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In the Name of God بسم الله

Borderline Personality Disorder?

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Salam,

I am curious to know what Islam says about borderline personality disorder? A Borderline personality disorder is a personality disorder marked by a prolonged disturbance of personality function, characterized by unusual variability and depth of moods. These moods may secondarily affect cognition and interpersonal relations.

Does Islam agree with the west in its diagnosis of this disorder? And does it agree that there is no cure for it? And if there is a cure for it then what is the cure?

Or is it that there is no such thing as personality disorders in Islam? Is it all the creation of mankind?

PS. Please if you can help enlighten me do so as I do need as much info as I can get about this.

Edited by Rose.Garden
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Ok. I started looking into this thread because i haven't paid much attention to BPD since my psychiatry rotation in college (though you see the odd case of that on medical wards as well). True i'm not

i can see where ur coming from but as humans, we have been made limited. through Allah swt's power, anything is achievable and by all means use this to strengthen your emaan but be wary of false hope.

Seriously people, Jinn? Man there is so many mental illnesses going around just look at al the pollution, the food we eat, all the chemicals we process, all the un healthiness, all the drugs(prescribe

Salaam I dont know much but wanted to add something . Some of these problems like bipolar the western medicine doesn't explain properly. From what I noticed it's a possibility of jins and things like that as well. I witnessed a link that always in the " crazy hospitals" people talk about the heavy presence of jins. Why? What's so special about the crazy people's hospital?

It's the craziness which they couldn't diagnose

They do excorsiem ithink to rid the body of it but my knowledge of this is very limited

Edited by alimohamad40
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the "west's" definition of it is as best described as a "disorder" because its not a disease. ur personality is something inherent to u and there is very little that can be changed once its developed. i dont know much detail about how a personality develops but its mainly a combination of the genes u r born with and ur lifes experiences especially in the early years (ie your upbringing and the people around u). please correct me if i am wrong but islam doesnt have an answer to everything. for example there is not an "islamic" view on brain cancer and how to treat it. similarly, i dont think there is an islamic answer for u to seek in this case.

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I think there is a cure to everything in Islam we are just too ignorant to know it. Do you know that we have the potential to perform acts that others might think it is impossible to do so. Allah subhanu has in us this huge source of light that if used can bring forward great changes and achievements.

Now in regards to jins and how people with these disorders are thought of as having jins in them I did read about something very similar to that. There is this book which is called "Cure using the Quraan" Jihaad al nafes NO NO NO to shaytan; and the author of this book is Abo-hamam Al-huseini. It is in Arabic. Well in the book he treated such cases and even people that were tooo lazy it turned out there was a jin in them and he would remove the jin bu reading ayat Quraan. He even had conversations with the jin.

I was wondering how true is that? And is it really the cure for these kind of disorders?

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In Islam, a type of mental disorder that is recognized is a complete loss of sanity, and this is the most severe form of mental disorder. There are special rules applicable for such people and how they should be treated in society.

I think it falls under Pyschosis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosis

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Yes that is the most extreme case. But there other disorders that aren't considered "crazy or insane" such as borderline personality disorder. I wonder if the prophet PBUH ever had cases like that in which he cured. And what is the relationship between the jins and insanity or even the jins and borderline disorder?

If anyone has any ahadith as well that they can provide I would really appreciate!

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I think there is a cure to everything in Islam we are just too ignorant to know it. Do you know that we have the potential to perform acts that others might think it is impossible to do so. Allah subhanu has in us this huge source of light that if used can bring forward great changes and achievements.

i can see where ur coming from but as humans, we have been made limited. through Allah swt's power, anything is achievable and by all means use this to strengthen your emaan but be wary of false hope.

the reason why some ppl who suffer from psychiatric disorders may describe jinns is because delusions and hallucinations are often congruent to the person's upbringing. for example, a deeply religious shizophrenic may develop visual hallucinations of jinns. im not saying jinns don't exist but i think its dangerous to say that such people can be cured by reading Quran alone because it is more likely that they have an underlying psychiatric condition.

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Yes that is the most extreme case. But there other disorders that aren't considered "crazy or insane" such as borderline personality disorder. I wonder if the prophet PBUH ever had cases like that in which he cured. And what is the relationship between the jins and insanity or even the jins and borderline disorder?

