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In the Name of God بسم الله
Guest Mushu

Exposing Yassir Al-Habib

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Anyone who is so profoundly arrogant as to proclaim to know the judgement of God on himself, let alone any other individual, is not a person i would turn to for wisdom.

Assalamu Alaykum, Hayakum Allah.

It would seem from your other posts of you denying ahadith of the Imams (as) outright that you would include them (as) in this definition as well. Am I correct?

Keep me in your duas,

Hassan b. Salem al-Ilami.

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So the shirazis are okay only when they accept sheikh yacoobi? And then yasir al habib finally doesnt represent all shirazis? thats just funny....

Not at all, but seeing Sheikh al-Yaqoobi being friendly with all made me realise that I should emulate that.

Well yes, it certainly made me realise that he doesn't represent Shirazis. Why should I have known that before?

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Assalamu Alaykum, Hayakum Allah.

It would seem from your other posts of you denying ahadith of the Imams (as) outright that you would include them (as) in this definition as well. Am I correct?

Keep me in your duas,

Hassan b. Salem al-Ilami.

.

ws, not sure exactly what you are refering to, but ive expressed sceptisim about the authenticity various ahadith in the past yes. It is my assertion that no mortal living being can predict the judgement of God on another being; to do so would be a direct challange to God because to make such a judgment you need to be omniscient - aware of everything that can be possibly known about a being that can be taken into consideration in order to make the judgement on them.

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.

ws, not sure exactly what you are refering to, but ive expressed sceptisim about the authenticity various ahadith in the past yes. It is my assertion that no mortal living being can predict the judgement of God on another being; to do so would be a direct challange to God because to make such a judgment you need to be omniscient - aware of everything that can be possibly known about a being that can be taken into consideration in order to make the judgement on them.

Salaams,

He means Ahadith and verses from the Qur'an that describe the fate of certain types of people.

For instance,

98_6.png

Indeed, they who disbelieved among the People of the Scripture and the polytheists will be in the fire of Hell, abiding eternally therein. Those are the worst of creatures.

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^ ws, I dont know how he's interpreting that. Its seems when these verses are interpreted, a lot of assumptions are made (about what eternity means with regard to something not attached to matter, for instance) and the interpretations of what a 'non-believer' is, exactly. Some peoples interpretations are very much informed by ahadith, rather than a personal process or journeying that can lead to a much fuller/deeper understanding of such terms, rather than a narrow, instant, child-like one.

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^ ws, I dont know how he's interpreting that. Its seems when these verses are interpreted, a lot of assumptions are made (about what eternity means with regard to something not attached to matter, for instance) and the interpretations of what a 'non-believer' is, exactly. Some peoples interpretations are very much informed by ahadith, rather than a personal process or journeying that can lead to a much fuller/deeper understanding of such terms, rather than a narrow, instant, child-like one.

Assalamu Alaykum, Hayakum Allah.

I'm not talking about the verse Mushu posted. Verses of Qur'an are always up for interpretation (unless you're the Imam (as) ), but not ahadith. I was referring to the debates you had with Haydar Husayn where you explicitly denied narrations of the Prophet (pbuh) doing mut'ah. Calling it weak may be one thing, but rejecting narrations is forbidden by the Ahlul Bayt (as). I'm not here to preach to you what you should be doing, but your methods may get you into serious trouble later on.

Keep me in your duas,

Hassan b. Salem al-Ilami.

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Assalamu Alaykum, Hayakum Allah.

I'm not talking about the verse Mushu posted. Verses of Qur'an are always up for interpretation (unless you're the Imam (as) ), but not ahadith. I was referring to the debates you had with Haydar Husayn where you explicitly denied narrations of the Prophet (pbuh) doing mut'ah. Calling it weak may be one thing, but rejecting narrations is forbidden by the Ahlul Bayt (as). I'm not here to preach to you what you should be doing, but your methods may get you into serious trouble later on.

Keep me in your duas,

Hassan b. Salem al-Ilami.

Where did you get the impression that rejecting a hadith is forbidden? from a hadith?

