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In the Name of God بسم الله
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Wahhabism4All

If You Are Human, Do Not Support The Syrian Regime

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This thread will never end.

Upon Fink's request, I demand the mods lock this thread up.

People are running arguments on emotion, not reason.

No, this thread should not be locked. This is after all what the Hezbollah supporter members writing here want - to derail the thread and get it locked. However, I'm sure the ShiaChat admins will be fair and just and allow the voice of reason to be heard to show the brutality of the Syrian regime against fellow Muslims. I'm sure it is a requirement of admins here to care about fellow innocent Muslims dying.

Please add your input to the thread. The voice of reason is needed here.

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I was watching this video

The first clip appears to have peacefull protesting, i dont see any shootouts, but rather the protestors are being shot at. That and, snipers firing on people whom appear to be casual people simply trying to recover bodies from the street. And of course children being harmed. Many people are protesting against Assad.

Does everyone agree with this?

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Shot at by whom? Do you see them? Are you aware of armed terrorist groups intending to destablise Syria? Have you heard of simulation?

Many people protesting against Assad. Even more protesting for him.

Welcome to 5 month ago.

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Shot at by whom? Do you see them? Are you aware of armed terrorist groups intending to destablise Syria? Have you heard of simulation?

Many people protesting against Assad. Even more protesting for him.

Welcome to 5 month ago.

They appear to have an APC up the street, and if the protestors are protesting against them, then most likely it is the govt. People do not picket against armed enemies, nor do terrorists commonly drive around in armored vehicles, nor do they normally casually walk around with armor on.

Edited by iSilurian

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if the protestors are protesting against them, then most likely it is the govt

That's where your logic is flawed.

It's most likely the agitators. The APC is there for the people's protection. I hope you're not deliberately distorting these facts.

What does a government get from shooting at supposedly peaceful protestors? And why are they not shot in Damascus?

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That's where your logic is flawed.

It's most likely the agitators. The APC is there for the people's protection. I hope you're not deliberately distorting these facts.

The logic seems fair. They arent armed terrorists firing on the people. What does the govt get from shooting at peaceful protestors? Its happened in many countries in history many times for many different reasons. I wouldnt put it past me that it were a possible means of quelling protests.

Does anyone actualy have data on the views of the people? It would help if we had some data to better grasp the number he is up against.

Edited by iSilurian

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And welcome to you to, cartoon boy. What happened to your anime mech warrior avatar?

The real cartoon is you. People here have continually given you ample facts about your own videos in order to make you rethink your stance. But no, just like your ancestors ibn Taymiyyah and Abdul Wahab (may Allah damn their accursed souls to hell), you remain stubborn to the end, lowly nasibi. All you have is perhaps an interest of the Munafiq states of the Gulf (like Saudi Arabia) that they gain control of Syria. Just like bro Aba said, go back to Riyadh and await Iran to nuke your asses into the oblivion they belong.

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السلام عليكم ورحمة الله

Why should we, as Shi`a Muslims, support a secular dictatorship in Syria? Have any maraji or major scholars commented on the events there?

The oppressed Bahraini nation is like the Egyptian nation, the Tunisian nation and the Yemeni nation. They are all in the same situation. It is meaningless to distinguish between the movements of these nations. Unfortunately we see that instead of paying attention to what nations want, some people follow the path and make the move that the enemies of these nations want. Today in order to simulate what was done in Egypt, Tunisia, Yemen, Libya and other such countries, America has realized that it should create problems for Syria - which is moving on the path of resistance. The nature of the issue in Syria is different from the nature of the issue in these countries. In these countries, the movements were anti-America and anti-Zionism, but America is clearly involved in Syria. The Zionists are following up the issue. We should not make a mistake. We should not forget our standard. Wherever a movement is anti-America and anti-Zionism, that movement is a genuine and popular movement. Wherever the slogans are in favor of America and Zionism, the movement is misguided. We will preserve this logic and this insight.

Source: Leader's Speech to State Officials on Mab'ath

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It amazes me that Shias will support an illegitimate leader just because he has ties with Iran and Hizbullah. Talk about self interest.

Mubarak, Khadaffi, Asad are all from the same ilk (individuals that were given power because of daddy, not people).

