Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله
Sign in to follow this  
CLynn

Allah - All Forgiving

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

'forgive as God forgives... as far as the east is from the west... your sins are remembered no more...'

 

Can muslims believe that God forgives this way?
I seem to have been told that Allah is all forgiving... does he forgive in this way?

32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.  (Ephesians 4:32)

12 As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.  (Psalm 103)

12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.  (Hebrews 8)

25 I, even I, am He that blotteth out thy transgressions for Mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins.  (Isaiah 43)

 

 

asalaam.

Edited by CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

By Allah and by his mercy, those who have repented have no sins.

 

Greetings PenofTruth,

 

The reason I ask is because, don't muslims believe that someone is keeping a record book of rights and wrongs for muslims to be judged by?

 

Salaam,

CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Greetings PenofTruth,

 

The reason I ask is because, don't muslims believe that someone is keeping a record book of rights and wrongs for muslims to be judged by?

 

Salaam,

CLynn

hello sibling in humanity,

Yes, but who said Allah's mercy does not remove things from that book?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well since your "god Jesus" "died" for (all of) your sins, past and future, and of all who believe him as "son-god" and go to the church on sundays, while we are accountable for our actions by God, being watched and having our deeds recorded and scrutinized, this is a moot discussion. Allow me to confess that on behalf of all the Shia Muslims. Happy?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

'forgive as God forgives... as far as the east is from the west... your sins are remembered no more...'

 

Can muslims believe that God forgives this way?

I seem to have been told that Allah is all forgiving... does he forgive in this way?

32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.  (Ephesians 4:32)

12 As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.  (Psalm 103)

12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.  (Hebrews 8)

25 I, even I, am He that blotteth out thy transgressions for Mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins.  (Isaiah 43)

 

 

Greetings Clynn

 

I hope that you don't believe that every sin and every sinner will be forgiven.

 

It simply does not make sense.

 

As far as Islam is concerned, God will forgive most sins but not all.

 

But no one can assume forgiveness. It will depend entirely on God's overall assessment of your performance.

 

 

[4:31] If you avoid the big sins which you have been forbidden, We will blot out all your faults, and We will let you enter Paradise honorably.

 

[4:110] Yet whosoever does evil or wrongs himself and then seeks God's pardon, will find God Forgiving, and Merciful.

 

[5:40] Do you not know that God is the one to Whom belongs the Kingdom of the heavens and the earth? He punishes whom He pleases and forgives whom He pleases, and God has power over all things.

 

[8:33] But God would not punish them while you were with them, nor would He punish them if they sought His pardon.

 

[20:82] Indeed I am forgiving to the one who repents, believes and does good and then remains guided.

 

[39:53] Say, O my servants, those who have transgressed against your souls, do not despair of God's mercy, for God forgives all sins. He is Gracious and Merciful!

 

[42:30] Whatever  misfortunes visit you are the consequence of your own hands. Yet He forgives most sins.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well since your "god Jesus" "died" for (all of) your sins, past and future, and of all who believe him as "son-god" and go to the church on sundays, while we are accountable for our actions by God, being watched and having our deeds recorded and scrutinized, this is a moot discussion. Allow me to confess that on behalf of all the Shia Muslims. Happy?

I'd rather hear it from other Shia Muslims for some reason.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Islam is a really practical religion. There are many components to a Repentance. Imam Ali (as) explains it:

 

Verily istighfar (Seeking God's forgiveness) is a degree of the ‘illiyyun and it is a word that means six things. First is remorse over the past. Second, the resolution not to return to it ever. Third, to return to the creatures their rights (usurped in the past) so that you meet God Almighty in such a state of purity that no one has a claim against you. Fourth, that you fulfill every duty that was neglected by you, in order to satisfy your obligation in respect of it. Fifth, that you attend to the flesh of your body that had grown on unlawful nourishment so that it melts away as a result of grief and mourning and the skin adheres to the bones, after which new flesh grows there between. Sixth, that you make your body taste the pain of obedience in the same way as it tasted earlier the pleasure of sinfulness. When you have done these things then say Astaghfirullah!

 

If only asking forgiveness was as easy as going to Sunday confession box.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are many components to a Repentance. Imam Ali (as)explains it:

 

Yes, in one word, repentance does mean undoing all the evil you have done, as far as practicable and ensuring that you have renounced that sin for ever.

