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hamza1892

Girls Playing In High School Events

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Is it haram for girls to play sports in high school events? for example soccor. basketball etc.

And also

Is it haram to go out with 10 friends to lunch, that are a mixture of girls and guys? (which all of them are muslims)

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Why would it be haram if you properly wear your hijab while playing sports and all are Muslims who are not going to drink alcohol (i hope) at the same table as you when going for lunch..anyway these kind of questions it's better if you ask your marja anyway ;)

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sports wont be a problem if she wears hijab properly and no tight clothing. I think problems may arise in the mixed gathering for lunch. Hijab is sometimes compromised in these type of gatherings and there will be a lot of chatting that will cross the line of "small-talk", so best to ask you're marja.

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Girls and education? The Shia ulama have already said they shouldn't learn how to write or read books. And now you want a shariah ruling on if they can play school sports?

ويكره للنساء الحرائر الشباب أن يكون سكناهن في الغرف الشارعات، ويكره لهن تعلم الكتابة، وقراءة الكتب

It is hated for free, young women to live in rooms on the street level, and it is hated for them to learn how to write or read books. - Sheikh al-Mufid, Ahkam al-Nisa

ويعلمه الخط والسباحة ، ويؤمر بالصلاة لسبع ويفرق بين الصبيان في المضاجع لعشر ، ويعلم القرآن ، والصبية سورة النور لا سورة يوسف ، ولا الخط ، ولا تنزل الغرف

Boys should learn writing and swimming, they should be commanded to pray when they are seven, and separated from females when they are 10. And, teach them the Koran. As for girls, they should be taught Surah al-Nur, and not Surah Yusuf. And not writing. And they should not descend from their rooms. - Yahya ibn Saed al-Hilli, Jami lil-Sharai

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Girls and education? The Shia ulama have already said they shouldn't learn how to write or read books. And now you want a shariah ruling on if they can play school sports?

ويكره للنساء الحرائر الشباب أن يكون سكناهن في الغرف الشارعات، ويكره لهن تعلم الكتابة، وقراءة الكتب

It is hated for free, young women to live in rooms on the street level, and it is hated for them to learn how to write or read books. - Sheikh al-Mufid, Ahkam al-Nisa

ويعلمه الخط والسباحة ، ويؤمر بالصلاة لسبع ويفرق بين الصبيان في المضاجع لعشر ، ويعلم القرآن ، والصبية سورة النور لا سورة يوسف ، ولا الخط ، ولا تنزل الغرف

Boys should learn writing and swimming, they should be commanded to pray when they are seven, and separated from females when they are 10. And, teach them the Koran. As for girls, they should be taught Surah al-Nur, and not Surah Yusuf. And not writing. And they should not descend from their rooms. - Yahya ibn Saed al-Hilli, Jami lil-Sharai

Qiyas, and based on weak hadiths. Next.

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Girls and education? The Shia ulama have already said they shouldn't learn how to write or read books. And now you want a shariah ruling on if they can play school sports?

ويكره للنساء الحرائر الشباب أن يكون سكناهن في الغرف الشارعات، ويكره لهن تعلم الكتابة، وقراءة الكتب

It is hated for free, young women to live in rooms on the street level, and it is hated for them to learn how to write or read books. - Sheikh al-Mufid, Ahkam al-Nisa

ويعلمه الخط والسباحة ، ويؤمر بالصلاة لسبع ويفرق بين الصبيان في المضاجع لعشر ، ويعلم القرآن ، والصبية سورة النور لا سورة يوسف ، ولا الخط ، ولا تنزل الغرف

Boys should learn writing and swimming, they should be commanded to pray when they are seven, and separated from females when they are 10. And, teach them the Koran. As for girls, they should be taught Surah al-Nur, and not Surah Yusuf. And not writing. And they should not descend from their rooms. - Yahya ibn Saed al-Hilli, Jami lil-Sharai

Shi'ite ulema don't make the law, they try to interpret it. We can debate about the permissibility of girls playing sports in front of non-mahram men, but are you really going to say that they shouldn't be educated? This is precisely why we all need to have a critical mind. I'm not saying we're more knowledgeable than the ulema, that would be absurd. But blind following is even more absurd. Sometimes we need to engage with the tradition ourselves, instead of depending solely on the fallible interpretation of the established scholarship. We might end up further from the truth, but at least we will have freed ourselves from this painful ignorance that prevades over our communities. It's amazing how little we study our own history and development as a religious group. The ulema, and the fuqaha in particular, have not always assumed such authority in the community, especially the kind of formalities that exist today. The ulema will only produce quality scholarship when the laymen demand it. The more questions we ask, the better the answers will be. But, that's assuming we're all educated enough to ask meaningful questions, boys and girls alike. Wa Allahu 'Alam.

