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In the Name of God بسم الله

About Ya Ali (As) Madad

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Ya Allah madad. No, I am not a wahabi....

salam Alaikum:   bismillah       Quran Summary (no contradictions):     و إ ذا سألك عبادي عني فإني قريب أجيب دعوة الداع إذا دعان فليستجيبوا لي وليؤمنوا بي لعلهم يرشدون  2:186   إنك سميع الدعاء  3:38  

lanatualah alai wahabion

thanks brother mutazili(wasil)

 

i strive and hope to be among the shias in sha Allah.

 

thank you for your kind words brother,

 

 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ  :wub: 

 

 

fi aman ilah 
 

(wasalam)


Brother, I enjoyed how you  totally ignorred eveything and just copied what you wished out of context.

 

Look, we won't agree. And as you can go to page 1 and see, I created this thread for something else. Not to argue on the permissability of Ya Ali Madad.

 

Salam

 

Brother the reason i ignored some, is because i don't like delving too much into falsehood.

 

you want a bit more?

 

 

 

Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has kept some of the jurisdictions in His hand

 

again outrageous comments, may Allah forgive and guide us all!!!

 

what about 

 

lahu ma fi samawaat wal ard?

 

what about 

 

la hawla walaqowata ila bilah "There is no might nor power except in Allah."

 

 

there is not point in discussing any further about posts that are purely some peoples opinions, without any backup.

 

 

claiming that Allah only has some jurisdiction, means he is having some partner (sharikto share his jurisdiction with or? isn't that pure and utter shirq??

 

 

 

in all due respect it is our duty to point out falsehood according to Quran and Ahlul Bayt, without anger, but with evidence and logic based on evidence. 

 

 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ   :wub: 

 

 

fi aman ilah 
 

(wasalam)

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thanks brother mutazili(wasil)

 

i strive and hope to be among the shias in sha Allah.

 

thank you for your kind words brother,

 

 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ  :wub: 

 

 

fi aman ilah 
 

(wasalam)

 

Brother the reason i ignored some, is because i don't like delving too much into falsehood.

 

you want a bit more?

 

 

again outrageous comments, may Allah forgive and guide us all!!!

 

what about 

 

lahu ma fi samawaat wal ard?

 

what about 

 

la hawla walaqowata ila bilah "There is no might nor power except in Allah."

 

 

there is not point in discussing any further about posts that are purely some peoples opinions, without any backup.

 

 

claiming that Allah only has some jurisdiction, means he is having some partner (sharikto share his jurisdiction with or? isn't that pure and utter shirq??

 

 

 

in all due respect it is our duty to point out falsehood according to Quran and Ahlul Bayt, without anger, but with evidence and logic based on evidence. 

 

 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ   :wub: 

 

 

fi aman ilah 
 

(wasalam)

Please, qoute the whole thing and highlight that which you have a problem with

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The Meaning of YA ALI  (as) MADAD A few things should be made clear upon you:

1. Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has bestowed the highest status upon: the Holy Prophet of Islam, all other Prophets (Peace Be Upon Them), Imam Ali  (as), and the rest of the infallibles  (as). Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has bestowed upon them the highest jurisdictions and in this there is no doubt amongst any of the Shia and there should not be any doubt. The details of these jurisdictions and explanations of the fixing of the boundaries are above the intellectual understanding of any normal person. However, the infallibles  (as) in some of the traditions have indicated towards this meaning, so in the truth of the Ahlul Bait  (as), we should not get entangled in disbelief or claims of deficiency and defectiveness of the Ahlul Bait  (as), and neither in the greatness (nature, power) of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì Almighty. We should not unnecessarily transgress and pass the prescribed limits.

2. Those personalities (entities) which we have mentioned above are the selected people of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì. That honor which they have obtained has only been obtained with the devotion of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì.

3. (4) Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has kept some of the jurisdictions in His hand and has not consigned these to anybody else other than Himself. In this, there is life and death, creation and demission, and rizq.

4. If somebody himself says that those things which have been mentioned before are not in the hands of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì, then he implies that we have retired Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì Almighty (Astagh Firullah). One should remember that the creator of these personalities (entities) is only Him. The creator of the (1) master of the universe Imam Ali  (as) and the creator of the milk in the chest of his blessed and purified mother was only Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì Almighty. May it be known that Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has never retired nor shall He ever retire!

5. (2) Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has ordered us that we seek our needs from the aforementioned entities, that we ask for our needs from Him, and that we give for the sake of those infallibles. When we all say YA ALI  (as) MADAD, this does not proclaim the belief of any Muslim that Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has retired (Astagh Firullah) or that Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has become old (Al Ayaazo Billah) or that someone has deprived Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì from him His jurisdictions through elections or an army revolution (Astagh Firullah) or that someone has cheated Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì (Astagh Firullah) or that someone has deceived Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì and snatched from Him His jurisdictions (Al Ayaazo Billah). The essence of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì and any of His attributes to have any kind of alteration in this belief is equal and parallel to Kufr (disbelief). We give for the sake of the infallibles and ask for Dua (prayers); this is the meaning of YA ALI  (as) MADAD. When you ask for help from anybody, you hope that he helps and supports you in accordance to one’s own power. Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì Almighty has given the Prophet of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì, Janab-e-Zahra (SA), and all of the infallibles the power of victory to support His Shia. (3) This power is in their intercession, in which they do dua (prayer) for all of their Shia and they ask forgiveness for them and they fulfill the requirement from Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì. This is the meaning of YA ALI  (as) MADAD.

The Office of The Grand Ayatollah Al Uzma Sheikh Basheer Hussain Najafi

Najaf e Ashraf

Iraq

 

 

we are not to speak from our own opinions alone, but based on quran and hadiths that are in line with quran.

 

duas are for Allah and only Allah

 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ    :wub: 

 

fi aman ilah 
 

(wasalam)

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So, do you believe in Wilayat?


we are not to speak from our own opinions alone, but based on quran and hadiths that are in line with quran.

 

duas are for Allah and only Allah

 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ    :wub: 

 

fi aman ilah 
 

(wasalam)

I think you may have missed somethings.