If only asking forgiveness was as easy as going to Sunday confession box.

 

But there is hardly any need for such invidious comparisons. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd rather hear it from other Shia Muslims for some reason.

Well since your "god Jesus" "died" for (all of) your sins, past and future, and of all who believe him as "son-god" and go to the church on sundays, while we are accountable for our actions by God, being watched and having our deeds recorded and scrutinized, this is a moot discussion. Allow me to confess that on behalf of all the Shia Muslims. Happy?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Allah does not burden any human being with more than he can bear. Everyone will enjoy the credit of his deeds and suffer the debits of his evil-doings. The believers say: "Our Lord! Do not punish us if we forget or make a mistake. Our Lord! Do not place on us a burden as You placed on those before us. Our Lord! Lay not on us the kind of burden that we have no strength to bear. Pardon us, Forgive us, Have mercy on us. You are our Protector, help us against the unbelievers." [2:286, Shakir]

Say: If you love Allah, then follow me, Allah will love you and forgive you your faults, and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful [3:31]

These are the communications of Allah which We recite to you with truth, and Allah does not desire any injustice to the creatures. [3:108]

And those who when they commit an indecency or do injustice to their souls remember Allah and ask forgiveness for their faults-- and who forgives the faults but Allah, and (who) do not knowingly persist in what they have done. [3:135]

And repentance is not for those who go on doing evil deeds, until when death comes to one of them, he says: Surely now I repent; nor (for) those who die while they are unbelievers. These are they for whom We have prepared a painful chastisement. [4:18]

If you shun the great sins which you are forbidden, We will do away with your small sins and cause you to enter an honorable place of entering. [4:31]

Surely Allah does not do injustice to the weight of an atom, and if it is a good deed He multiplies it and gives from Himself a great reward. [4:40]

Surely Allah does not forgive that anything should be associated with Him, and forgives what is besides that to whomsoever He pleases; and whoever associates anything with Allah, he devises indeed a great sin. [4:48]

Surely (as for) those whom the angels cause to die while they are unjust to their souls, they shall say: In what state were you? They shall say: We were weak in the earth. They shall say: Was not Allah's earth spacious, so that you should have migrated therein? So these it is whose abode is hell, and it is an evil resort, except the weak from among the men and the children who have not in their power the means nor can they find a way (to escape); so these, it may be, Allah will pardon them, and Allah is Pardoning, Forgiving. [4:97-100]

And whoever does evil or acts unjustly to his soul, then asks forgiveness of Allah, he shall find Allah Forgiving, Merciful. [4:110]

Surely Allah does not forgive that anything should be associated with Him, and He forgives what is besides this to whom He pleases; and whoever associates anything with Allah, he indeed strays off into a remote error. [4:116]

Will they not then turn to Allah and ask His forgiveness? And Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. [5:74]

Know that Allah is severe in requiting (evil) and that Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. [5:98]

Say: To whom belongs what is in the heavens and the earth? Say: To Allah; He has ordained mercy on Himself; most certainly He will gather you on the resurrection day-- there is no doubt about it. (As for) those who have lost their souls, they will not believe. [6:12]

And do not approach the property of the orphan except in the best manner until he attains his maturity, and give full measure and weight with justice-- We do not impose on any soul a duty except to the extent of its ability; and when you speak, then be just though it be (against) a relative, and fulfill Allah's covenant; this He has enjoined you with that you may be mindful; [6:152]

Whoever brings a good deed, he shall have ten like it, and whoever brings an evil deed, he shall be recompensed only with the like of it, and they shall not be dealt with unjustly. [6:160]

And (as for) those who believe and do good We do not impose on any soul a duty except to the extent of its ability-- they are the dwellers of the garden; in it they shall abide. [7:42]

And do not make mischief in the earth after its reformation, and call on Him fearing and hoping; surely the mercy of Allah is nigh to those who do good (to others). [7:56]

And ordain for us good in this world's life and in the hereafter, for surely we turn to Thee. He said: (As for) My chastisement, I will afflict with it whom I please, and My mercy encompasses all things; so I will ordain it (specially) for those who guard (against evil) and pay the poor-rate, and those who believe in Our communications. [7:156]