(wasalam)

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(salam)

How did Shaikh Al-Mufeed conclude that it is hated for women to read?. As far as I am aware, there is no hadith at all supporting this, there are only hadiths that discourage women to write, and these hadiths are weak, no doubt about it.

(wasalam)

Edited by Crescent

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(salam)

How did Shaikh Al-Mufeed conclude that it is hated for women to read?. As far as I am aware, there is no hadith at all supporting this, there are only hadiths that discourage women to write, and these hadiths are weak, no doubt about it.

(wasalam)

I have heard our seyedeh Lady Fatima (as) used to write hadith and in order for one to write she needs to be able to read right?

Edited by Naz_

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^ What? Shaykh al-Mufid was heavily influenced by Mu'tazilite thought. He was, perhaps, the most influential scholar in changing the theological positions of the early Imamiyyah, particularly when it came to the use of `aql. Not sure, who you're talking about there.

(wasalam)

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Astaghfirullah. My mistake sorry brothers I thought they were referring to some Sunni guy I mistyped his name when googling. I will be more careful going forward.

Ya Ali

Edited by Ali-Reza

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What about the girls and women in Iran, they even casually show them on tv, being proud of them even. And yes they show them in action..better to ask a marja instead of everyone just giving out fatwas really.

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Is it haram for girls to play sports in high school events? for example soccor. basketball etc.

And also

Is it haram to go out with 10 friends to lunch, that are a mixture of girls and guys? (which all of them are muslims)

(salam)

I used to play soccer in High school.... Until a broke my nose with the soccer ball :squeez:

my team only had females.. so if your team is for girls only, there is no problem. ( i went to all girls high school)

Its haram to play with males !! They may accidentally touch you with the soccer ball ,or even be attracted to your gym clothes ..etc.

For your second question, make sure you have a full Hijab and interact very minimally with them. The brothers are muslim, so they should know about this and respect you ..

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This may not be exactly relevant, but it gives a general idea of the differences between the rules for men and women as taught by classical Imami scholars (maybe this helps).

Taken from: Women in traditional Sharīʾa: a list of differences between men and women in Islamic tradition, by Amineh Mahallati

One of the earliest examples of those lists is that prepared, in the form of an independent tract, by an early 2nd/8th-century Sh’ite scholar, Jabir ibn Yazid al-Ju’fi (d. 128/745–6). He attributed the material to Imam MuHammad al-Baqir, the fifth Imam of Imamite Shi’ism (d. c.117/735), suggesting that he prepared it from the teachings of the Imam, given possibly on different occasions. Jabir, a prominent scholar of Kufa and a student of Imam MuHammad al-Baqir, was considered one of the main sources of religious knowledge in his day. Many of the distinguished Muslim scholars of the mid-2nd/8th century studied with him and transmitted Hadith from him. He authored numerous religious and historical works, some of which have partially survived through citations by later authors.

.

The list is quoted in full in a work of a 4th/10th-century prolific Shi’ite scholar, Ibn Babawayh al-Qummi [shaykh Saduq] (d. 381/991) named Kit b al-Khisal. The text is reproduced below . . .

Women are not required to say the public call to prayer (adhan) or its shorter version in the opening of the daily prayers (iqama), nor to attend the Friday prayer or participate in the congregational prayers.

They are not to visit the ill or to attend funeral processions.

[in the pilgrimage to the house of God in Mecca] they are not supposed to raise their voice with the talbiyah [that is, the acceptance formula to God’s invita-tion to His house that the pilgrims cry while approaching the house], run between the two mounts of af and Marwah, kiss the Black Stone, enter the Ka’bah, or shave their heads; they will instead trim a little from their hair and nail.

