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In the Name of God بسم الله

Is Pakistan Going To Become Wahabistan?

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Tiger

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What do you think about this:

this is reality in pakistan...a

hard reality,

every day...every day atleast

10 to 25 shias and sunnis are

murdered in pakistan as an

average by wahabi terrorists, from:

parachanar,

hangu,

peshawar,

di khan,

dg khan, chakwal,

lahore,

quetta,

karachi,

etc..etc... this has become a routine in

pakistan,

this has become more

advanced since last 30 years

from wahabi ziaul haq's

regime, pakistani establishment,

pakistani bureaucracy,

pakistani administration,

pakistani politicians,

pakistani system,

pakistani media, pakistani elites,

pakistani rulers,

etc... they all are either wahabis

themselves or are under the

influence of wahabis,

they protect wahabi criminals

in front of all without any

shame, they hide facts to protect

wahabi criminals,

they support wahabi ideas

while they know that they

are fake, why they do this all??? to protect nationalism??? No, to protect wahabis, the name of pakistan means

wahabistan, pakistan has lost its direction

since wahabis have invaded

pakistan with the help of

wahabi saudi money, what you see today is not

pakistan, but wahabistan, sunnis and shias who make up

more than 90% of total

pakistani population, are

dying under hunger and

poverty,

while wahabis are enjoying...pakistan...wahabistan, have you ever tried to

calculate that what is the

current poverty ratio in

wahabis????

and, what is in sunnis and

shias???? sunnis and shias have created

pakistan, while then wahabis

opposed pakistan's creation,

today, sunnis and shias have

been kicked out on the street,

and wahabis are sitting in the ruling palaces of pakistan,

do not ever confuse with

gelani or zardari, they are just

kept on the face,

behind that, there is another

world, a very very ugly world of

wahabis.

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There is already a backlash building up from the Barelhvi majority especially in places like Karachi and Faisalabad. Drive through Sindh countryside during the 12th of Rabiul Awal and you'll see the country painted green with their flags . I once saw "Deoband Kutta" written on the wall where a Sunni tehreek rally passed through. In a few decades the Wahabis'll be reeling under the Qadris. And neither are much good for Shias, but at least the Barelhvis dont blow themselves up.

Edited by JimJam
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The Wahhabis (working with their CIA masters) certainly wish to destroy Pakistan. Pakistan needs to seek the support of Iran, Russia, and China to be protected from the Zio-Amerikkkan imperialist threat and the CIA's "al-Qaeda" aka al-CIA-duh false flag program.

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Pakistan is a failed nation cuz we are ignorant n emotional freaks. Shias are no better.... Shias are dead beats!! most of the shias in Pakistan are shias by name only! They could care less about their fellow shia brothers n sisters.. i.e Zulfiqar Mirza, Zardari, Faisal Raza Abidi, Haider Abbas Rizvi.......

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The sad and unfortunate aspect is, that there's no single solution to cleaning up this mess.

The frightening thing is, sooner or later, if there are no actions, I can see the Wahabis imposing their ways onto the Barelvi peasants, eventually forcefully assimilating them, gaining more grounds and numbers, then eventually killing off the Shiites.

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The problem is, that the wahabis are actually quite clever, their ideology has being subtly spreading for a long long time now, in the same way, we get accused of dazzling sunnis with our talk of love of the ahl ul bayt, the same is true of the wahabis when it comes to the sunnah. Basically they set themselves up as being pro-sunnah and anti bid'ah, (which in a warped way is true), so who in their right mind would be against that? Especially in the west, (in england at any rate) this idea of the four schools isn't really that alive in the youth, i have never really heard that many people describe themselves as hanafi, maliki etc, and as such, it is easy for them to get drawn towards wahabism (also I have read that the saudis fund up to 90% of mosques in the uk). To most people in england, especially in the pakistani and somali communities, bin-Laden is hero, defender of the sunnah etc etc, when i was in college i always heard people glorifying him, the taliban, al qaeda, even if they probalby didn't know the ins and outs of these groups, to them these groups are the living sunnah, as such even though alot of these people i'm talking about did listen to music, smoke weed, have girl friends, go to raves etc, in their minds in the future they aspired to live like the taliban, some guys even talked about their dream being to die in jihad in Iraq (I always assumed in fighting the americans, though i didn't really ask)

Also it isn't really that hard for the wahabis to get the general sunnis to be suspicious of the shi'a, most shi'a behave in a very strange way to start with, and the uneducated cultural ones do more propaganda for the wahabis than the wahabis need. Of course every now and again things happen that make the normal sunnis think twice, Hezbollah and sayed Nasrullah have played a massive role in this, also certain sunni countries obvious proximaty to america and as such israel is make people question certain things. Suicide bombs on civilans also doesn't help when it comes to rational people.

