Co Wife Question

[ImAli]

Everyone says it is abused, but they never say how exactly. Reading the hadiths of the Imams (as) on the subject, it seems to me that it would be pretty hard to 'abuse' muta.

If you want to know what I am talking about why don't you read the unwanted child from mutah thread. After reading that thread you will know that this is what I am talking about when I say it should be done very carefully but instead it usually is done with careless intention. Of course you will disagree just for the sake of disagreement, but we all know too many idiots are partaking in the practice of mutah without being responsible.

[Haydar Husayn]

If you want to know what I am talking about why don't you read the unwanted child from mutah thread. After reading that thread you will know that this is what I am talking about when I say it should be done very carefully but instead it usually is done with careless intention. Of course you will disagree just for the sake of disagreement, but we all know too many idiots are partaking in the practice of mutah without being responsible.

That's a seperate issue, but I agree with you. Those that have mutas should fulfill their Islamic responsibilities in case a child is born.

[ImAli]

That's a seperate issue, but I agree with you. Those that have mutas should fulfill their Islamic responsibilities in case a child is born.

It is not a separate issue....it is a perfect example of mutah abuse.

[Haydar Husayn]

It is not a separate issue....it is a perfect example of mutah abuse.

So as long as men take their responsibilities towards their children, you are fine with muta then?

[ImAli]

So as long as men take their responsibilities towards their children, you are fine with muta then?

I won't do it, but if others want to do it I could care less.....AS LONG AS THEY ARE RESPONSIBLE. I see too many stupid kids wanting to do it and they don't think past 5 minutes. Just because something is halal doesn't mean it can't be abused or become a disaster.

[DeeeeeBo]

If people one this site are said to be 'pro-muta' based on some pretty mild comments, I can only imagine what you think of the words of the Imams (as)

You know you started off by showing ikhla2 , but you seriously threw it all down the drain, with such a stupid statement/question !!!

You do not know anything about me. You didnt even take into consideration what i said, you merely saw me as in this case "anti-mut3a" , and started to do what most people do this days, start regurgitating hadiths like there is no tomorrow trying to justify your stance, on a topic that is blown out of proportion, and you have mis understood what i said.

Like Im Ali is saying, Mut3a within itself, is halal, there is nothing wrong with it, but do you think it is being practiced these days the way it should ?

another personal question, you do not have to answer me, but if you did, it would help greatly !!!

Are you married bro ? if so, would you do mut3a behind your wifes back ? just answer me that honestly ?

just because its halal, doesnt make it the right thing to do, somethings are halal, but when you abuse it, it becomes haram... As far as im concerned anything that harms the body, soul, and mind in Islam is forbidden. This is why alcohol is haram in the form on drinks, yet halal to clean your hands with and in medication !

Meat might be halal bro, but if you eat too much meat, dont exercise and sit around all day, you will eventually cause some type of harm to yourself, doesnt make meat haram does it ?

the word is moderation and circumstances. Throwing the "its halal" stamp of authority over it, does not give you the chance to do it.

Would you like it if your father was doing Mut3a with a lady ? while still married to your mother ? be honest with me !

Would you like it to happen to your sister ? what if the male she done it with was only using her ? she ends up being heart broken, the guy continues on, taking advantage of good decent Muslima sisters, only causing more damage then he did good, only to justify his act by throwing around hadiths !!!

Im not against mut3a, im not saying its haram, im not saying those who like it are devils, i just dont like how everything is mut3a mut3a mut3a its halal because its mut3a its ok because its mut3a, Imam so and so said its fine so ima do it...

So if according to hadiths bro, its fine so do you mind if i have your sisters email ?

im a really nice guy, i respect women, im actually engaged, but hey thats cool, im allowed to right ? i promise wallahi i wont treat her bad, im a good looking guy, with a bit of charm, i wont let her down wallah i wont

help a brother out, its what the Imams would want !!!!!