 

 

 

 

The Meaning of YA ALI  (as) MADAD A few things should be made clear upon you:

1. Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has bestowed the highest status upon: the Holy Prophet of Islam, all other Prophets (Peace Be Upon Them), Imam Ali  (as), and the rest of the infallibles  (as). Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has bestowed upon them the highest jurisdictions and in this there is no doubt amongst any of the Shia and there should not be any doubt. The details of these jurisdictions and explanations of the fixing of the boundaries are above the intellectual understanding of any normal person. However, the infallibles  (as) in some of the traditions have indicated towards this meaning, so in the truth of the Ahlul Bait  (as), we should not get entangled in disbelief or claims of deficiency and defectiveness of the Ahlul Bait  (as), and neither in the greatness (nature, power) of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì Almighty. We should not unnecessarily transgress and pass the prescribed limits.

2. Those personalities (entities) which we have mentioned above are the selected people of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì. That honor which they have obtained has only been obtained with the devotion of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì.

3. (4) Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has kept some of the jurisdictions in His hand and has not consigned these to anybody else other than Himself. In this, there is life and death, creation and demission, and rizq.

4. If somebody himself says that those things which have been mentioned before are not in the hands of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì, then he implies that we have retired Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì Almighty (Astagh Firullah). One should remember that the creator of these personalities (entities) is only Him. The creator of the (1) master of the universe Imam Ali  (as) and the creator of the milk in the chest of his blessed and purified mother was only Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì Almighty. May it be known that Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has never retired nor shall He ever retire!

5. (2) Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has ordered us that we seek our needs from the aforementioned entities, that we ask for our needs from Him, and that we give for the sake of those infallibles. When we all say YA ALI  (as) MADAD, this does not proclaim the belief of any Muslim that Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has retired (Astagh Firullah) or that Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has become old (Al Ayaazo Billah) or that someone has deprived Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì from him His jurisdictions through elections or an army revolution (Astagh Firullah) or that someone has cheated Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì (Astagh Firullah) or that someone has deceived Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì and snatched from Him His jurisdictions (Al Ayaazo Billah). The essence of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì and any of His attributes to have any kind of alteration in this belief is equal and parallel to Kufr (disbelief). We give for the sake of the infallibles and ask for Dua (prayers); this is the meaning of YA ALI  (as) MADAD. When you ask for help from anybody, you hope that he helps and supports you in accordance to one’s own power. Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì Almighty has given the Prophet of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì, Janab-e-Zahra (SA), and all of the infallibles the power of victory to support His Shia. (3) This power is in their intercession, in which they do dua (prayer) for all of their Shia and they ask forgiveness for them and they fulfill the requirement from Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì. This is the meaning of YA ALI  (as) MADAD.

The Office of The Grand Ayatollah Al Uzma Sheikh Basheer Hussain Najafi

Najaf e Ashraf

Iraq

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yes the text is full of contradictions.

 

this statement:

 

 

 

Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì has kept some of the jurisdictions in His hand and has not consigned these to anybody else other than Himself. In this, there is life and death, creation and demission, and rizq.

 

how can he have "some" without sharing them with somebody else?? this statement contradicts itself, makes no sense, is backed by no evidence.

 

the same with the rest of the statements.

 

a statement like 

 

"Allah has ordered us that we seek our needs from the aforementioned entities" can NEVER be excused under any circumstance.

 

 

this is like saying for instance: "God does not control everything, but God controls everything" there is no excuse for that first statement no matter in what context!

 

again, i brought evidence above, so this is pointless talk of opinions of fallible weak limited non-masum humans

 

 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ     :wub: 

 

fi aman ilah 
 

(wasalam)

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look brother .. prove that we may supplicate/make dua/ call upon any other than Allah from Quran and don't forget that at least 99% of the hadiths support this.

 

the masumeen always call only upon Allah, and we have no instance of them ever saying grandfather madad..

 

quran hadiths .. if the quran is 100% clear about it, and the hadiths 99%, then why go against it.

 

 

if you want to talk about wilaya being that we call upon them, then prove it from quran, and hadiths. which you wont be able to, except by some very rare stray hadiths that contradict the quran.

 

again, talk straight, talk quran, talk hadith. i don't want my opinions i don't want your opinion, i want Allah's opinion.

 

fi sabeel Allah 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ      :wub:

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ      :wub:

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ      :wub:

 

(wasalam)


(salam)

 

let me add something that reminds me of "ya ali madad" ..

 

did you hear about how the bani israel said to moses "you go fight the enemies with your God and we will stay here"?? do you know that?

 

 

the ya ali madad is in direct opposition to what we ought to say.

 

we ought to say labayka a ali

 

labayka ya hussain

 

 

we are supposed to serve them spiritually and make duas for them, and fight in their cause.

 

we are supposed to give them, and not expect anything in return

 

 

praying to Imam Ali can never be excused, and praying to any other than Allah is shirq and the biggest crime possible.

 

the only crime Allah says in the quran he will not excuse.

 

 

labayka ya hussain !

 

fi aman ilah

 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ       :wub:

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ       :wub:

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ       :wub:

 

(wasalam)

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bismilah

 

i believe in quran and ahl bayt

 

do you believe in the ayat posted in post # 32?

 

fi aman ilah

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ        :wub:

 

(wasalam)

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this is my hopefully my last post until i find anybody bringing evidence from quran and hadiths:

 

i'll end it this way in sha Allah:

 

Let us imagine that we are in our graves

 

peace seeker: 

  • the angels come to question me
  • they ask me: "why did you NOT pray and make duas to the imam Ali?"
  • i would say right now: "it is written clearly in the quran only to pray and seek help from Allah, and also 99.99% of narrations"

 

Assad91:

 

  • the angels come to you
  • they ask: "why did you pray and make duas to imam ali when the quran says only to do that to Allah, and most all hadiths as well"?
  • you would say " ___________________"

 

 

 

... what would you say? answer that, and in relation to the verses i shared above. in post #32 

 

 

fi aman ilah 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ         :wub:

 

(wasalam)

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(bismillah)

(salam)

 

 

 

 

- @Nima: You are free to have your views. But as a Sunni you shouldn't be preaching about what is and what isn't a Shia view. If you believe it's shirk- fine. Do so in the Shia / Sunni forum, not here where innocent Shia come to the forum thinking that everyone else here is a Shia.