As to the state on the ground in pakistan, I don't know, it's been a while since i've been, but I can easily believe it soon will be wahabistan, if it isn't already

Somalia will also be wahamalia soon, if it isn't already

inna lillahi wa inna layhi raji'oon

Edited by Ali_Hussain
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The main problem is that the most of the Sunnis don't read or don't know how to read. Here a family sends her/his son or daughter to Madras headed by an ignorant Wahabi type element who claims to be a True follower of Deen. He would be sitting in the Madrasa all day long sending children to different homes collecting food and money in the name of Madrasa construction. In most families children who have mental disabilities or autism are sent to Madrasa because their family believe he/she might do good in deen if not in practical life. The mentally incapable child then further becomes a mindless terrorist or an idiot so called Alm-e-deen.

I have had family friends who are Sunni. Socially when they meet, they usually show their acceptance towards shia sect but there is always an element of " but" in the argument. When i was growing up i studied with their children in school. Although their parents seemed pro-Shia their children spoke otherwise. The constant bragging of shia being hypocrites, lairs, deceivers and jews in disguise of Muslims were something commonly said.

If for any reason Pakistan does become Wahabistan then i guess the only thing we would be left with is nuking our selves !

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The sad and unfortunate aspect is, that there's no single solution to cleaning up this mess.

The frightening thing is, sooner or later, if there are no actions, I can see the Wahabis imposing their ways onto the Barelvi peasants, eventually forcefully assimilating them, gaining more grounds and numbers, then eventually killing off the Shiites.

I thought the peasants were already lost to the extremists, am I wrong? I too think Pakistan is lost for now but being lost is not always a permanent circumstance. I have Shia friends in a few cities in Pakistan, I pray and meditate on their safety and pray for better days for them and Pakistan, I just cannot give up.

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I see a small ray of hope rising from Imran Khan. If there is to be a revolution in Pakistan similar to the recent Arab spring, he will seed it, and bring back hope to Pakistan. Though my hope dwindles day by day as I see Shias being targeted and massacred on a daily basis.

sorry, I don't follow pakistani politics that closely, but isn't Imran Khan a big supporter of the taliban?

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I thought the peasants were already lost to the extremists, am I wrong?

Most of the rural population of Pakistan is Barelhvi, the Deobandi majority province is Pukhtunkhwa and the Ahl-e-Hadith i.e Wahabis are the smallest sect in Pakistan, apart from the Ahmadis and Ismailis. The Deobandis & ahl-e-hadiths real source of power is the they have influence in the military and intelligence which supports and turn a blind eye to their terrorists.

Most of you guys aren't even in Pakistan. The Wahabi / Deobandi are being called what they are now, Wahhabis. Once a movement that tries to hide in ambiguity and vagueness is labelled, it stagnates. I have hope for the future.

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  • 2 months later...
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Pakistan, unfortunately, is a failed state. The fact that Wahabis are slaughtering people left and right every day is indicative of such.

At least in India, for the most part, Shiites are safe.

Extremely wrong you are or you are misguided. I personally know Pakistan but there is no such religious war because it is only political war. In India there is a much difference kept in Muslim and Hindu which cause trouble to muslims. If you remember that Muslims were burnt alive once in India and there mosques are also not secure.

Tiger TOO wrong with his opinion that wahabi are terrorists. No Muslim can be terrorist and you should know it if being a muslim brother.

A country having his own Atomic Bomb can't be called a failed state.

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Pakistan is a failed nation cuz we are ignorant n emotional freaks. Shias are no better.... Shias are dead beats!! most of the shias in Pakistan are shias by name only! They could care less about their fellow shia brothers n sisters..

So true unfortunately. There is no Shia leadership proper.

The way Pakistani Shias are, they are destined for humiliation, murders, and genocides. They will wake-up only after a jolt like Iraq where a couple of millions were massacred by Saddam. Had they listened to Ayatullah Khomeni and Ayatullah Baqir us Sadr in 70s, they would not have wasted their 2 generations in Iraq.

I see a glimmer of hope from Shia activism from Karachi and Parachinar area, and may be Gilgit Baltistan. Hazara communities in Baluchistan are also prime for Shia activism. If someone wants to invest in correcting the state of Shias in Pakistan, these are the places where the ROI will be much higher.

Rest of Punjab and Sind is just filled with idiots who will more likely change their religion once the push comes to shove. They are not known for showing any spine to any strong invaders, ideological or physical. These people care more about their linguistic or clan affiliations and don't care about religion much anyway. Almost akin to animals without any reasoning or discipline.

Even in Qom Howzas, you see a distinct difference in approach and intellect between the students coming from Karachi/Parachinar/Baluchistan versus the clowns who show up from Punjab and Sind.

