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Mo.

Allah Sends Shooting Stars As Missiles To Chase...

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So it really was you, you were the guy that registered as 'Reason' and pretend to be a potential convert. How dare you do deceive your own fellow Shias? Did you know that I wasted an hour looking up for this when you made that thread? I wonder why the admins banned your 'Reason' account, but not your current one. And what is your obsession with atheists? Who the hell cares about them, they're all destined to hell anyway, sheeesh!

There are good people out there. Is it your hell and heaven ? Most religions are corrupt and atheists have seen that. Islam is not represented well, can you blame anyone for not following a religion?

Please spend a few hours debating atheists, and you will see they are quite rational.

I'm a muslim from the jafferi fiqh.

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Recently I started thinking about these verses more....and instead of starting a new topic thought I would go into this one. Is it possible sky/heaven refers to higher spiritual realm and lamps refers to Angels and the Spiritual appointed guides, they are lamps spiritually, and they also attack Sayateen when need be.

I'm not sure - what do you guys think of this possible interpretation?

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Video of a UFO evading what seems to be a missile:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=eil_2WOv5VA

If we are ignorant enough and can not explain something like a video, and there is a plethora of unexplainable things, then we have no right to deny things we don't or can't have knowledge of. 

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For me, the verse that speaks of shooting stars chasing away demons only proves Prophet Muhammad a fallible being. He was not granted special knowledge of the world. Contrary to what Shias believe, he was a simple man with a spiritual mission. It also descredits the Sunni doctrine that posits the innerancy of the Quran.

 

May Allah increase and knowledge.

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For me, the verse that speaks of shooting stars chasing away demons only proves Prophet Muhammad a fallible being. He was not granted special knowledge of the world. Contrary to what Shias believe, he was a simple man with a spiritual mission. It also descredits the Sunni doctrine that posits the innerancy of the Quran.

 

May Allah increase and knowledge.

 

Hang on,

 

It is talking about something metaphysical, we believe in angels don't we? In Jinn, and so on. Why can't some meteors be there to attack Jinn? Most granted are random, some may not be. It's not unscientific, it does not contradict logic, it merely requires faith in the existence of jinns really.

 

Secondly  , some believe it is metaphorical to mean astrologers.

Edited by Tawheed313

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Hang on,

 

It is talking about something metaphysical, we believe in angels don't we? In Jinn, and so on. Why can't some meteors be there to attack Jinn? Most granted are random, some may not be. It's not unscientific, it does not contradict logic, it merely requires faith in the existence of jinns really.

 

Secondly  , some believe it is metaphorical to mean astrologers.

 

How does a moving meteor, with physical properties, strike out a metaphysical creature that supposedly transcends time and space? I have no idea where people come up with these baseless explanations.

 

As to your second point, of course *some* scholars will resort to figurative explanations. What else can they do? There is no other way to explain these contradictions. It's what many Jews and Christians have been doing for centuries to save their inane beliefs. It's also an art mastered by the early Mu'tazila to reconcile Islam with Greek philosophy.

 

There's nothing to indicate it's a metaphor. But assuming it is, I'm still left questioning the eloquence of the Quran.

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To sum up my entire response- read what is in bold. That's all. Thank you :) 

 

I have read the quran and honestly, didn't think much of this verse. There's many others that should've made you stop and scratch your head before this, haha. 

What you've got to realise is this, the quran wasn't written for one people (tribe, time etc.) but all people. It can only do so much to suit the understanding and knowledge of the time and the people. The way it handles this, I find most intriguing. 

 

Going back to your question, on a first read, I would think the devils- shayateen- in this case was referring to evil. God "throws" (rojoom, according to my understanding of the arabic language, is like throwing a stone. It's an aggressive word) light on them, so we may seem them- hence the use of the word masabee7 (lamps). What makes you think lamps are stars alone? We have galaxies, our milky way and even closer, our own moon! But I am no 3alim. Saying this is fact, is kufr on my behalf. So I did some research. 

This is what I found: 

 

"Muhammad Asad's commentary on 67:5, in his translation and commentary to the Qur'an, reports that Baydawi also said that the allusion here is to astrologers, who are here denoted as "Satanic" due to their misguidance in trying to foretell the future.