And if Allah should hasten the evil to men as they desire the hastening on of good, their doom should certainly have been decreed for them; but We leave those alone who hope not for Our meeting in their inordinacy, blindly wandering on. [10:11]

Surely Allah does not do any injustice to men, but men are unjust to themselves. [10:44]

And keep up prayer in the two parts of the day and in the first hours of the night; surely good deeds take away evil deeds this is a reminder to the mindful. [11:114]

O my sons! Go and inquire respecting Yusuf and his brother, and despair not of Allah's mercy; surely none despairs of Allah's mercy except the unbelieving people. [12:87]

And when your Lord made it known: If you are grateful, I would certainly give to you more, and if you are ungrateful, My chastisement is truly severe. [14:7]

And if Allah had destroyed men for their iniquity, He would not leave on the earth a single creature, but He respites them till an appointed time; so when their doom will come they shall not be able to delay (it) an hour nor can they bring (it) on (before its time). [16:61]

Whoever does good whether male or female and he is a believer, We will most certainly make him live a happy life, and We will most certainly give them their reward for the best of what they did. [16:97]

Yet surely your Lord, with respect to those who do an evil in ignorance, then turn after that and make amends, most surely your Lord after that is Forgiving, Merciful. [16:119]

And We will set up a just balance on the day of resurrection, so no soul shall be dealt with unjustly in the least; and though there be the weight of a grain of mustard seed, (yet) will We bring it, and sufficient are We to take account. [21:47]

Surely those who believe and those who are Jews and the Sabeans and the Christians and the Magians and those who associate (others with Allah)-- surely Allah will decide between them on the day of resurrection; surely Allah is a witness over all things. [22:17]

And We do not lay on any soul a burden except to the extent of its ability, and with Us is a book which speaks the truth, and they shall not be dealt with unjustly. [23:62]

And they who do not call upon another god with Allah and do not slay the soul, which Allah has forbidden except in the requirements of justice, and (who) do not commit fornication and he who does this shall find a requital of sin; [25:68]

Whoever brings good, he shall have better than it, and whoever brings evil, those who do evil shall not be rewarded (for) aught except what they did. [28:84]

And were Allah to punish men for what they earn, He would not leave on the back of it any creature, but He respites them till an appointed term; so when their doom shall come, then surely Allah is Seeing with respect to His servants. [35:45]

Say: O my servants! who have acted extravagantly against their own souls, do not despair of the mercy of Allah; surely Allah forgives the faults altogether; surely He is the Forgiving the Merciful. [39:53]

Those who bear the power and those around Him celebrate the praise of their Lord and believe in Him and ask protection for those who believe: Our Lord! Thou embracest all things in mercy and knowledge, therefore grant protection to those who turn (to Thee) and follow Thy way, and save them from the punishment of the hell: [40:7]

And Allah judges with the truth; and those whom they call upon besides Him cannot judge aught; surely Allah is the Hearing, the Seeing. [40:20]

Whoever does good, it is for his own soul, and whoever does evil, it is against it; and your Lord is not in the least unjust to the servants. [41:46]

And whatever affliction befalls you, it is on account of what your hands have wrought, and (yet) He pardons most (of your faults). [42:30]

Those who keep aloof from the great sins and the indecencies but the passing idea; surely your Lord is liberal in forgiving. He knows you best when He brings you forth from the earth and when you are embryos in the wombs of your mothers; therefore do not attribute purity to your souls; He knows him best who guards (against evil). [53:32]

Surely your Lord knows that you pass in prayer nearly two-thirds of the night, and (sometimes) half of it, and (sometimes) a third of it, and (also) a party of those with you; and Allah measures the night and the day. He knows that you are not able to do it, so He has turned to you (mercifully), therefore read what is easy of the Quran. He knows that there must be among you sick, and others who travel in the land seeking of the bounty of Allah, and others who fight in Allah's way, therefore read as much of it as is easy (to you), and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate and offer to Allah a goodly gift, and whatever of good you send on beforehand for yourselves, you will find it with Allah; that is best and greatest in reward; and ask forgiveness of Allah; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. [73:20]

Certainly We created man in the best make.Then We render him the lowest of the low. Except those who believe and do good, so they shall have a reward never to be cut off. Then who can give you the lie after (this) about the judgment?Is not Allah the best of the Judges? [95:48]

 

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/234998642-mercy-and-justice-of-Allah-in-the-quran/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Allow me to confess that on behalf of all the Shia Muslims.  

