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In the Name of God بسم الله
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Grief

The Lord's Prayer And Al-Fatiha

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(bismillah)

 

(salam)

 

http://www.shiasource.com/al-mizan/tafsir/1-6-7/

 

I was just looking throught the Tafseer and I saw that Allama Tabataba'i wrote about the Lord's Prayer as well, so I thought it might be of interest for some of our Christian brothers and sisters to see our perspective on the prayer when compared to Al-Fatiha.

 

Here is a small exerpt from the link:

 

ar-Rida (a.s.) narrates through his forefathers from Amiral al-mu'minin (a.s.) that he said: "I heard the Apostle of Allah saying: 'Allah, Mighty and Great is He, has said: "I have divide the Opening of the Book between Myself and My servant; so, half is for Me and the (other) half is for My servant. And My servant shall get what he asks for." When the servant says: In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful, Allah, Great is His Glory, says: "My servant has started with My name, an it is incumbent upon Me that I should complete his works him and bless him in his affairs." And when he says: All praise is due to Allah, the Lord of the worlds, Allah, Great is His Glory says: "My servant has Praised Me, and he knows that the bounties that are with him are from Me, and that the misfortunate that have been averted from him were so averted by My grace; (O My angels!) I appoint You as My witnesses that I shall add for him the favors of the next world to those of this world, and will avert from him the calamities of the next world as I have averted from him the calamities of this world." And when he says, The Beneficent, the Merciful, Allah, Great is His Glory, says: "My servant bore witness for Me that I am the Beneficent, the MercifuI; I make you My witness that I will most surely augment his share in My mercy, and I will most certainly increase his portion My bounties." And when he says, The Master of the Day of Judgment, Allah, the High, says: "I make you My witness that, as he has acknowledged that I am the Master of the Day of Judgment I will most certainly make his reckoning easier (for him) on the Day of Reckoning, and I will most certainly accept his good deed and look over his sins." And when he says: Thee do we worship, Allah, Mighty and Great is He, says: "My servant is telling truth, He worships Me only. Be My witness that I will most surely give him for his worship a reward that will be the (object of) envy to all who opposed him when he worshipped Me." And when he says, and Thee do we beseech for help, Allah, the High, says: "From Me has My servant sought help, and in Me has he taken refuge. Be My witness that I will most certainly help him in his affairs, and will aid him in his difficulties, and will take his hand in his calamities." And when he says, Guide us to the eight path..., Allah, Mighty and Great is He, says: "This (part) is for My servant, and My servant shall have what he asks for; and I have answered (the prayer of) My servant, and have given him what he hopes for and have protected him from what he is afraid of." '" ('Uyunul-akhbar).

 

The author says: as-Saduq has narrated in 'Ilalu 'sh-shara'i', an almost similar tradition from ar-Rida (a.s.). The tradition explains the chapter of The Opening in the frame of the daily prayer. It further confirms the previously mentioned fact that this divine revelation has been sent, as though on behalf of the servants of Allah, to teach them the manners of servitude; to show them how to praise their Lord and how to declare their allegiance to Him. It is a chapter made especially for the purpose of worship; and no other chapter comes near to it in this respect. For example:

 

1. The entire chapter is a divine speech, revealed on behalf of His servant, so that he may recite it when he stands to worship his Lord.

 

2. It is divided in two parts: one for Allah and the other for the servant.

 

3. It contains, in spite of its brevity, all the Qur'anic wisdom. The Qur'an is a vast treasure of fundamental truths, moral values and the most comprehensive shari'ahwhich consists of the rules of worship and mutual dealings, as well as the penal and civil codes. Further it is a valuable mine of divine promises and threats, stories of previous peoples as well as parables and moral lessons. But, in spite of this wide scope, all its teachings may be returned to four fundamental truths: the Oneness of God, the prophethood, the resurrection (with all its details) and the guidance of mankind to its bliss in this world as well as in the next. Needless to reiterate that this chapter contains all these basic realities in these very short, and at the same time very eloquent, sentence.