 

 

(wasalam)

 

 

I am a shia muslim. 

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wilaya is discussed in the quran and i have studied each verse about it alhamdulilah.

 

for somebody like me who believes in all of the quran, i think it's a weird question to pose.

 

 

it is you who doesn't accept some verses in the quran

Thanks for the dirty accusation.

 

Isn't control over things that usually Allah is over control, by the imams? Thats part of wilayat. So how do you disagree with the fatwa?

 

 

Read under number 2 http://www.al-islam.org/wilayat/7.htm

"

 

Assad91:

 

  • the angels come to you
  • they ask: "why did you pray and make duas to imam ali when the quran says only to do that to Allah, and most all hadiths as well"?
  • you would say " ___________________"

 

You seem to think I pray to Imam Ali as if he is Allah, astigfurllah. No. I say Ya Ali Madad, in hopes of intercession in times of trouble.

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Thanks for the dirty accusation.

 

Isn't control over things that usually Allah is over control, by the imams? Thats part of wilayat. So how do you disagree with the fatwa?

 

 

Read under number 2 http://www.al-islam.org/wilayat/7.htm

"

You seem to think I pray to Imam Ali as if he is Allah, astigfurllah. No. I say Ya Ali Madad, in hopes of intercession in times of trouble.

 

asSalaam

 

I have to say that from a Quranic point ,brother peace seeker is 100%.

 

I would also like to make an observation according to the Quran.

The brother says  and I quote: " I say ya Ali madad , in hopes of intercession in times of trouble."

 

Allah says in:

سورة البقرة  , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #155

"Be sure we shall test you with something of fear and hunger, some loss in goods or lives or the fruits (of your toil), but give glad tidings to those who patiently persevere,"

 

This verse states that Allah will test us in ways only Allah knows and since we don't know it is a test from Allah we may call it "times of trouble"

as the brother indicated above.

 

The question is ,can Ali override what Allah has decreed for us in a test ?

 

Soloman

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The question is ,can Ali override what Allah has decreed for us in a test ?

 

 

Salam.

I hope you don't mind me deleating some of your post I am not respoding to. THis is just tomake sure to easily follow.

 

As to your question. I don't think so. Ali (as) is Amir al Momineen, and infallible. But he is not Allah. His intercession, is like my intercession for you, except sweeter. For he is much closer to Allah then I will ever be

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"

You seem to think I pray to Imam Ali as if he is Allah, astigfurllah. No. I say Ya Ali Madad, in hopes of intercession in times of trouble.

 

that contradicts the rules in the quran:

 

 

 

And those you call upon besides Him are unable to help you, nor can they help themselves." 7:197

 

Say, "Invoke those you have claimed [as gods] besides Him, for they do not possess the [ability for] removal of adversity from you or [for its] transfer [to someone else]." 17:56

 

Those whom they invoke seek means of access to their Lord, [striving as to] which of them would be nearest, and they hope for His mercy and fear His punishment. Indeed, the punishment of your Lord is ever feared. 17:57

 

Indeed, those you [polytheists] call upon besides Allah are servants like you. So call upon them and let them respond to you, if you should be truthful. 7:194

 

 

 And intercession does not benefit with Him except for one whom He permits. [And those wait] until, when terror is removed from their hearts, they will say [to one another], "What has your Lord said?" They will say, "The truth." And He is the Most High, the Grand. 34:23

 

39:44 Say, "To Allah belongs [the right to allow] intercession entirely. To Him belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth. Then to Him you will be returned."

 

those quranic verses are some you are ignoring and going against. how do you dare to ignore them? Allah tells us not to call upon any other than him, and that intercession is through Him, and not through others!!!

 

 

why do you contradict Quran ??

 

what gives you the liberty??

 

why do you contradict Allah??

 

bring your evidence if you can, but you won't !!!!

 

 

Isn't control over things that usually Allah is over control, by the imams? Thats part of wilayat. So how do you disagree with the fatwa?

 

 

Read under number 2 http://www.al-islam.org/wilayat/7.htm

 

 

 

 

 

instead of posting links, why don't you bring proof that shows that we can ignore the ayat posted above, which have no ayat contradicting.

 

if you look at the ayat of the quran you will find contradiction in the use of word wilaya. sometimes it's said: "only Allah is your wali", then it says "you are wali to one another" .. but when it comes to seeking help and calling upon and intercession, there is no contradiction.

 

tell me, how will you excuse those ayat i posted once you're in your grave? i am going with those ayat and you are contradicting them.

 

is it possible for you to answer me for a change, or has the doing duas to slaves of God caused you too much of a blockage my brother?

 

may Allah open up your faith and bring you into the fold of monotheism an tawheed in line with quran in sha Allah.

 

(wasalam)

 

we follow quran in sha Allah, how about you? bring the verses that support you if you are so sure!

 

fi sabeel ilah

 

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ      :wub:

 

(wasalam)

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And those you call upon besides Him are unable to help you, nor can they help themselves." 7:197

 

Say, "Invoke those you have claimed [as gods] besides Him, for they do not possess the [ability for] removal of adversity from you or [for its] transfer [to someone else]." 17:56

 

Those whom they invoke seek means of access to their Lord, [striving as to] which of them would be nearest, and they hope for His mercy and fear His punishment. Indeed, the punishment of your Lord is ever feared. 17:57

 

Indeed, those you [polytheists] call upon besides Allah are servants like you. So call upon them and let them respond to you, if you should be truthful. 7:194

No contradition as these verses are for thhe polytheist and those who comit shirk.

 

 

 

 And intercession does not benefit with Him except for one whom He permits. [And those wait] until, when terror is removed from their hearts, they will say [to one another], "What has your Lord said?" They will say, "The truth." And He is the Most High, the Grand. 34:23

 

39:44 Say, "To Allah belongs [the right to allow] intercession entirely. To Him belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth. Then to Him you will be returned.

