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In the Name of God بسم الله

Barelvi Sunnis

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(bismillah)

(salam)

There is a large Sunni sect on the Indian Subcontinent known as Barelvis. Can any Barelvi here give a summary of the differences between their beliefs and practices and those of other Sunnis? Or can a non-Barelvi who knows a lot about them do so? If any sources could be provided, that would be helpful.

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There's a heck of a lot of em in the UK too.

They are more sufi-inclined and believe that the Prophet s.a.w is hadir and nadir, that he is omnipresent. From experience in discussing with some in the past, they tend to get very easily heated up if you were to say something as largely accepted that the Prophet s.a.w "passed away" or "died", because he is alive in his grave.

They also do collective dhikr chanting every Thursday nights, with the lights turned out.

The rival sub-sect of Hanafi in the Indian Subcontinent is Deobandis (the Taliban are Deobandis) and the Barevlis accuse them of being wahabis, and the latter accuses them of bidah.

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Barelvis form the majority of Sunnis in Pakistan, at least on paper. Sufi influences include shrine visitation and a more relaxed view on Islam, as opposed to Deobandis/Wahabi's puritanical approach. They have their own pressure group in Pakistan, the Sunni Threek, though they are not known for picking up arms.

Barelvis are "shia friendly" as Jaber said, and many that I know keenly participate in Azadari for Imam Hussain (as) , also like the Shias they hold

Ahly Bayt (as) in high regard. They also organise Milaads for the Holy Prophet (pbuh) and take out rallies on 12th of Rabi-ul-Awal, the supposed date of birth of Prophet Mohammad (as).

They brutally oppose Deobandis, and there have been instances where they clashed with them over control of mosques.

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Although some say they are supposedly "Shia Friendly" I would say they perhaps do not show it in a violent way or as openly as Salafis or Deobandis, however I have spoken with enough to know they still deem Shias to be if not heretical, then incorrect in their beliefs.

This could may well be an instance of gradual Salafi propaganda that has found it's way among Barelvis, at least in the West.

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Yes we are extremely shia friendly and friendly with who ever says kalima we are never quick to call people kafir etc like deobands we follow the hanafi fiqh who are more sufi we love ahlebait ra and hear there stories since we were kids we are taught to love them they are the best family ra we have never insinuated violence against shia i myself have a lot of shia friends very close we always agree to disagree and if it were not for deobands we were living peacefully together in pakistan until the bida brigades started and started marginalising people the only diffs between us is i think is just imamat where as we believe Ali kaw is maula is a wali but not in the concept of shia i am not doing justice here i think if you watch lecture of dr tahir ul qadri on Ali kaw ra his explanation is better to the point the deobands started saying he is a shia at the end we all love Allah swt his nabi saws and all his family ra as well as his companions ra we are all ONE UMMAH but on diff roads some have the easy road some have the long road but our goal and aim is the same and inshallah we will all get there in the end with our love for Allah swt his prophet saws his family ra his companions ra they are our guides

Edited by Blacknight
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The problem rises because, no matter what, Shias will never deny what the Sahaba did after the Holy Prophet (as), and consequently will never side with the likes of You-know-who, people who both the Barelvis and Deobandis hold in high esteem. So according to them, we'll always be the "bad ones" because we don't agree with (some of the) Sahaba.

Edited by Brained
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Brained

The problem rises because, no matter what, Shias will never deny what the Sahaba did after the Holy Prophet (as), and consequently will never side with the likes of You-know-who, people who both the Barelvis and Deobandis hold in high esteem. So according to them, we'll always be the "bad ones" because we don't agree with (some of the) Sahaba.

Salam brother this is where we should just agree to disagree and get on with life as long as no obscenities or insults are involved then it shoud not matter at all for we are first and foremost muslims whether one believes Ali kaw ra is first or not we follow quran and our nabi saws and his noble family ra and whoever wants to follow sahaba ra as long as there is no insults or abuses lets make our past into a better future in our masjid all are welcome shia wahabi as long as you believe in Allah swt and his prophet saws no one has a monopoly on them everyone is equal in front of Allah swt only our deeds will count!

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There's a heck of a lot of em in the UK too.