Even Wali ul Faqi gets elected by a council.

Next on the list Abdallah of Jordan, Mohammed of Morocco, Abdullah of Saudi (hard one).

Edited by Ugly Jinn

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It amazes me that Shias will support an illegitimate leader just because he has ties with Iran and Hizbullah. Talk about self interest.

Mubarak, Khadaffi, Asad are all from the same ilk (individuals that were given power because of daddy, not people).

Even Wali ul Faqi gets elected by a council.

Next on the list Abdallah of Jordan, Mohammed of Morocco, Abdullah of Saudi (hard one).

Well you lost your legitimacy right there because Ghaddafi took over in a coup; he didn't have his power given to him by his father.

Even wali faqih? You say that as if wali faqih is such an autocrat and such a despot! You failed to mention that this council (the Assembly of Experts) is, an assembly of experts. Meaning, they are an assembly that -- collectively -- knows who is the most fit to lead. You also failed to mention that this council is elected by the people.

Anyway Bashar is different from the individuals you mentioned for a number of reasons, many of which have been mentioned in the preceding 12 pages.

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Well you lost your legitimacy right there because Ghaddafi took over in a coup; he didn't have his power given to him by his father.

Even wali faqih? You say that as if wali faqih is such an autocrat and such a despot! You failed to mention that this council (the Assembly of Experts) is, an assembly of experts. Meaning, they are an assembly that -- collectively -- knows who is the most fit to lead. You also failed to mention that this council is elected by the people.

Oh dear, the coup. I guess Ghaddafi is more legitimate than Bashar, atleast he had to fight for power.

Regarding Wali ul Faqi, I'm giving you an example that even he is elected.

Anyway Bashar is different from the individuals you mentioned for a number of reasons, many of which have been mentioned in the preceding 12 pages.

Nope. Power given by daddy. Re-elected with no oppostion...lol.

You can be in denial and look the other way regarding his origin and legitimacy because he is 'good' for Iran/Hizbullah. It's hypocrisy.

Edited by Ugly Jinn

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The logic seems fair. They arent armed terrorists firing on the people.

Again, logical fallecy. We have documented footage of terrorists firing on protestors. Confirmed liar.

What does the govt get from shooting at peaceful protestors?

Past performance never dictates future action. Police/soldiers were given direct orders never to shoot unarmed people.

Its happened in many countries in history many times for many different reasons. I wouldnt put it past me that it were a possible means of quelling protests.

So you think they can quell fake protestors by shooting at them??? You're completely deluded if so. That's precisely how you make them multiply in numbers if they were genuine.

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Here we go again, Western news organisations proclaim that the word of the month for Augest is......... "legitimacy"

& satyaban does not hold back,

Another case of Monkey see monkey do!!

and the problem is that all these monkeys dont even come from syria or the surrounding regions that will suffer as a direct result of the terrorismm that is being formented

Unless I don't know how to read you are in Australia. One does not have to live in Syria to see a regime that has no legitimacy. Tell tell how someone is qualified to rule because his father chose him? Good luck with that.

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The Syrian regime is a murderous regime that is not governing by the consent of its people. It has now resorted to Iranian tactics of murdering peaceful protestors, including little children, in order to lengthen its illegitimate hold on power. It is time for Syria's people to be free of the swine ruling, but not leading them. It is overdue for Iran's people to be free of the swine ruling them as well. The freedom that Tunisians, Egyptians, Israelis and other soon to be democratic states have will expand (hopefully soon) to include Syria, Bahrain, Iran and of course Saudi Arabia.

We take these truths to be self-evident, that people are endowed by their creator (Allah) with certain inalienable rights. It is time for these rights not to trampled in the Middle East by those usurping the role of Allah whether it be Iranian clerics or Syrian/Saudi secular dicatators. People of the Middle East unite against these power-grubbing anti-revolutionary forces.

Ignore the Admins and other uneducated stooges of the Iranian regime on shiachat and other Iranian regime run webisites. There is nothing about being born in Syria/.Saudi Arabia that means you gave up their god-given rights to a unscrupulous, corrupt regime. There is nothing about being born in Iran that means people you up your rights to an anti-revolutionary Guard that sucks up the economic power of the country at the expense of the population in order to line their pockets.

