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Khadim uz Zahra

Importance Of Akhlaq While On The Forum

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In The Name of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì, The Most Beneficent, The Most Merciful.

I just wanted this post to be, like many previous ones by others who are much more better than me in Akhlaq and more entitled to talk about this than me, be a reminder that we are supposed to stay moral, intellectual and within our limits and manners while on the forum. We must not be offensive, insulting or be intimidating to others just because it is a shia forum and we are Shias; we should not be thinking that since this is a Shia forum, we are the "dons" here and no one can oppose us.

After all, the names of the respective forums are "debate","discussion" and like so in a debate, obviously, we should expect some opposition to our beliefs but this does not mean we should start getting angry at the other person. I would greatly commend those who are active in the "Philosophy, Atheism/Theism & Other Interfaith Dialogue" section which, in my view, is the most respectful, clean and all welcoming forum that I have found in the whole of Shiachat. Of course, this is just my view and you may disagree. One very good example is when KingPomba who is an atheist and not a Shia, saying "in this forum, we" which shows he considers the forum his own!

This is the type of spirit we should be having when debating or discussing. We all know that theological and religious discussions are sensitive and we may be hurt but we must try to keep ourselves in control and let our anger get over us.

Moving to a recent problem, I believe that this "mutah crew" vs. feminists (I don't mean to offend any of the people but I am just using it because that is how people recognise others or else I am very much against these classification and stuff) is getting WAY OUT OF HAND. I think we need to stop about that.

For one thing, most of those some call the "mutah crew" like Haydar Husayn and Dawud have, most probably, never even done it in their lives. All they are trying to do is to support what they believe is the right interpretation of Islam so I really don't think it is wise to be calling people "Mutah man" or other names in an insulting manner or trying to portray them as immoral or indecent people. If they were, they would be doing so everyday and, if they even did, this was what they thought right (I am NOT saying that it is; neither do I support them nor the "feminists - I am not giving any views on this topic) and, surely, the line of immodesty for them is getting into an unmarried relationship so, ACCORDING TO THEM, they are not being indecent so if you think it is wrong try to change their views by discussions and NOT insults or trying to say they are "indecent".

As for the "feminists", I think we must understand that they do NOT say that Mutah is haraam; all they say is that we must not use it too frequently and only as an extreme alternative.

I won't comment on who is, in my view (if I have a view on this topic), right or wrong but all I am trying to say is that:

1. We must not misunderstand each other or, intentionally, misrepresent the views of those we disagree with.

2. We must not hurl insults at the others (something both sides are guilty of).

3. If we don't agree, try to explain in an intellectual manner and if they don't understand, leave them to their condition. There is absolutely no need for you to sin yourself - through insults - in trying to do Amar bil Ma'aroof and Nahi anil Munkar (Enjoinment of the Good and forbidding the evil). I don't see much use in trying to correct others while accumulating sins on your own self.

I am NOT saying any one is acquiring sins but I am just tryign to give a general advice.

There is, clearly, a difference in interpretation between the two parties and there is NO problem with that but why are we getting either offensive or insulting? Why can't we treat this conflict like all other conflicts on which there is a difference of opinion - The concept of Taqleed, The concept of Wilayatul Faqih, Shia and Sunni disputes and many others - whereby we don't get so angry by the differences on these topics so why should this conflict be any different? I am, by no means, trying to say that this topic is unimportant - I agree that the right interpretation of mutah is needed as it is a moral issue and if we are on the wrong side of the coin, we would not be following the Ahlulbayt (peace be upon them all) correctly - but is the debate between Shias and Sunni, for example, more important? After all, the differences between Shias and Sunnis comprises a lot more than just one issue and even if you are wrong on mutah, you are only wrong for one belief but when it comes to the issues of Shias and Sunnis, there is so much more - including mutah - such that if we get those wrong, we may be of the dwellers of the Hell. If we don't get so hostile on these important issues, why should this topic call for so much conflict amongst the Shias themselves?

INSHALLAH, I have been helpful and have NOT hurt anyone. :) If I have, I am extremely sorry and ask them to forgive me.