If thats ok with you of coarse ? im a Muslim, and according to Islam and Ahlul Bayt, to reject someone who is a decent Muslim, for no reason and not give him the chance, is considered haram, so if you are as true to your words as you claim, can i please approach your sister !

Thanks brother you have been really helpful !

Salams

[Haydar Husayn]

You know you started off by showing ikhla2 , but you seriously threw it all down the drain, with such a stupid statement/question !!!

You do not know anything about me. You didnt even take into consideration what i said, you merely saw me as in this case "anti-mut3a" , and started to do what most people do this days, start regurgitating hadiths like there is no tomorrow trying to justify your stance, on a topic that is blown out of proportion, and you have mis understood what i said.

And what was the substance of your post? That all pro-muta/polygamy people are hypocrites since in your opinion they wouldn't like their female relatives to be involved in such relationships, based on no more evidence than your own baseless assumptions?

Your sentence "gee no wonder why SUnnis are laughing at us, something that Allah Blessed us with, so we can cope in certain circumstances has been BLOWN out of proportion to fulfill mans sexual desires" clearly implies a degree of restrictiveness on the use of muta which is not supported by the narrations on the subject.

Like Im Ali is saying, Mut3a within itself, is halal, there is nothing wrong with it, but do you think it is being practiced these days the way it should ?

No, I don't think it is been practiced the way it should, but probably for different reasons than you.

another personal question, you do not have to answer me, but if you did, it would help greatly !!!

Are you married bro ? if so, would you do mut3a behind your wifes back ? just answer me that honestly ?

Sorry, I don't answer personal questions, since I prefer to debate ideas and not personalities. All I will say is I am not a hypocrite. I wouldn't advocate something as halal whilst making it haraam on myself.

just because its halal, doesnt make it the right thing to do, somethings are halal, but when you abuse it, it becomes haram...

What is abuse of muta according to you?

As far as im concerned anything that harms the body, soul, and mind in Islam is forbidden. This is why alcohol is haram in the form on drinks, yet halal to clean your hands with and in medication !

Under what circumstances would muta be forbidden?

Meat might be halal bro, but if you eat too much meat, dont exercise and sit around all day, you will eventually cause some type of harm to yourself, doesnt make meat haram does it ?

the word is moderation and circumstances. Throwing the "its halal" stamp of authority over it, does not give you the chance to do it.

I don't think I ever said anything about not doing things in moderation. Did I ever write that people should spend their whole time doing muta? I'm not even advocating people do it, even though the hadiths seem pretty clear on that, just defending it's absolute permissibility against efforts to restrict it into virtual non-existence.

Would you like it if your father was doing Mut3a with a lady ? while still married to your mother ? be honest with me !

What does this have to do with anything? Whether I would like it or not would in no way affect it's permissibility or desirability. However, let's say I didn't like it, I would have to force myself to accept it since I am a Muslim. Therefore I should accept what is acceptable to Allah, and not just what non-Muslim society finds acceptable. What kind of Muslim would criticise their father for doing something the Prophet (pbuh) did (muta while married) anyway?

Sometimes I wonder about some of you. You can't even do enough jihad an-nafs to put up with muta or polygamy, but you would no doubt tell people attracted to members of the same sex that they should control their desires. Halal and haraam have nothing to do with human desires.

Would you like it to happen to your sister ? what if the male she done it with was only using her ? she ends up being heart broken, the guy continues on, taking advantage of good decent Muslima sisters, only causing more damage then he did good, only to justify his act by throwing around hadiths !!!

No one is forced to do muta. If they aren't capable of handling the emotions that could arise after a muta expires, then they shouldn't do it. Virgin girls of a young age (who are most likely to be affect in the way you say) should also probably avoid muta.

Im not against mut3a, im not saying its haram, im not saying those who like it are devils, i just dont like how everything is mut3a mut3a mut3a its halal because its mut3a its ok because its mut3a, Imam so and so said its fine so ima do it...

The Imams (as) didn't say it was just 'fine', they said it was highly recommended. Did you actually read those hadiths, or did you just skip over them? If they say it is highly recommended, then who are you to tell people to stay away from it?