People of the Middle East will continue to throw off the shackles those that would control them. The current leaders and their stooges will burn in Hell. No virgins for you in the afterlife!

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Oh dear, the coup. I guess Ghaddafi is more legitimate than Bashar, atleast he had to fight for power.

Regarding Wali ul Faqi, I'm giving you an example that even he is elected.

Nope. Power given by daddy. Re-elected with no oppostion...lol.

You can be in denial and look the other way regarding his origin and legitimacy because he is 'good' for Iran/Hizbullah. It's hypocrisy.

He is on the resistance path, which by nature makes him 1000000000 times more representative of his people than the stooges that are governing other Arab countries.

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Why should we, as Shi`a Muslims, support a secular dictatorship in Syria?

We never supported the War on Iraq in 03. Didn't support the War on Libya either. Even though you won't find bigger scum than Saddam and Ghaddafi.

Why didn't we support those wars?

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He is on the resistance path, which by nature makes him 1000000000 times more representative of his people than the stooges that are governing other Arab countries.

Doesn't matter what path he takes, he has no legitimacy, just like most of the arab stooges who were handed down power from daddy. This is about principle.

Let the people choose. And I don't mean another election with no opposition.

It's obvious desires and self interests have obstructed correct judgement.

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The worries of those Shia Muslims on this forum who stand against Bashar are understandable. But brothers and sisters you need to understand something as I have been trying to for the past year: choosing good over evil is not as hard as choosing the lesser of two evils or choosing the greater of two goods.

What we have in Syria is people making a choice between two evils, Bashar, or a US-installed Wahabbi puppet just like in the rest of the Gulf. Anyone who has opened their eyes to the reality behind the overly loud songs of democracy the USA keeps singing while treading over regions in the ME should know by now that they cannot be given their leeway over Middle Eastern matters any longer... I know choosing Bashar is hard, but that's what needs to be done if we are to see any kind of resistance against Israel and those who wish to destroy the Muslims in the future...

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LOL trying to appeal to the Shia. Listen bro, I know you mean well, but you should know that Bashar is very popular, it's Ba'ath which isn't.

You guys really need to walk away from complex situations like Syria unless you're willing to spend years studying what is really going on.

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LOL trying to appeal to the Shia. Listen bro, I know you mean well, but you should know that Bashar is very popular, it's Ba'ath which isn't.

You guys really need to walk away from complex situations like Syria unless you're willing to spend years studying what is really going on.

It's just as you say. I'm not well-versed in these matters but you can't deny there are some grey areas with regards to the Ba'ath (and/or Bashar? :wacko: ). Therefore I'm doing what can be done best given the circumstances: making a judgment call.

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This revolution phenomenon through out middle east and North Africa is happening for a reason.

Shias will pick and choose because of self interest. Same problem happens in Bahrain, shias will support the people (search for Bahrain threads on here). If it happens in Egypt and Libya, good riddance to the leaders.

All of these countries have a common denominator, they are/were ruled by an illegitimate, mostly passed down from daddy dictators.

Can't modify your principles because of self interest.

What we have in Syria is people making a choice between two evils, Bashar, or a US-installed Wahabbi puppet just like in the rest of the Gulf. Anyone who has opened their eyes to the reality behind the overly loud songs of democracy the USA keeps singing while treading over regions in the ME should know by now that they cannot be given their leeway over Middle Eastern matters any longer... I know choosing Bashar is hard, but that's what needs to be done if we are to see any kind of resistance against Israel and those who wish to destroy the Muslims in the future...

Why are you assuming that if Bashar is dethroned a puppet will be installed?

LOL trying to appeal to the Shia. Listen bro, I know you mean well, but you should know that Bashar is very popular, it's Ba'ath which isn't.

You guys really need to walk away from complex situations like Syria unless you're willing to spend years studying what is really going on.

You know Hitler was popular to. Ofcourse I'm not comparing the 2, but his popularity (which is debatable) doesn't change the fact that he didn't earn that position.

If he really had that much popularity, why didn't he have any opposing candidate during the elections? What was he worried about.