Given this information, a clear understanding presents itself. Astrologers and soothsayers observe celestial phenomena, such as the positions of the planets and stars in the sky, and occurrences such as meteors (or "shooting stars"), in order to try to foretell the future. However, the Qur'an replies to them, saying that these people are "Satanic." It furthermore says (in 67:5) that, rather than being a source of guidance for them, these celestial phenomena are there to "stone" them. This means, their misuse of celestial phenomena, and misguidance, will be a source of punishment for them on that Day when all will be held to account." 

 

Source: answering-Christianity. Not the best, but still good. Hope this helped :) 

Edited by NoorA.95

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Another possible interpretation could be that the verses are talking about two differing phenomena and we have mistakenly conflated them.

 

Christian scholar Gabriel Said Reynolds:

 

When the Quran describes "lamps" (i.e. "stars" or "towers") as rujum, it does not mean that  they are missiles to be cast at demons, but rather that they are part of the celestial fortress that protects the heaven.

 

 

 
It is worth noting, however, that this shihab does not stone (rajama) the deamons or jinn. It pursues (atba'a) them. The stars meanwhile never perform this function.

 

 

 

A great part of his justification for this view rests upon the meaning of the word rujum in this context. To him it doesn't mean missiles/stones but things which act as barriers.

 

You can read a complete chapter on this subject here:

 

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=dKaLAgAAQBAJ&q=stars#v=snippet&q=stars&f=false

 

Although I really cannot agree with all that he has said, I think this differentiation of two separate phenomena is worth considering. I want to propose that this differentiation is actually indicated in the Quran. You may have to read his text before considering this suggestion.

 

The Quran talks about the chasing flame in three places where it seems like the flames are a secondary/additional defence mechanism which is preceded by a primary means of defence:

 

 

{Shakir 37:6} Surely We have adorned the nearest heaven with an adornment, the stars, 
{Shakir 37:7} And (there is) a safeguard against every rebellious Shaitan. 
{Shakir 37:8} They cannot listen to the exalted assembly and they are thrown at from every side, 
{Shakir 37:9} Being driven off, and for them is a perpetual chastisement, 
{Shakir 37:10} Except him who snatches off but once, then there follows him a brightly shining flame. 
 
Here it is stated that the shayaateen are thrown from every side so that they may not listen to the assembly. This is seemingly done to them prior to the chasing of the flame. However those that do manage to be somewhat successful, are driven off with a flame. 
 
 
{Shakir 15:16} And certainly We have made strongholds in the heaven and We have made it fair seeming to the beholders. 
{Shakir 15:17} And We guard it against every accursed Shaitan, 
{Shakir 15:18} But he who steals a hearing, so there follows him a visible flame. 
 
 
Similar to the previous set of verses, it seems like two different forms of guarding are employed. The first is a guarding and the second is the flame. However the second is employed for the ones who do manage to steal a hearing.
 
{Shakir 72:8} And that we sought to reach heaven, but we found it filled with strong guards and flaming stars
{Shakir 72:9} And that we used to sit in some of the sitting-places thereof to steal a hearing, but he who would (try to) listen now would find a flame lying in wait for him: 
 
It may be that this verse also indicates that there are two separate phenomena. i.e. the strong guards and the flames (the word stars is added by the translator and does not appear in the original).
 
There is one verse which is normally interpreted to mean that the stars/planets are the missiles:
 
{Shakir 67:5} And certainly We have adorned this lower heaven with lamps and We have made these missiles for the Shaitans, and We have prepared for them the chastisement of burning. 
 
However if we interpret the word rujum (missiles in that translation) in the way that Reynolds has done (or maybe even another way *), then it is not the case that these lamps are the missiles. 
 
* E.g. If rujum is interpreted as causes of confusion for the astrologers.
 
Criticism is very welcome.
Edited by Muhammed Ali

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Science has no classification for shooting stars. There's no such thing. A shooting star is what people back in the olden days believed in because they didn't know the difference between a star, comet, asteroid, meteorite, planet, etc. Except for the sun and moon, everything in the sky was a star - some of which were stationary and some of which moved by Allah's discretion (to chase demons, thus "shooting stars").

