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In the Name of God بسم الله

How Did Imam Al-baqir And Imam Al-sadiq Pray?

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HOW IMAM BAQIR PRAY

nor did I say nor does it say in the hadith that imam ali folded his hands.

Here is hadith again:

Narrated Ali ibn AbuTalib: AbuJuhayfah said: Ali said that it is a sunnah to place one hand on the other in prayer below the navel.

Imam ali SAID it is sunnah it doesn't say he did it himself.

Bit like saying I tell my friend it is a good thing to eat 5 fruit and veg a day because I heard doctor say it, (similarly imam ali heard or seen prophet pbuh pray in this manner)thatdoesn't necessarily mean I do it myself.

Also nowhere in that hadith does it say eg; imam ali used to fold hands it just says he SAID, ADVISED that's it.

 

Advised? The hadith is very Weak.

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Please read the following and stop making assumption, when are you going to provide us with actual proof.

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Muhammad b. `Ali b. al Husain (Shaykh al Saduq in al-Faqih) with his chains from Hammad b. `Isa, that he said: Abu `Abdillah  (as) said to me one day: Do you know how to pray, O Hammad? He said: I said: O my master! I comply with the Book of Hariz about prayer (therein is an account of Hariz for the preservation (?) of the Book and his narration and that is only for acting upon it, and the statements about that and its examples are more than can be enumerated, and parts of that will appear in the Book of Judgment etcetera – from it, certain differences (?) in the margin of the manuscript). He said: So he  (as) said: Worry not! Stand and pray. He said: So I stood in front of him, facing the Qiblah. Then I commenced the prayer and I bowed and I prostrated. So he  (as) said: O Hammad! You do not know how to pray. How repulsive is it for a man (in the copy of al Kafi: بالرجل منكم – for a man among you) to have had sixty years or seventy years pass him by, and he has not established a single prayer with all its limits?! Hammad said: So abasement befell me within and I said: May I be sacrificed for you! Please teach me the prayer. So Abu `Abdillah  (as)stood facing the Qiblah, erect. Then he placed both his hands together on his thighs, his fingers joined together and he drew his feet near until they were three digits apart. And he turned, with all the toes of his feet together (in al Tahdheeb: جميعاً القبلة – in the margin of the manuscript), neither of his feet deflected from the Qiblah, with submissiveness and complete surrender (tranquility), and said: Allah is Greater (Allaahu Akbar)! Then he recited Surat al Hamd and Qul Huwa Allahu Ahad (Surat al Ikhlas) with the intonation (tarteel). Then he paused a little for a measure of one breath while he was standing. Then (in the Masdar, extra: رفع يديه حيال وجهه و- he raised his hands opposite his face and) he said: Allah is Greater (Allaahu Akbar), while he was standing. Then he bowed and spread his palms over the knees and pushed his knees backwards until his back was straight; were a drop of water or fat to be poured on him, it would not slide down due to the straightening of his back and the pushing (in the Masdar and the copy, in the margin of the manuscript: ورد) back of his knees, and he erected his neck (in the margin of the Asl: ومد في عنقه – and he stretched his neck) and looked down. Then he glorified thrice with tarteel and said: Allah listens to the one who praises Him (Sami`allaahu liman Hamidah). Then he recited the takbeer while he was standing and raised his hands opposite his face. And he prostrated and placed his hands on the ground prior to his knees and said: Purified (glorified) is my Lord, the Most High, and I praise Him (SubHaana rabbiya 'l-a`laa wa biHamdih), thrice, and he did not place (i.e. rest) anything (any part) of his body against anything from it. And he prostrated upon eight major (parts): the forehead and the palms and the kneecaps and the tips of the big toes of the feet and the nose; then these are seven, plenty (viz. seven are required). And the positioning of the nose over the earth is recommended. And it is (out of) compulsion (i.e., the nose is forced to rub the ground when the forehead is on the ground). Then he raised his head from prostration and when he was seated, he said: Allaahu Akbar! Then he sat on his left side and he placed the outside of his right foot over the inside of his left foot, and said: I seek forgiveness of Allah, my Lord and I turn towards (repent unto) Him (Astaghfirullaaha Rabbee wa atoobu ilayh). Then he recited the takbeer while he was seated and he prostrated a second time and said what he had said in the first and he did not resort to anything from his body against another from it either in the ruku` or the sujud, and he was winged (i.e., the placement of his hands appeared as if there were wings on either side) and he did not place his arms on the ground. Then he prayed the second rak`ah similarly, then said: O Hammad! Pray this way. And do not turn, nor play with your hands or your fingers and do not spit from your right nor (in the copy: ولا عن – nor from – in the margin of the manuscript) your left nor in front of you.

