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Sir

Iran- Sharia State?

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I don't want to defend myself.

I don't want to defend Iran.

I don't want to give you the answer you need.

You show alot of disrespect for something as big as Iran.

Use more words for those who ask not.

Use less words for those who ask.

Something?

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I don't want to defend myself.

I don't want to defend Iran.

I don't want to give you the answer you need.

You show alot of disrespect for something as big as Iran.

Use more words for those who ask not.

Use less words for those who ask.

Something?

???

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I have read many claims by Muslim arguing that there exists no sharia state. Would you consider Iran a proper shariah state? If not, why?

Thanks!

Those claims usually come from Sunni Muslims, most out of jealousy and some do not consider Sharia government implemented by Shias as valid...

But, most Shia Muslims consider Iran a proper Sharia state, especially when it comes to its laws and judiciary system. Actions of individuals, groups or governments not necessary represent the constitution or the Sharia rules defined by law. Also, proper does not mean perfect.

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I have read many claims by Muslim arguing that there exists no sharia state. Would you consider Iran a proper shariah state? If not, why?

Thanks!

A Sharia state is a racist state. Iran will never see the Light until they recognize "Iran for all Iranians".

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But, most Shia Muslims consider Iran a proper Sharia state, especially when it comes to its laws and judiciary system. Actions of individuals, groups or governments not necessary represent the constitution or the Sharia rules defined by law. Also, proper does not mean perfect.

Can you elaborate on that point? Besides the actions of certain individuals and the government, would you say that there are certain parts of Sharia that are not correctly implemented, or implemented at all (according to Shi'ism of course...) in Iran?

Edited by Sir

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salaam

Iran as well as the rest of the world are all very far from sharia i can give many examples of anti islamic laws

look at the citizenship laws

marriage laws

baitulmal

khums (tax) system

a million problems

you will find some parts of islam in iran and some parts of islam in the united states and some parts of Islam in Australia and so on

i give you examples comparing iran and Australia:

in hijab you might see Iran is more Islamic

in penal code iran is more islamic

in citizenship rights Australia is more Islamic than iran

in baitulmal Australia is more Islamic

in bribery control Australia is more Islamic

and so on depending on which sector

Edited by alimohamad40

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A true Sharia state will only be available at the time of Imam Mahdi, until that time states such as Iran can only try it's best to make it possible.

As brother Alimohammad40 mentioned there are many problems in Iran in regards to Law. But, you can't really blame this entirely on the lawmakers.

Many factors are involved when trying to turn the tide on a law that has been well rooted in a system that is both national and international.

An example of this is Citizenship. In another thread it was discussed why Woman with non Iranian fathers can't get citizenship. Reasons for these are plenty, security is one reason.

Iran is a nation that is under constant attack from spies, agents, journalists, saboteurs etc. It is somewhat crucial to know the background of each person, and usually this is done by tracking fathers history.

Or many years of Western influence into every governement system, bank, and official offices, hard to change something like that.

However, on the flip side, there are some sideeffects such as a story from a family friend of mine. We know this Afghan shia family who fought against Saddam side by side with Iranian shias. He got martyred, and his son got paralyzed.

They fought for Islam, and they fought for the safety of Iranian Shias. They got kicked out from Iran and did not get citizenship. They live with me now for the time being.

That being said, i'm still a supporter of Iran because it has people who try really hard to make it a good Shia state. I never understood people who turn their backs because some Ulama, lawmakers, government official aren't trying hard enough. There are plenty who are trying to make it an Islamic Utopia. Instead of turning our backs, we the younger generation need to put effort into fixing that which is broken.

But,,,,,,,,in the end,,,haters gonna hate!!!

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I have read many claims by Muslim arguing that there exists no sharia state. Would you consider Iran a proper shariah state? If not, why?

Thanks!

The Islamic Republic of Iran implements the Shari'ah more thoroughly then most Muslim-majority countries. As for a perfect Islamic state following the Islamic Shari'ah perfectly I believe that will likely only come when Imam al-Mahdi (as) returns.