There's no connection between borderline personality disorder with Jinns. These people don't exhibit any of the symptoms "usually" associated with being possessed by the Jinns.

a deeply religious shizophrenic may develop visual hallucinations of jinns. im not saying jinns don't exist but i think its dangerous to say that such people can be cured by reading Quran alone because it is more likely that they have an underlying psychiatric condition.

I've seen this happening with real people. It's strange that they see angels and Jinns. The schizophrenia's hallucination revolves on what he perceive as reality and that thing can be anything.

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I think there is a cure to everything in Islam we are just too ignorant to know it.

Indeed there is a cure for everything except death. Devoted practice of Islamic teachings give prevention and healing over time to the practitioner. For emphasized and quicker healing you'll need to find the spiritual practitioners who are skillful at imbuing people with Quranic passages, for example, to help them heal and recover from so many diseases. Unfortunately such people are obscure people and need to be found. There are a lot of frauds masking as spiritual people who are only in to make money from peoples' ignorance by playing with their psychology, like exorcists etc.

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In the book I mentioned above a guy comes to this religious imam and tells him that he used to be very successful in school, get high marks and was a devout muslim. All of the sudden he became very lazy and not wanting to study etc..So the imam lied him down and started reading Quranic verses on him starting with Surah al-Baqara. The guy started turning yellow and starting yawning and begged the Imam to stop reading those verses. Not only that the Imam made conversation with the jin. I am going to type up his story which is very interesting so you see what I mean. I am not talking about bipolar, schizophrenia or insanity that is difficult to cure but not impossible through Allah Subhanu's will. I am talking about extreme laziness, extreme shift in mood and thinking like borderline personality disorder. These things I am talking about.

Edited by Rose.Garden
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If you want to know about schizophrenics i could give you an insight into the whole experience as i am one, have been diagnosed ( not just by myself but a doctor) and it runs in my family ( maternal side)i dont take meds but mostly recite Duas when things get out of hand.

I may still have some sanity left because i am scared of being held accountable for the things that i do and dont when i die.

our perception is quite different when it comes to things like Jinns and demons, I personally dont see strange things flying around etc ( i can if i want to delude myself or if i concentrate on something for long it starts to shapeshift), hallucinations are not that scary but reality in itself is pretty scary/intense/beautiful , ofcourse one might think that we have an altered vision of reality but that is not the case,we see the meaning in animate or inanimate object thru the history of its becoming and not by its visual representation( for a normal person its a very difficult thing to grasp)

anyways if i can be of any help then ask away.

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There is a hadeeth where the prophet walked past a group of people that was trying to exorcise a "jinn" out of some person, and the prophet stopped and asked the people what they were doing

and they precisely responded that they were freeing him from evil spirits, the Prophet then said stop stop this man is mentally deficient and he needs treatment for that, he is not possessed by jinn

Imams have said that all diseases come from the stomach and we are told the Quran is a healing for all illneses, and also there is many hadeth which say that for every illness Allah created a cure, why? because in the Quran Surah Yaseen Allah says he creates things in pairs, so for every single thing there is a cure that is for certain, and since Allah created disease/illness/ etc then clearly there it cannot fall out of this divine law, its just a matter of finding it

on that topic Imam Ali said that every disease is in the human and every cure is within the human as well, just like he said all knowledge is within the human, in fact he also said that the whole universe is within the human (and specifically it points to the heart or Qalb of the human when it is mentioned)

one more thing i think is relevant, there is hadeeth which says that all knowledge we have currently fall under two branches, and when the Qaim returns he will unveil another 70 branches of knowledge , so clearly we as humans have a long way to go when it comes to discovering knowledge of us and the universe and perhaps all the diseases and cures

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Brother/Sister No body I salute you for having the courage and the persistence to do all you can to deal with your situation and to become a better person. May Allah reward you for all your hard effort and free you from your illness. I am starting to see that there is actually both a mental illness as well as there is instance where the jinns play a part. But how can you tell whether or not it is a mental illness or some black magic done to you or jinn. For instance the young man I was talking about with extreme laziness did not know he was possessed with jinn he had no signs such as seeing flying things or creatures. It wasn't until the Imam found out he was possessed by reading on him Quranic verses. I will share with you the story and the conversation that went on between the Imam and the jinn as soon as I have it translated to English myself.