 

It will not be out of place to compare the beauty, glory and spirituality of this chapter, used in the Muslims' prayers, with the Lord's prayer, used by the Christians in their prayer:

 

Our Father which art in heaven Hallowed be thy name.

 

Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth as it is in heaven.

 

Give us this day our daily bread.

 

And forgive us our debts as we forgive our debtors.

 

And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever.

 

Amen.

 

(Matthews 6:9-13)

 

Ponder deeply on the teachings contained in these sentences, supposed to be of divine revelation, and see what manners of servitude does this prayer teach. First it tells them that their Father (i.e. God, in their terminology) is in heaven. Then it prays about the Father that His name be hallowed, His kingdom come and His will be done in earth as it is in heaven. The question is: Who will fulfill these wishes which look more like political slogans than spiritual invocation. Then it makes them ask for their daily bread, and for His forgiveness in lieu of their forgiveness - that He should waive His rights as they have waived theirs. But what right do they possess except that which they have been given by God Himself? Then they beseech Him not to lead them into temptation but to deliver them from evil. This is asking for impossible, because this world is the place appointed for our test and trial, so that we may acquire spiritual perfection. Would not salvation lose its meaning, if there was no test and trial?

And yet some orientalists have temerity to write: "Islam does not have any superiority over other religions, so far as spiritual knowledge is concerned, because all divine religions invite the men to the belief in one God, and ask them to purify themselves by good character and virtuous deeds. The religions excel one another only in deep-rootedness of their social fruits."

 

Other Traditions

 

It is narrated in Man la yahduruhu'l-faqih and at-Tafsirof al-'Ayyashi that as-Sadiq (a.s.) said: "The straight path is Amiru'l-mu'minin (a.s.)."

as-Sadiq (a.s.) said: "(The Straight path) is the path to the knowledge of Allah. And there are two paths, one in this world and the other in the next. As for the path in this world, it is the Imam whose obedience is obligatory; whosoever knows him in this world and follows his guidance, he shall proceed on the path which is the bridge over the hell in the next world; and whosoever does not know him in this world, his foot shall slip (over that bridge) in the next world, and he shall fall down into the fire of the hell." (Ma'ani 'l-akhbar)

 

The same book quotes as-Sajad (a.s-) as saying: "There no curtain between Allah and His proof, nor is there any screen for Allah against His proof. We are the gates of Allah, and we are the straight path, and we are the (treasure) chest of His Knowledge, and we are, the interpreters of His revelation, and we are the pillars of His Oneness, and we are the place of His secret."

 

Ibn Shahrashub has quoted from at-Tafsir of Waki' Ibn al-Jarrah from ath-Thawri from as-Suddi from Asbat and Mujahid from ibn 'Abbas that he said about the verse: Guide us to the straight path:"Say O group of the servants (of Allah): Lead us to the love of Muhammad (s.a.w.) and his family members."

 

The author says: There are other traditions of the same meaning. Such traditions are based on the "flow" of the Qur'an, that is, application of the Qur'an wherever it is applicable. It should be noted that the term, "flow" - and it will often be used in this book - has been taken from the traditions of the Imams of Ahlul-bayt (a.s.):

 

al-Fudayl ibn Yasar said: "I asked Abu Ja'far (a.s.) about the tradition, 'There is no verse in the Qur'an but it has an exterior and an interior, and there is no word in it but it has a boundary, and every boundary has a watching place.' (I asked him) what was the meaning of exterior and interior. The Imam said: 'Its exterior is its revelation and its interior is its interpretation; some of it has already passed (i.e. happened) and some of it has not come about yet; it runs along (or flows) as run the sun and the moon; when a thing of it comes (to its appointed place and time) it happens... (at-Tafsir, of al-'Ayyashi)

 

(wasalam)

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(bismillah)

 

(salam)