So if according to hadiths bro, its fine so do you mind if i have your sisters email ?

im a really nice guy, i respect women, im actually engaged, but hey thats cool, im allowed to right ? i promise wallahi i wont treat her bad, im a good looking guy, with a bit of charm, i wont let her down wallah i wont

help a brother out, its what the Imams would want !!!!!

*Yawn*

Interesting that you are 'engaged', which means nothing in Islam. So you are busy opposing Islamic institutions, while being involved in a non-Islamic one.

If thats ok with you of coarse ? im a Muslim, and according to Islam and Ahlul Bayt, to reject someone who is a decent Muslim, for no reason and not give him the chance, is considered haram, so if you are as true to your words as you claim, can i please approach your sister !

Thanks brother you have been really helpful !

Salams

You seem confused. It is the girl's father or grandfather you need to be approaching for permission, not the brother. You can of course approach whoever you want, but I think you need to remind yourself that they don't need to accept. Also, if your attitude to muta and polygamy is any indication, you probably aren't on the level to assume you can't be rejected by the father (or indeed the girl) on Islamic grounds.

[jund_el_Mahdi]

A lot of people here seem to always overlook something when speaking about the "abuse of mut3a"...the woman also consents to it out of her own choice, no one is ever forced into it.

[alimohamad40]

Deebo

You say (my misses ) and so and so. If u believe in having a misses and a non-superficial engagement relation without any marriage contract then how do u have the face to stick ur nose in religion issues when your so distant from it?

Your post had no logical analysis nither textual references from the religion that u claim to follow. Logic for usool and text for foroo. Remember that in any country where people have legal dispute they refer back to the constitution and it's statutes and for a Muslim it's the aql and naql (mind reasoning and textual reference)

[MissShiaMuslim]

Deebo

You say (my misses ) and so and so. If u believe in having a misses and a non-superficial engagement relation without any marriage contract then how do u have the face to stick ur nose in religion issues when your so distant from it?

Your post had no logical analysis nither textual references from the religion that u claim to follow. Logic for usool and text for foroo. Remember that in any country where people have legal dispute they refer back to the constitution and it's statutes and for a Muslim it's the aql and naql (mind reasoning and textual reference)

sorry, im not involved in this conversation at all but let me say something, who are you to judge Deeebo on his iman? you dont know him, i do. Mashallah this guy has iman, but is also inbetween with the way he thinks, hes half morals and half religion. he will give advice on the religious aspect but also will empathise with her and help her that way. the way advice should be. he doesnt step out of the religious value whilst giving advice.

does every single post he submits have to have quotes from the quran or hadiths etc to back up advice? he isnt going agaisnt any islamic principle to place any sort of references to back himself up. he is simply stating an opinion and to me, that doesnt require any sort of reference.

what an insult to say he is far from religion. astaghfirAllah. honestly the people on this forum are nothing but fake morons that sticky beak in peoples posts. this is about the SISTER wanting ADVICE. not having one up on each other in religion.

either stick to the subject or simply just dont post. its a serious issue were a sister really needs serious answers. inshaAllah you all realise what your doing and actually help this poor sister.

As Salaam Alaikum to all that read this post. I 'm the first wife and my husband has choses a co wife. I m having some problems with this. He has not married her yet, but they are spending the night together in a hotel alone. This is very hurtful to me because I ask him to wait until they are married before I have to start to share our time. Keep in mind I only found out about her a week ago by drving by a hotel and seen his car their. I was so hurt I havent been able to eat or sleep since this took place. some one plese help me understand. she has been spending time with my husband on some level since May 2011 and i just found out about her 8/23/11. in the above way. I dont think im being vauled and since Ive only been in the deen 3 years i have no clue if this is right please help someone with Quran or sunah referances to give be help

Salam sis.