Edited by Ugly Jinn

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Asad doesn't have the U.S. or NATO bombing him like Gadafi and Saddam. There are a few salafi irhaabiyoon amongst the demonstrators and they are being used to justify a country-wide crack down on people demanding their rights. The salafis are causing trouble in places like Egypt and Libya too so it's not unique to Syria. I can't stomach Asad's actions and I don't believe that the enemy of my enemy is my friend - that sounds more like Real Politik than Islam.

Would you support the Abbasid take over of Bani Umayya knowing that Abbasids will treat the Imams a lot worse than Bani Umayya did?

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We should stand up for truth akhi. There is no comparison with your example and the more that some Shi`a support a despot for political reasons, the more likely the region will become polarized. Asad's actions should be condemned because they go against the teachings of Islam.

I've been calling for reforms for years bro. I know there is plenty of corruption in the Syrian government. As for 'his' actions, do we condemn Rasoul (sawa) for the actions of Khalid ibnil Walid when he was under Him in Yemen?

Bashar hasn't called for the slaughter of Syrians. He's called for the annihilation of terrorists, the same ones that were used in Iraq, they've sent them all now to Syria.

Bringing chaos to the country is only going to help the enemies. The first thing they'll do, probably blow up the Shrine of Sayyida Zainab (as).

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Perhaps we all need to go back into history and learn more about our noble Imam Ali ibn Musa al-Ridha (as) and how he had to deal with the Abbasids, a dilemma not so different from what Syria faces today...

I've been calling for reforms for years bro. I know there is plenty of corruption in the Syrian government. As for 'his' actions, do we condemn Rasoul (sawa) for the actions of Khalid ibnil Walid when he was under Him in Yemen?

Bashar hasn't called for the slaughter of Syrians. He's called for the annihilation of terrorists, the same ones that were used in Iraq, they've sent them all now to Syria.

Bringing chaos to the country is only going to help the enemies. The first thing they'll do, probably blow up the Shrine of Sayyida Zainab (as).

Wait... the Shrine of Lady Zainab (as) is in Syria? More motive for Salafi pigs to storm into Syria... "WHAT?! A SHRINE?! BOMB IT, AND BOMB THE RAWAFIDH INSIDE!!!!!1111ONE11ONEONE"

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Akhi again, there is a major difference between the actions of some violent "sahabi" and the president of Syria giving the orders to shell civilian areas. The ends don't justify the means in Islam. I don't want to go back and forth but I truly believe the vast majority of people in the streets want democratic reforms.

I think "going back and forth" is inevitable. Aba has posted numerous pictures and videos of pro-Bashar rallies, numbering in the millions, if not hundred millions... Is that not democracy?

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Dictators always have a large base, as was seen in Bahrain. People throughout the region want representative government and more freedoms. I support the youth and all those involved in the revolutions in Yemen, Syria, Bahrain and Egypt.

Unfortunately the revolution in Egypt has been hijacked. The Libyan rebels have already cut deals with the World Bank, BP and other Multinational corps. Just going to get more of the same that we've seen for the past 30 years. Only whilst changing from one ill-regime to the next, the destitute are the ones that cop it the most.

I'd prefer the regime of the lesser of the two evils and sparing innocent lives, than the larger of the evils taking over through chaos. Syria's already preparing for a transitional government by the end of the year. The voices of the opposition have been heard. The voices of the terrorists however, their mouths are being smacked shut.

http://news.xinhuane...c_131033563.htm

Syria's general elections to take place by end of 2011: FM

DAMASCUS, Aug. 6 (Xinhua) -- Syrian Foreign Minister Walid al- Moallem said Saturday that the country's general elections will take place by the end of this year, adding that it would be "free and fair."

Al-Moallem made the statement during his meeting with foreign ambassadors in capital Damascus, in which he said the new parliament will represent the aspirations of the Syrian people.

The current parliament's four-year term has expired earlier this year, and President Bashar al-Assad will set a date for new legislative elections before the end of 2011.

The Syrian leadership is going on with the process of reform, al-Moallem said, adding that all the reform steps announced by the president will be implemented soon.

He voiced the Syrian leadership's keenness to maintain the security and stability of the country and to put an end to the sabotaging acts.

