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In the Name of God بسم الله

For Those Who Curse (pt2)

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  • Advanced Member

Move this to general discussion.

Down with this cult. Well done Ammar Nakshawani.

This is what Sheikh Cyrous wrote on FB

BEWARE potential Iranian terrorist regime undercover agent praising Khamenei!

Nakshwani officially took oath of allegiance to Khamenei's Regime terrorist agenda and start to "fight" shiA Ulama and Hawzah mu'amameen !

May Allah (swt) protect us from Iranian regime terrorism and ideology

We need to prevent Nakshwani to encourage simple-minded youth in the West to apply Khomenei's fatwa of suicide murder, killing Salman Rushdie and shiA opponents of Iranian Regime. Nakshwani must stop to promote Iranian regime interests.

After the fall of the Khamenei Iranian regime, a list of Khamenei's collaborators shall be submit to the International Criminal Court.

http://www.facebook.com/sentierislam

What nonsense.

We all know which marja he is talking about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=X1U51iHRKTo#!

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By no means do I agree with the mannerisms and methodology of brother Yassir Habib and his affiliates, but I ask in all honesty to the brothers who have posted in this thread and others like it, how much better are you than them by speaking this way about a fellow Imami?

Calling them "cave men" amongst other names we can see throughout the forum is uncalled for and a bit hypocritical as well as revealing about the attitude surrounding this matter. Why is it Imamis can openly insult, mock, and attack their 'own' brothers and sisters (i.e. fellow Imami) in front of the entire world but refuse to address the Sunnis who attack us in the same manner? Or even the historical personalities that committed the initial crimes against the Ahlul Bayt (as) and their followers?

None of this should be done openly for the world to see.

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  • Advanced Member

As the brother above also mentioned - what is wrong with you Shi'ah? You seem to have no problem calling other Shi'ah all types of names whilst getting upset that we're calling known enemies of Allah and His Prophet out on their treachery?!?

Unity? Please grow up. It's a one-way thing, the minority (but growing) Shi'ah trying to not upset the (misguided and shrinking) majority.

Be civil, treat all you find as fellow humans (until they prove to be otherwise) but stop politicking about unity - vast majority of Bakris really don't care about it and the only ones who do sadly don't matter in the bigger scheme of things.

ALI

Edited by Kismet110
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  • Advanced Member

I didnt call them cavemen but Ammar did.

We dont like them cause they do tafker on us. Do you want me to have unity with people who call us kaffers? No unity with wahabis and no unity with takferi shia!

Dawud, seriously! You know why we dont like them. It because they hate us, period.

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shia islam is divided so much even in this small sample size at SC. We have the takifiri group, the Rehbari group, the i follow my own whims no marja group, the liberal group, the islam should be like this group, and my favorite completely confused group.

Its amazing how we are still alive with so much division.

Al Ajal ya Imam

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I find it amazing that the shias who bleat on the most about unity between muslims of different sects, are often the ones to show the worst akhlaq to their own shia brothers and sisters.

:dry:

+ 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

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I find it amazing that the shias who bleat on the most about unity between muslims of different sects, are often the ones to show the worst akhlaq to their own shia brothers and sisters.

:dry:

there is a difference between unity among sects and dissociating from the fitna mongers no matter what label they put on. U can call them shia brother/sisters, but in reality they are nothing but savages.

Its easy to up front deny nusairis being part of shias, but when it comes to this group they are brothers. They have caused so many deaths all over the world for your other shia brothers/sisters but offcourse we have to keep a close eye on that issue. Since nothing makes us stronger shias then cursing the 4. Not to forget that Tabarra means way different then what we are doing and preaching so goodluck thinking that you are getting closer to Ahlulbayt (as)

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I find it amazing that the shias who bleat on the most about unity between muslims of different sects, are often the ones to show the worst akhlaq to their own shia brothers and sisters.

Why dont you get it????

I want good unity with shias but these lot dont want unity with people like me. They call us kuffar and even normal sunnis dont call us kaffers. Dont blame the victims -- blame these lot like yaser habib who do takfer on Sayed Khomeini.

Do you get it now?

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Guest EndlessEndeavor

Once again some are missing the point.

Yes shia-shia unity is of primary importance but not when one faction of the shias are acting in an an extremely naive manner that may be DIRECTLY or indirectly resulting in the death of SHIA around the world.