They are more sufi-inclined and believe that the Prophet s.a.w is hadir and nadir, that he is omnipresent. From experience in discussing with some in the past, they tend to get very easily heated up if you were to say something as largely accepted that the Prophet s.a.w "passed away" or "died", because he is alive in his grave.

They also do collective dhikr chanting every Thursday nights, with the lights turned out.

The rival sub-sect of Hanafi in the Indian Subcontinent is Deobandis (the Taliban are Deobandis) and the Barevlis accuse them of being wahabis, and the latter accuses them of bidah.

Is this their tv station?

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Is this their tv station?

0.jpg

Yeah, its them(atleast a faction amongst them)....although a majority of them isnt this irrational...

Dhulfiqar313

The Barelvis believe that Muhammad (pbuh) is the last and final messenger. Their rivals, Deobandis, believe that although he is the "seal of the prophethood", more prophets could come after him.

Salaam brother is that wot they believe?? I never knew!!

both these groups believe in the finality of the prophethood...their disputes are rather petty(i,e: qawalis, the signifance of religious figures and vistitng their tombs, etc.)..As far as I know, a Deobandi and Barelvi can be members of the same family and could go on without ever finding out..As far as their view of the Shia is concerned, its pretty more or less the same....we cant say that one group is more hostile than the other..

Edited by thebeast
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From experience in discussing with some in the past, they tend to get very easily heated up if you were to say something as largely accepted that the Prophet s.a.w "passed away" or "died", because he is alive in his grave.

I swear this post confused me, do Shias not believe that Imams are still alive?

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Their rivals, Deobandis, believe that although he is the "seal of the prophethood", more prophets could come after him.

I think you are talking about Ahmediya, because Deobandis are still a subschool of the Sunni Hanafi mathab, they do not believe any prophet could come after Muhammad s.a.w.

Unless you could provide some proof, otherwise it comes off as mere heresay.

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Brelvis are mostly Shia friendly and in Deobandi some are Shia friendly.

Only difference between us and Brelvis is issue of Imamat and issues related to history of that time, which is different on some occasions.

There is lots of influence of Wahabi philosophy on both Brelvis and Deobandis and this influence is increasing day by day in subcontinent.

I believe this is largely due to very simple and straight forward nature of their philosophy, or in other words they have no philosophy at all, so minds can easily digest them. In psychology it is rule that mind will go for simple things. So they are deceiving muslims controlling their minds. Man who have invented Wahabism should be indeed a hell of a genius. It penetrates mind even when they reject it out loud.

They used to arrange sabeels during muharram and we used to arrange milaads for them in old days. But since this Wahabi movement in subcontinent, our differences are widening up day by day despite all the efforts of Imam Khamenei and Allama Tahir ul Qadri.

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Salams

Brelvi Profile:

1) They are Pro Panjtan Paak.

2) Their popular debate with deobandis is that they say Nabi Paak is "Noori" (and who receives our salams, who is alive in the sense Quran calls the shohada alive, who can communicate with us and vice versa) while the deobandis say, Nabi Paak was mere "Bashr" (who is now dead).

3) They seek nearness to Allah through waseelah of the Prophet P.b.u.H. They also believe in Prophet's shafa'at on the day of Judgement. Deobandis disagree and say, ask directly from Allah.

4) They focus on spirituality by having zikars, Mehfil-e-Naat e.t.c.

5) Brelvis consider Yazeed Laanti. They mourn the death of Imam Hussain a.s and consider rest of the 11 Imams as Spiritual Leaders. Deobandis say, both Hazrat Hussain and Yazeed did Ijtehad. Hazrat Hussain was right so He will receive two rewards. Yazeed will receive 1.

6) To an average brelvi, all Caliphs and Ahl-ulbayt lived happily ever after. Infact, this is what I received today from one of my brelvi friends:

post-14633-0-71755100-1344670176_thumb.j

"When Madaen was conquered, Hazrat Umar r.a firstly gave 1000 dirham each to Imam Hassan r.a and Imam Hussain r.a and then gave 500 dirham to his son, Abdullah bin Umar. His son said, "I fought in ghazwat during the lifetime of the Prophet when Husnain were both small but you gave them more. Farooq e Azam r.a said, "If you want to compare yourself to them then go and bring me a Father like theirs, a mother like theirs, a Grandfather like theirs........By God you cannot bring a single relation like them" When Maula Ali heard about this, He said, "Umar is a lamp for the janatis" When Hazrat Umar heard this, He became anxious and asked Maula Ali to write it down for Him....... That writing was burried along with him, as per his will"

Oh and I like this Hamd of Owaid Qadri:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0z79O3XYvaY&feature=related

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The Barelvis believe that Muhammad (pbuh) is the last and final messenger. Their rivals, Deobandis, believe that although he is the "seal of the prophethood", more prophets could come after him.