I will be asking a Marja3 soon what he thinks of all this and I will share that with you as well. As for the Imam Mahdi AJ. what I know that there are 23 letters in knowledge and we only have I believe 3 out of the 23 letters now. And when he comes out we will have all of it. OHHHHHHH I CAN'T WAIT FOR HIS RETURN! ALLAHUMA AJEL FARAJU and make us his helpers at his time of need :angel:

Edited by Rose.Garden
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Brother/Sister No body I salute you for having the courage and the persistence to do all you can to deal with your situation and to become a better person. May Allah reward you for all your hard effort and free you from your illness. I am starting to see that there is actually both a mental illness as well as there is instance where the jinns play a part. But how can you tell whether or not it is a mental illness or some black magic done to you or jinn.

i actually am convinced that my condition is Jinn related and some magic involved ( i have spent a considerable amount of time trying to get grips with what magic is) its all around you, its just that i have opened myself to it consciously, i just didnt see the point in resisting, i know there are people who can cure me, i have come across a few, i just choose not to be cured cuz that wouldnt be fair to the Jinns, i dont want to drive them away, i want them to be healed too...see my thought process is strange :)

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If you're looking for an "Islamic" response/understanding to the disorder - you're gonna have some difficulty 'cause 1) The collections of symptoms identified as "borderline" is a western diagnosis - and you may not find anything identified as such in any primary Islamic literature ... 2) how symptoms are classified and then labeled is done in a primarily urban western (North American/European - mostly White) context - other cultures may or may not have a similar grouping of symptoms... (for example Mexicans identify a condition they call "nervios" that is a combination of depression and anxiety - in the Mexican context, they have one word for this combination of symptoms, in white-western context, they are considered two separate diagnosis)...

However, you may find, if you shift through the hadith literature symptoms that people came to the Prophet and Imams with, and the remedies they recommended... that may begin to help you do a comparative analyses ...

Please do share any responses you get from the Maraja - I'd be very interested if they responses that are uniquely Islamic, or if they just refer you to a psychologist and/or a psychiatrist...

Edited by skylight2
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No body jinns are not supposed to interfere with humans nor associate with them and that is how Allah Subhanu commanded. The jinns that do enter humans bodies or associate with them are bad jinns just like we have good and bad humans. Good jinns pray for Allah Subhanu and follow all the rules provided to them. Jinns also come in different religions so you can have a muslim jinn, a jewish jinn and a christian jinn. If you are able to cure yourself then Allah will hold you accountable for not taking those steps to get cured. So if you think it is black magic then go see someone who can help cure you. Imagine a life free from all what you have been living through..there is hope out there you just have to grab it B)

Skylight2 it was the book that I was reading that made me think of all this. But I thought about all these mental disorders out there how they never existed 100 years ago. They actually had studies done in which a normal person went to a psychiatrist and describe how he/she was feeling and how the psychiatrist would put a LABEL "Oh you have this disorder and that disorder" when in reality there was nothing wrong with that person. What I believe the issue is a weakness in Eman which creates all these disorder. We must have a strong Akeeda and I believe that this is the key to solving many of our problems. For example we all have mood swings right?? So can I go and say to you "Oh you have borderline personality??" What if your Akeeda was just weak so you did not have a strong "Mabda2" or in English fixed strong values so you are always changing in how you think and feel. Are you getting what I'm trying to say?? I'm trying to go much deeper than what is on the surface.

And for sure once I get an answer from the Marja3 I will let you know :rolleyes:

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i actually am convinced that my condition is Jinn related and some magic involved ( i have spent a considerable amount of time trying to get grips with what magic is) its all around you, its just that i have opened myself to it consciously, i just didnt see the point in resisting, i know there are people who can cure me, i have come across a few, i just choose not to be cured cuz that wouldnt be fair to the Jinns, i dont want to drive them away, i want them to be healed too...see my thought process is strange :)

Its not strange to me at all. I know a few possessed people. Thing is, that as time passes it will become more difficult to recover you and ultimately it will become next to impossible. They can't heal. They'll simply keep feeding and keep playing through you. You're their vehicle. If they haven't already, then soon they will start changing your personal reality and your environment and the people close to you in horrible ways and you will think that its alright. If there's any sanity left in you then gather your will and your wits and find a way to get rid of them now.