 

ar-Rida (a.s.) narrates through his forefathers from Amiral al-mu'minin (a.s.) that he said: "I heard the Apostle of Allah saying: 'Allah, Mighty and Great is He, has said: "I have divide the Opening of the Book between Myself and My servant; so, half is for Me and the (other) half is for My servant. And My servant shall get what he asks for." When the servant says: In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful, Allah, Great is His Glory, says: "My servant has started with My name, an it is incumbent upon Me that I should complete his works him and bless him in his affairs." And when he says: All praise is due to Allah, the Lord of the worlds, Allah, Great is His Glory says: "My servant has Praised Me, and he knows that the bounties that are with him are from Me, and that the misfortunes that have been averted from him were averted by My grace; (O My angels!) I appoint You as My witnesses that I shall add for him the favors of the next world to those of this world, and will avert from him the calamities of the next world as I have averted from him the calamities of this world." And when he says, The Beneficent, the Merciful, Allah, Great is His Glory, says: "My servant bore witness for Me that I am the Beneficent, the MercifuI; I make you My witness that I will most surely augment his share in My mercy, and I will most certainly increase his portion My bounties." And when he says, The Master of the Day of Judgment, Allah, the High, says: "I make you My witness that, as he has acknowledged that I am the Master of the Day of Judgment I will most certainly make his reckoning easier (for him) on the Day of Reckoning, and I will most certainly accept his good deed and look over his sins." And when he says: Thee do we worship, Allah, Mighty and Great is He, says: "My servant is telling truth, He worships Me only. Be My witness that I will most surely give him for his worship a reward that will be the (object of) envy to all who opposed him when he worshiped Me." And when he says, and Thee do we beseech for help, Allah, the High, says: "From Me has My servant sought help, and in Me has he taken refuge. Be My witness that I will most certainly help him in his affairs, and will aid him in his difficulties, and will take his hand in his calamities." And when he says, Guide us to the eight path..., Allah, Mighty and Great is He, says: "This (part) is for My servant, and My servant shall have what he asks for; and I have answered (the prayer of) My servant, and have given him what he hopes for and have protected him from what he is afraid of." '" ('Uyunul-akhbar).

 

 

The person who has opened this thread should have indicated very clearly who the author of the article was and who gave the commentary on the Lord's prayer.  Imam Rida (as) has certainly nothing to do either with the article or with the commentary on the Lord's prayer. The opening post is not very clear on this and is indeed quite clumsy.

 

The first paragraph which I have cut above appears to have been quoted from a book called Uyunul-akhbar. This book claims to have reported the above piece from Imam Rida (as). But beyond this one paragraph, the rest of the post has nothing to do with Imam Rida (as).

 

The second paragraph which begins with the words 'the author says' quotes from a historian by the name of as-Saduq. But it still does not clarify who the 'author' of the article is. The part beginning with the words 'Ponder' and which contains the actual comparison with the Lord's prayer is also by the author of the article and once again, has nothing to do with our Imam.

 

Nothing beyond the first paragraph, which I have cut and placed above, has anything to do with our noble Imam Rida (as).

 

I realize that it may not have been very clear to you that ar-Rida (as) was the name of one of our holy Imams and I believe it was not your intention to be disrespectful. I also accept that the opening post has not been written very professionally but I would strongly urge you to speak with respect about our Imams.

 

I believe your choice of words and style was not quite appropriate to the sanctity of our Imams. If you find a piece that is alleged to be from our Holy Prophet or one of our Imams, it would best to comment on it with care, if it does not meet with your palette. Criticism is certainly acceptable as long as it meets with the usual norms of social discourse, as applicable to the status of the personages involved.

 

By the way, in Shia writings, the suffix '(as)' or ('a.s.)' after a name denotes someone held in very high esteem. 

 

I am sure you are aware that we hold all our twelve Imams very dearly.

 

No offence intended !   

 

Our Father which art in heaven Hallowed be thy name.

Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth as it is in heaven

Give us this day our daily bread And forgive us our debts as we forgive our debtors

And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil:

For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever.

 

My post was in reference to the comment in the opening post on the Lord's prayer.   

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The person who has opened this thread should have indicated very clearly who the author of the article was and who gave the commentary on the Lord's prayer.  Imam Rida (as) has certainly nothing to do either with the article or with the commentary on the Lord's prayer. The opening post is not very clear on this and is indeed quite clumsy.