Edited by EndlessEndeavor
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Once again some are missing the point.

Yes shia-shia unity is of primary importance but not when one faction of the shias are acting in an an extremely naive manner that may be DIRECTLY or indirectly resulting in the death of SHIA around the world.

And who was playing the role of Yassir Habib before the man was even born and Shia were being massacred no more and no less then we are being today?

Has he become a "justification" for Nasibis to attack us, sure. However is he the actual reason, no. They attack and murder Shia for the very reason that they always have, because we are who we are and they are who they are. Its that simple.

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Guest EndlessEndeavor

And who was playing the role of Yassir Habib before the man was even born and Shia were being massacred no more and no less then we are being today?

Has he become a "justification" for Nasibis to attack us, sure. However is he the actual reason, no. They attack and murder Shia for the very reason that they always have, because we are who we are and they are who they are. Its that simple.

Perhaps so, but often killings in the past were under different pretexts to justify them. Now they are simply because you are Shia and hence you deserve to be killed.

Nonetheless, this doesnt justify your point. Shall we incite them more? Is the need to publicly curse so great that we need to potentially risk a life? Does it endear the average Sunni to the Shia faith? Does it achieve anything for us spiritually to do it publicly? Does it expose the crimes of certain people against the AhlulBayt? Does it reflect the teachings of the AhlulBayt and how they responded to the injustices they faced?

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Perhaps so, but often killings in the past were under different pretexts to justify them. Now they are simply because you are Shia and hence you deserve to be killed.

Nonetheless, this doesnt justify your point. Shall we incite them more? Is the need to publicly curse so great that we need to potentially risk a life? Does it endear the average Sunni to the Shia faith? Does it achieve anything for us spiritually to do it publicly? Does it expose the crimes of certain people against the AhlulBayt? Does it reflect the teachings of the AhlulBayt and how they responded to the injustices they faced?

Justify what point? If you were to scroll up you would see where I said I do not agree with the mannerism and methodology of Yassir Habib though I am pro-tabara in a private context and amongst other Imamis. So the last part of your reply is not one meant for me akh.

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  • Advanced Member

(salam)

Sheikh Yasser al-Habib doesn't call all Shi'a who disagree with him kafir. Huge misconception.

He calls you Batri, which means you incline towards Bakri ideologies due to ignorance and/or being lied to for years with Taqiyyah from scholars.

Batri are not Kafir.

Fadlullah is Batri according to Sheikh Yasser al-Habib, he doesn't call him a Kafir.

However, Sheikh Yasser al-Habib strongly opposes Irfan, but that has nothing to do with Shi'ism and Islam, so I don't see how you can say he is making takfir on Shi'a.

Rather the most takfir comes from dishonest taqiyyah people who hate anyone who disagrees with them but refuses to debate intellectually, using political influence or strength in numbers to build a false sense of security and rightfulness.

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  • Advanced Member

However, Sheikh Yasser al-Habib strongly opposes Irfan, but that has nothing to do with Shi'ism and Islam, so I don't see how you can say he is making takfir on Shi'a.

No problem! If I am not a shia then dont accuse me of attacking so called fellow shia.

Strange how on this forum you can call Ayat Khomeini a mushrik but ur stopped when you send lanat on those who curse him. If i did takfer on habib they will edit my post ..... but its fine and dandy for you to do takfer on khomeini. nice forum!

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No problem! If I am not a shia then dont accuse me of attacking so called fellow shia.

Strange how on this forum you can call Ayat Khomeini a mushrik but ur stopped when you send lanat on those who curse him. If i did takfer on habib they will edit my post ..... but its fine and dandy for you to do takfer on khomeini. nice forum!

Ever heard of the expression "Truth is on the side of the oppressed" ?

Shi'a love using it, especially Khomeini's group... And yet, how many Ayatollahs and Marjaa have been oppressed, tortured, imprisoned by the WF?

Are you aware of Grand Ayatollah Sayed Muhammad Shirazi? He was imprisoned for disagreeing with Khomeini, for example.

Do some research inshallah, read the Qur'an first, then some hadith, then you'll know when you come across an unIslamic concept such as Wahdat al Wajud from Ibn Arabi (which Khomeini believed in devoutly)

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Why dont you get it????