Sorry i do not have much advice to give you, all i say is please talk to your husband, what he did was not right. I do not have any references to give you, but i do have my self respect and dignity which i go by. He should NEVER do what he did. Please talk to him and try to resolve the issue where you will feel comfortable about the situation and help you live a happy life and marriage.

i wish you all the best and inshaAllah Allah blesses you with a happy future.

I hope you find the right thing to you, both islamically and for yourself.

[Haydar Husayn]

Mashallah this guy has iman, but is also inbetween with the way he thinks, hes half morals and half religion.

Half morals and half religion? Says it all really.

[MissShiaMuslim]

Half morals and half religion? Says it all really.

once again over analysing everything that we write. dont you get what I said? he speaks from his HEART on what this sister should do. he DOESNT go out of the islamic VALUES to write a reference with what advice he gives her from his HEART.

get it now? or would you like me to open my oxford dictionary and rewrite it so im intellectually up to your standard? sir?

i totally forgot that a lot of people on this forum dont have hearts and simply cant write advice based upon it.

Edited August 29, 2011 by MissShiaMuslim

[Haydar Husayn]

once again over analysing everything that we write. dont you get what I said? he speaks from his HEART on what this sister should do. he DOESNT go out of the islamic VALUES to write a reference with what advice he gives her from his HEART.

get it now? or would you like me to open my oxford dictionary and rewrite it so im intellectually up to your standard? sir?

i totally forgot that a lot of people on this forum dont have hearts and simply cant write advice based upon it.

And when his 'heart' contradicts the religion, then what? Morality is not independent of the religion, it flows from it. To speak of them as if they are independent makes no sense, unless you are talking about a different morality than an Islamic one (and let's face it, most of you are).

[MissShiaMuslim]

And when his 'heart' contradicts the religion, then what? Morality is not independent of the religion, it flows from it. To speak of them as if they are independent makes no sense, unless you are talking about a different morality than an Islamic one (and let's face it, most of you are).

i never said he places his morals over the religion. if the heart contradicts religion, obviously religion comes first... what now your putting words in my mouth? tsk honestly is this whole argument even getting you anywhere?

[Haydar Husayn]

i never said he places his morals over the religion. if the heart contradicts religion, obviously religion comes first... what now your putting words in my mouth?

Well, the religion is contradicting a whole lot of hearts here, but I don't see you saying much to them about putting the religion first.

But going back to this distinction you made, where is the sense in it? If the religion contradicts morality/'the heart', then you choose the religion. And if they are in agreement, then it is still the religion. Therefore there is no distinction to be made for a Muslim.

tsk honestly is this whole argument even getting you anywhere?

It's virtually impossible to convince anyone of anything on a public forum, but it's possible that one or two people reading might rethink their views, Inshallah.

[Gypsy]

Thanks like I said before its not abou the co-wife I have the issuse it the conduct and the matter in which he is conducting himself around her. And he has not married her I did find that much out.

If he is not married to her then he has committed zina which is punishable by death.

[14infallibles]

Well, the religion is contradicting a whole lot of hearts here, but I don't see you saying much to them about putting the religion first.

(salam)

Good point. From reading the replies here it is clear that there's one side that is basing their words on ahadith and the laws of Allah, while another side that is basing their words on their cultural morals

For example, they will say "muta isnt being practiced as it should be practiced.. its being abused!!!!!!!!!!!!" ... and when they are asked "how should it be practiced??" they will not bring any hadiths but random opinions that have no say in Islam..............how is it being abused?? No answer

and they try to show how bad muta is by asking, "well would you allow me to have muta with your sister?" its funny but this video came to my mind:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTxDa0MV2TU

I dont support Yasir al habib in everything but still the video is worth watching. Keep in mind that he is replying to SUNNIS that ask this question... its unfortunate that now we have even SHIA who will ask this question to somehow prove a point against muta

[Gypsy]

Can a married wife engange in muta if she is not satisfied?

I have heard that its possible., its only haram to marry marry a second man while she is stil with first husband.

Muta is marriage so she cannot. She can however divorce and marry someone else.

