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Shia_Debater

Liquid Soap Najis

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(salam)

I would like to know if liquid soap can be najis or is there a chemical change which makes the products used in it tahir?

I found a ruling of seyed sistani :

95. The liquid medicines, perfumes, ghee, soap and wax polish which are imported, are Pak, if one is not sure of their being najis.

But it only mentions the imported soaps, it doesnt say those made in this country

Please reply quick as its urgent

(wasalam)

Edited by Shia_Debater

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Yes, if there is a change which is described as Istihala, then a Najis thing becomes Pak.

In respect of the ruling of Sayyed Sistani, the assumption is that one is living in a Muslim country.

So, such a product made in your country, if its a Muslim country, is Pak.

If your country is non-Muslim, and one can be reasonably sure that the animal parts in them are Najis, then its Najis, otherwise its Pak.

But, what is the Najis ingredient in liquid soap, because there has to be one for the question about its Najasah to arise?

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Normal solid soap has tallow in it, made from beef fat and other animal fats. Its in the ingredients as Tallowate or other chemical terms.

Whether Istihala takes place or not is debatable..

But I don;t think liquid soap has this ingredient.

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(salam)

From my limited knowledge about chemistry, the process for making the soap is actually a complete chemical change. This is true for most of the soaps produced through industrial factories. Don't really know about liquid soaps.

Someone else may have additional or supportive info.

Edited by Zareen

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But as Muslims, shouldn't we restrict our purchase of animal products only to what is clean and lawful? Even if there is a complete chemical change, you're still giving money directly to a supplier that doesn't slaughter or obtain a by-product from an animal that is slaughtered lawfully. If you have the option between a soap made using an animal product of a lawfully slaughtered animal, why wouldn't you choose that one?

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But as Muslims, shouldn't we restrict our purchase of animal products only to what is clean and lawful? Even if there is a complete chemical change, you're still giving money directly to a supplier that doesn't slaughter or obtain a by-product from an animal that is slaughtered lawfully. If you have the option between a soap made using an animal product of a lawfully slaughtered animal, why wouldn't you choose that one?

And where does one find this hypothetical other soap option? If you have the spare time and energy for that, go ahead. Most people don't have the luxury of being able to give what bar of soap they buy much thought.

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(wasalam)

Isn't the rule: "everything is tahir unless you have full knowledge it's najis"?

Anyhow - you wash off the soap when you wash your hands, so your hands should normally be tahir afterwards anyway.

yh .. but i doubt too much :donno: .. even though i know thats the rule sometimes i still regard the thing to be najis

and the soap part i was worried for another reason not only because of washing hands.

Thanks bro for your answer :D

JazakAllah Khair to everyone who answered, alhamdulillah now im not doubting and I wont take it as najis unless i become 100% sure :D

Edited by Shia_Debater

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And where does one find this hypothetical other soap option? If you have the spare time and energy for that, go ahead. Most people don't have the luxury of being able to give what bar of soap they buy much thought.

As said before, if you live in a Muslim country, it's safe to assume that the animal products used in most soaps available to you in that country are from a halal slaughtered animal.

It'd be like if I continued to buy milk from a supplier who beats his cows. If I know he does that, why would I give him money for milk? If you a buy a halal product from a supplier of both haram and halal goods and they choose to use the money you paid them for a halal product to invest in the production of a haram product, you are not responsible for that because you only encouraged the purchase and production of the halal product. But if you buy a product that is produced with haram methods, your purchase encourages the production of that item through those haram methods.

With things made from animal parts, I think it's important to consider from where and how the product's components are obtained.

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I live in Canada. I buy a lot of household things. Soap is one item out of a hundred. For the amount of mental energy I can reasonably give amongst work, kids, nutrition, fitness, mental development, spiritual development, my realistic level of choice in soap is Dove, Ivory, Irish Spring. That's just the way it is. I don't have the luxury surplus mental energy to care about soap beyond having a preference for the color and fragrance of Irish Spring. Most people are in the same boat.

Edited by kadhim

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Never seen liquid soaps use tallow, it's mainly in the hard soaps.

The hard soaps use predominantly glycerin or sodium tallowate, which is derived from tallow using an alkaline, and as mentioned previously, this is said to be enough for istihlal, making it taahir (pak).

Couple that with the fact that 1-the origins are not known, and 2-you (usually) wash the soap away with water anyway, the washing with water is enough for tahaara.

Anyways, Sayyid Sistani

http://www.sistani.org/index.php?p=251364&id=50&pid=2423

Q6: Some types of soap which are imported from outside contain lard in their ingredients but at the end, only 5% remains in them. In that case, is the ruling of transformation (istihalah) applicable (to it) and (is the soap) ruled to be ritually pure, or does it remain ritually impure?

A: It remains ritually impure. God knows best. (MMS, p. 17, Q17)

http://www.sistani.org/index.php?p=251364&id=48&pid=2140

(Q.29) Some imported soap contains lard. Eventually, only 5% [of the lard] remains in it. Can the rule of Istihalah (transformation) be applied here, so that it could be considered tahir (ceremonially clean), or does it remain najis?