The Syrian leadership is still affirming that the only way out of the current ordeal is through a national dialogue, Al-Moallem told the ambassadors, adding that in the absence of the national dialogue "because of the negativity of the opposition," the leadership has to move on with the reform.

The foreign minister's remarks came as his country is facing an international outcry over the alleged crackdown on anti-government protestors. According to activists, more than 1,700 civilians have been killed since the crisis began in mid-March.

The U.S. State Department on Friday issued a new travel warning for U.S. citizens traveling in Syria, citing the deteriorating situation there due to the escalation of violent clashes between government forces and opposition militants.

The travel warning came one day after the U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton accused the Syrian government of killing more than 2,000 of its own citizens during its alleged " ongoing brutal crackdown against opposition protesters."

"We think, to date, the government is responsible for the deaths of more than 2,000 people of all ages," Clinton said, repeating the U.S. administration's position that "Assad has lost his legitimacy to govern the Syrian people."

Activists said some 25 people were killed Friday, while the official media said two police officers were killed by armed men, as thousands of anti-government protestors took to the streets across Syria calling for the downfall of the leadership and demonstrating solidarity with the city of Hama, which has been under military siege since last week.

The Syrian authorities repeatedly brushed off the international pressures as "interference in the country's affairs" and blamed the violent acts on armed thugs and ultraconservative Muslims who want to establish Islamic emirates nationwide. The authorities pledged that there would be no letup in its crackdown on the gunmen to restore stability and security to the country.

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Interestingly, it seems that Bashar is following to some extent Brzezinski's advice to Carter and the Shah, for how to remain in control. Brzezinski's advice wasn't heeded, the Shah met his doom.

Brzezinski: "You first re-establish order, thereby asserting your authority. And shortly then thereafter, initiate the reforms, having proven that you're in charge."

http://youtu.be/FfrJ2rBobGs?t=11m20s

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Asad doesn't have the U.S. or NATO bombing him like Gadafi and Saddam. There are a few salafi irhaabiyoon amongst the demonstrators and they are being used to justify a country-wide crack down on people demanding their rights. The salafis are causing trouble in places like Egypt and Libya too so it's not unique to Syria. I can't stomach Asad's actions and I don't believe that the enemy of my enemy is my friend - that sounds more like Real Politik than Islam.

No one's asking you to stomach anything, you've eaten up a whole batch of lies.

Seriously none of the people here seem to have a single bit of interest in what happens to Syria at all.

The pragmatist would always agree with me. Even if all these lies were true and they are certainly not, you do not want outside interference with Syria. You'd have to be batsh*t insane after seeing what the west has done to the world the last 30 years to advocate it. That's if you're not Syrian, if you're Syrian, the only thing you should look forward to is the gallows.

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We should stand up for truth akhi. There is no comparison with your example and the more that some Shi`a support a despot for political reasons, the more likely the region will become polarized. Asad's actions should be condemned because they go against the teachings of Islam.

Brother this is where your wrong, Some shias are not supporting Asaad for purely political reasons, rather they are supporting him because they've seen the secterian nature of these protests, right at the start of the unrest when protests first started in daraa they didnt even number a hundred, yet they were chanting anti-Iran, anti- shia and anti hezbollah slogans for no reason other than appealing to zionists and wahabis,can you think of any legitimate reason why thay should hate Iran, shias or hezbollah? If these guys had any honour they would hate Jordan, Saudi Arabia and the UAE for supporting the zionist entity who have occupied a large portion of their land, and in contrast they should appreciate the resistance that Iran, hezbollah openly display against the Israeli occupation and support for the liberation of occupied lands.They accuse Syria of having a religious alliance with Iran which is nonsense, while praising those other puppet regimes who are too gutless to demand the return of what is rightfully Syrias. Like it or not all evidence points to these guys conspiring to ethnic cleanse syria of its minorities, and like we all know, Bashar dosnt care about Shia,sunni or christian and for that reason i support him and believe he is the only person strong enough to stop this fitna, he is much more trustworthy than a bloodthirsty wahabi.

if this crackdown dosnt succeed then my fears are that many more lives will be lost, what we've seen so far will only be regared as negligible to the overall amount of casualties.

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