May Allah (SWT) bless us all, our families and loved ones, guide us all to The Straight Path with His Perfect Guidance, grant us all patience, increase our imaan and may He, The Forgiver of Sins and The Oft-Forgiving, forgive all our sins for, indeed, there is neither any refuge nor any respite for the sinners except in Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì.

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In The Name of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì, The Most Beneficent, The Most Merciful.

I just wanted this post to be, like many previous ones by others who are much more better than me in Akhlaq and more entitled to talk about this than me, be a reminder that we are supposed to stay moral, intellectual and within our limits and manners while on the forum. We must not be offensive, insulting or be intimidating to others just because it is a shia forum and we are Shias; we should not be thinking that since this is a Shia forum, we are the "dons" here and no one can oppose us.

After all, the names of the respective forums are "debate","discussion" and like so in a debate, obviously, we should expect some opposition to our beliefs but this does not mean we should start getting angry at the other person. I would greatly commend those who are active in the "Philosophy, Atheism/Theism & Other Interfaith Dialogue" section which, in my view, is the most respectful, clean and all welcoming forum that I have found in the whole of Shiachat. Of course, this is just my view and you may disagree. One very good example is when KingPomba who is an atheist and not a Shia, saying "in this forum, we" which shows he considers the forum his own!

This is the type of spirit we should be having when debating or discussing. We all know that theological and religious discussions are sensitive and we may be hurt but we must try to keep ourselves in control and let our anger get over us.

Moving to a recent problem, I believe that this "mutah crew" vs. feminists (I don't mean to offend any of the people but I am just using it because that is how people recognise others or else I am very much against these classification and stuff) is getting WAY OUT OF HAND. I think we need to stop about that.

For one thing, most of those some call the "mutah crew" like Haydar Husayn and Dawud have, most probably, never even done it in their lives. All they are trying to do is to support what they believe is the right interpretation of Islam so I really don't think it is wise to be calling people "Mutah man" or other names in an insulting manner or trying to portray them as immoral or indecent people. If they were, they would be doing so everyday and, if they even did, this was what they thought right (I am NOT saying that it is; neither do I support them nor the "feminists - I am not giving any views on this topic) and, surely, the line of immodesty for them is getting into an unmarried relationship so, ACCORDING TO THEM, they are not being indecent so if you think it is wrong try to change their views by discussions and NOT insults or trying to say they are "indecent".

As for the "feminists", I think we must understand that they do NOT say that Mutah is haraam; all they say is that we must not use it too frequently and only as an extreme alternative.

I won't comment on who is, in my view (if I have a view on this topic), right or wrong but all I am trying to say is that:

1. We must not misunderstand each other or, intentionally, misrepresent the views of those we disagree with.

2. We must not hurl insults at the others (something both sides are guilty of).

3. If we don't agree, try to explain in an intellectual manner and if they don't understand, leave them to their condition. There is absolutely no need for you to sin yourself - through insults - in trying to do Amar bil Ma'aroof and Nahi anil Munkar (Enjoinment of the Good and forbidding the evil). I don't see much use in trying to correct others while accumulating sins on your own self.

I am NOT saying any one is acquiring sins but I am just tryign to give a general advice.

There is, clearly, a difference in interpretation between the two parties and there is NO problem with that but why are we getting either offensive or insulting? Why can't we treat this conflict like all other conflicts on which there is a difference of opinion - The concept of Taqleed, The concept of Wilayatul Faqih, Shia and Sunni disputes and many others - whereby we don't get so angry by the differences on these topics so why should this conflict be any different? I am, by no means, trying to say that this topic is unimportant - I agree that the right interpretation of mutah is needed as it is a moral issue and if we are on the wrong side of the coin, we would not be following the Ahlulbayt (peace be upon them all) correctly - but is the debate between Shias and Sunni, for example, more important? After all, the differences between Shias and Sunnis comprises a lot more than just one issue and even if you are wrong on mutah, you are only wrong for one belief but when it comes to the issues of Shias and Sunnis, there is so much more - including mutah - such that if we get those wrong, we may be of the dwellers of the Hell. If we don't get so hostile on these important issues, why should this topic call for so much conflict amongst the Shias themselves?

INSHALLAH, I have been helpful and have NOT hurt anyone. :) If I have, I am extremely sorry and ask them to forgive me.