 

I believe that all religions subscribe to the principle of accountability.

 

The idea of Jesus dying for sins is not understood by all Christians to mean that they have an irrevocable one-way ticket to heaven. May be some do see it that way but certainly not all.

 

Whether you are a Christian, a Muslim, a Hindu or whatever, from plain common sense, the view simply makes no sense.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Islam is a really practical religion. There are many components to a Repentance. Imam Ali (as) explains it:

 

Verily istighfar (Seeking God's forgiveness) is a degree of the ‘illiyyun and it is a word that means six things.

First is remorse over the past.

 

Check - confession

 

Second, the resolution not to return to it ever.

 

Check - repentance

 

Third, to return to the creatures their rights (usurped in the past) so that you meet God Almighty in such a state of purity that no one has a claim against you. Fourth, that you fulfill every duty that was neglected by you, in order to satisfy your obligation in respect of it.

 

Check - this put me in mind of the following words of Yshwe(Jesus)

              23 “Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, 24 leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift.

 

Fifth, that you attend to the flesh of your body that had grown on unlawful nourishment so that it melts away as a result of grief and mourning and the skin adheres to the bones, after which new flesh grows there between.

 

Don't know about that one

 

Sixth, that you make your body taste the pain of obedience in the same way as it tasted earlier the pleasure of sinfulness. When you have done these things then say Astaghfirullah!

 

Check - except I don't agree with the tasting of the 'pain' of obedience, but rather the pleasure of the freedom that comes with obedience... the freedom from the chains of sin... freedom from the bondage of sin is a joy.... becoming a 'slave' to God... whose burden is easy and whose yoke is light...

                 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light ( the Word of Yshwe)

 

rather than being a slave to sin which is a weight that takes us down.

 

Salaam and blessings. :)

The believers say: "Our Lord! Do not punish us if we forget or make a mistake. Our Lord! Do not place on us a burden as You placed on those before us. Our Lord! Lay not on us the kind of burden that we have no strength to bear. Pardon us, Forgive us, Have mercy on us. You are our Protector, help us against the unbelievers." [2:286, Shakir]

 

Greetings Haydar Husayn,

 

The only thing that always bothers me about this is...

who does a muslim define as an unbeliever?

If all muslims had one definition and I knew what that definition was....

 

Now I must read the rest of your long reply.  No disrespect meant here.  I just wanted to reply to that while it was on my mind and while I still have the time.  It is one of the things which comes up often for me in trying to determine the possibilities of peaceful relationship with muslims.

 

Salaam,

CLynn

I believe that all religions subscribe to the principle of accountability.

 

The idea of Jesus dying for sins is not understood by all Christians to mean that they have an irrevocable one-way ticket to heaven. May be some do see it that way but certainly not all.

 

Greetings PeaceLoving,

 

You are correct... the true follower of Yshwe(Jesus) knows that belief in Him means a turning from ones sinful ways... If one does not turn from their sinful ways they can not claim to be a true follower of Christ... thus His words;

 

20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. (book of Matthew, words of Christ)

 

14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.  (book of John, words of Christ)

 

46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

44 For every tree is known by his own fruit.  (book of Luke, words of Christ)

 

Salaam and blessings to you, :)

CLynn

Edited by CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Whether you are a Christian, a Muslim, a Hindu or whatever, from plain common sense, the view simply makes no sense.

 

Greetings PeaceLoving,

 

I don't know that any of us tries to claim full understanding of how it works... how can we...

'for now we see only as in a glass darkly'

we do not see in full.

We only know that we believe in the words of the One who died and was resurrected... and He says that we are saved by our belief on Him.

We do not know all of how this works,

but we know that we are drawn to Love and obedience through His sacrifice.

 

Salaam and blessings,

CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The only thing that always bothers me about this is.....who does a Muslim define as an unbeliever?

 

Greetings Clynn

 

The words 'believer' and 'unbeliever' are not absolute words. They are relative to the context they are spoken in.

 

For example, you and I and most of us are 'unbelievers' as far as 'fairies' or 'leprechauns' go.

 

However, while Muslims, Christians and Jews are all believers as far as belief in God goes, Muslims and Jews are unbelievers in the matter of the divinity of Jesus. 