Women are not to act as judges, assume political leadership, or be consulted [on matters of administration].

Women are not to slaughter animals except in cases of absolute necessity.

In ritual ablution for prayer, women wash the interior part of her forearm first while men do the exterior part first, and she wipes her head unlike men: she removes her head-scarf for the purpose in the morning and evening prayers but enters her hand under it to wipe her head, without removing it, for all other prayers. When a woman stands up for her prayer, she puts her feet together and places her hands to her chest but she places them on her thighs when bowing down. When she goes to prostrate, she first sits down and then prostrates keeping her body down; when she lifts her head from prostration, she first sits down and then moves to full standing position. When she sits down for saying the ritual testimony in prayer (tashahhud), she [first raises her legs then] places her thighs together. When glorifying God (after the prayer), she counts the times with her fingers as they will be asked (on the day of resurrection of what she has done with them).

When she wants to ask God about a need, she goes on top of her roof, says a two-cycle prayer, and removes her head cover facing up toward the sky. If she does that, God will answer her and will not let her down.

She is not required to perform the ritual, full body ablution on Fridays while traveling but cannot miss it when at home.

Women’s testimony as witnesses is not valid in matters of criminal law, nor in issues of divorce or sighting of the new moon. It is, however, valid in matters that men are not allowed to directly investigate.

Women should not walk in the middle of a walkway but on its two sides, nor to settle in the upper chambers overlooking the roads.

It is not for them to learn how to write but preferable that they learn wheel-spinning.

[it is also recommended that they learn] Srat al-Nur [chapter 24 of the Qur’an] but not Srat Yusuf [chapter 12].

If a woman apostatizes from Islam, she is to be ordered to repent. If she complies [all will be fine], but if she does not she is to remain in jail [indefinitely], but not killed as in the case of a male apostate. [she is to be subjected to] hard labor and the bare minimum food and drink allowance of rough stock and clothing of rough material, and will be beaten and forced to perform the daily prayers and obligatory fasting.

Women are not required to pay the poll tax.

At the time of childbirth, any [nonessential] women have to leave the room so that they do not look at the private part of the woman in labor. A woman who is menstruating or who has not yet performed the ritual full body ablution after having sex should not attend the benediction of a dead, as that disturbs the angels, nor should women be present at burials.

A man should not sit in a place where a woman has just left until the warmth left from her body dissipates.

The Holy Struggle (jihad) for a woman is to take proper care of her husband. Her husband’s rights form her priorities. He has the priority to [lead] performance of the ritual funeral prayer over her body if she dies.

A [Muslim] woman should not shed her clothes in front of a Jewish or Christian woman as they may describe her looks to their husbands.

[Muslim women] are not permitted to use perfume when going out.

She is not allowed to make herself look like men as the Messenger of God cursed men who make themselves look like women and women who make themselves look like men.

A woman should not be without adornment even if it is a simple string that she wears on her neck, nor leave her nails bare even if it is a touch of henna. [However,] she should not dye her hands while menstruating because of the risk of Satan’s temptation.

Should she need something while in prayer, she would call attention by clapping her hands whereas a man indicates [his need] with his head and hand and cries Glory to God. A woman cannot pray without a headscarf unless she is a slave in which case she prays with her head uncovered. A woman can wear thin silk or silk brocade except in prayer and pilgrimage to Mecca, but a man cannot except in war. A woman can wear a gold ring and pray in gold whereas a man cannot. The Prophet said: “’O ‘Al ! Do not wear gold rings, which will be your adornment in Paradise, nor silk, which will be your clothes in Paradise.”

A woman cannot make charitable donations nor free slaves or fast as supererogation except with her husband’s approval.

She cannot shake hands with a non-relative or pledge allegiance with her hand unless her hand is covered.

She cannot go on a supererogatory pilgrimage to Mecca except with her husband’s approval.

A woman does not go to a public bathhouse as it is not allowed for her to do so, nor does she ride on a saddle [that is, on a horse] unless absolutely necessary or in a journey.