I think this idea of 'rejecting' is a bit misplaced because the act of 'rejecting' doesnt take one form. If something isnt informing your behaviour then you are in effect rejecting it. For instance, when it comes to this ahadith you speak of regarding the Prophet(saw) doing a secret muta, one could say out loud and to our selves 'i am not going to say this isnt true, there fore i am not rejecting it'. But most people, when it comes to the crunch, are going to have a stance on this issue when faced with it directly and that stance may well be one in opposition to this hadith. Not rejecting it verbally (or in writing) does not mean that you dont consciously or subconsciously reject it and it will not be something that translates into behaviour. Probably because it jars so much with the other values that the Quran promotes, it doesnt feel in the flow of things. I think the fear that this idea of not rejecting is creating is making us a bit cowardly when it comes to getting honest and real about certain issues.

Edited by ~Ruqaya's Amal~

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@Mushu

salaaams,

I have watched the video and I have a fully functioning brain. I can see who is the true believer from the misguided ones who r many today. On the contrary, Its Yaqubi and his likes are the ones who are being exposed by Siekh yassir Habib (HA). Mushu, you have proved your one sided view once again.

you have forgot what Imam Ali said, 'do not follow personalities but principles'. you worship these personalities without having no knowledge about them. please do ur reaserch once again about ur marje3 and Sadr, they are misguided ppl, who want to sell our faith, you must understand this.

Anyway, coming back to Sheikh Yassir, he said in that video that anyone who issues or do hukum without proper knowledge will go to hell fire, its what the prophet himself said. what Sheikh Yassir said regarding your marje3 was that he issues fatawa WITHOUT knowledge. Yaqubi made tatbir haram on what basis? there's no proof whatsoever in the quran and Ahadith to make tatbir haram. majority of scholars do not regard it haram. plus why did he made tatrbir haram suddenly, wasn't he a merje3 for many yrs... did he only realize today that Allah made tatrbir haram? moreover, Sadr, gave a speech in Najaf where he placed imam ali forth of the 4 'khulafa' just like the mukhalifeen do, which shia does this? I knew it, Sheikh Yassir doesnt have time to waste it on foolish things. he did a great job by exposing this two to the whole shia world.

Ahlulbayt said that any one who place those 3 above Amiril-mumineen is a filthy filthy nasibi, and should never be called a shia. unfortunately many shias think that a nasibi is only the one who openly hates Ahlulbayt, but the ahadith from Ahlulbayt says that any one who regard those 3 khulafa and place them above imam Ali are nawaseb should never be prayed behind and should be also excluded from our shia communities.

so based on this, Sadr done a grave mistake. in stead of following just names, why dont you also look at their actions? do their actions go with or against Allah and Ahlulbayt? this should be the first and th elast question we should always look for, did Ahlulbayt say forget about imamate for the sake of 'unity' with ahlul-khilaf to gain political achievements?

no they never said that, so I fail to understand that why does some of the 'scholars' who are supposed to be ppl who know this better than us are the first ppl to come and commit those nasty things which highly offends any true believer? why? they are supposed to be in Iraq where the government is shia now and the majority r shia too.. what taqeyah works in that part of the world now? the days of Sadam is gone, do shia thr stil have to be afraid of him while he is in his grave? you have to realize that taqeya is nothing but a tool to sell our faith today.

there's no hidden agenda or mask on Sheikh Yassir. he is simply proud to be shia and will to any thing to educate and save shias esp the confused ones who seems to have the highest number of those who hate and oppose him. never has he done any thing that brings shame to Ahlulbayt or our faith... all his does is what sayeda Fatima did, she declared war against those 2 idols and he is just following her way. how is this hard to understand? he never bows down to the enemy and degrade the believers with him unlike those ppl whom you look up to. its time you realize and stop following ppl who ONLY mention Islam and ahlulbayt to hide their fetish and chauvinism.

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@Mushu

salaaams,

I have watched the video and I have a fully functioning brain. I can see who is the true believer from the misguided ones who r many today. On the contrary, Its Yaqubi and his likes are the ones who are being exposed by Siekh yassir Habib (HA). Mushu, you have proved your one sided view once again.

you have forgot what Imam Ali said, 'do not follow personalities but principles'. you worship these personalities without having no knowledge about them. please do ur reaserch once again about ur marje3 and Sadr, they are misguided ppl, who want to sell our faith, you must understand this.

