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In the Name of God بسم الله

Is It True That Most Iranians Are Leaving Islam?

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Ive heard that Many people of Persian descent outside of Iran are leaving Islam due to the supposed oppression in the Islamic republic, and are turning to nationalistic Iranian views that is drawn from an increasingly pro-Aryan and Anti- Arab mindset, or is this just propaganda from a minority of Iranians. Some of them even claim that the majority of Iranians are not even Muslim anymore!

The Iranian nationalists also claim that the Islamic revolution was forced on them and is the fault of the Arabs, and they made the corrupt Shah Pahllavis as their hero. But isnt that ignoring the fact that during the time of the revolution it was the Iranian people that were fed up with the Shah and wholeheartedly supported the Ayatollah Khomeini. The nationalists like to blame everything that has gone wrong with Iran on Islam and the Arabs.

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(bismillah) (salam)

Everyone watch this video. You don't need to watch it all. Just start at 24:45 and make sure to see the chants. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiQPEYpCbTQ I think this answers the OP's question.

So I will: http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb10/IranElection_Feb10_rpt.pdf Let's not forget: http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20291-iran-is-top-of-the-world-in-science-growth.html

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More anti Iran claims with no proof or reliable sources, just making a few things crystal clear here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_diaspora

Most of Iranians outside of Iran live in the United States, they are mostly people who fled to the US after Islamic revolution, most of them are criminals who worked for Shah's oppressive kingdom.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_American

Most of Iranians in the United States are Muslims despite the fact they might oppose Islamic revolution. But still most of them voted in Iran's 2009 election.

Islam is still the fastest growing religion in the world, and 98% of Iranians remain Muslims. Around 90% to 95% of Iranians remain Shias.

  1. ^ Walter Ralston Martin, Ravi K. Zacharias, The Kingdom of the Cults (2003), p.421; Excerpt: Ninety-five percent of Iran's Muslims are Shi'ites.
  2. ^ Bhabani Sen Gupta, The Persian Gulf and South Asia:: prospects and problems of inter-regional cooperation. p.158; Excerpt: Shias constitute seventy-five percent of the population of the Gulf. Of this, ninety-five percent of Iranians and sixty of Iraqis are Shias.
  3. ^ Daily report, Issues 64-73‎ -'United States. Foreign Broadcast Information Service- Page 50, Excerpt: Ninety -five percent of Iranians are Shiite Moslems.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Iran

Most Iranians will always stand behind Islamic revolution and support it to the end. Independence, Freedom, Islamic Republic.

http://shervinandpolitics.wordpress.com/2011/03/02/picture-of-iranians-during-celebration-of-victory-of-islamic-revolution-2011/

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Firstly, people who leave Iran generally do so for ideological reasons. These people are generally among the economic elite. Their reason for leaving is that they cannot stand to live under an Islamic government.

This is the first thing that must be taken into consideration. They cannot be seen as representative of Iranians in Iran, because they are the ones who leave Iran for this specific reason.

The second thing that must considered is that, even among Iranians abroad, there are plenty of mo'mineen. You just don't hear about them as much because they don't run their mouths as much as the secularists, they don't get invited to political TV shows, and they don't have lobbies in Washington.

If you want to see how most Iranians feel, look at this link: http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb10/IranElection_Feb10_rpt.pdf

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You expect me to read 38 pages... :wacko:

I must be in the minority then, I don't live in Iran but.. I don't live in the US, my family did not 'flee' after the Islamic revolution and my parents aren't criminals who worked for the Shah. :lol:

It's like what Bush said regarding axis of evil.

If you left Iran you are a criminal (against us), if not you are alhumdullillah a pious lover of Ahlul Bayt fighting the righteous fight.

So many similarities between the psyche of american right wing conservatives and Shia conservatives that support Iran. I think I can write a book on it.

Edited by Ugly Jinn
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More anti Iran claims with no proof or reliable sources, just making a few things crystal clear here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_diaspora Most of Iranians outside of Iran live in the United States, they are mostly people who fled to the US after Islamic revolution, most of them are criminals who worked for Shah's oppressive kingdom. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_American Most of Iranians in the United States are Muslims despite the fact they might oppose Islamic revolution. But still most of them voted in Iran's 2009 election. Islam is still the fastest growing religion in the world, and 98% of Iranians remain Muslims. Around 90% to 95% of Iranians remain Shias.
  1. ^ Walter Ralston Martin, Ravi K. Zacharias, The Kingdom of the Cults (2003), p.421; Excerpt: Ninety-five percent of Iran's Muslims are Shi'ites.
  2. ^ Bhabani Sen Gupta, The Persian Gulf and South Asia:: prospects and problems of inter-regional cooperation. p.158; Excerpt: Shias constitute seventy-five percent of the population of the Gulf. Of this, ninety-five percent of Iranians and sixty of Iraqis are Shias.
  3. ^ Daily report, Issues 64-73‎ -'United States. Foreign Broadcast Information Service- Page 50, Excerpt: Ninety -five percent of Iranians are Shiite Moslems.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Iran Most Iranians will always stand behind Islamic revolution and support it to the end. Independence, Freedom, Islamic Republic. http://shervinandpolitics.wordpress.com/2011/03/02/picture-of-iranians-during-celebration-of-victory-of-islamic-revolution-2011/

ahh.. so it it exactly as i suspected, still it seems those Iranians that are anti Muslim really do have a strong hatred

