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In the Name of God بسم الله

Intriguing Hadith In Bukhari That Was Untranslated

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(bismillah)

(salam)

In the English translation of Sahih al-Bukhari by Dr. Muhsin Khan, we find this hadith:

Volume 9, Book 88, Number 180:

Narrated Abu Huraira:

I heard the truthful and trusted by Allah (i.e., the Prophet ) saying, "The destruction of my followers will be through the hands of young men from Quraish."

Yet when we look at the Arabic text on the right, we see a lot more Arabic than English:

6649 ÍÏËäÇ ãæÓì Èä ÅÓãÇÚíá ÍÏËäÇ ÚãÑæ Èä íÍíì Èä ÓÚíÏ Èä ÚãÑæ Èä ÓÚíÏ ÞÇá ÃÎÈÑäí ÌÏí ÞÇá ßäÊ ÌÇáÓÇ ãÚ ÃÈí åÑíÑÉ Ýí ãÓÌÏ ÇáäÈí Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÓáã ÈÇáãÏíäÉ æãÚäÇ ãÑæÇä ÞÇá ÃÈæ åÑíÑÉ ÓãÚÊ ÇáÕÇÏÞ ÇáãÕÏæÞ íÞæá åáßÉ ÃãÊí Úáì íÏí ÛáãÉ ãä ÞÑíÔ ÝÞÇá ãÑæÇä áÚäÉ Çááå Úáíåã ÛáãÉ ÝÞÇá ÃÈæ åÑíÑÉ áæ ÔÆÊ Ãä ÃÞæá Èäí ÝáÇä æÈäí ÝáÇä áÝÚáÊ ÝßäÊ ÃÎÑÌ ãÚ ÌÏí Åáì Èäí ãÑæÇä Ííä ãáßæÇ ÈÇáÔÃã ÝÅÐÇ ÑÂåã ÛáãÇäÇ ÃÍÏÇËÇ ÞÇá áäÇ ÚÓì åÄáÇÁ Ãä íßæäæÇ ãäåã ÞáäÇ ÃäÊ ÃÚáã

(i've made the translated part red)

So what's all of that stuff after the red that wasn't translated? Well, let's translate it:

Musa bin Isma'eel narrated to us. 'Amro bin Yahya bin Sa'eed bin 'Amro bin Sa'eed narrated to us. He said, my grandfather informed me. He said: I was sitting with Abu Hurairah in the Prophet's (pbuh) mosque in Madinah and Marwan was with us. Abu Hurariah said, I heard the truthful and trusted by Allah (i.e., the Prophet ) saying, "The destruction of my followers will be through the hands of young men from Quraish.

So Marwan said, May God curse (la'nah) those youths."

Abu Hurairah said, "If I wanted to, i would say Banu So-and-so and Banu so-and-so, I would of."

So I (Amro bin Yahya) left with my grandfather (the one who was with Abu Hurariah and Marwan) to Banu Marwan when they ruled Sha'am (Sha'am=Sham) and saw them, youths causing mischief, so he (the grandfather) said to us, "Perhaps these are from them (ie the youths from Banu so-and-so that the Prophet(pbuh) warned about who would bring destruction to the Ummah)." So we said, "You know best".

(the blue is the part that was originally translated)

... ÓÈÍÇä Çááå

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http://www.quran.net/hadees/bukhari/056.sbt.html

Volume 4, Book 56, Number 802:

Narrated Said Al-Umawi:

I was with Marwan and Abu Huraira and heard Abu Huraira saying, "I heard the trustworthy, truly inspired one (i.e. the Prophet ) saying, 'The destruction of my followers will be brought about by the hands of some youngsters from Quraish." Marwan asked, "Youngsters?" Abu Huraira said, "If you wish, I would name them: They are the children of so-and-so and the children of so-and-so."

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http://www.quran.net/hadees/bukhari/056.sbt.html

Volume 4, Book 56, Number 802:

Narrated Said Al-Umawi:

I was with Marwan and Abu Huraira and heard Abu Huraira saying, "I heard the trustworthy, truly inspired one (i.e. the Prophet ) saying, 'The destruction of my followers will be brought about by the hands of some youngsters from Quraish." Marwan asked, "Youngsters?" Abu Huraira said, "If you wish, I would name them: They are the children of so-and-so and the children of so-and-so."

I guess Abu Huraira was doing taqiya by not stating the real names as he usually used to do during the Caliphs to save his life.

Sahih Bukhari Volume 1, Book 3, Number 121:

Narrated Abu Huraira:

I have memorized two kinds of knowledge from Allah's Apostle . I have propagated one of them to you and if I propagated the second, then my pharynx (throat) would be cut (i.e. killed).