Anyway, coming back to Sheikh Yassir, he said in that video that anyone who issues or do hukum without proper knowledge will go to hell fire, its what the prophet himself said. what Sheikh Yassir said regarding your marje3 was that he issues fatawa WITHOUT knowledge. Yaqubi made tatbir haram on what basis? there's no proof whatsoever in the quran and Ahadith to make tatbir haram. majority of scholars do not regard it haram. plus why did he made tatrbir haram suddenly, wasn't he a merje3 for many yrs... did he only realize today that Allah made tatrbir haram? moreover, Sadr, gave a speech in Najaf where he placed imam ali forth of the 4 'khulafa' just like the mukhalifeen do, which shia does this? I knew it, Sheikh Yassir doesnt have time to waste it on foolish things. he did a great job by exposing this two to the whole shia world.

Ahlulbayt said that any one who place those 3 above Amiril-mumineen is a filthy filthy nasibi, and should never be called a shia. unfortunately many shias think that a nasibi is only the one who openly hates Ahlulbayt, but the ahadith from Ahlulbayt says that any one who regard those 3 khulafa and place them above imam Ali are nawaseb should never be prayed behind and should be also excluded from our shia communities.

so based on this, Sadr done a grave mistake. in stead of following just names, why dont you also look at their actions? do their actions go with or against Allah and Ahlulbayt? this should be the first and th elast question we should always look for, did Ahlulbayt say forget about imamate for the sake of 'unity' with ahlul-khilaf to gain political achievements?

no they never said that, so I fail to understand that why does some of the 'scholars' who are supposed to be ppl who know this better than us are the first ppl to come and commit those nasty things which highly offends any true believer? why? they are supposed to be in Iraq where the government is shia now and the majority r shia too.. what taqeyah works in that part of the world now? the days of Sadam is gone, do shia thr stil have to be afraid of him while he is in his grave? you have to realize that taqeya is nothing but a tool to sell our faith today.

there's no hidden agenda or mask on Sheikh Yassir. he is simply proud to be shia and will to any thing to educate and save shias esp the confused ones who seems to have the highest number of those who hate and oppose him. never has he done any thing that brings shame to Ahlulbayt or our faith... all his does is what sayeda Fatima did, she declared war against those 2 idols and he is just following her way. how is this hard to understand? he never bows down to the enemy and degrade the believers with him unlike those ppl whom you look up to. its time you realize and stop following ppl who ONLY mention Islam and ahlulbayt to hide their fetish and chauvinism.

i will comment on a few things you said, firstly, the sadr family did not sell the religeon, if that was true then how comes they were martyred? shaheed muhammad baqir al sadr was tortured by saddam regime and then killled. Shaheed sadiq al sadr i think it was, was also martyred. SO please go do research before you make blind claims like that

secondly, tatbir only came about around a century ago, so instead you should give proof why it should be allowed. most marjae, directly or indirectly have condemned it.

thirdly, sheikh yasser al habib has caused a lot of damage to peoples perceptions of shias. Some of the claims he makes are outrageous and people from other sects seem to think he represents all shias. After he called aisha an adulterer, there were protests against him, even here in london, where sunnis came together to protest against him and many were under the assumption that his beliefs are the beliefs of all shias.

so, its more like you whose following yasser blindly.

Edited by ThE-Samz

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Guest Mushu

@Mushu

salaaams,

I have watched the video and I have a fully functioning brain. I can see who is the true believer from the misguided ones who r many today. On the contrary, Its Yaqubi and his likes are the ones who are being exposed by Siekh yassir Habib (HA). Mushu, you have proved your one sided view once again.

you have forgot what Imam Ali said, 'do not follow personalities but principles'. you worship these personalities without having no knowledge about them. please do ur reaserch once again about ur marje3 and Sadr, they are misguided ppl, who want to sell our faith, you must understand this.