A handful of righteous ulema who are from Punjab such as Jawad Naqvi have already been discredited by the same Jahil masses even before they boarded from the plane. You read Kufi character in Karbala, these people are true Kufi in nature. Another unfortunate fact for Pakistani Shias, these people are in numerical majority among the general population and Shia population in Pakistan.

Overall for Pakistan, even a crazy leadership will do (ike Sadr in Iraq) as long as those Paki Shias learn to stand under one banner.

P.S. I apologize if I've ruffled some feathers by my criticism of Punjabi and Sindi Shias. If you think otherwise, give me one concrete example of if those succors have done anything good for the fate of Pakistani Shias in past 60 years.

Edited by Waiting for HIM
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Even in Qom Howzas, you see a distinct difference in approach and intellect between the students coming from Karachi/Parachinar/Baluchistan versus the clowns who show up from Punjab and Sind.

Refrain from making such sweeping, bigoted statements.

We are all of the same stock. What is so magical about a Balochi Shia aalim (are there any, anyway?) and not about a Punjabi one. Nothing.

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P.S. I apologize if I've ruffled some feathers by my criticism of Punjabi and Sindi Shias. If you think otherwise, give me one concrete example of if those succors have done anything good for the fate of Pakistani Shias in past 60 years.

Interesting you appologize while you twist the knife in their back.

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Even in Qom Howzas, you see a distinct difference in approach and intellect between the students coming from Karachi/Parachinar/Baluchistan versus the clowns who show up from Punjab and Sind.

Thinking of it, I hope you have heard the name of Grand Ayatullah Hafiz Bashir Hussain Najafi. He is a Punjabi.

Bring one of the same calibre from Parachinar/Karachi/Balochistan and all the other areas you seem to fancy.

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Two of the biggest mujtahids from Pakistan are Punjabis.

A handful of righteous ulema who are from Punjab such as Jawad Naqvi have already been discredited by the same Jahil masses even before they boarded from the plane. You read Kufi character in Karbala, these people are true Kufi in nature. Another unfortunate fact for Pakistani Shias, these people are in numerical majority among the general population and Shia population in Pakistan

I agree there is lots of Jahalat in Punjab, but which kind are you talking about?

And how is it not present in any other part of the country?

Edited by doobybrother
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I do not want to take this wonderful OP to a wrong tangent but, one Allama Iqbal, one Bashir Hussain Najafi, one Jawad Naqvi can not compensate millions of ignorant good for nothing masses.

Compare this with all the Shia philanthropic work that is done by Hazara Shis community, the prolonged resistance to wahabis and paki army that Parachinar people have been facing for over a decade, the Shia community work being done by Karachi Shias and so on. Like I said, quote one substantial, (just one) major work done by Shias of Punjab or Sind that contributes towards the overall good for Pakistani Shias.

Overall in wealth and influence, Shias of Punjab and Sind lead by far but their role in overall good for Shias is zero, zilch, nada.

I do not want to make it a Punjabi/Sindi bashing post. If you do not see room for improvement, then stay as you are. If you agree, then have Punjabi/ Sindhi Shias show some real work.

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@Waiting for him

"I do not want to make it a Punjabi/Sindi bashing post. If you do not see room for improvement, then stay as you are. If you agree, then have Punjabi/ Sindhi Shias show some real work. "

But you will.

"but, one Allama Iqbal, one Bashir Hussain Najafi, one Jawad Naqvi can not compensate millions of ignorant good for nothing masses."

You are a silly girl no offence to the women here.

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Again, do not want to change this wonderful topic...

I admit, I got little carried away in my previous post criticizing Shias from Punjab and Sind. I reviewed my posts and they came out little racist. I by no means am against the Shias of Punjab or Sind due to their linguistic background. I wish them good and pray that inshAllah they get the taufeeq to do something concrete in paying their dues to the Imam of Time (as). I hope they realize that they among the most resourceful, most influential, and numerically highest among Pakistani Shias, so they put their weight in improving the sad state of Shias of Pakistan. We all can benefit from more ilm and more awareness.

Peace..

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I do not want to take this wonderful OP to a wrong tangent but, one Allama Iqbal, one Bashir Hussain Najafi, one Jawad Naqvi can not compensate millions of ignorant good for nothing masses.

Compare this with all the Shia philanthropic work that is done by Hazara Shis community, the prolonged resistance to wahabis and paki army that Parachinar people have been facing for over a decade, the Shia community work being done by Karachi Shias and so on. Like I said, quote one substantial, (just one) major work done by Shias of Punjab or Sind that contributes towards the overall good for Pakistani Shias.

Overall in wealth and influence, Shias of Punjab and Sind lead by far but their role in overall good for Shias is zero, zilch, nada.