[ImAli]

You are all asking about how mutah is being abused. Well I will give you my opinion. First example is a case of mutah not being abused and believe it or not it was a married man who did mutah but no I don't think it was abused.

1. Example of mutah not being abused:

A married man I know of was away from his wife in another country for a few years. He contracted mutah with another woman, he didn't lead the mutah wife on to thinking it would could ever be more, and he didn't keep his wife in the dark. I guess he could have jumped from woman to woman doing mutah but he picked a responsible, clean, adult woman for mutah and it worked out well for everyone.

2. Examples of mutah being abused:

While this is allowed I don't think it is right, it is disgusting and a harvest for disease. Young men going out every weekend finding a new woman to do mutah with every Friday and Saturday night and usually they don't even use protection. I am sure they even lead some of these girls on to thinking it will be something more than just a one night stand. Also like I stated earlier read the post of unwanted child from mutah....this is just sick and he is probably barely out of training pants and had no business doing mutah if he can't think that far into the future.

[ALI77ZM]

SALAM

SISTER, I AM A MAN AND THERE IS NO WAY I CAN MARRY ANOTHER WOMEN WITHOUT MY WIFE'S PERMISSION. THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IS WE CANNOT MARRY AS WE CANNOT MAINTAIN EQUALITY BETWEEN THEM , WE ARE NEITHER PROPHETS NOR IMAMS, WE ARE ONLY ORDINARY HUMANS. IF IN ANY CIRCUMSTANCE HE WANTS TO MARRY, FIRST HE NEED TO TEL YOU WHAT IS YOUR OPINION, SO THAT YOU CAN FIND OUY WHY AND FOR WHAT HE NEEDS ANOTHER WOMEN, HE CANT CHANGE WIFE FOR BEAUTY, MONEY , POWER , ETC. THERE IS NO WAY YOU ARE GOING TO SIT AND SEE HIM DO THIS TO YOU. I HAVE SEEN MANY SHEIKS MARRYING WOMEN BUT ONLY TO HELP THEM FROM DIFFCULTIES EITHER IN RAISING THEIR KIDS OR HELPING THEM IN GENERAL NOT FOR SEXUAL INTERCOURSE ONLY,

YOU BETTER SPEND SOME TIME WITH YOUR HUBBY SO THAT HE CAN OR MAYBE! TELL YOU WHAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH YOU( OF COURSE NOBODY WILL ARRANGE IN HIMSELF HAVING A PROBLEM)? FACING CHALLENGE IS THE BIGGEST GIFT TO ATTAIN Allah'S MERCY AND NEVER LOSE HOPE . SALAM.

[Haydar Husayn]

You are all asking about how mutah is being abused. Well I will give you my opinion. First example is a case of mutah not being abused and believe it or not it was a married man who did mutah but no I don't think it was abused.

1. Example of mutah not being abused:

A married man I know of was away from his wife in another country for a few years. He contracted mutah with another woman, he didn't lead the mutah wife on to thinking it would could ever be more, and he didn't keep his wife in the dark. I guess he could have jumped from woman to woman doing mutah but he picked a responsible, clean, adult woman for mutah and it worked out well for everyone.

2. Examples of mutah being abused:

While this is allowed I don't think it is right, it is disgusting and a harvest for disease. Young men going out every weekend finding a new woman to do mutah with every Friday and Saturday night and usually they don't even use protection. I am sure they even lead some of these girls on to thinking it will be something more than just a one night stand. Also like I stated earlier read the post of unwanted child from mutah....this is just sick and he is probably barely out of training pants and had no business doing mutah if he can't think that far into the future.

What about if a man, who is not travelling, just decides to have a muta with some woman, and doesn't tell his wife (or wives) about it. Is that abuse?

[14infallibles]

What about if a man, who is not travelling, just decides to have a muta with some woman, and doesn't tell his wife (or wives) about it. Is that abuse?

(salam)

I doubt they will answer

[ImAli]

What about if a man, who is not travelling, just decides to have a muta with some woman, and doesn't tell his wife (or wives) about it. Is that abuse?