 

 

The first paragraph which I have cut above appears to have been quoted from a book called Uyunul-akhbar. This book claims to have reported the above piece from Imam Rida (as). But beyond this one paragraph, the rest of the post has nothing to do with Imam Rida (as).

 

 

The second paragraph which begins with the words 'the author says' quotes from a historian by the name of as-Saduq. But it still does not clarify who the 'author' of the article is. The part beginning with the words 'Ponder' and which contains the actual comparison with the Lord's prayer is also by the author of the article and once again, has nothing to do with our Imam.

 

 

Nothing beyond the first paragraph, which I have cut and placed above, has anything to do with our noble Imam Rida (as).

 

 

I realize that it may not have been very clear to you that ar-Rida (as) was the name of one of our holy Imams and I believe it was not your intention to be disrespectful. I also accept that the opening post has not been written very professionally but I would strongly urge you to speak with respect about our Imams.

 

 

I believe your choice of words and style was not quite appropriate to the sanctity of our Imams. If you find a piece that is alleged to be from our Holy Prophet or one of our Imams, it would best to comment on it with care, if it does not meet with your palette. Criticism is certainly acceptable as long as it meets with the usual norms of social discourse, as applicable to the status of the personages involved.

 

 

By the way, in Shia writings, the suffix '(as)' or ('a.s.)' after a name denotes someone held in very high esteem. 

 

 

I am sure you are aware that we hold all our twelve Imams very dearly.

 

 

No offence intended !   

 

 

My post was in reference to the comment in the opening post on the Lord's prayer.   

 

Had no idea the mess I was responding to. Please remove Ar-Rida from my post, replace it with the OP until the author is known.

Sorry if I rattled you.

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'and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against'
and I ask that I may be forgiven, even as I follow your example to forgive.

'and lead us not into temptation but deliver us from evil'
Lord I pray not to be led into temptation, and with Your help, to avoid to do any evil.

Yes, this world is a test and this is why we pray to God to deliver us from evil... i.e., help us to pass this test.  What other chance do we have of success?

 

Yahshua tells us to turn to the Father, the Creator of all, for His care, His strength, and His guidance... to help us to be more like Him.

Edited by CLynn

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(bismillah)

 

(salam)

 

I'm sorry for any misinterpretation that may have occurred, but I believe that my opening post was made very clear in its intention and content. Had the individual responding to the post have clicked the link or read the text preceeding the excerpt, he would have known exactly what I was talking about and who the author was.

 

Either way, I'm sorry for the confusion.

 

(wasalam)

Edited by BuggyLemon

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This individual...asks sincere apologies for the mix up. post deleted, thankful not booted.

 

Al-Mizan, I should have known, :blush:

Allamah Muhammad Hussein Tabatabai does not like Christians.

Not true him and henry corbin and Prof hussayn nasr use to have closed sessions on comparative mysticism sometimes they would even discuss the gospel of john if i am not mistaking. . 

Edited by Maitham

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This individual...asks sincere apologies for the mix up. post deleted, thankful not booted.

 

Al-Mizan, I should have known, :blush:

Allamah Muhammad Hussein Tabatabai does not like Christians.

 

(bismillah)

 

(salam)

 

Upon re-reading of my post above, I realize that it may have seemed affronting and for that, I ask for your forgiveness as I did not mean to be rude by referring to you in the third person.

 

I understand your qualms with Allamah Tabatabai's views and I believe that I would feel the same way if I was in your place. Your questions and comments were justified considering your position and I am sorry if my posting of the Tafseer caused you any offence. Unfortunately, I do not have time to reply to many of the points brought up, but I hope that things are resolved and if not, respectfully disagreed upon sooner or later.

 

You are very humble to have apologized to those you may have offended from your mistakenly worded post and I commend you for that quality of yours.

 

May God bless you.

 

(wasalam)

Edited by BuggyLemon

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Kind words, thank you.

I read up on some of Ar-Rida's  advise and beliefs and felt worse.

 

(bismillah)

 

(salam)

 

It was unintentional use of the name without knowing the personality behind it. You did not intend to be malicious or anything, so no harm done.

 

(wasalam)

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