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Seriously people, Jinn? Man there is so many mental illnesses going around just look at al the pollution, the food we eat, all the chemicals we process, all the un healthiness, all the drugs(prescribed) we take, and your surprised we get born with deficiencies such as mental or physical, not to mention all the stuff that was released from labs or just managed to escaped by air or whatever seriously stop with all the grandma talk

The reason the oldies would talk about Jinns is because they are from an uneducated era, we now know how chemicals affects , second hand smoking, you dont think all this does damage to us? We are biological on the outside, and all those chemicals we process, im surprised were not all dead. and its impossible to enumerate all the chemicals which do exist and what effects they have on us

Jinns this jinns that, as if Jinns have nothing to do but to make people ill and stop there. If they had any ill intent and the ability and harboured such hate, wouldnt they just kill you? Why do it so forth, and why isnt every one of these so called "jinn" related causes not the same? why are some so extreme while others minimum, it just doesnt make any logical sense and if you believe it, here is some advice, go buy a biology book and learn about the human body, once you done that, you will finally undertstand the complex and millions of processes that go on every milli second which keep you able and alive, and then subtract or add chemicals which we induce or inhale or soak up through our skin from the external industrial world, and then tell me that everything is okay there that it is still Jinn

Some of you people seriously snap out of it

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Skylight2 it was the book that I was reading that made me think of all this. But I thought about all these mental disorders out there how they never existed 100 years ago. They actually had studies done in which a normal person went to a psychiatrist and describe how he/she was feeling and how the psychiatrist would put a LABEL "Oh you have this disorder and that disorder" when in reality there was nothing wrong with that person. What I believe the issue is a weakness in Eman which creates all these disorder. We must have a strong Akeeda and I believe that this is the key to solving many of our problems. For example we all have mood swings right?? So can I go and say to you "Oh you have borderline personality??" What if your Akeeda was just weak so you did not have a strong "Mabda2" or in English fixed strong values so you are always changing in how you think and feel. Are you getting what I'm trying to say?? I'm trying to go much deeper than what is on the surface.

the reason why people didnt "have" certain mental disorders 100 years ago was that some psychiatric conditions had not been classified...not that they didnt exist but that that the collection of symptoms was not labelled as a particular condition.

saying that those who develop a psychiatric illness are deficient in eman is prejudiced. most psychological illnesses have a clear biological basis (hormone/neurotransmitter imbalance) whilst others are being heavily researched for biological basis. often there is a genetic link as well as your upbringing and life experiences predisposing individuals to certain mental illnesses.

as i said before, a personality disorder isnt classed as a psychiatric illness. it is just an extreme form of a personality. im not saying that an individual can not change their personality through will power etc but western medicine does not ascribe to a "treatment" for personality disorders as they are considered to be inherent to an individual.

im not a fan of the jinn theories but i guess each to their own. i will not comment on this.

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Seriously people, Jinn? Man there is so many mental illnesses going around just look at al the pollution, the food we eat, all the chemicals we process, all the un healthiness, all the drugs(prescribed) we take, and your surprised we get born with deficiencies such as mental or physical, not to mention all the stuff that was released from labs or just managed to escaped by air or whatever seriously stop with all the grandma talk

The reason the oldies would talk about Jinns is because they are from an uneducated era, we now know how chemicals affects , second hand smoking, you dont think all this does damage to us? We are biological on the outside, and all those chemicals we process, im surprised were not all dead. and its impossible to enumerate all the chemicals which do exist and what effects they have on us

Jinns this jinns that, as if Jinns have nothing to do but to make people ill and stop there. If they had any ill intent and the ability and harboured such hate, wouldnt they just kill you? Why do it so forth, and why isnt every one of these so called "jinn" related causes not the same? why are some so extreme while others minimum, it just doesnt make any logical sense and if you believe it, here is some advice, go buy a biology book and learn about the human body, once you done that, you will finally undertstand the complex and millions of processes that go on every milli second which keep you able and alive, and then subtract or add chemicals which we induce or inhale or soak up through our skin from the external industrial world, and then tell me that everything is okay there that it is still Jinn

Some of you people seriously snap out of it

Do I poke my nose into your gay poetry threads and other banal point of views? No? Its because thats the right thing to do for a person. I let them be. You should learn and try to do the same. If your almighty medical science and psychiatric treatments and drugs were all so simple and effective then they wouldn't fail a majority of the time in treating actual mental disorders (and no the fat woman's poodle dying and her "depression" getting treated with prozacs is not an achievement for psychiatry). "Chemical pollutants" my freckled butt.