I have a mixed opinion on this. If he is getting you know what from his wife or wives then isn't he being greedy and inconsiderate of his wives who would probably enjoy that company and attention from him...in that case I think it is abuse. If the wife or wives are pregnant, or having female problems and he is hiding it to avoid heartbreak I really don't think it is abuse. Also if he does mutah in secret or not in secret......with all of the filth and disease in this world he should take care because it could have a negative impact on his wife or wives health, especially if his wife is breast feeding a child, then it even carries on to the health of the child. If he doesn't take care to keep himself clean the best he can this is also abuse. Then there are married men who go out and do mutah every weekend with different women as if he is still single while his wife is dying for his attention at home and many would consider this abuse.

Edited August 29, 2011 by ImAli

[Elvis_King]

Even if you ask your wifes permission 99.99% it will hurt her even to hear that question.

[Haydar Husayn]

I have a mixed opinion on this. If he is getting you know what from his wife or wives then isn't he being greedy and inconsiderate of his wives who would probably enjoy that company and attention from him?

Just because he has muta with a woman, does not mean that he is necessarily incapable of meeting the needs of his permanent wives. If he isn't satisfying his wives, then I would agree that he shouldn't be doing muta, all other things being equal.

In that case I think it is abuse, but if the wife or wives are pregnant, or having female problems and he is hiding it to avoid heartbreak I really don't think it is abuse.

Well, now you are in a position of saying the Prophet (pbuh) potentially abused muta, since it is hard to imagine that all his wives had 'female problems' at the same time when he did muta. And certainly, considering the little time he had to spend with each wife, they would have appreciated the extra time. Imam Ali (as) also almost certainly had mutas with women while married to several wives. And generally, the Imams (as) don't seem to have put any restrictions of the type you are suggesting on muta.

For example:

13 – And by the isnad from Ahmad b. Muhammad from Ibn Ashyam from Marwan b. Muslim from Isma`il b. al-Fadl al-Hashimi. He said: Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام said to me: Have you done mut`a since you have gone out from your family? I said: Due to the abundance of what is with me of wives, Allah has made me needless of it. He said: And even if you are needless, for verily I love that you should revive the Sunna of the Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وآله.

http://www.tashayyu....ability-of-muta

or

[ 26425 ] 6 ـ محمد بن علي بن الحسين بإسناده عن موسى بن بكر ، عن زرارة ، عن أبي جعفر ( عليه السلام ) ـ في حديث ـ قال : وله أن يتمتع إن شاء وله امرأة وإن كان مقيما معها في مصره .

6 – Muhammad b. `Ali b. al-Husayn by his isnad from Musa b. Bakr from Zurara from Abu Ja`far عليه السلام in a hadith wherein he said: And (it is allowed) for him to do mut`a if he wants while he has a wife, even if she is residing with him in his city.

Also if he does mutah in secret or not in secret......with all of the filth and disease in this world he should take care because it could have a negative impact on his wife or wives health, especially if his wife is breast feeding a child, then it even carries on to the health of the child. If he doesn't take care to keep himself clean the best he can this is also abuse.

Well yes, precautions should be taken. But unless in extreme circumstances, it is better to avoid doing muta with a fornicatress anyway. Better to select a believing Shia woman (although attitudes in this day and age make that more difficult than it perhaps should be). As long as the right kind of women is selected, it's relatively unlikely she will be carrying any diseases. What with the iddah period, it's not that easy even for a woman constantly doing muta to have many sexual partners.

Then there are married men who go out and do mutah every weekend with different women as if he is still single while his wife is dying for his attention at home and many would consider this abuse.

Yes, I agree. Contrary to what you might think, I am not advocating men being cruel to their wives. The Prophet (pbuh) taught kindness to women, and we should follow his example. The only thing is a wife should in return not impinge on her husband's rights as long as he is meeting his responsibilities.