Her share from the inheritance is half of that of a man and her blood money is half of that of a man. A woman equals a man in retribution for bodily injury until the financial compensation exceeds one third of the full [amount of] blood money [due for a man] after that [it is half of that of a man, so] it increases for the man and decreases for the woman.

When the woman is praying alone with a man, she stands behind him and not by his side.

When a woman dies, the one who performs the funeral prayer stands at her chest whereas in the case of a man, he stands at his head. When the body of the woman is being laid to rest, the husband stands where he can hold her thigh [to help place her in the grave]. Nothing will intercede for a woman before God more success-fully than husband’s satisfaction with her. When Fatimah [al-Zahra’] died, the Commander of the Faithful [‘Al ] stood up next to her body and said: “O God! I am pleased with the daughter of Your prophet. O God! She is in fear now; so, give her comfort. O God! She departed us; so, connect to her. O God! She was treated unjustly; so, be her judge. You are the best of all the judges.

Arabic text:

حدثنا أحمد بن الحسن القطان قال: حدثنا الحسن بن علي العسكري قال: حدثنا أبوعبد الله محمد بن زكريا البصري قال: حدثنا جعفر بن محمد بن عمارة، عن أبيه عن جابر بن يزيد الجعفي قال: سمعت أبا جعفر محمد بن علي الباقر عليهما السلام يقول: ليس على النساء أذان ولا إقامة، ولا جمعة، ولا جماعة، ولا عيادة المريض، ولا اتباع الجنائز، ولا إجهار بالتلبية، ولا الهرولة بين الصفا والمروة، ولا استلام الحجر الاسود، ولا دخول الكعبة، ولا الحلق إنما يقصرن من شعورهن، ولا تولى المرأة القضاء، ولا تولى الامارة، ولا تستشار، ولا تذبح إلا من اضطرار، وتبدء في الوضوء بباطن الذراع والرجل بظاهره، ولا تمسح كما يمسح الرجال بل عليها أن تلقى الخمار من موضع مسح رأسها في صلاة الغداة والمغرب، وتمسح عليه وفي سائر الصلوات تدخل إصبعها فتمسح على رأسها من غير أن تلقى عنها خمارها فاذا قامت في صلاتها ضمت رجليها ووضعت يديها على صدرهـا، وتضـع

يديها في ركوعها على فخذيها، وتجلس إذا أرادت السجود سجدت لاطئة بالارض، وإذا رفعت رأسها من السجود جلست ثم نهضت إلى القيام، وإذا قعدت للتشهد رفعت رجليها وضمت فخذيها، وإذا سبحت عقدت بالانامل لانهن مسؤولات، وإذا كانت لها إلى الله عز وجل حاجة صعدت فوق بيتها وصلت ركعتين وكشفت رأسها إلى السماء فإنها إذا فعلت ذلك استجاب الله لها ولم يخبها، وليس عليها غسل الجمعة في السفر، ولا يجوز لها تركه في الحضر، ولا يجوز شهادة النساء في شيء في الحدود، ولا يجوز شهادتهن في الطلاق، ولا في رؤية الهلال، وتجوز شهادتهن فيما لا يحل للرجل النظر إليه، وليس للنساء من سروات الطريق شيء ولهن جنبتاه، ولا يجوز لهن نزول الغرف، ولا تعلم الكتابة، ويستحب لهن تعلم المغزل، وسورة النور، ويكره لهن تعلم سورة يوسف، وإذا ارتدت المرأة عن الاسلام استتيبت، فإن تابت وإلا خلدت في السجن، ولا تقتل كما يقتل الرجل إذا ارتد، ولكنها تستخدم خدمة شديدة، وتمنع من الطعام والشراب إلا ما تمسك به نفسها، ولا تطعم إلا جشب الطعام ولا تكسى إلا غليظ الثياب وخشنها، وتضرب على الصلاة والصيام، ولا جزية على النساء، وإذا حضر ولادة المرأة وجب إخراج من في البيت من النساء كيلا يكن أول ناظر إلى عورتها، ولا يجوز للمرأة الحائض ولا الجنب الحضور عند تلقين الميت لان الملائكة تتأذى بهما، ولا يجوز لهما إدخال الميت قبره، وإذا قامت المرأة من مجلسها فلا يجوز للرجل أن يجلس فيه حتى يبرد، وجهاد المرأة حسن التبعل وأعظم الناس حقا عليها زوجها، وأحق الناس بالصـلاة