As I believe in wilayat, I see no cotradiction once again.As I go off the assumption Allah has given th right to interession to Amir al Momineen, the Propeht and all of the Imams.

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those verses clearly talk about ANY other than Allah. because Allah has no partners.

 

as soon as somebody calls upon more than One they are technically polytheists , even if they don't mean it. and if they don't mean it then may Allah forgive them in sha Allah

 

there is not ONE shred of evidence in the quran suggesting that we should call upon others than Allah or do duas to other, or ask for intercession to anybody except to Allah.

 

 

just saying that one is monotheist doesn't have to be true. actions speak louder than words.

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those verses clearly talk about ANY other than Allah. because Allah has no partners.

 

as soon as somebody calls upon more than One they are technically polytheists , even if they don't mean it. and if they don't mean it then may Allah forgive them in sha Allah

 

there is not ONE shred of evidence in the quran suggesting that we should call upon others than Allah or do duas to other, or ask for intercession to anybody except to Allah.

 

 

just saying that one is monotheist doesn't have to be true. actions speak louder than words.

Actually, you posted two verses that do attest to the fact that intercession is real and possible.

 

You have a similar belief as the wahabis. To go so far to even say askig for intercession is shirk.

Its a sad day when a Shia sounds more like a wahabi

 

Ya Ali Madad

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i said to ask for other than Allah for intercession.

 

39:44 Say, "To Allah belongs intercession entirely. "

 

are you going to keep on ignoring the verses again? and call me wahabi because i don't?

 

which aya shows us that we may make duas to others than Allah?

 

 

 

 

Ya Ali Madad

 

 

Indeed, those you [polytheists] call upon besides Allah are servants like you. So call upon them and let them respond to you, if you should be truthful. 7:194

 

 

.. 

 

 

at least now when you are in your grave.. and in judgment day you can't say you weren't warned. life and death and judgment of Allah is fair.

 

fi aman ilah

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ       :wub:

 

(wasalam)

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i said to ask for other than Allah for intercession.

 

39:44 Say, "To Allah belongs intercession entirely. "

 

are you going to keep on ignoring the verses again? and call me wahabi because i don't?

Nice try. But you alreay posted this verse. It went like;

39:44 Say, "To Allah belongs [the right to allow] intercession entirely. To Him belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth. Then to Him you will be returned.

 

Yeah. I like what you tried to do there. Pretty decieving.

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why? because i removed the bracket which is not there in the arabic original text? or because i didn't add the second sentence?

 

does it change anything in meaning?

 

where is your understanding and fear?


i know it is painful to admit that one is wrong, but for sake of Allah it is a great sacrifice that is jihad el nafs at its finest.

 

you haven't been able to refute any of Allah's proofs so far. not a single one. if you die right now that would be tragic, and i truly wish you for you to repent, even if it's secretly, before that moment in sha Allah.

 

i don't need to know about it.

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why? because i removed the bracket which is not there in the arabic original text? or because i didn't add the second sentence?

does it change anything in meaning?

where is your understanding and fear?

i know it is painful to admit that one is wrong, but for sake of Allah it is a great sacrifice that is jihad el nafs at its finest.

you haven't been able to refute any of Allah's proofs so far. not a single one. if you die right now that would be tragic, and i truly wish you for you to repent, even if it's secretly, before that moment in sha Allah.

i don't need to know about it.

if you die right now it would be tragic, brother.
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(bismillah)

 

Wilayat al-Takwiniyya is the standard position of the Hawzaat. So, most maraji do accept it. Also, I do not believe there is really a problem in the belief and most people make a big deal calling it tafwid (which is not the case nor provable). The explanation of the doctrine is cloaked in language which seems to just mean that when they ask for something to happen, it happens and Allah [swt] has given them command on creation (eg. if they commanded a tree to uproot and move, it would do so). They're not going to conflict with Allah's plan or command, they are informed of that. It ties into their `isma, I believe.

 

 

Really, the beliefs of the Imami Shia hasn't gone through that much transformation, especially as much as our neo-Salafi companions like to argue. The difference is that the language used to discuss these things has changed and evolved, perhaps the ethos of it all as well.

 

I also imagine that this doctrine is implicated in narrations like the following:

 

10 - أبي - رحمه الله - قال: حدثنا سعد بن عبدالله، قال: حدثنا أحمد بن محمد بن عيسى، عن الحسين بن سعيد، عن فضالة بن أيوب، عن أبان بن عثمان، عن محمد بن مسلم، قال: سمعت أبا عبدالله عليه السلام يقول: إن لله عزوجل خلقا خلقهم من نوره، ورحمة من رحمته لرحمته، فهم عين الله الناظرة، واذنه السامعة، ولسانه الناطق في خلقه باذنه، وامناؤه على ماأنزل من عذر أونذر أوحجة، فبهم يمحو الله السيئات، وبهم يدفع الضيم، وبهم ينزل الرحمة، وبهم يحيي ميتا ويميت حيا، وبهم يبتلي خلقه، وبهم يقضي في خلقه قضية.
قلت: جعلت فداك من هؤلاء؟ قال: الاوصياء.


 

10 - My father - Allah have mercy on Him - said: Sa`d b. `Abdullah narrated to us, he said: Ahmad b. Muhammad b. `Isa narrated to us, from al-Husayn b. Sa`eed, from Faddala b. Ayyub, from Abban b. `Uthman, from Muhammad b. Muslim, who said: I heard Aba `Abdillah (al-Sadiq) [a] say: Indeed Allah, Mighty and Exalted, created certain creatures from His light, and a mercy from His mercy for the sake of His Mercy. For these are the eye of Allah that sees, and His ear that hears, and His tongue that speaks to His creation by His permission, and the safeguards over what has descended from (His) justifications and warnings and proofs. And through them He wards off grievances, and through them He sends down mercy, and through them He enlivens the dead, and causes to die the living. And through them He afflicts His creation (with tribulations), and through them He judges cases among His creation.

I asked: May I be your ransom - Who are these?