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A Sharia state is a racist state. Iran will never see the Light until they recognize "Iran for all Iranians".

Lol, you apparently don't know a thing about Sharia.

Too bad he is banned, I always look forward to reading his trollish remarks LOOOL.

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Do you need to be a perfect state to ban public music concerts, and not allow Western musicians to perform in your country? Is it really that hard?

I think what's hard is dealing with the consequences of the ban.

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I think what's hard is dealing with the consequences of the ban.

And what would those be? Just don't prosecute people for making/downloading/listening to music in private. If people want to corrupt themselves in private, then I don't think it's any of the state's business, but the spread of public corruption can certainly be prevented.

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And what would those be? Just don't prosecute people for making/downloading/listening to music in private. If people want to corrupt themselves in private, then I don't think it's any of the state's business, but the spread of public corruption can certainly be prevented.

Growing public displeasure with government? Think of it as regulation of corruption.

Anyway there are a million other "inconsistencies" within the state as you say that make concerts a non issue. The average Iranian doesn't even know that music is haram (according to some marjas).

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Growing public displeasure with government? Think of it as regulation of corruption.

Anyway there are a million other "inconsistencies" within the state as you say that make concerts a non issue.

Yeah, I'm just using it as an example.

The average Iranian doesn't even know that music is haram (according to some marjas).

I'm pretty sure no marja would allow the kind of music that is played in pop or rock concerts. We aren't talking classical music concerts here.

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Can you elaborate on that point? Besides the actions of certain individuals and the government, would you say that there are certain parts of Sharia that are not correctly implemented, or implemented at all (according to Shi'ism of course...) in Iran?

By those two terms I meant that, you could say Iran is a proper Islamic state, but if you are expecting a 'perfect' Islamic state then the claim that there is no Islamic state might apply. And as repenter stated, "A true Sharia state will only be available at the time of Imam Mahdi, until that time states such as Iran can only try it's best to make it possible."

And yes, there been evidences where flaws existed and mistakes done by officials and some of the governments, or in the society by the people where government never bothered to fix or prevent them.

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I have read many claims by Muslim arguing that there exists no sharia state. Would you consider Iran a proper shariah state? If not, why?

Thanks!

No.

Can you elaborate on that point? Besides the actions of certain individuals and the government, would you say that there are certain parts of Sharia that are not correctly implemented, or implemented at all (according to Shi'ism of course...) in Iran?

Definitely.

Iran is anything but Islamic...

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No.

Definitely.

Iran is anything but Islamic...

These kinds of statements are only based on 'hatred, jealousy or bad experience'......

Anything------but-------Islamic? That is really a strong claim... I often hear such statements by Salafi/Wahabis who express their hatreds either for Persians or for Shias and come up with such wordings.

Lets put it this way! Is there any other government or country on the planet earth that is closer to Islamic Sharia more than Iran?

For example, we have Saudi, Sudan, Pakistan, Yemen, Afghanistan (current and former under the Taliban), Turkey (AK), Egypt (biggest MB group operating & struggling for years), current Iraq, Gaza (Palestine) and some other states where by constitution they either claim Sharia laws or Islamic movements exist running the governments. And Iran. Which one would you pick?

Edited by Noah-

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No.

Definitely.

Iran is anything but Islamic...

(bismillah)

iran is more islamic than any other nation, they are led by followers of ahlulbayt, ofcourse they are not perfect, but to even say iran is anything but islamic, what does that make western countries in perspective of your claim? they wouldnt be deemed as humane.

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salaam

A true Sharia state will only be available at the time of Imam Mahdi, until that time states such as Iran can only try it's best to make it possible.

As brother Alimohammad40 mentioned there are many problems in Iran in regards to Law. But, you can't really blame this entirely on the lawmakers.

Many factors are involved when trying to turn the tide on a law that has been well rooted in a system that is both national and international.

An example of this is Citizenship. In another thread it was discussed why Woman with non Iranian fathers can't get citizenship. Reasons for these are plenty, security is one reason.