May Allah (SWT) bless us all, our families and loved ones, guide us all to The Straight Path with His Perfect Guidance, grant us all patience, increase our imaan and may He, The Forgiver of Sins and The Oft-Forgiving, forgive all our sins for, indeed, there is neither any refuge nor any respite for the sinners except in Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì.

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I havent read the issue you are discussing above,, but:

I agree with the Insults to others in some forums. Even if its a joke its not nice to spam the thread and keep making it long and filling it up with insults.... others such as myself come to read and comment , but when the thread is filled with none sense,, I don't even bother reading the posts nor commenting anymore. The site is becoming boring to be honest. Admins need to be doing their jobs but instead some admins join the spamming,,, which makes me even more frustrated.

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Alhamdhulilah. God bless you my dear bro ;)

Yours would be better! You are one of the

...others who are much more better than me in Akhlaq and more entitled to talk about this than me...

I have to agree with you about the inter-faith threads, some of the best akhlaq on here is by ppl who identify themselves as non-muslim.

This is, exactly, one of the reasons I used to love iSilurian; it is a pity he left. By the way, of course, I do agree with your statement that " some of the best akhlaq on here is by ppl who identify themselves as non-muslim" but the point I was trying to make is that the SHIAS who post in the Philosophy, Atheism/Theism section are welcoming enough to those who have different beliefs. Very rarely, if at all, would I have seen any insults in that section and, therefore, I find that the SHIAS who are active in that section are welcoming and mannerly and to such an extent that Kingpomba, who is NOT even Muslim, feels that the forum is his! That is what I was trying to say and was trying to encourage all the other members to follow the example of the Shias in this section.

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I find that the SHIAS who are active in that section are welcoming and mannerly and to such an extent that Kingpomba, who is NOT even Muslim, feels that the forum is his! That is what I was trying to say and was trying to encourage all the other members to follow the example of the Shias in this section.

Haha, i also read threads outside of that section :dry: .

I dont feel it is mine, if it was i'd be very boring indeed!.

I think its partially because of the nature of the place as well, a lot of people with really strong beliefs and no interest in justifying them or arguing over them stay out, same for slightly less mature people as well. I think it might also be because between muslims it can be easy to accuse someone of being wrong or being a sinner or something like that but if its someone of a different religion those kind of statements don't really hold much weight at all.

The people who practice these kind of things in ordinary discourse soon (usually) find out things like that don't generally work in those forums.

The discussion is generally very well conducted in there though.

Isiluriun left? Since when? Since why? I hope you are mistaken! I enjoy his posts very much.

A couple days ago i believe. He sent me a PM but i was away doing christmas things. I asked him why he decided to leave, his account is still here but i don't know if he can recieve messages anymore. If he gets back to me and says its ok to share, i'll try tell you guys why.

Edited by kingpomba

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I dont feel it is mine, if it was i'd be very boring indeed!.

What does the boring part mean? Even if we say you don't find it yours, then:

1. We should move towards trying to make you feel it's yours;

2. You are still very comfortable in it but on the other sections, the picture is not that nice.

The discussion is generally very well conducted in there though.

For the philosophy, atheism/theism...section, I would agree but on the other ones, I think there is a lot of work to be done. It seems you have not read the Shia and Sunni discussion and, surely, you have not read the mutah "Armageddon" that is going on these days.

The accusations and insults are, overall, on the whole forum getting a bit too much.

A couple days ago i believe. He sent me a PM but i was away doing christmas things. I asked him why he decided to leave, his account is still here but i don't know if he can recieve messages anymore. If he gets back to me and says its ok to share, i'll try tell you guys why.

Controversy is that iSilurian was Muslim member undercover. What do you think? By the way, his account has been deactivated. It is like his account remains and also posts after de-activation but he cannot sign in or something like that.

Last but not the least, thank youuuuuu for posting ALL of you! :D

May Allah (SWT) bless us all, our families and loved ones, may He guide us all to The Straight Path with His Perfect Guidance and may He, The Forgiver of Sins and The Oft-Forgiving, forgive all our sins for, indeed, there is neither any refuge nor any respite for the sinners except in Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì.