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I am gathering as much information about this topic from an islamic point of view. I will have an answer from a marja3 by tomorrow InshAllah. And yes I am not denying that some of the is biological but that is only a small percentage. I am in a rush so I do not have much time to expand on what I am saying..Will do so soon :rolleyes:

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It can be treated and in a lot of cases, people do get better. See a marja if thats what you really want but for the love of God, please also see a doctor. Therapy has been proven to work for many people (not all), so has medication but that should be a last resort. Really, it's in their best interests to even just get assessed and see what can be done. No one is forcing you to continute the treatment indefinitely or get treated at all but it is really important to consult a healthcare professional. Some of the advice here has the potential to cause serious harm.

Depression, borderline personality disorders etc are as biological as diabetes. You don't tell a diabetic to stop babying themselves or stop being weak with all this insulin stuff. You get them treated. All mental health issues have a basis in the brain (surprise) which is an organ like the diabetics pancreas. Illnesses of this nature can be absolutely horrible, arguably moreso than somatic (of the body) illnesses. All of us here want the same thing, we want someone to get better, we want someone to get well. There is no real reason why you can't have both spirituality and modern medicine.

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Kingpomba I DO NOT HAVE any mental disorder or any of these signs. I just read a book about Using Quran to cure people from jinn. As well as jinn and the relation between diseases both mental and physical and how people were cured by the Imam reading Quranic verses on them so I was curious to know how true is that??

I will also show this book to Marja3 to see if in fact this book is a fake or it is a trusted one.The book is called "Cure using the Quraan" Jihaad al nafes NO NO NO to shaytan; and the author of this book is Abo-hamam Al-huseini.

Do you know of this book?

Edited by Rose.Garden
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i actually am convinced that my condition is Jinn related and some magic involved

With all due respect bro/sis, but that's a load of hogwash. Jinn's can't posses you, and God didn't give humans or jinns the ability to perform magic, and there's no ahadith that prove as such. The most He allowed was Iblees to do waswasa, but not bodily possession. Don't fall into the trap of believing these old wives tales.

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ofcourse i know they are not trying to destroy me, as for magic we have a very skewed understanding of what magic is, like i said i have spent a considerable amout of time trying to figure out what magic is and how its done.

I accepted that i am insane but i didnt confess to being stupid :)

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Do I poke my nose into your gay poetry threads and other banal point of views? No? Its because thats the right thing to do for a person. I let them be. You should learn and try to do the same. If your almighty medical science and psychiatric treatments and drugs were all so simple and effective then they wouldn't fail a majority of the time in treating actual mental disorders (and no the fat woman's poodle dying and her "depression" getting treated with prozacs is not an achievement for psychiatry). "Chemical pollutants" my freckled butt.

So you want to believe that the source of the problem is Jinn, for which there really is no prescription, and as if the Jinn somehow are superior to us and we at the mercy of them, as if whenever they please they can waltz right into your body and turn you insane. This goes against the freedom of life and the purpose of life, and just sounds like ignorant mumbo jumbo

actually there is a Jinn possession and it is been demonstrated right here, Iblees and his Jinn minions are whispering discord amongst us and turning us against each other by filling our heads up with these whispers of disarray in order to disunite us and make us turn against each other, while making us feed pride and arrogance in our selves

so yeah in that regard there definitely is Jinn involved now here

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Ya Aba3abdillah I am unable to make more posts as it keeps telling me that I have only 1 left..Anyways can you fix this please?? OR do I have to wait until I post 18 more approved posts..As you can see I am not a spammer so can you please lift up this restriction? Thanks!