He [a] replied: Al-Awsiyaa (the vice-regents).           
 
The chain is extremely strong. The chains are many and widespread up to al-Husayn b. Sa`id and Ahmad b. Muhammad b. Isa through Saduq and Tusi's chain of all their books and riwayat. From there, every member is from Ashab al-Ijma`. Also, this is from al-Tawhid by al-Saduq who was trying to prove the correct doctrines of Tawhid with this book.
 
 

- سعد، عن أحمد بن محمد بن عيسى، عن الحسين بن سعيد، عن حماد ابن عيسى، عن ابراهيم بن عمر اليماني، عن أبي الطفيل: عن أبي جعفر عليه السلام، (عن آبائه)(1) قال: قال رسولالله صلى الله عليه وآله، لامير المؤمنين عليه السلام: اكتب ما أملي عليك، فقال: يا نبي الله، وتخاف علي النسيان؟ فقال: لست أخاف عليك النسيان، وقد دعوت الله لك أن يحفظك ولا ينسيك،ولكن اكتب لشركائك، قال: قلت: ومن شركائي يا نبي الله؟ ! قال: الائمة من ولدك، بهم تسقى امتي الغيث، وبهم يستجاب دعاؤهم، وبهم يصرف الله عنهم البلاء، وبهم ينزل الرحمة من السماء.

وهذا أولهم، وأومى إلى الحسن، ثم أومى إلى الحسين عليهما السلام، ثم قال: الائمة من ولده عليهم السلام(2).

 

38 – Sa`d from Ahmad b. Muhammad b. `Isa from al-Husayn b. Sa`id from Hammad b. `Isa from Ibrahim b. `Umar al-Yamani from Abu ‘t-Tufayl from Abu Ja`far عليه السلام [from his fathers].  He said: The Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وآله  said to Amir al-Mu’mineen عليه السلام: Write down what I dictate to you.  So he said: O Prophet of Allah, and are you fearful of forgetfulness for me?  So said: I do not fear forgetfulness for you, as I have prayed to Allah for you that He guard you (or, make you remember) and that He not make you forget.  However, write for your associates.  He said: I said: And who are my associates, O Prophet of Allah?  He said: The Imams from my children.  Through them, my Umma shall be given the rain to drink.  And through them, their prayers will be answered. And through them, Allah shall turn affliction away from them.  And through them, mercy shall be sent down from Heaven.

And this is the first of them, and he gestured to al-Hasan.  Then he gestured to al-Husayn عليهما السلام.  Then he said: The Imams are from his children عليهم السلام.

 
Chain up to Hammad b. `Isa is extremely strong as well, the leaders of the Ta'ifa. Ibrahim b. `Umar is reliable and from the shuyukh of the Ta'ifa and Abu Tufayl is also from the original Rawafd companions of Imam `Ali [as] up to al-Baqir [as] that were loyal to them and their reliable ones. 

 

There's also the mutawatar tradition of the Earth being unable to exist without a hujja from Allah, that it would be swallowed upon itself [paraphrasing]. 

 

The Wilayah of the A'imma [as] and the Prophet is not simply that they were there to answer our fiqh questions, their role is cosmic.

 

في أمان الله

 

 

So, through them we recieve Allah's mercy, but asking them for help, even with the clear intention for intercession, is haram ?

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point is that Allah decides through whom what happens, but quran is very clear that this does not excuse praying or making duas to anybody other than him.

 

if we want intercession, we have to ask Allah for it, because He is 100% in control of it, and not the slaves of Allah who passed away. 

 

And intercession does not benefit with Him except for one whom He permits. 34:23

 

Say, "To Allah belongs intercession entirely. 39:44

 

 

here about intercession via slaves of Allah including Imam Ali ibn Talib a.s.

 

Those whom they invoke seek means of access to their Lord, which of them would be nearest, and they hope for His mercy and fear His punishment. 17:57

 

Indeed, those you call upon besides Allah are servants like you. 7:194

 

fi amanilah

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ        :wub:

 

(wasalam)

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(bismillah)

(salam)

 

@peace seeker: When exactly did I say I was referring to Ali Musaaa? I keep my eyes open to everyone. And I will keep on singing: watchout for the Wahhabi trolls on this forum who want Shia to drop their beliefs- these are the shayaateen among the human beings who work through deception and want to see the Shia fall.

 

And I didn't come here to debate my religion, my beliefs are firm as stone, if you don't like it tough. The verses you quoted do not conflict with any of our beliefs, your interpretation is out of context and follows the wahhabi ideology. The pagans were worshipping and calling idols to help them independent of Allah. This is not what we do when we call the Aimmah (as). Allah sent them to us as His proofs upon His creation, and gave them spiritual gifts to do with as they please- they are not independent of Allah. If you want to ignore them, then that is your choice and your belief, "for you your religion, for me my religion."

 

 

I am a shia muslim. 

 

Oooooooh are you? Astaghfirullah!! How rude of me. Tell me O 'Shia', if you think this is shirk, and Ayatullah Sistani has no objection to it, then in your mind Ayatullah Sistani is a Mushrik? O 'Shia' does that mean you consider all of our 'Ulema who don't have any problems with this, those who have dedicated their entire lives to the study of religion as Mushrikeen? Mashaa'Allah we have very wise, holy and pious 'Shia' on this forum-- Please do enlighten us about your insight from your lofty status and beliefs on the subject, O 'Shia'.  :rolleyes:

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(bismillah)

(salam)

 

@peace seeker: When exactly did I say I was referring to Ali Musaaa? I keep my eyes open to everyone. And I will keep on singing: watchout for the Wahhabi trolls on this forum who want Shia to drop their beliefs- these are the shayaateen among the human beings who work through deception and want to see the Shia fall.

 

And I didn't come here to debate my religion, my beliefs are firm as stone, if you don't like it tough. The verses you quoted do not conflict with any of our beliefs, your interpretation is out of context and follows the wahhabi ideology. The pagans were worshipping and calling idols to help them independent of Allah. This is not what we do when we call the Aimmah (as). Allah sent them to us as His proofs upon His creation, and gave them spiritual gifts to do with as they please- they are not independent of Allah. If you want to ignore them, then that is your choice and your belief, "for you your religion, for me my religion."