Iran is a nation that is under constant attack from spies, agents, journalists, saboteurs etc. It is somewhat crucial to know the background of each person, and usually this is done by tracking fathers history.

Or many years of Western influence into every governement system, bank, and official offices, hard to change something like that.

However, on the flip side, there are some sideeffects such as a story from a family friend of mine. We know this Afghan shia family who fought against Saddam side by side with Iranian shias. He got martyred, and his son got paralyzed.

They fought for Islam, and they fought for the safety of Iranian Shias. They got kicked out from Iran and did not get citizenship. They live with me now for the time being.

That being said, i'm still a supporter of Iran because it has people who try really hard to make it a good Shia state. I never understood people who turn their backs because some Ulama, lawmakers, government official aren't trying hard enough. There are plenty who are trying to make it an Islamic Utopia. Instead of turning our backs, we the younger generation need to put effort into fixing that which is broken.

But,,,,,,,,in the end,,,haters gonna hate!!!

brother allow me to disagree with this section about finding excuses for Irans anti islamic civil laws..... There are no excuses and this talk about spies and things like that do not justify abandoning Islamic laws and are not real threats any way...

its just racism and the mumins are too weak there to uproot this racism. (but don't get me wrong racism is everywhere and it was probably worse in Iraq)

Iran is more threatened by Iranians than foreigners. Many of the foreigners who Aim to come to Iran are people who might come to Iran for ideological and moral reasons because it presents itself as an ideological state. its a poor country and has no much temptations for people to come to it in the search of worldly benefits.

Just open the borders now and make a referendum and ask how many iranians want to be Australian and how many australians would want to be iranian?? Don't be surprised if 80% of the Iranians run to here and you'll be lucky if you get even 1% of Australians who would want to go to Iran.

people are generally chasing worldly gains so why on earth is Iran still scared to give the migrants citizenships?

So Islam by name doesn't help when you see countries which are not even Muslim but applying more Islam than countries who are claiming to be followers of Islam.

like a good example that you gave of these afghans who shared ideology with the shia state and fought for it and lost so many members and end up getting kicked out !!!!

That's a great loss for Iran and stupidity on her behalf and a recipe for her failure.

I give you another example my own family We are iranians in origin but my grandparents lived in iraq and so did my parents and myself. My uncle was the attorney for mohamad baqir alsadr in Basra so during the war we clashed with saddam and gave alot of sacrifices in lives and other things . 7 of my uncles have either gotten executed or jailed for life and all their brothers faced jail for at least 4 years. My grandfather died under torture in the jail and Even I was born in a prison because my mother was jailed. We went to Iran naively thinking " islamic islamic" but it was very far from that.

My grandmother was able to easily prove that she was iranian so they gave her citizenship but the others had many difficulties and they asked them to do hasr alwaratha which means to investigate and establish that many generations of your fathers are pure Iranian.

I felt like i was in Nazi Germany not in a place that claims Islam.

some migrants whom Saddam kicked them out of Iraq claiming that they were (Iranians) have been in Iran for 30 years but don't have citizenship!!!!

We had a green card which meant officially we are not allowed to marry to an iranian or own a house or go to school or university......

so where is this from islam? you grab a migrant who has no place to go back to and tell him to stay in a cave which has no light,, he cant own a house, he cant get married, he cant go to school?

in reality they allowed people to attend schools in some cases but still just having that law is a shame

We applied for australia and australia which is corrupted in many other aspects was much more Islamic in these aspects than Iran and Iraq. They took us and granted us citizenship without asking our bloodline or discriminating against us by racism. They opened the opportunities for us to go to schools and we went to schools and i finished university and was treated in a fair way where the law did not differentiate between me and an Australian by one inch.

thats true islam amd thats why you see irnaians and others killing themslves and going in the boats just to come to these countries.