 

http://www.tashayyu....-and-etiquettes 

Edited by TheIslamHistory
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(bismillah)

 

Hamza Yusuf mentions this hadith in the video^. He said it's a weak hadith.

 

في أمان الله

 

I dont know why he keeps on repeating the same hadith over and over :P

He was suppose to go research and come back... he keeps coming back empty handed...

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Potentially an interesting hadith in the context of this thread:

 

Sahih Bukhari 1.507:
Narrated Ghailan:
Anas said, "I do not find (now−a−days) things as they were (practiced) at the time of the Prophet." Somebody said "The prayer (is as it was.)" Anas said, "Have you not done in the prayer what you have done?"

 

Narrated Az−Zuhri that he visited Anas bin Malik at Damascus and found him weeping and asked him why he was weeping. He replied, "I do not know anything which I used to know during the lifetime of Allah's Apostle except this prayer which is being lost (not offered as it should be).

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Shias are hung up on trying to convince the world that Hz Umar  (ra) instituted clasping hands.

If Imam Malik is correct they were all still praying hands down up to his time and this was well after the death of Hz Umar and in fact all the Khilafa Rashidoon.

 

If indeed the Khariji do pray with their hands down thi is further proof that hands at your side was the more common approach because they are one of the earliest recorded formal splits in Islam.

 

Kharijis formed their own kingdoms and institution in N Africa. They never recognised the Caliphs. And it is my my surmise that either the Abbasides or the Ommayads who instituted the hand clasping and effectively obliterated the early history of Sunnis clasping hands.

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Shias are hung up on trying to convince the world that Hz Umar  (ra) instituted clasping hands.

If Imam Malik is correct they were all still praying hands down up to his time and this was well after the death of Hz Umar and in fact all the Khilafa Rashidoon.

 

If indeed the Khariji do pray with their hands down thi is further proof that hands at your side was the more common approach because they are one of the earliest recorded formal splits in Islam.

 

Kharijis formed their own kingdoms and institution in N Africa. They never recognised the Caliphs. And it is my my surmise that either the Abbasides or the Ommayads who instituted the hand clasping and effectively obliterated the early history of Sunnis clasping hands.

 

Certain Shias may think it was `Umar who instituted hand clasping, but I don't, partly for the reasons you mentioned.

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Shias are hung up on trying to convince the world that Hz Umar  (ra) instituted clasping hands.

If Imam Malik is correct they were all still praying hands down up to his time and this was well after the death of Hz Umar and in fact all the Khilafa Rashidoon.

 

If indeed the Khariji do pray with their hands down thi is further proof that hands at your side was the more common approach because they are one of the earliest recorded formal splits in Islam.

 

Kharijis formed their own kingdoms and institution in N Africa. They never recognised the Caliphs. And it is my my surmise that either the Abbasides or the Ommayads who instituted the hand clasping and effectively obliterated the early history of Sunnis clasping hands.

non sense.

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786

I have a theory I would like to share and maybe the members who are strong in the science of Hadith can pursue it.