Edited August 29, 2011 by Haider Husayn

[ImAli]

Just because he has muta with a woman, does not mean that he is necessarily incapable of meeting the needs of his permanent wives. If he isn't satisfying his wives, then I would agree that he shouldn't be doing muta, all other things being equal.

Well, now you are in a position of saying the Prophet (pbuh) potentially abused muta, since it is hard to imagine that all his wives had 'female problems' at the same time when he did muta. And certainly, considering the little time he had to spend with each wife, they would have appreciated the extra time. Imam Ali (as) also almost certainly had mutas with women while married to several wives. And generally, the Imams (as) don't seem to have put any restrictions of the type you are suggesting on muta.

For example:

13 – And by the isnad from Ahmad b. Muhammad from Ibn Ashyam from Marwan b. Muslim from Isma`il b. al-Fadl al-Hashimi. He said: Abu `Abdillah عليه السلام said to me: Have you done mut`a since you have gone out from your family? I said: Due to the abundance of what is with me of wives, Allah has made me needless of it. He said: And even if you are needless, for verily I love that you should revive the Sunna of the Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وآله.

http://www.tashayyu....ability-of-muta

or

[ 26425 ] 6 ـ محمد بن علي بن الحسين بإسناده عن موسى بن بكر ، عن زرارة ، عن أبي جعفر ( عليه السلام ) ـ في حديث ـ قال : وله أن يتمتع إن شاء وله امرأة وإن كان مقيما معها في مصره .

6 – Muhammad b. `Ali b. al-Husayn by his isnad from Musa b. Bakr from Zurara from Abu Ja`far عليه السلام in a hadith wherein he said: And (it is allowed) for him to do mut`a if he wants while he has a wife, even if she is residing with him in his city.

Well yes, precautions should be taken. But unless in extreme circumstances, it is better to avoid doing muta with a fornicatress anyway. Better to select a believing Shia woman (although attitudes in this day and age make that more difficult than it perhaps should be). As long as the right kind of women is selected, it's relatively unlikely she will be carrying any diseases. What with the iddah period, it's not that easy even for a woman constantly doing muta to have many sexual partners.

Yes, I agree. Contrary to what you might think, I am not advocating men being cruel to their wives. The Prophet (pbuh) tought kindness to women, and we should follow his example. The only thing is a wife should in return not impinge on her husband's rights as long as he is meeting his responsibilities.

Ok I am too lazy to cut the other parts out of your post but I am answering to the female problems part. One thing you should know is that most women who are around each other all of the time or live in close quarters that time of the month usually coincides for them. This is too much information but my neighbors that I see every day this happened for us.....after spending a couple of hours a day together talking or drinking coffee (we don't even live together) the woman's curse comes at the same time....LOL. It also happened when my MIL, 2 SIL's and myself were all living in the same house. So for all of you men who are thinking about marrying multiple women and having them all live close to each other and see each other all of the time be careful Hahahaha it could be too dangerous to go home at the time of the month then :shaytan:

[Haydar Husayn]

Ok I am too lazy to cut the other parts out of your post but I am answering to the female problems part. One thing you should know is that most women who are around each other all of the time or live in close quarters that time of the month usually coincides for them. This is too much information but my neighbors that I see every day this happened for us.....after spending a couple of hours a day together talking or drinking coffee (we don't even live together) the woman's curse comes at the same time....LOL. It also happened when my MIL, 2 SIL's and myself were all living in the same house. So for all of you men who are thinking about marrying multiple women and having them all live close to each other and see each other all of the time be careful Hahahaha it could be too dangerous to go home at the time of the month then :shaytan:

Somehow I had a feeling you were going to make this point. However, I don't know if this could apply to the wives of the Prophet (pbuh) given the number of them, and the fact that they all had seperate living quarters. Anything is possible though, I guess. In any case, the hadiths are clear enough.

Edited August 29, 2011 by Haider Husayn

[ImAli]

Somehow I had a feeling you were going to make this point. However, I don't know if this could apply to the wives of the Prophet (pbuh) given the number of them, and the fact that they all had seperate living quarters. Anything is possible though, I guess. In any case, the hadiths are clear enough.