Anyway, coming back to Sheikh Yassir, he said in that video that anyone who issues or do hukum without proper knowledge will go to hell fire, its what the prophet himself said. what Sheikh Yassir said regarding your marje3 was that he issues fatawa WITHOUT knowledge. Yaqubi made tatbir haram on what basis? there's no proof whatsoever in the quran and Ahadith to make tatbir haram. majority of scholars do not regard it haram. plus why did he made tatrbir haram suddenly, wasn't he a merje3 for many yrs... did he only realize today that Allah made tatrbir haram? moreover, Sadr, gave a speech in Najaf where he placed imam ali forth of the 4 'khulafa' just like the mukhalifeen do, which shia does this? I knew it, Sheikh Yassir doesnt have time to waste it on foolish things. he did a great job by exposing this two to the whole shia world.

Ahlulbayt said that any one who place those 3 above Amiril-mumineen is a filthy filthy nasibi, and should never be called a shia. unfortunately many shias think that a nasibi is only the one who openly hates Ahlulbayt, but the ahadith from Ahlulbayt says that any one who regard those 3 khulafa and place them above imam Ali are nawaseb should never be prayed behind and should be also excluded from our shia communities.

so based on this, Sadr done a grave mistake. in stead of following just names, why dont you also look at their actions? do their actions go with or against Allah and Ahlulbayt? this should be the first and th elast question we should always look for, did Ahlulbayt say forget about imamate for the sake of 'unity' with ahlul-khilaf to gain political achievements?

no they never said that, so I fail to understand that why does some of the 'scholars' who are supposed to be ppl who know this better than us are the first ppl to come and commit those nasty things which highly offends any true believer? why? they are supposed to be in Iraq where the government is shia now and the majority r shia too.. what taqeyah works in that part of the world now? the days of Sadam is gone, do shia thr stil have to be afraid of him while he is in his grave? you have to realize that taqeya is nothing but a tool to sell our faith today.

there's no hidden agenda or mask on Sheikh Yassir. he is simply proud to be shia and will to any thing to educate and save shias esp the confused ones who seems to have the highest number of those who hate and oppose him. never has he done any thing that brings shame to Ahlulbayt or our faith... all his does is what sayeda Fatima did, she declared war against those 2 idols and he is just following her way. how is this hard to understand? he never bows down to the enemy and degrade the believers with him unlike those ppl whom you look up to. its time you realize and stop following ppl who ONLY mention Islam and ahlulbayt to hide their fetish and chauvinism.

Wa alaykum al-Salaam sister,

I really don't want this to turn into a Tatbir thread, but i'll just quickly address your point.

Firstly, Sheikh al-Yaqoobi is not the only marji3 to have declared Tatbir Haraam. Nor is Syed Khamenei. In actual fact, it was declared Haraam before it was declared Halaal.

Tatbir first gained popularity in the early 1900s. In those days, due to a lack of internet and other outlets, the majority of people would follow one marji3. The first marji3 I know of to issue a statement regarding Tatbir is Syed Abul-Hassan al-Esfahani, an extremely respected marji3, and was the Grand AyatAllah of the Shia before Syed Mohsin al-Hakim (who was before Syed al-Khoei).

Syed Abul-Hassan issued the following Fatwa:

“The usage of swords, chains, drums, horns and the likes today, which have become common in mourning ceremonies on Ashura, is definitely forbidden and against religious doctrine.”

Dayrah al-Ma”arif Tashayu’, v.2, p.531; A’yan al-Shia, v.10, p.378; Professor Hassan Shabir, Tarikh Iraq Mu’asir, v.2, p.340

There are two other very prominent maraji3 of that time, Syed Mohsin al-Amin al-'Aamili, and Sheikh Muhammad-Hussain Kashif al-Ghitaa'. Syed Mohsin al-Amin has a very famous Fatwa regarding Tatbir, famous because it condemned it so strongly. Here are the Fatwas of both of them:

al-'Aamili:

“And what some people do injuring themselves with swords and hitting themselves in a way that harms them is from the encouragement of Shaytan”.

“It is from the saddening things… using drums and flutes, and cutting the heads in a way that show the Shia in a barbaric way and make the others mock them… and on top of that (they) consider it a kind of worship and attribute it to the purified Ahlubayt عليه السلام.”