If you study Jewish jurisprudence, they pray towards al-Quds, orient their synagogues towards the city and pray Salaat daily with their arms crossed and rise and bow without using their arms similar to some Al-Sunnah. Now when Islam was first introduced, the Muslims did similar things as the Jews and then changed to distinguish themselves when ordered via the verse of Quran. This may have caused the difference because of lack of communication and possibly the Omayyad's fitnah later.

Allah (swt) knows best!

Was salaam

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How did Imaam Baqir (as) and Imaam Sadiq (as) pray??? Very simple, just like the Prophet (pbuh). And that is with their hands open and by their sides. Why??? Because this is based on nature, is natural behaviour and what comes naturally. Islam is based on nature and doesn't go against it. Praying with your hands folded and where they should be positioned, is a tradition cicked off by somebody. Praying in such a manner is traditional and not natural. Just as simple as that. No need to go into this or that.

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the proto-sunnis were cut off from the guidance of Ameer ul Mumineen (as). 

 

Only after a century later he was incorporated as the 4th Rightly Guided Caliph. Ahlul Sunnah was coined and perfected by the Ummayad oppressors and in particular Hujjaj bin Yusuf Al-Thaqafi (la). 

 

Ameer ul Mumineen (as) has to be re-moulded to fit into this patchy framework of Caliphs and also the newly crystallised concept of "the justice of the Sahaba"

 

Most of the narrations from the Amma (modern day sunni) which does not come through the Shi'as of Ameer ul Mumineen (as) is mostly fabricated. 

 

 

Due to the political upheaval, many in Syria did not know how to perform Salah and ignorance prevailed. Islam has gone through deadly civil wars to the extent the Kabbah was demolished. Bear that in mind.

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the proto-sunnis were cut off from the guidance of Ameer ul Mumineen (as). 

 

Only after a century later he was incorporated as the 4th Rightly Guided Caliph. Ahlul Sunnah was coined and perfected by the Ummayad oppressors and in particular Hujjaj bin Yusuf Al-Thaqafi (la). 

 

Ameer ul Mumineen (as) has to be re-moulded to fit into this patchy framework of Caliphs and also the newly crystallised concept of "the justice of the Sahaba"

 

Most of the narrations from the Amma (modern day sunni) which does not come through the Shi'as of Ameer ul Mumineen (as) is mostly fabricated. 

 

 

Due to the political upheaval, many in Syria did not know how to perform Salah and ignorance prevailed. Islam has gone through deadly civil wars to the extent the Kabbah was demolished. Bear that in mind.

 

So you are in agreement that all the early Khalifa prior to the Ummayads performed Salah with their arms open and it was probably the Ummayads or Abbasides who instituted arm clasping

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So you are in agreement that all the early Khalifa prior to the Ummayads performed Salah with their arms open and it was probably the Ummayads or Abbasides who instituted arm clasping

 

 
Yes, Shi'is and Sunnis are so obsessed about the Khulafa that they forgot the "contribution" of Banu Ummaya. 
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Only an idiot blindly follows what a scholar says. The key is what argument the scholar uses, and this is what you need to deal with. A Hadith being 'sahih' doesn't mean that it was said with certainty, does it?

So what you need to ask yourself is if Imam Ali did indeed fold his arms in prayer, then why do other narration say he did sadl, as well as Imam al-Hasan (as), Muhammad al-Baqir (as), Jafar as-Sadiq (as), Musa al-Kadhim (as), Ali ar-Rida (as), ...

Pretty strange that all his most famous descendants would be praying differently to how he did, including his children. Additionally, both the Shia and Khawarij pray like that. Why would the Shia pray differently to the person they claim to follow? The Khawarij originated from the camp of Imam Ali (as), so why would they do sadl while he did qabd?

Rather than following narrations blindly, you need to use your brain, and study the issue objectively. At least listen to the lecture and hear the arguments before coming to a conclusion.

Correct me if I'm wrong but one of the distinctions of the Khawarij is that they finally only accepted the first two caliphs so even in their time (the time of Abu Bakr and Umar) 'sadl' must have been a tradition which was custom among all the people.

Edited by Iskandarovich
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