 

 

 

Don't promote your wahhabi garbage here

 

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/index.php?/topic/235004604-benefits-of-nade-ali-as/?p=2452676

 

 

 

where is the hadith for you wahhabi's?

 

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/index.php?/topic/235004604-benefits-of-nade-ali-as/?p=2453294

 

 

 

 

And to any readers out there on the internet - don't be fooled or swayed by these wahhabi trolls - even sunni muslims call directly on ahlul bayt for help.

 

 

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/index.php?/topic/235004604-benefits-of-nade-ali-as/?p=2453379

 

 

 

 

Why are you so annoyed? perhaps another wahabi in hiding?

 

 

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/index.php?/topic/235004604-benefits-of-nade-ali-as/?p=2454600

 

 

 

 

subhan Allah !!! it is interesting to observe that in virtually any discussion the people with low akhlaq are the ones wrong about what they are discussing. there is always an exception when an intelligent person may have a bad day, so that is the 1% where somebody who is right might slip

 

@Fuan,

 

I will not discuss with you much longer it seems, before you let go of arrogant ways and slandering approach.

 

 

 

And I didn't come here to debate my religion,

 

 

i am here to discuss Islam, and not consider my opinions infallible, without need of a base of thaqalayn.

 

 

 

 

your interpretation is out of context a

 

so you come here just to insult and accuse, and share your dogmatic views, without any proof. if you can prove the verses and translators (interpreters) wrong, then go ahead (just like proving that you didn't call Ali Musaaa :) a wahabi ). but if you don't need hadiths for your beliefs then you are most likely going to refuse quran as well .. thaqalayn can not be separated 

 

look what you say here:

 

 

 

Nade Ali doesn't need a hadith, if you can't understand the thought process behind it then you need to start from the beginning and learn what is Shia and what is Wahhabi - after that everything is clear - no need for any narrators.

 

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/index.php?/topic/235004604-benefits-of-nade-ali-as/?p=2453294

 

 

 

 

The verses you quoted do not conflict with any of our beliefs

 

 

really? you see these verses do not talk about inanimate statues. they talk about calling upon "servants of Allah", for instance, and how intercession belongs only to Allah. 

 

Indeed, those you call upon besides Allah are servants like you. 7:194

 

Say, "To Allah belongs intercession entirely. 39:44

 

Those whom they invoke seek means of access to their Lord, which of them would be nearest, and they hope for His mercy and fear His punishment. 17:57

 

 

 

 

If you want to ignore them,

 

.. if you want to ignore Allah and as you mentioned before, ignore hadiths .. 

 

 

so, i think that unless you actually bring proof which you wont be able to, because there is no ayat in the quran that agree with you, nor 99% of sahih hadiths, i hope to Allah to ignore you and your arrogant insulting slandering posts.

 

 

 

"for you your religion, for me my religion."

 

of from surat kafirun ?? how charming lol :D .. because i refuse to accept going against monotheism and orders of Allah, and the masumeen??? masha Allah.

 

bring Proofs in relation to the above verses lol :D

fi aman ilah

 

fi sabeel ilah

 

fi hobb ilah

 

:wub: اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ       :wub:

 

(wasalam)

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(bismillah)

(salam)

 

@peace seeker: You seem confused - I don't feel guilty about what I said - the point I'm making is that these people are present and I'm not gonna stop calling them out. And when I said "when was I referring to him" you again took it out of context, I obviously meant "In This Thread" because I know that he's not the only one on this forum. I look at everyone, I don't limit myself to one person. 

 

And by the looks of it, you don't even accept Wilayah so I guess I should be adding you to that list.

 



 

so you come here just to insult and accuse, and share your dogmatic views, without any proof. if you can prove the verses and translators (interpreters) wrong, then go ahead (just like proving that you didn't call Ali Musaaa :) a wahabi ). but if you don't need hadiths for your beliefs then you are most likely going to refuse quran as well .. thaqalayn can not be separated 

 

I can say the same thing right back at you - all of those verses of copy and paste are the same thing. You come and repeat those verses over and over as if it means something new to us. It's just dogma for you the same way that rejecting them is dogma for me.

 

They refer to the idols, plain and simple. If someone doesn't even obey Wilayah of verse 5:55 and take Imam Ali as their guardian, then I could care less about how you interpret all of those other verses.

 

 

I maintain what I said - I don't need a hadith or a chain of narrators to make a dua. A dua is your own supplication. Sure you might want a dua that genuinely comes from Ahlul Bayt, but dua in itself doesn't require that. There is nothing wrong in what I said - especially if you have understood the status of Ahlul Bayt (as)-- if you haven't then that is a lack in your understanding.

 

so, i think that unless you actually bring proof which you wont be able to, because there is no ayat in the quran that agree with you, nor 99% of sahih hadiths, i hope to Allah to ignore you and your arrogant insulting slandering posts.

 

We always mention the verse of wasilah, the brothers of Yusuf, the verse of "asmaa ul husna", the verse of "wajhullah", and Brained even quoted a saheeh hadith above about the status of Ahlul Bayt (as). But you don't want to listen and you want to ignore them or put your interpretations for them, and then you blame us of doing the same. It's as if you think we have never read the Qur'an - or for that matter, as if none of our scholars have read it and as if they are all Mushrikeen in your eyes.

 

And I'm not worried. If you say I'm going to hell for doing Shirk, then by all means - make sure to write my name right beside Sayyid Sistani (ha), don't even leave a space between our names.  B) 

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Fuan is the judge. please forgive me if i disagree with you.

 

i believe in wilayat ahlbait (as) and defended it more than you will ever do. 

 

respect people and don't act as if you know me . i've been to hell and back and in that situation(i almost died) i even rejected Allah's existence from time to time  but always came back to tawheed and everytime i go back to tawheed wilayat ahlbait was in my heart and soul running in my veins alongside tawheed . 