Firstly, people who leave Iran generally do so for ideological reasons. These people are generally among the economic elite. Their reason for leaving is that they cannot stand to live under an Islamic government. This is the first thing that must be taken into consideration. They cannot be seen as representative of Iranians in Iran, because they are the ones who leave Iran for this specific reason. The second thing that must considered is that, even among Iranians abroad, there are plenty of mo'mineen. You just don't hear about them as much because they don't run their mouths as much as the secularists, they don't get invited to political TV shows, and they don't have lobbies in Washington. If you want to see how most Iranians feel, look at this link: http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb10/IranElection_Feb10_rpt.pdf

I agree with you, the Muslim Iranians seem to lay low while the nationalistic ones claim that they are the only Iranians and their views are the opinion of all Iranians, and anyone whoo disagrees with them are Arabs.

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I can summarize :

Majority of Iranians are pro-government and conservative leaning(religious).

I would also cause of fear.

Rich yuppies in Tehran driving in BMW's dont represent the vast majority.

Those rich punks!

Everyone watch this video. You don't need to watch it all. Just start at 24:45 and make sure to see the chants.

I think this answers the OP's question.

You want me to post a video exactly like yours? Ohh, the only difference is the people are chanting to Saddam. ;)

Not comparing Saddam to Khamenei. I actually don't dislike Khamenei. But making a point.

Edited by Ugly Jinn
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I would also cause of fear.

Those rich punks!

You want me to post a video exactly like yours? Ohh, the only difference is the people are chanting to Saddam. ;)

Not comparing Saddam to Khamenei. I actually don't dislike Khamenei. But making a point.

Talk to anybody who has ever studied at a university in Iran and they will say there is no shortage of people who would gladly die for the leader.

Most of the anti-revolutionary youth in Iran admit that they are in the minority.

Think about it: there are 12 million Basijis, most of whom are in their early 20s or younger. Nobody is forced to join.

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Wiki = solid reference ^_^

FYI, Wikipedia itself is not a references, but it represents references such as books ^_^

ahh.. so it it exactly as i suspected, still it seems those Iranians that are anti Muslim really do have a strong hatred

You make no sense, I am bring proof for you from reliable sources and you keep repeating yourself like a parrot, take your hatred against Iran in some other forum where they buy it.

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Think about it: there are 12 million Basijis, most of whom are in their early 20s or younger. Nobody is forced to join.

You know why most Afghans join the military/police in Afghanistan? Benefits! It's so they can get paid to pay for fundamental needs like food, water, clothing.

These youngsters in Iran join for the benefits (admission to university, promotions gov jobs, money), not because they love the 'holy divine Irani regime'. :wacko: Heck even I'd have probably joined to help myself and my family.

Take away the benefits and you'll see how many will join for 'love' ^_^

Edited by Ugly Jinn
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Everyone watch this video. You don't need to watch it all. Just start at 24:45 and make sure to see the chants.

I bet you would have loved to be amongst the crowds chanting away....the more I see these types of videos, the more ridiculous they get. May Allah guide us all.

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You know why most Afghans join the military/police in Afghanistan? Benefits! It's so they can get paid to pay for fundamental needs like food, water, clothing.

These youngsters in Iran join for the benefits (admission to university, promotions gov jobs, money), not because they love the 'holy divine Irani regime'. :wacko: Heck even I'd have probably joined to help myself and my family.

Take away the benefits and you'll see how many will join for 'love' ^_^

As Shervin mentioned, Basijis don't get paid jack.

They do other stuff. Being a Basiji isn't their job.

Basijis do have priority in university and job applications (which, by the way, is openly announced by all state employers!), but this difference is not enough to push an opponent of Islamic government and WF to join Basij. When you're a Basiji you have to attend meetings and be active in various activities. You can't just join, get a card, and be given a baton to beat down on soosoolis.

25_8907101815_L600.jpg

People opposed to the system won't work so diligently for it just for a negligible advantage in job/university admissions. You can get by just fine in Iran without being a Basiji. Don't project your stereotypical "fear society" view upon Iran.

I bet you would have loved to be amongst the crowds chanting away....the more I see these types of videos, the more ridiculous they get. May Allah guide us all.

Watch it Hawraa. WATCH IT.

AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAA

ای رهبر آزاده آماده ایم آماده!

ای رهبر آزاده آماده ایم آماده!

ای رهبر آزاده آماده ایم آماده!

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Everyone watch this video. You don't need to watch it all. Just start at 24:45 and make sure to see the chants.

http://youtu.be/qiQPEYpCbTQ?t=24m45s

And you wonder why there's so many haters :lol:

khomeini_funeral2.jpg

To this day, it remains the largest funeral known in human history

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Everyone watch this video. You don't need to watch it all. Just start at 24:45 and make sure to see the chants.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiQPEYpCbTQ

I think this answers the OP's question.

Thanks.. interesting video

FYI, Wikipedia itself is not a references, but it represents references such as books ^_^

You make no sense, I am bring proof for you from reliable sources and you keep repeating yourself like a parrot, take your hatred against Iran in some other forum where they buy it.

why would i hate Iranians? i am not saying you arent giving reliable sources. I think you shoould calm down my friend

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As Shervin mentioned, Basijis don't get paid jack.

They do other stuff. Being a Basiji isn't their job.

Basijis do have priority in university and job applications (which, by the way, is openly announced by all state employers!), but this difference is not enough to push an opponent of Islamic government and WF to join Basij. When you're a Basiji you have to attend meetings and be active in various activities. You can't just join, get a card, and be given a baton to beat down on soosoolis.

People opposed to the system won't work so diligently for it just for a negligible advantage in job/university admissions. You can get by just fine in Iran without being a Basiji. Don't project your stereotypical "fear society" view upon Iran.

Not money per se, leads to opportunities to make money (ex. promotion, welfare subsidies, etc.), compared to what opportunities are out there.

If you dig a little deeper, most join are lower-middle class. The benefits outweigh most opportunities that exists, some may get lucky. Upper and upper-middle class youths rarely join. Youth unemployment is 20%+, and the most of the ones that do get a job are low paying. Suicide rates are soaring.

It's not always black and white. :rolleyes:

Edited by Ugly Jinn
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Not money per se, leads to opportunities to make money (ex. promotion, welfare subsidies, etc.), compared to what opportunities are out there.

If you dig a little deeper, most join are lower-middle class. The benefits outweigh most opportunities that exists, some may get lucky. Upper and upper-middle class youths rarely join. Youth unemployment is 20%+, and the most of the ones that do get a job are low paying. Suicide rates are soaring.

It's not always black and white. :rolleyes:

LOL.

Of course Hawraa liked this post.

Well Iran is 100th in the world in suicide rate, near the bottom of the list of those counties for which such statistics are available. (The list contains 107 countries). So when you say "suicide rates are soaring" you make it seem like people are flocking in droves to the Milad Tower to throw themselves off! Life in Iran is just that horrible, I guess.

I don't know your sources for saying that most Basijis are lower middle class. Most Basijis are students, who are by nature hard to classify along class lines.

And please provide a source for the youth unemployment rate as well.

I saw one statistic that showed unemployment rate as 40 percent! After looking into it more I learned that it included people as young as 15 (which is ridiculous, to count those amongst the unemployed).

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I saw one statistic that showed unemployment rate as 40 percent! After looking into it more I learned that it included people as young as 15 (which is ridiculous, to count those amongst the unemployed).

Yeah lying by omission.

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I dunno man. The average fertility rate in Iran is 1.8 kids per woman according to this month's National Geographic (pg 148 in the pdf) compare this to Israels 3 kids per woman and Saudi Arabia's 3.8 kids per woman, America's 2 kids per woman and Pakistan's 4 kids per woman . You guys need to make more babby.

My brother is in Reno, Nevada, he used to live in Las Vegas and says the Iranis of Las Vegas were non-religious and they are so westernized and liberal, especially the women, that even the whiles seem conservative by comparison. Although he also told me there was a mosque run by an Irani Alim in Reno who has even managed to get some local converts.

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Not money per se, leads to opportunities to make money (ex. promotion, welfare subsidies, etc.), compared to what opportunities are out there.

If you dig a little deeper, most join are lower-middle class. The benefits outweigh most opportunities that exists, some may get lucky. Upper and upper-middle class youths rarely join. Youth unemployment is 20%+, and the most of the ones that do get a job are low paying. Suicide rates are soaring.

It's not always black and white. :rolleyes:

http://en.wikipedia....employment_rate

22px-Flag_of_Iran.svg.pngIran 11.8%

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate

100 22px-Flag_of_Iran.svg.pngIran 0.3 0.1

:rolleyes:

Edited by Shervin
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LOL.

Of course Hawraa liked this post.

Well Iran is 100th in the world in suicide rate, near the bottom of the list of those counties for which such statistics are available. (The list contains 107 countries). So when you say "suicide rates are soaring" you make it seem like people are flocking in droves to the Milad Tower to throw themselves off! Life in Iran is just that horrible, I guess.