I want good unity with shias but these lot dont want unity with people like me. They call us kuffar and even normal sunnis dont call us kaffers. Dont blame the victims -- blame these lot like yaser habib who do takfer on Sayed Khomeini.

Do you get it now?

No.

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I'm not surprised.

If you can show good akhlaq to people who are quite happy to call you a kaffir (wahabbis, sunnis etc), for the sake of islamic unity, why are you not able to show good akhlaq to shias who aren't too nice to you?

And I wasn't actually referring to the malang brigade in my post. I was referring to mainstream shias, who don't get sucked in by Yasir al Habib et al, but don't want to bend over backwards to please wahabbis, either.

Edit : Salam.

Edited by lalala123
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Why dont you get it????

I want good unity with shias but these lot dont want unity with people like me. They call us kuffar and even normal sunnis dont call us kaffers. Dont blame the victims -- blame these lot like yaser habib who do takfer on Sayed Khomeini.

Do you get it now?

So being against public tabarra means you have to believe in such things as Wahdat al-Wujud (since I think this is why the Shirazi camp is making takfir)?

I honestly doubt anyone is going to call you a kafir for saying we shouldn't curse certain individuals in public.

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(bismillah)

(salam)

This statement comes from my heart and my heart alone, and I could be wrong but I ask you to listen. Yes, the people are dividing themselves, with the help of western forces coming in and trying to exacerbate our differences and feeding off them and into them. There has always been differences since the time of the Death of the Holy Prophet (saw) yes, and Imam Ali (as) as well all the other Aimmah (as) preached constantly against dividing ourselves, but Imam Ali (as) especially (and remember to know the Last (atf) hadith tells us we have to know the First (as) ). We have differences, but we have commonalities also. There are two main bodies of Muslim, all who love their Prophet (saw) all who love the Revealed Book, the Word of Allah, and all want to live in decency and simply have a good life.

Both sides have their extremes, who do nothing but preach hate and division. These are the scholars of falsehood, the ones who are 'not from Us (as)' and we are not to have anything to do with them because they are teaching in opposition to the teachings of Aale Muhammed (as), there are shia teachers of religion who fit this category. A true teacher will not teach anything that is not taught by the Aimmah (as) and in the manner of the Aimmah (as) which means everything is taught with the utmost akhlaq and respect for other hearers. It is these scholars of falsehood that the Masumeen (as) have warned us against.

We are seeing the effects of this right now, these are the effects these scholars of falsehood have had upon the ummah of Muhammed wa Aale Muhammed (saw) and we have been fools.

post-82031-0-46333400-1328975724_thumb.j

Divide and conquer. This is a truth in war, if you can divide your enemy the conquering is all the easier, a unified whole cannot be defeated, a set of broken groups can be. Rome is coming to conquer us. The divisions are almost complete. Rome is coming and they want our wealth, they will conquer us and we will be their dogs. They will suck dry from the earth every resource and leave us with nothing. We will be their slaves.

But, if we concentrate on akhlaq, show our commonalities and know the face of the true enemy, we can overcome what is happening, we cannot divide further, it is time to recognize what is really happening, and what we all have been buying into, and realize we have been wrong, we have wronged our own selves. Something must be done, but it must be done in accordance to the teachings of Muhammed wa Aale Muhammed (saw). Not in accordance to the benefit of Rome.

It doesnt matter the exact belief of another, what matters is La Ilaha Ilallah, Muhammad ar Rasulullah, nothing else matters now, if we can have akhlaq toward christians regardless of the fact they hold a different faith (who among us walks up to a christian they meet on the street and start cursing on them for believing the Prophet Isa (as) to be God?) then why cant we have akhlaq with one another, sunni, shia, usooli akhbari, who cares? I no longer care, whats the point of caring about slight differences but to breed hate and ignorance, it is only a tool of the shaytan!

Edited by thenamelessone
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  • Advanced Member

So being against public tabarra means you have to believe in such things as Wahdat al-Wujud (since I think this is why the Shirazi camp is making takfir)?

I honestly doubt anyone is going to call you a kafir for saying we shouldn't curse certain individuals in public.

Indeed we (Sheikh Yasser al-Habib and group) don't curse anyone who doesn't curse.