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What does the boring part mean? Even if we say you don't find it yours, then:

1. We should move towards trying to make you feel it's yours;

2. You are still very comfortable in it but on the other sections, the picture is not that nice.

Oh damn, i think i totally misunderstood you. I thought you meant i act like i think i own that part of the section or i police it or aggresively argue it. I totally took it in the wrong way. I understood what you meant now, slightly embarrasing actually. I do feel very welcome there though, its great that people haven't resorted to petty insults or anything but i think when people see the quality of that forum and how good people in there at arguing and systematically showing the flaws in weak ideas, i think they just kind of give up haha.

I do look in the other sections occasionally but i stopped that after awhile. In the laws section i was told a couple of times my views were not at all welcome because i wasn't a muslim and in the mutah thread i point out how they were saying certain things about how easy women of certain religions are and i made my objections there, wasn't expecting as much fire as i got. So, i just largely don't even read those anymore. They are mostly for the muslims here though anyway, i feel like i would be intruding.

At least i understand what you mean now.

For the philosophy, atheism/theism...section, I would agree but on the other ones, I think there is a lot of work to be done. It seems you have not read the Shia and Sunni discussion and, surely, you have not read the mutah "Armageddon" that is going on these days.

Yeah, i don't even go in the shia/sunni one. I think with ideas like mutah its very emotional and strong. There aren't really a lot of philosophical ways (might be some theological ways) to argue against it, so i can see how it can turn into a volley of not so nice things.

Overall though, i am very surprised how welcoming these forums are. Many times i've been expected to of been banned or cautioned for expressing certain views or ideas or saying things that could be considered by some insulting but i wasn't really out to insult anyone. A lot of people have pointed out how welcoming this forum has been to them (well the non-muslims i've seen anyway) and i'm very thankful this place is like that. I think on many other boards i would of got banned long ago.

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A couple days ago i believe. He sent me a PM but i was away doing christmas things. I asked him why he decided to leave, his account is still here but i don't know if he can recieve messages anymore. If he gets back to me and says its ok to share, i'll try tell you guys why.

He will be able to receive your message (through his email address) however he wont be able to reply via PM, so unless he has another way to contact you I don't think he would be able to reply.

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Khadim, my akhlaq is nothing next to yours. Masha'Allah one of the most well mannered on this forum.

But i mean it will take more than just a thread, there have been many threads.. This one is more specific whch is good, but imo te MOD's need to enforce better.. For example bring in 'temp post bans' if someone dishes an insult, maybe ban them from posting for a day or a few days (depending on the unakhlaqiness shown).. That may work if it is consistantly enforced? Or it might just do nothing. Lol. But come on it's not hard to keep a little akhlaq..

Edited by Kamran-Syed

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In The Name of Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì, The Most Beneficent, The Most Merciful.

Oh damn, i think i totally misunderstood you. I thought you meant i act like i think i own that part of the section or i police it or aggresively argue it. I totally took it in the wrong way. I understood what you meant now, slightly embarrasing actually. I do feel very welcome there though, its great that people haven't resorted to petty insults or anything but i think when people see the quality of that forum and how good people in there at arguing and systematically showing the flaws in weak ideas, i think they just kind of give up haha.

I do look in the other sections occasionally but i stopped that after awhile. In the laws section i was told a couple of times my views were not at all welcome because i wasn't a muslim and in the mutah thread i point out how they were saying certain things about how easy women of certain religions are and i made my objections there, wasn't expecting as much fire as i got. So, i just largely don't even read those anymore. They are mostly for the muslims here though anyway, i feel like i would be intruding.

At least i understand what you mean now.

Yeah, i don't even go in the shia/sunni one. I think with ideas like mutah its very emotional and strong. There aren't really a lot of philosophical ways (might be some theological ways) to argue against it, so i can see how it can turn into a volley of not so nice things.

Overall though, i am very surprised how welcoming these forums are. Many times i've been expected to of been banned or cautioned for expressing certain views or ideas or saying things that could be considered by some insulting but i wasn't really out to insult anyone. A lot of people have pointed out how welcoming this forum has been to them (well the non-muslims i've seen anyway) and i'm very thankful this place is like that. I think on many other boards i would of got banned long ago.

