Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله
Sign in to follow this  
Modest Muslim

Self-Flagellation In Islam

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

ste and desire, Ayatullah Khorassani's words are pretty clear and do not need any explanation.

 

Watch the video here again:

 

Feeble so feeble  telling us to watch it again doesnt alter what he says. He is not advocating blood letting on the video . He hasnt expressed an opinion either way. So shame on you for misrepresenting and lying about a scholar you claim to respect. All his commenst are about Azadari shame on you and your lying ilk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While in the past I have been pro-Tatbeer, meaning that it should allow all kinds of Tatbeer, I have altered my position towards it.

Azadari itself should be upheld by all means.
If some people might faint or hit themselves harder with their hands emotionally (like Sayyed Zakar has done in his videos sometimes), I have understanding. But I am against the industry which produces sharp tools which are used in these ceremonies.
It should not be the norm or the main aspect of Azadari. If you do Azadari then do with your hands beating the chest and crying. That is the best form of Azadari. And spreading, learning, trying to understand and to live the message of Imam Hussain(a) by all means. That's my opinion.

 

 

(bismillah)

(salam)

 

listen to agha wahid's lecture again, there is no mention of blades dangling at the ends of the chains.

 

(wasalam)

 


I agree with that post.

No true Alim will ever prohibit Azadari.

 

Watch that:

Edited by Shiabro

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Feeble so feeble  telling us to watch it again doesnt alter what he says. He is not advocating blood letting on the video . He hasnt expressed an opinion either way. So shame on you for misrepresenting and lying about a scholar you claim to respect. All his commenst are about Azadari shame on you and your lying ilk

 

 

Dear true Umari!

 

Do not forget that I am a Shia and we are in a Shia forum and I am writing for the Shias. Umaris are welcome to express their opinion and views but they are not welcome to attack our core beliefs and Attribute Lies to our Imams and our Fuqaha.

 

I ask the Admins and Mods to closely monitor the Umaris replies as they are getting very comfortable here!

 

May Allah's cure be upon the Idols of Quraysh and Their Daughters and Their Followers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

listen to agha wahid's lecture again, there is no mention of blades dangling at the ends of the chains.

 

You have brought up the chains now read the answer carefully; My replies shall serve as Hujjat on you on the Day of Shafa'at and you will be accountable.

 

Ayatollah Khorassani is not giving his opinions, He just confirms and approves the verdict of His superiors. He is referring to His Pro-Azadari-Tat'bir superiors (who are Alhamdolillah majority) such as Ustad ul-Fuqaha Ayatullah al-Uzma Naai'ni, Ayatullah Burujerdi, Ayatullah Ha'iri (founder of Hawza of Qum), etc. May Allah elevate their status in paradise) and says: "These individuals are the pillars of jurisprudence and knowledge of Islam." It means if you have to take your religion from anyone, it should be them not illiterates and self-declared mujtahids who say cry slowly.

 

Chains with blades; a cultural and traditional way of Azadari in Afghanistan and Pakistan

Ayatollah Khorassani continues quoting Ayatullah Burujerdi who in answer to a question that: "in our city people build miniature shrines, then on Ashura they put a black cloth over it and they bring it out as a standard (Alam)" Ayatollah Khorassani quotes Grand Ayatullah Burujerdi and confirms His verdict which is as follows: "In each city and every city, Mourning Ceremony has to be conducted according to its own traditon."

 

Chain with blades is a traditional and cultural form of Azadari which is common only among the Shias of Afghanistan and Pakistan. I am from Afghanistan and I know that;

  1. People who do it are Experienced in it,
  2. They do not inflict permanent damage to themselves,
  3. It is only once a year (on Ashura day), and for a few minutes

No objections from Mujtahids.

 

Other traditional forms of Azadari

In Iran; There are people who perform Azadari by "walking on hot stones"

Some people "paint their face and try to look like Jins" to remember the leader of the Jins who came with an Army of Jins to help His Imam (A) in Karbala but Imam (A) rejected saying you are too strong for the humans. And more. No objections from Mujtahids.