I don't know your sources for saying that most Basijis are lower middle class. Most Basijis are students, who are by nature hard to classify along class lines.

And please provide a source for the youth unemployment rate as well.

I saw one statistic that showed unemployment rate as 40 percent! After looking into it more I learned that it included people as young as 15 (which is ridiculous, to count those amongst the unemployed).

You can google it and choose which sources to reject or believe (most lovers of the regime tend to reject any sources that has negative information about Iran)

But, I'll provide one from 2007 (it's worse now)

Youth men = 20%

Youth Women = 30%

Combined = 22.3%

http://www.indexmund...yment-rate.html

Regardless, if you think most join cause of 'love' then you are delusional. No offence.

Read again carefully, "Youth unemployment". :rolleyes:

Edited by Ugly Jinn
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Never been to Iran, but I have heard nothing whatever that suggests that Iran is full of closet atheists dying to overthrow the evil regime. As far as I can tell most people opposed to the government do so within the framework of Shia Islam, not militant atheism. Can't speak about their personal piety. I have noticed the diaspora tends to be pretty nationalistic, if not racist and honestly view it with a bit of distaste. Maybe it is because I hang out on history forums, but they always insist Iran was great and awesome before evil Islam was forced on the them by the Arabs and after that it has all been terrible. Problem is, that's really not a very accurate statement at all, and they seem perfectly willing to ignore historical facts and just hate on Arabs. Maybe it is because I have had a few bad experiences, and forums are not usually the most polite places or the best to get an impression of a whole group, but my brushes with them have left me with a negative impression of the Iranian diaspora.

EDIT: And actually, by world standards, a youth unemployment rate of 20% is not very remarkable. It is about 18% in the US and usually hovers around 25% in France. Spain is close to 40% IIRC. If Iran's youth unemployment rate is a roughly 20% it is about in line with the world average, no more, no less.

Edited by Akritas
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^^Bangladeshi atheists (who similarly make up a tiny minority), interestingly enough, say the exact same thing, that our "glorrrious" "culture" was destroyed by the evil Arabs, and that now we are some sort of "traitors" to our "mother", and that we now follow Arab culture.. But take a look at history, we used to be lowest-class Hindus who used to clean the sh!t of the upper classes with our bare hands before Islam, suffering as peasants under the feudal landlords and loan sharks. They don't care about the truth, and continue with their pathetic lies.

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Completely false. Sure, some might not identify themselves as practising muslims, but they will say they are muslim none the less. Different groups of iranians have different interpretations of what it means to be a muslim, just like other people. It saddens me to hear that muslims have this misconception about iranians. The vast majority have a solid belief in God, His Prophets and Ahlulbayt. It's ingrained in society, their beliefs are not being lost over generations. This is happening in the west, especially the UK where people are fast losing their christian roots. More and more of the young generation are born to devout christian parents, yet will identify themselves as atheist and have had little experience of a christian upbringing. Iranians are not like this, the youth still believe even though they might protest, dress inappropriately and act foolish like young people do. But you know what, these young girls that prefer to dress as "barbie dolls" as people say, will still put on their chadors and make ziyarat of Imam Reza (as).

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Completely false. Sure, some might not identify themselves as practising muslims, but they will say they are muslim none the less. Different groups of iranians have different interpretations of what it means to be a muslim, just like other people. It saddens me to hear that muslims have this misconception about iranians. The vast majority have a solid belief in God, His Prophets and Ahlulbayt. It's ingrained in society, their beliefs are not being lost over generations. This is happening in the west, especially the UK where people are fast losing their christian roots. More and more of the young generation are born to devout christian parents, yet will identify themselves as atheist and have had little experience of a christian upbringing. Iranians are not like this, the youth still believe even though they might protest, dress inappropriately and act foolish like young people do. But you know what, these young girls that prefer to dress as "barbie dolls" as people say, will still put on their chadors and make ziyarat of Imam Reza (as).

Iranians come in different labels. Yes, many may be practicing Muslims however a vast majority are not. Many have converted to Christianity and Zoroastrianism which is truly saddening. Many Iranians are just Muslim by name. They wouldn't know the first thing about Islam. With all that said many young Iranians are seeing the light however as they haven't been brought up into religious households they're being led in the wrong direction i.e having Sunni beliefs.

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Iranians come in different labels. Yes, many may be practicing Muslims however a vast majority are not. Many have converted to Christianity and Zoroastrianism which is truly saddening. Many Iranians are just Muslim by name. They wouldn't know the first thing about Islam. With all that said many young Iranians are seeing the light however as they haven't been brought up into religious households they're being led in the wrong direction i.e having Sunni beliefs.

How many times do I have to tell you, don't talk about Iran and Iranians when you clearly don't know what you're talking about!

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