Kashif al-Ghitaa':

“If we want to act in accordance to jurisprudential principles and the derivation of religious rulings regarding the issue of mourning by hitting the face and other practices like blood matam (which are prevalent in the modern age) we will not find anything except forbiddance. We will not have any choice in issuing a verdict stating that these actions are forbidden. The reason is that there have been no exceptions to the principles of the forbiddance of causing harm to ones body or endangering the life of a human in this regard. Therefore, there is no reason for these actions to have any other ruling than forbiddance. But, most of the people who perform such actions do so more to show themselves off or to be fanatic; they do not perform such actions with pure intentions. This, in itself, is problematic; rather it is also forbidden because of some reasons involved with the age and the location as well.”

Al-Firdus al-Ala’, p.19-22

These were some of the largest maraji3 of the time. I believe most of the other maraji3 of the time agreed with them, and issued similar Fatwas.

Now, with the next generation of maraji3, we have Sheikh al-Na'eeni, and Syed Mohsin al-Hakim being the two biggest maraji3. Sheikh al-Na'eeni issued a famous Fatwa about Tatbir, where he ruled that it is not Haraam on the basis that it is done out of love for Imam Hussain (as). Syed Mohsin al-Hakim and other maraji3 agreed with his Fatwa, and issued similar ones. However, Sheikh al-Na'eeni's Fatwa was extremely strict regarding Tatbir (no children, only people who know how to do it properly are allowed, depends on time and place, and many other conditions).

Now, as the generations have passed, it seems that the Fatwas regarding Tatbir have become increasingly laxed. Sheikh al-Yaqoobi is in agreement with Syed Abul-Hassan, that Tatbir has no Islamic basis, and is therefore a Haraam Bid3a.

Please, I don't want to turn this into a Tatbir thread, so that was just a quick response to address your point.

Regarding Shahid al-Sadr, what you said is clearly ridiculous, and if it holds any truth, it has definitely been taken out context. Additionally, you have a grave misunderstanding of what Taqeyya is. Just a point to think about though: Allah (SWT) chooses his Shuhadaa'. It is the highest rank attainable in Islam. If the Sadrs were so misguided, why would Allah (SWT) award them with the highest rank attainable in Islam? A rank that places them in the highest levels of Janna?

Anyways, everything i've said is irrelevant. You completely ignored the whole point of my thread. It wasn't Yaqoobi/Sadrs vs Yassir. It was Syed Sadiq al-Shirazi vs Yassir.

Please, look through what i've said, and respond to the aim of the topic.

Edited by Mushu

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i will comment on a few things you said, firstly, the sadr family did not sell the religeon, if that was true then how comes they were martyred? shaheed muhammad baqir al sadr was tortured by saddam regime and then killled. Shaheed sadiq al sadr i think it was, was also martyred. SO please go do research before you make blind claims like that

first of all, I did not speak of the whole family but about this particular Sadr that sheikh Yassir spoke about that Mushu in other threads kept defending and mocking us coz we didnt know exactly who he was.. sadr is clearly a misguided soul that should be exposed and get rid of. ppl like him does no good for shias of Ahlulbayt today. he should stay in his house and not come in public and speak non sense that misguides ppl and hurt the feelings of the believers. family name and titles do no good when the person acts like an enemy to the way of Ahlulbayt, period.

second, not all ppl who die are shuhada, only Allah knows their true status. that doesn't mean that I'm insulting this ppl or any thing, they cud be shuhada but that doesnt cover up of his dirty deeds, which shia comes in public and speak like that abt Amirul-mumineen... such a man is not a shia and should not be defended. so b4 u comment and accuse ppl to have blind views, read what they say first and understand their point.

secondly, tatbir only came about around a century ago, so instead you should give proof why it should be allowed. most marjae, directly or indirectly have condemned it.

the truth is, in islam nothing is haram until proven the otherwise, so its not me to prove anything here whether tatbir is halal or haram its the one who made it haram to prove it haram. plus if you want to know about tatbir there r plenty of threads on here that you can search for.

thirdly, sheikh yasser al habib has caused a lot of damage to peoples perceptions of shias. Some of the claims he makes are outrageous and people from other sects seem to think he represents all shias. After he called aisha an adulterer, there were protests against him, even here in london, where sunnis came together to protest against him and many were under the assumption that his beliefs are the beliefs of all shias.