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Salam Alaikum

Ibn Hajr in his renowned commentary of Sahih Bukhari writes in his introduction to his commentary, Fat'h-ul-Bari, in the chapter in which he explains what Bukhari meant when he left certain characters' names out:

"The hadeeth of Abu Hurayrah: If I wanted I would have said Bani Fulan and Bani Fulan; he meant: Bani Marwan and Bani Muawiyah."

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Who actually follow Umayyads in these days?? I am sure not abusing them, doesn't mean following them. Besides not every Umayyad was a blacksheep, just like not each of Hashimi and Alawi were righteous.

Who actually follow Umayyads in these days?? I am sure not abusing them, doesn't mean following them. Besides not every Umayyad was a blacksheep, just like not each of Hashimi and Alawi were righteous.

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Who actually follow Umayyads in these days?? I am sure not abusing them, doesn't mean following them. Besides not every Umayyad was a blacksheep, just like not each of Hashimi and Alawi were righteous.

Who actually follow Umayyads in these days?? I am sure not abusing them, doesn't mean following them. Besides not every Umayyad was a blacksheep, just like not each of Hashimi and Alawi were righteous.

All the lovers of Ibn Taymiyyah and abdul wahab commonly referred as wahabi/salafi/takfeeri/ahlehadith these days.

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Sallamun Alaykum

brother ibn taymyya if you take the time to study sayed kamal haydari program last year you will understand why wahabis are seen as followers of the ummayads.

secondaly take the time to read minhaj alsunnah and other books by ibn taymiiah and others. you will find there is a high concentration on defending the ummayads and greatening their position and deacresing the grateness of the Ahlulbayt and even insulting them at times.

you might say but that is the truth however if you take the time to watch sayed kamals hayderis past programs and research yourself without bias you will see that even if someone hates and insults the ahlulbayt he is still taken as a great personality and glorified and in doing so following the path of the ummayads.

ws wr wb

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I've read in this regard more than you, alhamdulillah, that is why i am confident in this matter. Neither Ibn Taymiyya nor any reliable sunni follows evil Umayyads (exception to those who were good like Usman, Umar ibn Abdul Aziz). In that too they look who is close to Prophet PBUH in their views. In short sunni do not follow anyone in absolute sense except the Messenger of Allah PBUH. As for Kamal al-Haidari then, although i don't expect something new, but i'll try to find it out.

I've read in this regard more than you, alhamdulillah, that is why i am confident in this matter. Neither Ibn Taymiyya nor any reliable sunni follows evil Umayyads (exception to those who were good like Usman, Umar ibn Abdul Aziz). In that too they look who is close to Prophet PBUH in their views. In short sunni do not follow anyone in absolute sense except the Messenger of Allah PBUH. As for Kamal al-Haidari then, although i don't expect something new, but i'll try to find it out.

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sallamun alaykum

from your tone you havent.

remember there is a diffarance between confidance and certainty.

i pray you do not confuse them.

also i dont see how you can say u have read more than me when you dont even know how much i have read, if you use this type of thinking then obviously you wont see the truth.

ws wr wb

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Look my tone is perfect. You might not get it as you are just reading it. I've know several of your posts and i know to whom i am speaking.

Now, in forum discussions and debates it is not a good way to answer someone by referring to a lecture or a book. You should instead post here, if you have yourself take care to watch or read it, the relevant answer and then you can refer to something external for more detail, regardless of whether i read it or not. Otherwise you can simply collect some lectures and book names and keep on referring to it whenever someone raise some evidence against you. I just don't like this way of discussion. I can also refer to you refutations of al-Haidari by sunni scholars and students.

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sallamun alaykum

actually i dont go back to my books to see the refutations and use them rather i look at both books think about it then see if i was wrong or the person discussing with me is or if we both are. it seems u dont know me that well. the reason i asked u to watch it was becuase to prove the wahabis are following the ummayad line would require extensive research which has been shown by sayed kamal furthermore i dont expect u to change your view by seeing it rather u should look at it then check the refutation then see if there is anything else then think for yourself then decide what u beleive.

if youve seen my other posts u know that i like to discuss without links or videos but becuase this issue is so extensive you will need to watch the program to start the discussion.

the thing is even if i prove to you that your scholars love the ummayads especially Muawyah and Yazid and decrease the importance of Ahlulbayt you probably still wouldnt be convinced.

ws wr wb

Edited by mo87_11014
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Ok start one by one. Start a topic on ''how sunnis are followers of Banu Umayyah''. Start with evidences provided by Al-Haidary and then add to it whatever you like. Then seek some replies from sunni and make your counter reply to it. No need to post scans or links (except if you like to). Do it step by step...

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How can you claim people now don't follow the Bani Ummayah? During their reign (mostly) the Ahlulbayt (as) and their followers were persecuted, exactly the same happens to followers of Ahlulbayt (as) today - who's 'sunnah' are the modern day equivalents following?

ALI

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