Edited by Rose.Garden
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So I asked about this and this is what I was told. The personality of a person is a combination of genetics and the environment. It can be changed by changing your environment and strengthening your Akeeda and following Allah's will in living your life. In regards to the jinn yes there are instance were they have possessed people but these are few cases. It has also been known that people that deal with jinn "taskheer al jinn" either they loose their loved ones or bad things happen to them. It is Moharam to deal with them unless you need to do so to undue black magic.

**Bottom line read Surah Al-falaq and Al-nas and Al-kafroun to protect yourself from the hasad, the jinn and other people. Have the will to change, strengthen your akeeda and that would create stability and happiness in your life. May Allah grant us the strength to bring forward changes without giving up!! DO NOT GIVE UP!! TAKE IT ONE STEP AT A TIME :rolleyes:

PS. I got my answer from a Sayid but I haven't had the chance to speak to a Marja3 yet!

Edited by Rose.Garden
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salams,

Hadith tells us that for every illness Allah sent a cure and He sent it before He sent the illness... i can get the exact citation if you want it.

As a clinical social worker I can only tell you not to let 'diagnosis' and all that bother you too much. It is just a tool to identify a problem the person is having so we can figure out how to help people make things better. Technically personality disorders are with the person long term as it is a part of the personality. Other diagnoses are can be either short or long lived. From teh social work approach it is not all that analytical things about the psyche and toilet training! Rather it is simply looking at the whole enchilada (helal please!) of the persons life and finding out all the way to make things better... learning life skills, finding untreated medical problems and getting them treated... and much more.

Don't think of it as 'crazy' or whatever. Everyone can be diagnosed. Relax, get to a counselor if possible (know that all counselors are not good - just like mechanics and doctors). See if they havae a practical down to earth approach and yoiu are comfortable with them. and of course ask Allah and your Imam a.s. for help!

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no no, i know that bro, but trust me, no one is working magic on you, and jinns aren't trying to destroy you. There's no such thing.

And how do you know? I'm not saying he is bewitched but I'm curious to know how you ruled out that possibility.

With all due respect bro/sis, but that's a load of hogwash. Jinn's can't posses you, and God didn't give humans or jinns the ability to perform magic, and there's no ahadith that prove as such. The most He allowed was Iblees to do waswasa, but not bodily possession. Don't fall into the trap of believing these old wives tales.

You should get the Abu Hanifah Prize for conjecture. You can't ever have enough of your arrogance, can you? How do you live with yourself.

So you want to believe that the source of the problem is Jinn, for which there really is no prescription, and as if the Jinn somehow are superior to us and we at the mercy of them, as if whenever they please they can waltz right into your body and turn you insane. This goes against the freedom of life and the purpose of life, and just sounds like ignorant mumbo jumbo

You have freedom? You're actually free and you have sovereignty over your life? Wow. That's so envious brah. And no I don't know that the source of problem is Jinn or magic. But it is most certainly a possibility.

If Mr. Perfect the Mullah can't find a sahih hadith about something, then he's free to believe whatever he wants, but in reality it doesn't change a thing. Closing your eyes like a pigeon doesn't mean the cat will walk away. Magic is as real as a virus in a computer and just like the hackers who can waltz into your unprotected system and then screw it up, so can magicians and their jinn partners do something similar to people if they are given enough favorable conditions for enough time, i.e., lack of protection. The simplest yet among the most effective protections against such things is continuous Tahaarat and regular offering of prayers. But that is a preventive or passive measure against it.

People from Hawza Qum and famous Shi'ite scholars both modern and classical ones like Sheikh Saduq have both offered narrations and their own comments on the paranormal and magic. It is only peoples' ignorance that they either do not read or simply wish to live in denial. IA I'm working on a thread about Spirituality and there I will make sure to provide the proper mullah stuff in order to educate or deter the arrogant and the ignorant.

Edited by Darth Vader
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could someone please explain to me what these islamic rituals are? look up the meaning of ritual in a dictionary then tell me what is the logic behind them ( programming your subconscious ?)

I can invoke rain and earthquakes and i am not even into rituals, does that mean i am not human? :P

@darth its been 20 years and i am doing fine bro, for me this is a test and i wont let "words" ( with all due respect to the muwakils of those words)come between me and my God,the harder it gets the closer i feel to Him ,so its more than worth it.

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