 

don't judge people plz

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(bismillah)

(salam)

 

@peace seeker: You seem confused - I don't feel guilty about what I said - the point I'm making is that these people are present and I'm not gonna stop calling them out. And when I said "when was I referring to him" you again took it out of context, I obviously meant "In This Thread" because I know that he's not the only one on this forum. I look at everyone, I don't limit myself to one person. 

 

And by the looks of it, you don't even accept Wilayah so I guess I should be adding you to that list.

 

 

I can say the same thing right back at you - all of those verses of copy and paste are the same thing. You come and repeat those verses over and over as if it means something new to us. It's just dogma for you the same way that rejecting them is dogma for me.

 

They refer to the idols, plain and simple. If someone doesn't even obey Wilayah of verse 5:55 and take Imam Ali as their guardian, then I could care less about how you interpret all of those other verses.

 

 

I maintain what I said - I don't need a hadith or a chain of narrators to make a dua. A dua is your own supplication. Sure you might want a dua that genuinely comes from Ahlul Bayt, but dua in itself doesn't require that. There is nothing wrong in what I said - especially if you have understood the status of Ahlul Bayt (as)-- if you haven't then that is a lack in your understanding.

 

 

We always mention the verse of wasilah, the brothers of Yusuf, the verse of "asmaa ul husna", the verse of "wajhullah", and Brained even quoted a saheeh hadith above about the status of Ahlul Bayt (as). But you don't want to listen and you want to ignore them or put your interpretations for them, and then you blame us of doing the same. It's as if you think we have never read the Qur'an - or for that matter, as if none of our scholars have read it and as if they are all Mushrikeen in your eyes.

 

And I'm not worried. If you say I'm going to hell for doing Shirk, then by all means - make sure to write my name right beside Sayyid Sistani (ha), don't even leave a space between our names.  B) 

 

 

 

You seem confused - I don't feel guilty about what I said

 

it's a pity that you don't feel bad and repent for slandering a brother, and then denying it! even after i clearly proved you wrong, you still go on? it's up to you but again imam ali said: 'slander eats away at faith faster than leprosy " .. an interesting quote for you.

 

They refer to the idols, plain and simple

 

really? so "servant" is an idol? isn't Imam Ali a servant?? 

 

Indeed, those you call upon besides Allah are servants like you. 7:194 

 

I maintain what I said - I don't need a hadith or a chain of narrators to make a dua

 

ok blame me for proving you clearly wrong with quran, and tell me that you don't need ahl bayt hadiths, and tell me i don't believe in wilaya :D lol

 

There is nothing wrong in what I said

 

 according to quran and hadiths there is, but hey you are above need of ahadeeth and quran lol :D you're funny fuan!! :P i swear to God you are cracking me up

 

And I'm not worried.

 

well you should be brother :D lol any momin must have fear and worry about their destiny and true level of faith and understanding

 

 

i predict that Allah will not open up your eyes until you apologize to Ali Musaaa :) and repent to Allah for this terrible slander you did. you zalamt Ali Musaaa :) .. but God is great maybe he will take away your pride and blatant arrogance without you apologizing to Ali Musaaa :) for that. your forgiveness from Allah will depend on Ali Mussaaa :) forgiveness too btw. that's how things work.

 

 

and saying that a servant of Allah is an idol .. well those who pray to them treat them as such. buddha and jesus were also just men :D 

 

 

oh boy!

 

fi aman ilah 

 

 

اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ وسَهِّلْ مَخْرَجَهُمْ والعَنْ أعْدَاءَهُم الأوّلينَ وَالآخِريْن إِلَى قِيَامِ يَوْمِ الدِّينْ

 

(wasalam)

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(bismillah)

(salam)

 

 

Fuan is the judge. please forgive me if i disagree with you.

 

i believe in wilayat ahlbait (as) and defended it more than you will ever do. 

 

respect people and don't act as if you know me . i've been to hell and back and in that situation(i almost died) i even rejected Allah's existence from time to time  but always came back to tawheed and everytime i go back to tawheed wilayat ahlbait was in my heart and soul running in my veins alongside tawheed . 

 

don't judge people plz

 

Really?.. Ok let me play devils advocate here: what's worse? "Fuan the judge" or "mutazili(wasil) the deceiving liar"..?

 

If I'm wrong then fine, I apologise, but in no way will I stop after seeing the amount of people that come to this forum just to lie and deceive other people about who they really are, and what motives they really had --and nor will I feel guilty for making sure that readers beware.

 

It's sad, you would think that as a Muslim posting on a Muslim forum you would be open and honest with some integrity --and yet the majority of 'Muslims' who come to this forum deceive and lie, and then they somehow believe that they are doing good deeds. Go figure.

 

 

 

fi aman ilah 

 

 

اللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ وعَجِّلْ فَرَجَهُمْ وسَهِّلْ مَخْرَجَهُمْ والعَنْ أعْدَاءَهُم الأوّلينَ وَالآخِريْن إِلَى قِيَامِ يَوْمِ الدِّينْ

 

(wasalam)

 

peace seeker you are picking and choosing what you want to respond to in my post, but I can see that there won't be any change on your part nor will there be any change on mine. We can agree to differ. (wasalam)

Edited by Fuan
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(bismillah)

(salam)

 

@OP: Getting back OT !!