A lamp is also a source of light. Allah's idea of what gave light in the nightsky is contradictory to science. Planets reflect light, they do not emit light. But in the Quran, they and stars are the same category: both are lamps, meaning both are sources of light in the nightsky. The science here is rather primitive because it cannot distinguish between different cosmic objects. Not just that, but it assumes that all visible objects in the sky are lamps, ie sources of light, and hence of fiery elememts, and hence used as hurling objects at demonic entities. Whatever shoots across space has no light source infact, except for its tail, which is hardly visible unless very near to earth's orbital pull. The whole sky was decorated with lamps. These lamps are mostly stars by today's interpretation of science. And these lamps are collectively rujuman for the demons.

That tafsir had me confused, I must admit. It's rather an extraordinary interpretation of rujum and shayateen. Allah begins that passage by mentioning something literal in the nightsky, as lamps, decorating the sky. And then suddenly the passage shifts metaphorical and is interpreted as astrologists getting hit (in some form) by god's wrath.

It's an odd interpretation and has split the ayah into two halves. The first half where god clearly mentions how he decorated the nightsky with lamps, and then the second half which talks about astronomers getting hit by a guesswork that is associated to these physical lamps. If anything, the tafsir makes it look even more confusing.

Don't believe everything they say in science. How do you know that what scientists say is true, everything is taken at face value, all pictures of planets, galaxies etc are doctored CGI, they tell you this is what it is and everyone believes them as being truthful. The scientists have their not so hidden agenda to disprove the existence of God and creationism. Everyone is taught from an early age what the scientist say what is in the universe and how it came into being and what its made off. Everyone believes it as we are conditioned to at an early age. Anyone who thinks against their scientific "truths" is labelled a fruitcake.

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Its amazing all the interpretations you can get from 1 verse. When i read it the most apparent meaning to me is that 'devils' is a way of talking about the people who will be cast into the fire. Not devils as in non-human creatures, but human beings who are motivated by those aspects in themselves more aligned with satan than Allah. The chapter goes on to say how they will be asked if they recieved a warner and they will say " Yes, a warner had come to us, but we denied and said, ' Allah has not sent down anything. You are not but in great error.' ". This leads me to think that the people being referred to are people rejecting the Prophet(saw) at the time he was amongst them delivering the message. Could the 'missiles'  be referring to some of the weaponry being used in the warfare? were they using rocks as missiles to attack those who were attacking them?  or, could there have been a meteor/comet strike around the time that was known to the people in the area? if so, this verse could have served as a warning in relation to that (i.e rocks can fall out of the sky, they could fall out of the sky and hit you if you dont amend your behaviour).

 

Going a bit off topic here, but where was the black stone of the Kaaba found btw? was it known to be from space at the time?

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brother some things you just have to believe in Allah, his he not that created you from a sperm, then turned into a clot then then a lump of flesh then that lump fo flesh grew bones then you attained full strength ? 

there are alot of things you have to believe that can happen without us needing to know or explain how, if you havent read the whole quran yet, do you know that the stars the moon the sun go into sajood ? (prostation) though do we get to see them go into prostation ? no. do you know that their are angels on our shoulders that record or deeds ? do we see them ? no. do you know that their is an angel with his head in the heavens and his feet are on the earth ? there are alot of things that are considered to be in "ghaiba" (unseen) we dont have to worry about them. 

also to shed light to your cosmo knowledge, ill start of with saying not everything scientists concieve is to be real, meaning you shouldnt believe what they say and write about, an example is the passage your refering to, if these lamps are set to protect heaven that means heaven is behind those stars correct ? then when scientist predict that every star is a sun and every sun has their own planets this is bogus. because firstly they still havent created any tool to see a star close up nor have ever been able to reach any star to actually state that they are suns. they havnt even been to any planet other then mars. and stars are known to be light years away so how can they say they are suns and have their own planets and etc. ? basically mankind isnt meant to know what is outside the earth really, because if Allah wanted us to know these things he would have given this information to us though he gave us just enough about the stars the sun and the moon because we get to see them daily and without explaintion to what they are, mankind would begin to question their belief. 

also olden day times people use to believe they were holes into the heaven and if a man could be able to reach them he would enter heaven, so its actually good that Allah explained what they are, imagine if he didnt what ridiculous things would people have made up about them.