Thank you for answering! :P Yes, what I had meant by "Kingpomba...feels the forum is his" is that you feel part of it and you feel as if it is your own much like a shia would consider Shiachat to be his "own" forum.

I would certainly disagree. I have not read much of your posts (because they are either too long or too complicated for my little head) but from the one I have, I can easily tell that you are very mannered. So, I don't think you would ever get banned!

Khadim, my akhlaq is nothing next to yours. Masha'Allah one of the most well mannered on this forum.

But i mean it will take more than just a thread, there have been many threads.. This one is more specific whch is good, but imo te MOD's need to enforce better.. For example bring in 'temp post bans' if someone dishes an insult, maybe ban them from posting for a day or a few days (depending on the unakhlaqiness shown).. That may work if it is consistantly enforced? Or it might just do nothing. Lol. But come on it's not hard to keep a little akhlaq..

Oh no! You are just being humble. Your akhlaq beats mine by miles and miles! And to say I am the most well mannered? Well, that is, certainly, a grosssssssssssssssssssssssssssss exaggeration!

I do agree to your point about the mods/admins being a bit more strict on things and be a bit more quicker as well. I had the same thought in mind but I thought, they obviously have their own policy and, perhaps, being more stricter than they already are may make the forum more intolerant and maybe this is why they are a bit more easy on things. Your suggestions about temporary bans are quite good such that, if needed, they discipline a person but at the same time, we don't lose one of our members.

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In The Name of Allah سبحانه وتعالى, The Most Beneficent, The Most Merciful.

Thank you for answering! :P Yes, what I had meant by "Kingpomba...feels the forum is his" is that you feel part of it and you feel as if it is your own much like a shia would consider Shiachat to be his "own" forum.

I would certainly disagree. I have not read much of your posts (because they are either too long or too complicated for my little head) but from the one I have, I can easily tell that you are very mannered. So, I don't think you would ever get banned!

Oh no! You are just being humble. Your akhlaq beats mine by miles and miles! And to say I am the most well mannered? Well, that is, certainly, a grosssssssssssssssssssssssssssss exaggeration!

I do agree to your point about the mods/admins being a bit more strict on things and be a bit more quicker as well. I had the same thought in mind but I thought, they obviously have their own policy and, perhaps, being more stricter than they already are may make the forum more intolerant and maybe this is why they are a bit more easy on things. Your suggestions about temporary bans are quite good such that, if needed, they discipline a person but at the same time, we don't lose one of our members.

I'm not exaggerating! You areeeeeeeeee!

Yeah, lets just hope people show some akhlaq instead, rather than MODs having to waste more time. Another way forward could be to have - FORUM MODs - strictly to keep threads etc friendly and if they see bad behaviour, intervene. Ban for few days if need be etc. or even delete posts?

But yeah your akhlaq is awesome.

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Guest Mushu

In The Name of Allah سبحانه وتعالى, The Most Beneficent, The Most Merciful.

Thank you for answering! :P Yes, what I had meant by "Kingpomba...feels the forum is his" is that you feel part of it and you feel as if it is your own much like a shia would consider Shiachat to be his "own" forum.

I would certainly disagree. I have not read much of your posts (because they are either too long or too complicated for my little head) but from the one I have, I can easily tell that you are very mannered. So, I don't think you would ever get banned!

Oh no! You are just being humble. Your akhlaq beats mine by miles and miles! And to say I am the most well mannered? Well, that is, certainly, a grosssssssssssssssssssssssssssss exaggeration!

I do agree to your point about the mods/admins being a bit more strict on things and be a bit more quicker as well. I had the same thought in mind but I thought, they obviously have their own policy and, perhaps, being more stricter than they already are may make the forum more intolerant and maybe this is why they are a bit more easy on things. Your suggestions about temporary bans are quite good such that, if needed, they discipline a person but at the same time, we don't lose one of our members.

I'm not exaggerating! You areeeeeeeeee!

Yeah, lets just hope people show some akhlaq instead, rather than MODs having to waste more time. Another way forward could be to have - FORUM MODs - strictly to keep threads etc friendly and if they see bad behaviour, intervene. Ban for few days if need be etc. or even delete posts?