 

 

~ The Call "Ya Ali (as)" ~

 

حدثنا أبي (رحمه الله)، قال: حدثنا عبد الله بن الحسن المؤدب، عن أحمد بن علي الأصبهاني، عن إبراهيم بن محمد الثقفي، قال: حدثنا محمد بن داود الدينوري، قال: حدثنا منذر العشراني، قال: حدثنا سعيد بن زيد، عن أبي قنبل، عن أبي الجارود، عن سعيد بن جبير، عن ابن عباس، عن النبي (صلى الله عليه وآله)، قال: إن حلقة باب الجنة من ياقوتة حمراء على صفائح الذهب، فإذا دقت الحلقة على الصفحة طنت وقالت: يا علي

 

Narrated to me my father  (ra), from Abdullah bin al-Hasan al-Muaddab, from Ahmad bin Ali al-Asbhani, from Ibraheem bin Muhammad al-Saqafi, from Muhammad bin Dawood al-Denoori, from Manzar al-Ashari, from Saeed bin Zayd, from Abi Qanbl, from Abi Jarood, from Saeed bin Jabeer, from Ibn Abbas, from Prophet (saww):


Prophet Muhammad (saww) said: 

"The ring on the door of paradise is made of red yaqoot placed upon planks of gold. When the ring knocks upon the planks, it rings and says "Ya Ali (as)" 

[source: Amaali - Sheikh Sadooq, Majalis. 86, Hadees. 13]
 
الحسين بن محمد، عن معلى بن محمد، عن محمد بن مسلم، عن الحسين بن نصر، عن أبيه، عن عمر وبن شمر، عن جابر قال: أراد أبوجعفر عليه السلام الركوب إلى بعض شيعته ليعوده، فقال: ياجابر ألحقني فتبعته، فلما انتهى إلى باب الدار خرج علينا ابن له صغير فقال له أبوجعفر عليه السلام: ما اسمك؟ قال: محمد قال: فبما تكنى؟ قال: بعلي، فقال له أبوجعفر عليه السلام: لقد احتظرت من الشيطان احتظارا شديد إن الشيطان إذا سمع مناديا ينادي يا محمد يا علي ذاب كما يذوب الرصاص حتى إذا سمع مناديا ينادي باسم عدو من أعدائنا اهتز واختال
 
Al-Hussain bin Muhammad, from Mualla bin Muhammad, from Muhammad bin Muslim, from Al-Husain bin Nasr, from his father, from Umr bin Shimr, from Jabir who said:
 
Abu Jafar  (as) intended to ride towards few of his Shias to return (?) to them. So He said, "O Jabir, Join Me". So I followed Him.
And we had not reached to the end of the door that a small boy came out unto us. 
 
Abu Jafar  (as) said to him, "What is your name"? He said, "Muhammad". 
Abu Jafar  (as) said to him, "What is your title (Kuniyyah)"? He said, "Ali".
 
Then Abu Jafar  (as) said to him, "Verily you are protected from Saitan, a severe protection. Verily when Saitan hears a caller calling "Ya Muhammad" or "Ya Ali", he melts like the melting of the lead. And when saitan hears a caller calling with the name of our enemy, he starts swinging (with joy) and boasts about his own-self".
 
[source: Al-Kafi, Vol. 6, Pg. 20]

 

http://www.marefateahlebait.com/miscellaneous/ya-ali

 

 

 

 

 

كتاب درر المطالب  : قال : خرج رسول الله - صلى الله عليه وآله - إلى غزاة تبوك وخلف علي بن أبي طالب - عليه السلام - على أهله ، وأمره بالاقامة فيهم ،فأرجف المنافقون وقالوا : ما خلفه إلا استقلالا به ، فلما سمع ذلك أخذ سلاحه وخرج إلى النبي - صلى الله عليه وآله - وهو نازل بالحرق ، فقال : يا رسول الله زعمالمنافقون انك إنما خلفتني استقلالا بي . فقال رسول الله - صلى الله عليه وآله - : كذبوا ، ولكني خلفتك لما تركت ورائي ، فارجع فاخلفني في أهلي وأهلك ، ألا ترضى أن تكون مني بمنزلة هارون من موسى إلا انه لا نبي بعدى ، فرجع إلى المدينة ، ومضى رسول الله - صلى الله عليه وآله - لسفره . قال : وكان من أمر الجيش انه انكسر وانهزم الناس عن رسول الله - صلى الله عليه وآله - ، فنزل جبرائيل ، وقال : يا نبي الله إن الله يقرئك السلام ، ويبشرك النصرة ، ويخبرك إن شئت أنزلت الملائكة يقاتلون ، وإن شئت عليا فادعه يأتيك ، فاختار النبي - صلى الله عليه وآله - عليا ، فقال جبرائيل : در وجهك نحو المدينة وناد : يا أبا الغيث ادركني ، يا علي أدركني ، ادركني يا علي

 
"When Prophet Muhammad (saww) left for the battle of Tabuq and left behind Ali bin Abi Talib (as) with his family, and ordered him to stay with them. Then the hypocrites said, "Prophet Muhammad (saww) did not leave him behind but to be independent of him.

When Imam Ali (as) heard this, he took his weapon and left towards the Prophet (saww) and said, "O Messenger of Allah (saww), the hypocrites claim that you left me behind to be independent of me.

Then the Messenger of Allah (saww) said, "They have lied, but I left You behind, so that You are left after Me. Go back and leave to my family and your family. Are You not satisfied that You have to Me the position/station that Haroon had with Moosa except that there is no Messenger after me."

Then He went back towards Medina and the Messenger of Allah (saww) carried on with his travel.

Then when He ordered the army, the army broke apart and defeated the men from the Messenger of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì

Then Jibraeel descended and said, "O Messenger of Allah (saww), Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì sends blessings upon you and gives you tidings of support. And tells you that if you wish the angels will descend killing, and if You wish for Ali (as) , call Him, He will come to You. The Messenger of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì chose Ali (as) .

Then Jibraeel said, "Turn Your face towards Madina and call, "O' Abal-Ghayth Reach me", "O'Ali Reach me", "Reach me O'Ali".
 
[source: Madinat Al-Ma'ajiz, Vol. 2, Pg. 9-10] 

 

 

 

 

When Ali ibn Abi Taleb returned from Ohud, he gave his sword to Fatema (sa) and read this poem:"O Fatema (sa)! Take my sword, the sword that is not disgraced. I am not frightened nor am I a villain. I swear that I worked hard to support Ahmad (saww) and to please the Merciful lord of the slaves."

On the day of Ohud when it was very windy, people heard a voice that recited this poem:
"There is no sword except Zulfiqar, and there is no man except Ali.
When you need help, cry out the name of the loyal one, and the (name of the) brother of the loyal one."

[source: Amali - Sheikh Toosi 1:142 / Basharatul Mustafa Le Shiyat e Murtuza Ch.11 Hadees.13]

 

 

 

(wasalam)

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