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بِسْمِ اللَّهِ الرَّحْمَٰنِ الرَّحِيم

29:43  وَتِلْكَ الْأَمْثَالُ نَضْرِبُهَا لِلنَّاسِ ۖ وَمَا يَعْقِلُهَا إِلَّا الْعَالِمُونَ

And such are the Parables/examples, We set forth for mankind, but only those can understand them, who have knowledge.

The above Ayat states that parables and examples that are set forth in Allah’s Book can be understood with people of knowledge only. Lets review some Ayas in this post, which were previously interpreted based on old dogmas and mainly carrying the theme that Jinns and Jinn Shiateen are supernatural creatures wandering the sky and they seems to be particularly fond of listening to angles’ meeting and when they do so, are targeted with flaming balls of fires to cast them away. Major problem with this interpretation is that it was assumed that Satan Jinns were supernatural spiritual beings. As you cannot beat a spiritual being with a stick or any material object, same way you cannot expel or beat a spiritual Jinn with balls of fire.

 

72:8-9  وَأَنَّا لَمَسْنَا السَّمَاءَ فَوَجَدْنَاهَا مُلِئَتْ حَرَسًا شَدِيدًا وَشُهُبًا  وَأَنَّا كُنَّا نَقْعُدُ مِنْهَا مَقَاعِدَ لِلسَّمْعِ ۖ فَمَن يَسْتَمِعِ الْآنَ يَجِدْ لَهُ شِهَابًا رَّصَدًا

‘And we pried into the sky; thus we found it filled with strong forces and fires. We  indeed, sat there in stations, for hearing; thus any who listens now finds a flaming fire following him.’

The above is a statement of Jinn nation. It is evident from above Ayat, that Jinns are those people from developed and technologically advanced nations of the world who hide a portion of their personalities/ideologies. They have explored the skies and found it to be having strong forces and containing extreme heat and energy. The technological advanced nations sends rockets and  satellites in space. Any nation who goes in space has to use rockets which are followed by hot burning flames of fire.

Image result for rocket going into space

37:6-10إِنَّا زَيَّنَّا السَّمَاءَ الدُّنْيَا بِزِينَةٍ الْكَوَاكِبِ  وَحِفْظًا مِّن كُلِّ شَيْطَانٍ مَّارِدٍ  لَّا يَسَّمَّعُونَ إِلَى الْمَلَإِ الْأَعْلَىٰ وَيُقْذَفُونَ مِن كُلِّ جَانِبٍ  دُحُورًا ۖ وَلَهُمْ عَذَابٌ وَاصِبٌ  إِلَّا مَنْ خَطِفَ الْخَطْفَةَ فَأَتْبَعَهُ شِهَابٌ ثَاقِبٌ

We have indeed adorned the lower heaven with planets/stars,- and guarded it against every rebellious satan.  They are not the listeners of the high command; and they are bombarded from  every side. Repulsed, for they are under a lasting  penalty, except one who snatches something away, he is pursued by a piercing  flame. 

The Satans/Shiateen are the mischievous technologically advanced people who hide part of their personalities. The atmospheric layer of the earth (the first sky) protects against harmful activities that they carry out on earth. It serves to mitigate by dispersing and recycling, the effects of pollution made by man on earth. The atmospheric layer of the earth protects earth against all harmful things such as meteorites entering earth atmosphere and it also protects against harmful objects made by technological advanced nations, an example of which is space junk falling off from their orbits to earth, which is burned before hitting the earth by bright fires.

The technologically advanced nations still lack significant knowledge about the magnificent Cosmos, however they pry to get information by sending space probes. In order to get this knowledge of space their space probes (rockets, satellites, shuttles)  need be trailed by piercing fire as they burn fuel, and they will be constantly targeted by objects of cosmos such as cosmic blasts of charged particles when they venture in space. The reference to Satan Jinns to be under perpetual penalty is a statement that the satans Jinns i.e those people of the technologically advanced nations who subscribe to atheistic philosophy don’t believe in the God and the Hereafter. Without divine guidance of purpose of life, they are always captives to the vicissitudes of worldly life. (Belief in hereafter mitigates the psychological effect of worldly problems as believers strive for a much larger span of life in Hereafter.)