It remains najis. Allah is All Knowing.

Sayyid Al-Khoe'i

http://www.al-islam.org/laws/al-khui/2.htm

95. Those liquid medicines, perfumes, ghee, soap and polish which are made in non-Islamic countries are pure, provided that one is not sure of their being impure.

Sayyid Khamena'i

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If it is not ascertained that it contains najis ingredients or it is doubted, it is ruled as pure.

There's previously a large discussion about it here

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(wasalam)

Isn't the rule: "everything is tahir unless you have full knowledge it's najis"?

Anyhow - you wash off the soap when you wash your hands, so your hands should normally be tahir afterwards anyway.

No its is not if you are asking in this way.

Anything you purchase from a Muslim bazaar (living in Muslim country) is halal/tahir until proven haram or najis.

Anything you purchase from any bazaar (living in non-Muslim country) is considered haram/najis until proven halal or tahir.

So inquiries like these are completely genuine and are really needed. Otherwise we may have never known about McDonal's fish being haram and Red20 being coming from Pig fat and so on.

Edited by Waiting for HIM

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No its is not if you are asking in this way.

Anything you purchase from a Muslim bazaar (living in Muslim country) is halal/tahir until proven haram or najis.

Anything you purchase from any bazaar (living in non-Muslim country) is considered haram/najis until proven halal or tahir.

So inquiries like these are completely genuine and are really needed. Otherwise we may have never known about McDonal's fish being haram and Red20 being coming from Pig fat and so on.

I always thought you're not obligated to inquire about the najasat/taharat of anything unless you see it yourself.

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I always thought you're not obligated to inquire about the najasat/taharat of anything unless you see it yourself.

You're indeed correct.

The concept changes depending on the ma'rifa/'urf of origin. For example, if a country is known to be an all bhudist/hindu country, then one can't assume tahaara, e.g.

http://www.sistani.org/index.php?p=251364&id=49&pid=2421

* Suppose a man’s wrist watch strap was made of leather and he was wearing a leather belt. Both were imported from a non-Muslim country. He has no knowledge whether the animal, whose hide was used in making the strap and the belt, was killed according to Islamic rituals. Should he take them off before starting prayer?

- His prayer is in order so long as there was a probability, that should be significant, that the animal was slaughtered according to Islamic rituals.

http://www.sistani.org/index.php?p=616687&id=1281

Question :

What about the leather products made in a European country, if we are unaware of the source of that leather? It is said that some European countries import cheap leather from Muslim countries and then use it for manufacturing various products. Can we consider such leather pure? Are we allowed to say salat in them? Can such a weak probability [about it originating from a Muslim country] be given any credence?

Answer :

If the probability of the leather originating from a zabiha (an animal slaughtered Islamically) source is so weak that people would not normally give any credence (for example, the probability of 2%), it is to be considered impure and this cannot be used in salat. But if the probability is not so weak, it can be considered pure and using it in salat would be permissible.

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Guest adilrizvi

No its is not if you are asking in this way.

Anything you purchase from a Muslim bazaar (living in Muslim country) is halal/tahir until proven haram or najis.

Anything you purchase from any bazaar (living in non-Muslim country) is considered haram/najis until proven halal or tahir.

So inquiries like these are completely genuine and are really needed. Otherwise we may have never known about McDonal's fish being haram and Red20 being coming from Pig fat and so on.

I'm sorry but you're wrong. Please don't generalize that anything obtained from a non-muslim countries bazar is haram najis until proven halal or tahir. There are different rulings for different things, for example leather.. meat which you use for eating and perfumes/shampoos. Things that that you eat have the strictest rulings.. i.e you cant eat them unless you're sure they come from a halal animal. You can pray with the leather as long as their is a probability that it might have came from an animal slaughtered according to islamic laws. And in case of perfumes/cremes etc the ruling is the least strictest.. you can use them as long as you're not sure of their najasat. No matter where they're coming from.

Generalization without complete knowledge leads to misunderstandings. If you say everything everything becomes pak by washing once under kurr water someone might just go and wash a utensil licked by a pig once in kurr water and think its pak, however the rulings are completely different for utensils. For example you must wash a utensil licked by a pig 7 times no matter if the water is kur, qaleel, jari etc etc and if licked by a dog it can't be made tahir unless rubbed with sand, water alone is insufficient in this case. I hope you get the point

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Najis soap. Interesting fatwas. Learned something new today.

But as Muslims, shouldn't we restrict our purchase of animal products only to what is clean and lawful? Even if there is a complete chemical change, you're still giving money directly to a supplier that doesn't slaughter or obtain a by-product from an animal that is slaughtered lawfully. If you have the option between a soap made using an animal product of a lawfully slaughtered animal, why wouldn't you choose that one?

Yeah I think as long as we have awareness of where things come from, most of us will make the right decisions.

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