I do not want to make it a Punjabi/Sindi bashing post. If you do not see room for improvement, then stay as you are. If you agree, then have Punjabi/ Sindhi Shias show some real work.

It is akin to a white supremacist telling us blacks/browns: "I am not being racist but these Asians are scum of the earth"

I don't understand what is your problem. What is so magical the Shia of Parachinar and Karachi have done that you don't find it among Punjabis and Sindhis? Parachinar is a highly polarised place, with competing Shia and Wahhabi tribes. They have been fighting for a long time. There is no such duplicate situation in the length and breadth of Punjab and Sindh (perhaps with the exception of Jhang) where there are no strictly Shia or Sunni tribes/cities/politics etc. So you can't expect Punjabi or Sindhi Shia to start killing Wahhabis there.

What is so wonderful about Karachi Shia? What have they done? Please enlighten us. If anything, the Shia of Karachi are a diverse group of people from many ethnicities, languages and cultures. There is no such thing as a monolith Karachi Shias. I take that you are referring to Urdu speaking immigrants from India and their descendents. If so, what's so magical about them?

I just told you about one of the grand marjas of Shia world, Bashir Hussain Najafi, who is a Punjabi. There is another marja residing in Pakistan who is also Punjabi from Sargodha: Muhammad Hussain Najafi aka Dhakoo. Does it mean nothing to you that you call them just "one Bashir Hussain Najafi". Show me something from Parachinar and Karachi of the same stature. Just show me.

And who the hell cares about Allama Iqbal. He has nothing to do with Shi'ism.

The "millions of ignorant good for nothing massess" also exist in abundance in Karachi and Parachinar, and in fact in the length of breadth of the country, in addition to in Punjab and Sindh.

You keep talking about "collective good of the Shia of Pakistan". How do you define it anyway? What great have Shia of Karachi (a motley group of all languages, ethnicities and cultures) and Parachinari Shia have done for the "collective good of the Shia"?

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There was a time not too long ago, when the anti US sentiment in Pakistan was still profound, and you have a large chunk of the Pakistani population harboring sympathies for the groups they today despise. This was before the extremists started targeting the muslim population. I think from a tactical stand point, it was a blunder, you do not senselessly target the very people whose sympathies you are trying to win over. By now the average Pakistani wants nothing to do with their brand of islam, especially given the democratic movements spanning across the world, the Pakistani people are looking for more sensible alternatives.

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  • 1 month later...

Extremely wrong you are or you are misguided. I personally know Pakistan but there is no such religious war because it is only political war. In India there is a much difference kept in Muslim and Hindu which cause trouble to muslims. If you remember that Muslims were burnt alive once in India and there mosques are also not secure.

Tiger TOO wrong with his opinion that wahabi are terrorists. No Muslim can be terrorist and you should know it if being a muslim brother.

A country having his own Atomic Bomb can't be called a failed state.

you are completely mistaken brother

india is a secular country

i think india is the only nation in the world of its kind

any religion can b practised peacefully here

let me ask u 1 question can a shia practise his faith in saudi or can a sunni in iran ..and like wise

the best example being "milad un nabi" is a public holiday in india but not in saudi arabia :no:

i do agree there are a few fanatics and politicians who want to disturb the secular atmosphere in india

but when you compare with other countries it is faaaaaaar better

jai hind

labbaik ya hussain a.s.

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  • 2 weeks later...
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I would like to add that killing each other incessantly will not do anything for Shias of Pakistan. Besides as Marbles has pointed earlier all of us have different cultural backgrounds and besides Muharram there is little or no contact beside the Friday prayer for most communities. Further more Sindhi and Urdu speaking communities view themselves as Sindhis and Urdu speakers first,in fact, the shia identity is not that valued as cultural one.

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Pakistan may not have already a wahabi satate but it is going in that direction. And why is this.....

1) social, economic and political downfall of Shias

2) while there is Shia nucleus those claiming to be leaders are everywhere and are only seen making statements when someone is killed. these leaders also lack the ability of public service infect they want the public to serve them.

3) Azadari used to be collective platform of Shias of all walks of life but even this unique platform is divided between so called malangs, valayatis, rewatis and progressive thinkers.

4) Pakistani Shias used to act or at least think as Shia nation whereas now our ideology is very much based upon language and geographical regions we are panjabi, pathan, saraki, balti, Sindhi, mahajar, Bloch Shias anything but not Pakistans

5) our Majalis have stopped teaching and promoting Hussainiyat instead out Majalis are more focused on yazid and his ancestors so while we teach our children who bad yazeed and his kind of people were we do not teach our children Hussainiyat therefore we can make them haters of yazeed but not followers of imam.

One can add more to this list and I am tryings to say is that Pakistan would never see wahabism if we were better Pakistani if we were better role models if we were united. Of course wahabism has a huge backing form likes of Saudis and qataris

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