 

Similarly, Christians and Jews may be unbelievers in the prophethood of Muhammad.

 

Considering that there is a lot of praise for both Jews and especially for Christians, they are not unbelievers in the absolute sense of the word.

 

But we are all unbelievers in some sense or another.

 

Also, please note that when the Quran praises or censures any group of people, it does not imply every member of that group everywhere in the world.

 

I hope you understand what I am trying to say. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Peace, 

I will try to explain who disbelievers are (with help of Allah) since I myself was confused and most other people are also same since we don't understand Arabic that well. 

The arabic word use for disbelievers is Kafiroon. Kafir is someone who covers up truth (the important thing here is that he knows the truth but then he covers it up). So he disbelieves in Allah's message, laws, books, hell/heaven, after they had been made clear to them. An example would be Pharaoh who saw all the signs of Allah yet he denied. Christians, Jews are Ahlul Kitab (people of book).

Anyone can correct me if i am wrong (hopefully Allah forgives me if I made an error explaining).  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We only know that we believe in the words of the One who died and was resurrected... and He says that we are saved by our belief on Him.

 

Sorry, I cannot accept that.

 

The belief does not make any logical sense.

 

Only a very unjust God will forgive a Christian such as Hitler just because he was a Christian.

 

God may forgive anyone but not because of his being a Christian or Muslim or Jew or whatever. 

 

Belief without deeds is meaningless.

 An example would be Pharaoh who saw all the signs of Allah yet he denied. Christians, Jews are Ahlul Kitab (people of book).

 

You are quite right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe that all religions subscribe to the principle of accountability.

 

The idea of Jesus dying for sins is not understood by all Christians to mean that they have an irrevocable one-way ticket to heaven. May be some do see it that way but certainly not all.

 

Whether you are a Christian, a Muslim, a Hindu or whatever, from plain common sense, the view simply makes no sense.

 all religions do not make sense , it is business to get the sheep into a state that maximises the return of the controllers .(:Islam is not a religion )

they (your masters) are the representatives of God ( god being :Iblees) .

For the Christians , all they have to do is believe that Jesus ( not :Isa (as) ) has died for their sins and bingo , it's done , a ticket to heaven ( :Iblees heaven ) .

Same for so called muslims , hindus , jews etc .

same doctrines with different branding.

Much like the airlines industry , you think emirates is Muslim because they serve halal food and their hostess wear a thin veil as uniform ?

they are all the same as the aviation industry  that regulates all airlines uses the same system  , it must be , all the various airlines do is attach a particular branding, style  and logos etc to cater for their market .

same for banking , courts , governments , and religion.

Edited by :Sami II

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well since your "god Jesus" "died" for (all of) your sins, past and future, and of all who believe him as "son-god" and go to the church on sundays, while we are accountable for our actions by God, being watched and having our deeds recorded and scrutinized, this is a moot discussion. Allow me to confess that on behalf of all the Shia Muslims. Happy?

Nice job Sami two, I thought you knew me better.

Don't you get annoyed when someone "tells" you what you are supposed to believe?

 

For the Christians , all they have to do is believe that Jesus ( not :Isa (as) ) has died for their sins and bingo , it's done , a ticket to heaven ( :Iblees heaven

 

Cynical much? Christians only have to wear oversized gawdy crosses and say "Jesus saves" when asked, then Blingo their bling cross works like a key. Only command is slam the door fast before the sarcastic and cynical ones try to slip thru.

Sounds better than your version ;)

Edited by Son of Placid

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry, I cannot accept that.

 

The belief does not make any logical sense.

 

Only a very unjust God will forgive a Christian such as Hitler just because he was a Christian.

 

God may forgive anyone but not because of his being a Christian or Muslim or Jew or whatever. 

 

Belief without deeds is meaningless.

 

Greetings PeaceLoving,

 

I feel that you did not read and take the time to comprehend anything that I wrote.

Do you really think Hitler ever, at any point, could be a follower of Yshwe?

My whole post wrote about how one is not a true follower unless one changes their ways...

"they are known by their fruits"

Did you completely miss my post #18?

 

Agreed - "faith without works is dead" ... but works without faith is just as dead.

Why do people think they can assign the logic of man to a superior God?  The concept of God itself defies all logic of man as the Creator is something other... something supernatural... beyond man's understanding.