This is absolutely true. Some of the highest Deobandi `ulema have said, but they mean this in the sense of a leader-prophet similar to imam. This new prophet doesn't bring a Shari`a nor does he have tafweed shari`i. Rather, he protects the teachings of the Prophet (pbuh).

Can the Barelvis here confirm this?

I'm well acquainted with the Barelvis. They do believe the Prophet (pbuh) is omnipresent, which is why the Deobandis accuse them of kufr.

5) Brelvis consider Yazeed Laanti. They mourn the death of Imam Hussain a.s and consider rest of the 11 Imams as Spiritual Leaders. Deobandis say, both Hazrat Hussain and Yazeed did Ijtehad. Hazrat Hussain was right so He will receive two rewards. Yazeed will receive 1.

This isn't correct; maybe some of the Deobandis have started saying this. However, Muslims in the subcontinent generally believe that Yazeed is hell-bound for killing Imam Husain (as). Some of the Barelvis also criticize Muawiya and some of the other caliphs after him, `alayhim jami`an la`anullah.

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Barelvis are "Shia friendly" and their rivals are the Deobandi Sunnis.

I've also read on the internet that they have some Sufi influences. They're opposed by the Wahabis, so they must be doing something right :D

Barelvis are not at all shia friendly. If they don't like Deobandis or Salafis, it doesn't mean they like shias. I have seen them very much allergic to shias. I think sunni talk is their channel which is a lot much anti shia.

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Barelvis are not at all shia friendly. If they don't like Deobandis or Salafis, it doesn't mean they like shias. I have seen them very much allergic to shias. I think sunni talk is their channel which is a lot much anti shia.

They are not anti-shia; 3 out of four of their * Taraq * directly link with Imam Ali (as)--

---only problem is that they think we were one big happy family--

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They are not anti-shia; 3 out of four of their * Taraq * directly link with Imam Ali (as)--

---only problem is that they think we were one big happy family--

Actually they claim to own Ali r.a more than shias. And their mainstream doesn't consider shias as Muslims. I can get you the references.

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Sonador

Actually they claim to own Ali r.a more than shias. And their mainstream doesn't consider shias as Muslims. I can get you the references.

Salaam brother

You dont like sufis? What does your mainstream consider? If i am right in thinking your a wahabi? Salafi? We may say they are wrong but its a sin to take a life of someone who loves Allah and his prophet sallallahu alaihe wasalam unlike in pakistan the deobands off shoots of salafis and wahabis have NO hesitation in killing and slaying and spreading RUMOURS to instill panick to get their way and there is plenty evidence for that as well as just common knowledge like i said before even deobandis started calling us shia too!!!

But would they call any other sunni same??

And the claim that we OWN ali radhyallahuanh??

How did you wirk that out?

Is it because we believe in Ali radhyallahuanh as MAWLA? And we believe he was HAQQ in every decision??

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At best they're Shi'ah-tolerant, not Shi'ah-friendly. They have supposed reverence for Ahlebayt (as) but you can see from the surreal Madani Channel (and the other supposed Barelwi ones in UK) they hardly ever mention any of the aal e Rasool (saww) and Takbeer TV (until a few months ago) was vehemently anti-Shi'ah.

The one time Madani channel did have something about Maula Jafar as Sadiq (as) the graphic was spinning every x seconds with Muawiyah's name written on the flipside - what the hell is that about?

But at least they don't go around killing Shi'ah or issuing fatwas although Ilyas Qadri is building up a cult based around himself.

ALI

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In terms of being "Shia-Friendly" theyre very much divided. For example Tahir Qadri declares Shia Kafir (if im not mistaken) but Many brelvi's love shias a lot. For instance in Pakistan there are stories of brelvi's being killed for defending shias.

But like I said, I've found the brelvi attitude to shias to be very polarised.

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