But yeah your akhlaq is awesome.

bromance.jpg

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Greetings

But i mean it will take more than just a thread, there have been many threads.. This one is more specific whch is good, but imo te MOD's need to enforce better.. For example bring in 'temp post bans' if someone dishes an insult, maybe ban them from posting for a day or a few days (depending on the unakhlaqiness shown).. That may work if it is consistantly enforced? Or it might just do nothing. Lol. But come on it's not hard to keep a little akhlaq..

Chamran brother (are you relative of Martyr Chamran?) I think masses must boycott bad akhlaq post by staging walkout from thread or by ignoring post completely.

Mr Ali he say :

Know that, certainly, those creatures of Allah who preserve His knowledge offer protection to those things which He desires to be protected and make His springs flow (for the benefit of others). They contact each other with friendliness and meet each other with affection. They drink water from cups that quench the thirst and return from the watering places fully satiated. Misgiving does not affect them and backbiting does not gain ground with them. In this way Allah has tied their nature with good manners. Because of this they love each other and meet each other. They have become superior, like seeds which are selected by taking some and throwing away others. This selection has distinguished them and the process of choosing has purified them.

Here is source

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Ahhh my heart hurts lool

Kamran and sd2 you two have the best akalq even though I havnt chat to you lots. I have never come across people like you. May god give you a manision in the after life in my name lool. Lool thats if you dont consider me as a kafriaa.

Deuces

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Ahhh my heart hurts lool

Kamran and sd2 you two have the best akalq even though I havnt chat to you lots. I have never come across people like you. May god give you a manision in the after life in my name lool. Lool thats if you dont consider me as a kafriaa.

Deuces

Thanks a lot kim.. Alhamdhulilah.. But there are others with better akhlaq, i'm telling you! loool @ mansion bit :lol:

God bless you

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Ahhh my heart hurts lool

Kamran and sd2 you two have the best akalq even though I havnt chat to you lots. I have never come across people like you. May god give you a manision in the after life in my name lool. Lool thats if you dont consider me as a kafriaa.

Deuces

Thanks :) but I am sure there are tons of people on this website with better akhlaaq than me .. and dont worry I dont consider you a kafir :P

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Guest Mushu

Thanks a lot kim.. Alhamdhulilah.. But there are others with better akhlaq, i'm telling you! loool @ mansion bit :lol:

God bless you

Thanks :) but I am sure there are tons of people on this website with better akhlaaq than me .. and dont worry I dont consider you a kafir :P

Lol am not going to lie to you but the onlys ones I have seen are you two , I hope theirs more lool ..

It's true, I have far better Akhlaq.

Can I have a mansion?

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I'm not exaggerating! You areeeeeeeeee!

Yeah, lets just hope people show some akhlaq instead, rather than MODs having to waste more time. Another way forward could be to have - FORUM MODs - strictly to keep threads etc friendly and if they see bad behaviour, intervene. Ban for few days if need be etc. or even delete posts?

But yeah your akhlaq is awesome.

I am NOT and you are! And my Akhlaq is NOT awesome! Period! End of discussion! And remember, if you try to argue with me, it is my thread, I can take preventive measures! :shaytan:

Well, I don't know. Like I have said, maybe too much policing by the mods/admins may lead to this forum being too intolerant for this forum? Most probably, punishment may not even work. :unsure:

bromance.jpg

What does this mean?

Edited by Khadim uz Zahra

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Ahhh my heart hurts lool

Kamran and sd2 you two have the best akalq even though I havnt chat to you lots. I have never come across people like you. May god give you a manision in the after life in my name lool. Lool thats if you dont consider me as a kafriaa.

Deuces

I was just about to agree but...SD2 CANNOT be the one with the best akhlaq because he is, after all, a Mufeedi! Mufeedis are tyrannical people and they surely don't have the best Akhlaq; so I would agree with the title going to Kamran but SD2... :no:

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So, you had meant SD2 has the best Akhlaq right? And NOT The Shia Terminator, right? Of course, you could never say that The Shia Terminator has the best Akhlaq; I am sure you know he is a Mufeedi and have seen his tyrannical rule on the chat room. But here is the sad news: The Shia Terminator is SD2! You see, he has two account in order to fool people. He uses that one to show he is so innocent but with the Terminator shows his tyrannical rule!

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