In Iraq: People hit their heads with side of swords and slightly cut their head for the blood to appear. Its called Qama Zani and some Iranians do it. again; those who do it are Experienced and they do not inflict permanent damage to themselves. No objections from Mujtahids of Najaf.

 

Apart from its unimaginable and uncalculatable reward by Allah which the least is to Resurrect alongside Imam Hussain (A) and the Martyrs of Karbala, and being able to do Shafa'at of other Mo'menin (i.e, sinful Shias only), science also proved that letting a little blood go or donating blood every once a while is very good for health.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You have brought up the chains now read the answer carefully; My replies shall serve as Hujjat on you on the Day of Shafa'at and you will be accountable.

 

Ayatollah Khorassani is not giving his opinions, He just confirms and approves the verdict of His superiors. He is referring to His Pro-Azadari-Tat'bir superiors (who are Alhamdolillah majority) such as Ustad ul-Fuqaha Ayatullah al-Uzma Naai'ni, Ayatullah Burujerdi, Ayatullah Ha'iri (founder of Hawza of Qum), etc. May Allah elevate their status in paradise) and says: "These individuals are the pillars of jurisprudence and knowledge of Islam." It means if you have to take your religion from anyone, it should be them not illiterates and self-declared mujtahids who say cry slowly.

 

Chains with blades; a cultural and traditional way of Azadari in Afghanistan and Pakistan

Ayatollah Khorassani continues quoting Ayatullah Burujerdi who in answer to a question that: "in our city people build miniature shrines, then on Ashura they put a black cloth over it and they bring it out as a standard (Alam)" Ayatollah Khorassani quotes Grand Ayatullah Burujerdi and confirms His verdict which is as follows: "In each city and every city, Mourning Ceremony has to be conducted according to its own traditon."

 

Chain with blades is a traditional and cultural form of Azadari which is common only among the Shias of Afghanistan and Pakistan. I am from Afghanistan and I know that;

  1. People who do it are Experienced in it,
  2. They do not inflict permanent damage to themselves,
  3. It is only once a year (on Ashura day), and for a few minutes

No objections from Mujtahids.

 

Other traditional forms of Azadari

In Iran; There are people who perform Azadari by "walking on hot stones"

Some people "paint their face and try to look like Jins" to remember the leader of the Jins who came with an Army of Jins to help His Imam Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã in Karbala but Imam Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã rejected saying you are too strong for the humans. And more. No objections from Mujtahids.

In Iraq: People hit their heads with side of swords and slightly cut their head for the blood to appear. Its called Qama Zani and some Iranians do it. again; those who do it are Experienced and they do not inflict permanent damage to themselves. No objections from Mujtahids of Najaf.

 

Apart from its unimaginable and uncalculatable reward by Allah which the least is to Resurrect alongside Imam Hussain Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã and the Martyrs of Karbala, and being able to do Shafa'at of other Mo'menin (i.e, sinful Shias only), science also proved that letting a little blood go or donating blood every once a while is very good for health.

 

Since the vid clip has been posted as 'proof' you should only refer to what the vid clip says. You cannot extrapolate from it. Numerous people have already said that Ayatullah Naenis fatwa is disputed as  to its meaning.

 

Pro blood letters will extrapolate a verdict from it not use the actual fatwa itself . Anti blood letters says its only permisable to use the ruling in its original form and to extrapolate a meaning from its is not permissable because Ayatullah Naenni is no longer alive.

 

Since we have 2 views on this ruling it is not correct to say people endorse or quote this fatwa until it is established which view they have.

 

As to Ayatullah Khorasanis lecture no mujtahid would have an issue with it because he hasnt actually gone beyond what is already permisable in Iran.

 

Chains are allowed

crying loudly is allowed

mourning is allowed 

Azadari is allowed

 

so the vid clip is not conclusive

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...