True islam is some thing that benefits the people and youll see the people running to it seeking refuge seeking their rights seeking justice.

one really ugly thing is how they distribute the money in the hawza to the students. each scholar makes them line up like beggers so they spend two days every month just lining up to get their money from different so called scholars

Imam Khamenie told them to just put it in the bank accounts then he got back fire and attack ( no bid3ah bid3ah)

the prophet said that "the proper shariah is a place where the weak one is given his right without having to bow his head"

just try to think about that.... in here if you are un-employed they have baytul mal , every month or whatever they put the money in your account and your dignity is respected

Israel has a law where any Jew in the world has automatically got a citizenship . Its a shame that the law of the zionists is more islamic than many of our so called islamic countries,,,, yes they are not scared of spies because the Jews are apparently braver than us ???

The USA also gives you citizenship if you migrate as far as i know.. Australia gives you a citizenship after two years...

and as you know in the USA and Australia there are benefits but a country like iran which their citizenship is rubbish any way and the citizen has no much benefits any way so why on earth are they greedy about giving the migrants citizenship?

They give the migrants some thing called green card (which is a copy cat from the USA idea) and this green card says on it that it is meaningless and you are not allowed to own a house or get married or go to school !!!!

its just shameful

or look at the islamic republic of pakistan !!!!!

or the islamic republic of afghanistan

The good thing about these countries is the name but unfortuantly the essence is far yet.

i hope they begfin to learn islam from the non muslims

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you will find some parts of islam in iran and some parts of islam in the united states and some parts of Islam in Australia and so on

i give you examples comparing iran and Australia:

in hijab you might see Iran is more Islamic

in penal code iran is more islamic

in citizenship rights Australia is more Islamic than iran

in baitulmal Australia is more Islamic

in bribery control Australia is more Islamic

and so on depending on which sector

It is like when Sayyed Jamaluddin Afghani visited Europe said that, he found many Muslims in the East but not Islam and he found no Muslim in Europe but he found Islam... or something like that... which I believe is totally nonsense!

It is like me saying, since your neighbor Mr. Johnson (atheist) has a better Akhlaq and a successful life than you, he is a better Muslim than you! While in reality you have submitted yourself to Islam and he is not. [just an example] thus, there is no point of comparison even if your neighbor has a few good qualities than you to claim he is a better Muslim.

What Western countries do have nothing to do with Islam. In Iran it is not secularism, it is Islamic laws... THAT IS WHAT THEY DO, they want to be ISLAMIC...To achieve that, they suffered and sacrificed themselves for most parts. They are Muslims and impose Islam, for the sake of Islam. While in the West, doesn't matter how close some of their laws are to Islam, has nothing to with Islam. You need to take into account all those trouble makers who want to create gaps between Islam and Iranians.. Those Iranians are not a few, they are even in millions. One key point for them to achieve their goal and bring down the Islamic establishment is to follow the rules in order to make it a failed state.

To conclude: I DO NOT SEE any basis of COMPARISON which will lead us to a good conclusion between a secular Christian country and a Islamic Muslim country the way you put it.

Edited by Noah-

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Iran is the only Islamic state where Jews, Christians, and Muslims, can get along well without feeling like they are insulted or in danger.

Edited by ShiaBen

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Thanks for all the answers. I also have a number of questions concerning political theory in a Shiite sharia state.

1. The Imam. What are his duties? How does he differ from the caliphate?

2. The Shura council. How do Shiites view it? What are its responsibilities in a Shiite sharia state?

3. With regards to Iran, would you say that the above two items have their faults (not correctly implemented, etc).

I hope to use this thread for questions/answers concerning Shiite Islam, so I hope the Mods would do something about that if there is a need....

Edited by Sir

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However, on the flip side, there are some sideeffects such as a story from a family friend of mine. We know this Afghan shia family who fought against Saddam side by side with Iranian shias. He got martyred, and his son got paralyzed.

They fought for Islam, and they fought for the safety of Iranian Shias. They got kicked out from Iran and did not get citizenship. They live with me now for the time being.

That is one of the biggest problems that exists in Iran and where the government did very little or almost nothing to fight and direct people-society to a better understanding!

Here, in this video clip, the Iranian cleric summarize it very well!

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