BTRs driving in the background of the video. Everybody, officers included, are watching the wedding and ignoring the BTRs.

The only "storming" the bases I saw on videos were walk-ins.

So all this western hysteria  is  more like  Sturm und Drang Theatre.

Obama's next move? Maybe, send in the Light Brigade.?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

secrecy and deception is part of every warfare. It is in fact what landed the allied troops on the beaches of Normandy. The lack of Russian insignia is just that. And so is the behind the scenes actions of the West. 

David, lets move on from this kindergarten politics where dads are the strongest people in the world, media is truthful, politicians are moral, and governments are just. When in fact our world is quite the contrary.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello,

Do you really think "unidentified" armed soldiers backed by "unidentified" infantry fighting vehicles taking over a soveregn countries military bases and taking members of that military hostage is analogous to the Invasion of Normand?  I really doubt that you do.

All the Best,

David

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I never said they were equal for that goes on to the domain of perspectives and becomes subjective.. I said they both are technics of warfare. It is what it is.

 

Greetings Wahdat,

 

Then you've just asserted that Russia has begun (engaged in) warfare against Ukraine?

asalaam,

CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

More like it is a 'luke-warm' war between Russia and the US.

 

Greetings Wahdat,

 

Yes... with Ukraine as a pawn... however it is Russia that brought in the military to make them the pawn.  It seems to be Russia that is seeking to exert and extend its power and influence... flex its muscles, so to speak.  I wonder what is their end goal, and what that will look like for the world.

Edited by CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Greetings Wahdat,

 

Yes... with Ukraine as a pawn... however it is Russia that brought in the military to make them the pawn.  It seems to be Russia that is seeking to exert and extend its power and influence... flex its muscles, so to speak.  I wonder what is their end goal, and what that will look like for the world.

 

Lets not forget that Russia is on the defensive here. They have almost lost Ukraine for good.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lets not forget that Russia is on the defensive here. They have almost lost Ukraine for good.

Hmmmm,

 

I could have sworn Ukraine was a sovereign Nation.  

Edited by David66

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are no "sovereign nations" except for USA. An american should've known about that..

 

What did the americans Think about the Soviet's having missiles pointed at America in Cuba? They threatened worldwide warfare because of it.. For Russia, the Ukraine is no different.. Because everybody knows that the coup in Ukraine was done by the US government in order to be able to have Ukraine in NATO..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmmm,

 

I could have sworn Ukraine was a sovereign Nation.  

 

Thats is where you are wrong. Neither Ukraine or Syria today, nor Libya yesterday or Iraq the day before are/were sovereign countries. Sovereignty is the delicacy for a handful of countries.

Because Ms. Nuland would not have spoken as such if she was under the impression that Ukraine was a sovereign country. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello,

 

If you believe sovereignty to be a "delicacy" then I guess there is not much left for me to say.

 

But, speaking of delicacies, as I said before, Ukraine is like a piece of candy that has been dropped in the dirt on a playground and two kids are fighting over it.  One kid will win, and he will victoriously pop the piece of candy in his mouth.  As soon as the dirt encrusted piece of candy hits his tongue he will think, "why was a I fighting for this."

 

Enjoy your candy Putin.   ;)

 

All the Best,

David

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello,

 

If you believe sovereignty to be a "delicacy" then I guess there is not much left for me to say.

Its not what I believe as much as its how things really are out there. Did Senaor Mc Cain have a Syrian visa when he went to Syria? And if not, is that a sign of respect for Syrian sovereignty or otherwise?

Is Turkey respecting Syrian sovereingty when it lets thousands of terrorists pass into Syria? Was Libya's sovereignty respected when their entire system was eradicated by Western fire power and local stupid power?  Is Israel's on and off participation in Syrian war a showcase of respect for sovereignty? Is the American interference in the internal affairs of other countries under the guise of democratic argument respecting sovereignty? You are talking as if we are still 1950s. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When the Soviet Union collapsed, in 1991, the newly independent Ukraine had on its territory what was the third largest strategic nuclear weapons arsenal in the world. It was larger than those of Britain, France, and China combined. On June 1, 1996 Ukraine became a non-nuclear nation when it sent the last of its 1,900 strategic nuclear warheads to Russia for dismantling. The first shipment of nuclear weapons from Ukraine to Russia (by train) was in March 1994. In return for giving up its nuclear weapons, Ukraine, the United States of America, Russia, and the United Kingdom signed the 1994 Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances, pledging to respect Ukraine territorial integrity

Edited by CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 In return for giving up its nuclear weapons, Ukraine, the United States of America, Russia, and the United Kingdom signed the 1994 Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances, pledging to respect Ukraine territorial integrity

 

Salam CLynn

 

Would it not be better to say then by some s[Edited Out] of paper signed by the unfair who make up their own rules as they go along,

'Decency demands the respect to the territorial integrity of all nations '. 

No stealth(NSA) or wealth(throwing money and incentives into Ukraine)

No lies(WMD in Iraq) or anything else. 

Looks like no one is listening to these liars any more and none are being influenced by the cheer leaders(read Western Media) any more.

 

Peace

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...