Image result for rocket going into space

 

15:16-18 وَلَقَدْ جَعَلْنَا فِي السَّمَاءِ بُرُوجًا وَزَيَّنَّاهَا لِلنَّاظِرِينَ  وَحَفِظْنَاهَا مِن كُلِّ شَيْطَانٍ رَّجِيمٍ  إِلَّا مَنِ اسْتَرَقَ السَّمْعَ فَأَتْبَعَهُ شِهَابٌ مُّبِين

And We have made structures in the sky, and made it an adornment for the on-lookers; And We have guarded them from every out-casted Satan/divergent one. But any that gains a hearing by stealth, is pursued by a flaming bright fire

Again it is mentioned that the sky is well protected and for anyone prying in space to get  some knowledge, will be trailed by piercing fire. This is because they will have to use some equipment which will consume a lot of fuel to escape earth’s escape velocity and thereby will leave a trail of piercing fire before it.

67:5  وَلَقَدْ زَيَّنَّا السَّمَاءَ الدُّنْيَا بِمَصَابِيحَ وَجَعَلْنَاهَا رُجُومًا لِّلشَّيَاطِينِ ۖ وَأَعْتَدْنَا لَهُمْ عَذَابَ السَّعِيرٌِ

And we have adorned the lowest heaven with Lamps, and We have made it (the lower sky)  a thing to cast stones at Satans/mischievous ones, and we have prepared for them the scorching penalty

 En route to outer space, astronauts will be bombarded with cosmic radiation: tiny, high-energy atom fragments that whiz through space and can damage cells and DNA. People on Earth are protected from cosmic rays thanks to Earth’s magnetic field. Astronauts venturing in outer space risk all these dangers of radiations, asteroid belt, space junk, objects in space which can hit them and need take good protective measures against them.

 

Notes:

What are the Van Allen belts?

It’s common to think of space as an empty void, a vast emptiness filled with nothing but starlight and the hum of 13-billion-year-old background radiation left over from the Big Bang. Not true! Human eyes can’t see it, but the space inside the solar system is full of magnetic fields and tiny particles.

Solar flares, which are intense bursts of radiation from sunspots, and coronal mass ejections, which are bursts of gas and magnetic fields, erupt from the surface of the Sun. During these solar storms, a constantly changing stream of mostly electrons, protons and some heavier ions erupt from the Sun and streak across space at millions of kilometers per hour, often straight at Earth. This solar wind pummels our magnetosphere in geomagnetic storms.

Coronal mass ejections and Earth's magnetosphere

Coronal mass ejections and Earth’s magnetosphere

The sun occasionally throws huge coronal mass ejections – blobs of plasma and charged particles – toward the Earth where they can cause severe geomagnetic storms. The Van Allen Radiation belts lie in the Earth’s magnetosphere, which responds dramatically to solar activity.

Crucial protection

Precise observations from hundreds of energy levels, rather than just a few, will allow scientists to create a more precise and rigorous model of what, exactly, is going on in the radiation belts, both during geomagnetic storms and during periods of relative calm.

These findings have important implications for operating spacecraft, TV and weather satellites as well as national security ones. Understanding the shape and size of the belts, and how they shrink and swell in space weather, is crucial for protecting satellites and crewed spacecraft. Knowing exactly how much and what type of radiation is present in any given region of space will let enable scientists and engineers to design lighter and cheaper satellites tailored to withstand the specific radiation levels they’ll encounter.

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Salam...

Sometimes we read

 "A'uzu Billahi Minashaitanir Rajim." 

What really happen to Shaitans when we read the above verse???  If we really see it through our spiritual eyes... then we will see how the devils are hit inside and outside our souls.... shooting stars and lasers are hitting these devils.

Wallahu alam.

Layman.

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The Shaitan has been granted permission by Allah  to delude people (as their test) till an appointed time, so he will continue to be deluding people of the world till that time.

15:36-39  قَالَ رَبِّ فَأَنظِرْنِي إِلَىٰ يَوْمِ يُبْعَثُونَ  قَالَ فَإِنَّكَ مِنَ الْمُنظَرِينَ  إِلَىٰ يَوْمِ الْوَقْتِ الْمَعْلُومِ

(Iblis) said. "O my Lord! give me respite till the Day the (dead) are raised."(Allah) said. "Respite is granted to thee, Till the Day of the appointed time ."

Symbolically we do rajm or cast stones at Shaitan during Hajj, therefore he is labeled the stoned one.

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