A kafir is a kafir, by the same definitions as any Muslim really. You set up partner with Allah knowingly, you're a Kafir. You believe in Wahdat al Wujud which implies that Allah is manifested in poop, you are a kafir.

You believe that Abu Bakr isn't such a bad guy, you are a Batri.

However, we do have a hadith which says "Anyone who doubts the Kufr of Umar is a kafir" which I've read before.

@ thenamelessone

I think your post is appealing to emotion and not reality.

Reality is, all of our Ma'soomeen (as) were murdered brutally.

The Shi'a can expect no comfort.

You seem to think we can all live in peace and harmony, that is impossible without the Mahdi (ajtf), until then we must stay on Haqq and endure the suffering inshallah.

Edited by Dawud Miqdad al-Amriki
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Guest EndlessEndeavor

Indeed we (Sheikh Yasser al-Habib and group) don't curse anyone who doesn't curse.

A kafir is a kafir, by the same definitions as any Muslim really. You set up partner with Allah knowingly, you're a Kafir. You believe in Wahdat al Wujud which implies that Allah is manifested in poop, you are a kafir.

You believe that Abu Bakr isn't such a bad guy, you are a Batri.

However, we do have a hadith which says "Anyone who doubts the Kufr of Umar is a kafir" which I've read before.

This is becoming absurd. It is sad to see someone warped in their delusions yet speak as if they have some knowledge of the matter.

If that is what you think wahdat al wujud is, I must say you have seriously misunderstood the concept.

What you believe it to be, and what you continue to refute isnt what wahdat al wujud is. I don't know how many times other posters are going to tell you, but frankly it's becoming ridiculous. You have no interest in learning, you are just here to parrot views about things you don't understand and I suspect your mentors don't either.

Edited by EndlessEndeavor
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  • Advanced Member

This is becoming absurd. It is sad to see someone warped in their delusions yet speak as if they have some knowledge of the matter.

If that is what you think wahdat al wujud is, I must say you have seriously misunderstood the concept.

What you believe it to be, and what you continue to refute isnt what wahdat al wujud is. I don't know how many times other posters are going to tell you, but frankly it's becoming ridiculous. You have no interest in learning, you are just here to parrot views about things you don't understand and I suspect your mentors don't either.

Listen, I understand Wahdat al Wujud.

When you say "Allah is the causer and sustainer, the one who makes you exist and keeps you in existence, without Allah you do not exist"

I agree!

And we should leave it at that... But, Wahdat al Wujud doesn't leave it, Wahdat al Wujud continues:

"Allah manifests in His creation, His is the light of the heavens and the earth! We interpret this to mean everything is mystically Allah in a deep way."

And this I disagree with.

Do you believe Allah is manifested in feces? When you see feces, do you think about Allah etc? That is Wahdat al Wujud, that is kufr.

Naudhubilah.

My post reflects the teachings of Muhammed wa Aale Muhammed (as) I feel sad for people like you who don't care for those Holy Words.

Muhammad wa Aale Muhammad (as) fought, killed, were killed. Were tortured. Were spit on...

We're following Sunnah and destiny.

You're swimming against the tide my brother.

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Hey Dawud, I've got one for you, it read it on an old thread

The hypocrites of Nabi Musa (a) worshiped the baqara, the hypocrites of nabi Muhammad (s) worshiped the abu bakara

:lol:

Edited by Ali_Hussain
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Guest EndlessEndeavor

Listen, I understand Wahdat al Wujud.

When you say "Allah is the causer and sustainer, the one who makes you exist and keeps you in existence, without Allah you do not exist"

I agree!

And we should leave it at that... But, Wahdat al Wujud doesn't leave it, Wahdat al Wujud continues:

"Allah manifests in His creation, His is the light of the heavens and the earth! We interpret this to mean everything is mystically Allah in a deep way."

And this I disagree with.

Do you believe Allah is manifested in feces? When you see feces, do you think about Allah etc? That is Wahdat al Wujud, that is kufr.

Naudhubilah.

Allah is manifest on Earth as He says so. Allah is the the light of the Heavens and the Earth as He says so.

"Everything is mystically Allah in a deep way"

No, this is you extrapolating and misinterpreting. As usual though, it seems your only purpose on these forums is to promote Yassir Al Habib's views and spout stupid arguments that insult our Creator and our intelligence.

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