so, its more like you whose following yasser blindly.

you ppl will never get do you? sunnis will never be pleased with shia no matter we do or say, why cant we just forget this ppl and act according to our faith whether they like it or not... they r no body!

am sick and tired of sunni say this, sunni think this.. plz dont force me to use bad language. I decided to learn to controle my anger and not hurt ppl... but truth has to be said. Aisha was a filthy woman who hated Islam and ahlulbayt, who cares what sunnis think we think of her, there r proof for whatever we say any way... abt what sheikh Yassir said her being an adulterer.. I can not comment on it, coz i haven't researched into depth abt this topic... and I do not follow ppl blindly. that's a baseless accussation. I have never follow ppl without actually believeing they were right.

.

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first of all, I did not speak of the whole family but about this particular Sadr that sheikh Yassir spoke about that Mushu in other threads kept defending and mocking us coz we didnt know exactly who he was.. sadr is clearly a misguided soul that should be exposed and get rid of. ppl like him does no good for shias of Ahlulbayt today. he should stay in his house and not come in public and speak non sense that misguides ppl and hurt the feelings of the believers. family name and titles do no good when the person acts like an enemy to the way of Ahlulbayt, period.

second, not all ppl who die are shuhada, only Allah knows their true status. that doesn't mean that I'm insulting this ppl or any thing, they cud be shuhada but that doesnt cover up of his dirty deeds, which shia comes in public and speak like that abt Amirul-mumineen... such a man is not a shia and should not be defended. so b4 u comment and accuse ppl to have blind views, read what they say first and understand their point.

the truth is, in islam nothing is haram until proven the otherwise, so its not me to prove anything here whether tatbir is halal or haram its the one who made it haram to prove it haram. plus if you want to know about tatbir there r plenty of threads on here that you can search for.

you ppl will never get do you? sunnis will never be pleased with shia no matter we do or say, why cant we just forget this ppl and act according to our faith whether they like it or not... they r no body!

am sick and tired of sunni say this, sunni think this.. plz dont force me to use bad language. I decided to learn to controle my anger and not hurt ppl... but truth has to be said. Aisha was a filthy woman who hated Islam and ahlulbayt, who cares what sunnis think we think of her, there r proof for whatever we say any way... abt what sheikh Yassir said her being an adulterer.. I can not comment on it, coz i haven't researched into depth abt this topic... and I do not follow ppl blindly. that's a baseless accussation. I have never follow ppl without actually believeing they were right.

.

mushu mostly talks about shaheed muhammad baqir al sadr, of whom sheikh ya'qoobi was a student. If shaheed sadr disgraced ahlulbayt and was doing taqiyya then how comes he was tortured and killed for his beliefs. makes no sense.

what do you mean not all people are shuhahda, he was martyred for his beliefs which were that of shia islam, and dying for this reason constitutes as martydom.

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Actually, Sheikh al-Yaqoobi was a student of Shaheed Syed Muhammad Sadiq al-Sadr, who was a student of Shaheed Syed Muhammad-Baqir al-Sadr.

ahh right, thanks for the clarification.

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Yasser habib isnt a respectable marja to treat him with respect, sayed nasrallah said no one had heard of habib in thr workd until he curded aisha a couple of years back and he indirectly said the he works for western intelligence, and when sayyed nasrallahs says that i think he has a reason to say it because sayed nasrallah doesnt talk about something just like that.

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I log into shiachat after a few months to find this, LOL but I shall comment on this :

you ppl will never get do you? Sunnis will never be pleased with Shia no matter we do or say, why can’t we just forget this ppl and act according to our faith whether they like it or not... they r no body!

am sick and tired of Sunni say this, Sunni think this.. plz don’t force me to use bad language. I decided to learn to controle my anger and not hurt ppl... but truth has to be said.

they are our equals in humanity and to personally I would love to see my equals in humanity be saved from hell fire, so it is our duty to guide them through consideration, cursing the sahaba and saying F the Sunnis sounds like a barbarian on crack. that is all...

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Guest Mushu

Only one Yassir al-Habib follower made any attempt to defend him. I don't know if that means this thread was an astounding success, or a huge fail. :unsure:

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