 

Salaam,

CLynn

 

For the Christians , all they have to do is believe that Jesus ( not :Isa (as) ) has died for their sins and bingo , it's done , a ticket to heaven ( :Iblees heaven ) .

 

Greetings Sami,

 

You seem to have missed post #18 also. :)

 

Salaam,

Clynn

Edited by CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Did you completely miss my post #18?

 

Greetings Clynn

 

I did read what you said in post #18 but I was responding to your post #20.

 

This is what you said in post #20.

 

 He says that we are saved by our belief on Him.

 

What you said in #20 implies that belief in  Jesus will save you.

 

This means that people of other religions will nit be saved because they don't believe in Jesus.

 

And I cannot accept that. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice job Sami two, I thought you knew me better.

Don't you get annoyed when someone "tells" you what you are supposed to believe?

 

Cynical much? Christians only have to wear oversized gawdy crosses and say "Jesus saves" when asked, then Blingo their bling cross works like a key. Only command is slam the door fast before the sarcastic and cynical ones try to slip thru.

Sounds better than your version ;)

and what about the muslims that want  in so they may have 72 virgins 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This means that people of other religions will nit be saved because they don't believe in Jesus.

 

And I cannot accept that. 

 

Greetings PeaceLoving,

 

Ah, I see.

If you put this in the context of the rest of what I said...

" we know that we are drawn to Love and obedience through His sacrifice."

 

I was meaning that, those who do believe in Yshwe, are saved by their belief in Him because they are drawn to Love and obedience through the great appreciation of this sacrifice of God made on our behalf.

It is a thing which we may not understand the workings of in full, but we do know, that when we accept the words of Yshwe and come to understand this sacrifice, we can not help but return love and devotion.

 

'What greater love than this, but than one lay down His life for another'?

We have been, 'bought with the blood of Christ'

and

'who then would trample under foot the blood of Christ'?

 

I do believe all will come one day to believe in Yshwe and His Word.  He is the Way, the Truth, and the Light.

This does not mean that I think all others are condemned to an eternity of hell-fire.  I guess I leave the questions open ended.  I do not know how the Creator brings to Himself.  I just believe that those of us who believe in Christ will, as Christ tells us, go with Him to the Father, and that is where I feel is the best place, and the place I want to go.  I want to go with Yshwe. :)

 

Salaam and blessings to you,

CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Greetings PeaceLoving,

 

I feel that you did not read and take the time to comprehend anything that I wrote.

Do you really think Hitler ever, at any point, could be a follower of Yshwe?

My whole post wrote about how one is not a true follower unless one changes their ways...

"they are known by their fruits"

Did you completely miss my post #18?

 

Agreed - "faith without works is dead" ... but works without faith is just as dead.

Why do people think they can assign the logic of man to a superior God?  The concept of God itself defies all logic of man as the Creator is something other... something supernatural... beyond man's understanding.

 

Salaam,

CLynn

 

 

Greetings Sami,

 

You seem to have missed post #18 also. :)

 

Salaam,

Clynn

greetings Clynn , 

I didn't realise till now our posts are numbered .

:Allah swt must be so forgiving that we have such opportunities to  discuss such topics .

the real question is are we forgiving ?

can we forgive our fellow humankind and can we forgive ourselves ?

 

peace and blessings .

Edited by :Sami II

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He is the Way, the Truth, and the Light.

 

Greetings Clynn

 

As the Quran says  -  'To you, your faith and to me mine' [97:6]

 

I just believe that those of us who believe in Christ will, as Christ tells us, go with Him to the Father.

 

Once again, that statement is deceptive.

 

It seems to indicate that those who do not believe in Christ will not go to the Father.

 

So I m sorry to say that if Christians do seriously accept the proposition that non-Christians will also go to the Father, your above statement makes very little sense.

Edited by PeaceLoving

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Greetings Clynn

 

As the Quran says  -  'To you, your faith and to me mine' [97:6]

 

*like  :)

 

It seems to indicate that those who do not believe in Christ will not go to the Father.

 

Greetings PeaceLoving,

 

I guess what I am saying is that I keep an open mind.  A part of me believes we will have many chances to come to know and accept the Truth of Yshwe.

I guess I believe that we will go to the one we believe in.

Yshwe is the one I want to go to.

 

Salaam and blessings,

CLynn

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...