Had the feeling I would make what point?

[Haydar Husayn]

Had the feeling I would make what point?

That when women live together their menstrual cycles tend to synchronise.

[Ya Aba 3abdillah]

A woman can stipulate in the marriage contract that if the man takes another wife, she has the right of divorce.

This is permitted in Shari'a faqat (no question about it).

She can't stop him having another relationship (or what they call an affair in the west).

But she can demand that if he does get into an affair, she can leave him, and if she does, he has no argument against it.

[ImAli]

That when women live together their menstrual cycles tend to synchronise.

So you knew about this already? Also you don't necessarily have to live together, it only takes seeing someone a few hours every day. It can also spread to people that you don't communicate with. For example someone sees her neighbor every day and every night the woman's neighbor goes to a house 10 minutes away to see her sister......eventually all 3 of them coincide even though the other women doesn't even really know her neighbors sister in law. Anyway way off topic sorry.

A woman can stipulate in the marriage contract that if the man takes another wife, she has the right of divorce.

This is permitted in Shari'a faqat (no question about it).

She can't stop him having another relationship (or what they call an affair in the west).

But she can demand that if he does get into an affair, she can leave him, and if she does, he has no argument against it.

Be careful Ya Aba they will call you evil.

[Haydar Husayn]

A woman can stipulate in the marriage contract that if the man takes another wife, she has the right of divorce.

This is permitted in Shari'a faqat (no question about it).

She can't stop him having another relationship (or what they call an affair in the west).

But she can demand that if he does get into an affair, she can leave him, and if she does, he has no argument against it.

Isn't think there is an argument that such agreements aren't valid? In any case most women do not put such a condition in their contracts.

So you knew about this already?

Yeah, it's a fairly well-known phenomenon, although I'm not familiar with the ins and outs of how and when it occurs. As far as I know, it's still not that well understood.

Also you don't necessarily have to live together, it only takes seeing someone a few hours every day. It can also spread to people that you don't communicate with. For example someone sees her neighbor every day and every night the woman's neighbor goes to a house 10 minutes away to see her sister......eventually all 3 of them coincide even though the other women doesn't even really know her neighbors sister in law. Anyway way off topic sorry.

I could be wrong, but as far as I know, it's not the case that the cycles of all women will always coincide. There is just an overall tendency among women (and some people are sceptical even of this).

[ImAli]

Isn't think there is an argument that such agreements aren't valid? In any case most women do not put such a condition in their contracts.

Yeah, it's a fairly well-known phenomenon, although I'm not familiar with the ins and outs of how and when it occurs. As far as I know, it's still not that well understood.

I could be wrong, but as far as I know, it's not the case that the cycles of all women will always coincide. There is just an overall tendency among women (and some people are sceptical even of this).

Everywhere I have ever lived it has always happened....just speaking from personal experience. As for the stipulation in the marriage contract, that just goes to show you that there is an argument for everything and many things can be interpreted in many different ways and each situation is unique.

[Ya Aba 3abdillah]

Isn't think there is an argument that such agreements aren't valid? In any case most women do not put such a condition in their contracts.

The agreement that isn't valid is stipulating that the man can't have a second wife. But what the girl is saying is "if he decides to have a second wife", then she can divorce him.

Yeh, most women don't. It's important that parents teach their daughters their rights before marriage.

[Haydar Husayn]

The agreement that isn't valid is stipulating that the man can't have a second wife. But what the girl is saying is "if he decides to have a second wife", then she can divorce him.

I see, thanks. What about in the case of him having a muta with another woman? If the same condition was put in, how could she prove her husband actually had a muta, unless he confessed?

Yeh, most women don't. It's important that parents teach their daughters their rights before marriage.

Yeah, I guess. It would also be good if they taught their daughters that there is nothing wrong with polygamy, but I guess that is too much to hope for.