عليها إذا ماتت زوجها، ولا يجوز للمرأة أن تنكشف بين يدي اليهودية والنصرانية، لانهن يصفن ذلك لازواجهن، ولا يجوز لها أن تتطيب إذا خرجت من بيتها، ولا يجوز لها أن تتشبه بالرجال لان رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله لعن المتشبهين من الرجال بالنساء ولعن المتشبهات من النساء بالرجال، ولا يجوز للمرأة أن تعطل نفسها ولو أن تعلق في عنقها خيطا، ولا يجوز أن ترى أظافيرها بيضاء، ولو أن تمسحها بالحناء مسحا، ولا تخضب يديها في حيضها لانه يخاف عليها الشيطان، وإذا أرادت المرأة الحاجة وهي في صلاتها صفقت بيديها والرجل يومي برأسه وهو في صلاته ويشير بيده ويسبح، ولا يجوز للمرأة أن تصلي بغير خمار إلا أن تكون أمة فانها تصلى بغير خمار مكشوفة الرأس، ويجوز للمرأة لبس الديباج والحرير في غير صلاة وإحرام، وحرم ذلك على الرجال إلا في الجهاد، ويجوز أن تتختم بالذهب وتصلي فيه، وحرم ذلك على الرجال [إلا في الجهاد] قال النبي صلى الله عليه وآله "يا علي لا تتختم بالذهب فانه زينتك في الجنة، ولا تلبس الحرير فإنه لباسك في الجنة" ولا يجوز للمرأة في مالها عتق ولا بر إلا باذن زوجها، ولا يجوز لها أن تصوم تطوعا إلا باذن زوجها، ولا يجوز للمرأة ان تصافح غير ذي محرم إلا من وراء ثوبها، ولا تبايع إلا من وراء ثوبها، ولا يجوز أن تحج تطوعا إلا باذن زوجها،ولا يجوز للمرأة أن تدخل الحمام فان ذلك محرم عليها، ولا يجوز للمرأة ركوب السرج إلا من ضرورة، أو في سفر، وميراث المرأة نصف ميراث الرجل، وديتها نصف دية الرجل وتقابل المرأة الرجل في الجراحات حتى تبلغ ثلث الدية فاذا زادت على الثلث ارتفع الرجل وسفلت المرأة، وإذا صلت المرأة وحدها مع الرجل قامت خلفه ولم تقم بجنبه، وإذا ماتت المرأة وقف المصـلي

عليها عند صدرها ومن الرجل إذا صلى عليه عند رأسه،وإذا دخلت المرأة القبر وقف زوجها في موضع يتناول وركها،ولا شفيع للمرأة أنجح عند ربها من رضا زوجها، ولما ماتت فاطمة عليها السلام قام عليها أمير المؤمنين عليه السلام وقال: "اللهم إني راض عنه ابنة نبيك اللهم إنها قد أوحشت فأنسها، اللهم إنها قد هجرت فصلها، اللهم إنها قد ظلمت فاحكم لها وأنت خير الحاكمين".

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From looking at your posts her on this forum, I can tell that you're only looking for trouble.

The hadith you have posted is weak. The chain of narrators contains Ahmad Ibn Al-Hassan Al-Qattan, who was one of Sheikh Al-Sadooq's sheikhs, but he is majhool (unknown). (ref: Al-Mufeed Min Ma`jam Rijal Al-Hadeeth, Page 25)

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Guest sumaya

(salam)

I used to play soccer in High school.... Until a broke my nose with the soccer ball :squeez:

my team only had females.. so if your team is for girls only, there is no problem. ( i went to all girls high school)

Its haram to play with males !! They may accidentally touch you with the soccer ball ,or even be attracted to your gym clothes ..etc.

For your second question, make sure you have a full Hijab and interact very minimally with them. The brothers are muslim, so they should know about this and respect you ..

same here ay sis :-)

[Edited] I didn't break my nose though lol, good old days ay.... :P

Edited by sumaya

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