Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله

Alcohol, Haram Or Not?!?

Rate this topic


the Neo

Recommended Posts

  • Advanced Member

The basic question is whether alcohol has been declared as 'haram' by the ultimate law_giver, the God of all creations, himself? or is it a 'sin'? a shaitani_work like lying, cheating, dishonesty, back biting and other 'social-evils'. It may b the worst among the worst of things, but, is it 'haram'.

The passion with which far too many ppl plead the case against alchol appears to depict that it is 'haram' although it is clear from the Quranic verses that the term 'haram' is not used here by the only authority competent to do so ie. The all knowing Allah. The allmighty is never short of words, then y did he not use 'haram' for alchohol..?

Every devine word has a specific meaning and conotations.

The decleration of 'haram' & 'halal' is no 1 elses domane but Allah taala's. Any individual interpreting smthing as 'haram', that which is not expressly termed as 'haram', would b asuming too much power. The term 'haram' is used for a pig and for many many other things & acts however, then y not use the term 'haram' for alcohol? Why is the term haram not used to give a devine sanctioning to the decleration? Furthermore, alchol is also promised in the afterlife!! So, if haram on earth then y not in paradise... Is this not confusing?

Personally, I am not an alchol lover but Allah taala's commandments cannot b interpreted as per the will of the interpreter, why arnt there express provisions in the ultimate book of knowledge, The Quran?

Can smthing b declared as ' haram' by drawing inferences? Is the matter of haram and halal, not the domain of the Omnopotent Himself?

There r no doubts abt the socialy negative repercussions, the negative impact on health & even on the mind...but what is the modus operendi for decleration of smthing as ' haram', is this not the jurisdiction of the allmighty? Can ppl infer and make something haram, that which is not declared to b so?

This confuses me, technical help is needed.

is it 'haram' or is it not, simply / catagorically??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

ÇáÎóãÑö

Alcohol

1Ü ÑÓæáõ Çááåöþö (Õóáøóíó Çááåõ Úóáóíåö æó Âáöåö) : áÇ ÊõÌúãóÚõ ÇáÎóãÑõ æÇáÅíãÇäõ Ýí ÌóæÝö Ãæ ÞóáÈö ÑÌõáò ÃÈÏÇð.

1– The Prophet (SAWA) said, ‘Alcohol and faith will never be together in the breast or heart of a man.’[bihar al-Anwar, v. 79, p. 152, no. 64] 2Ü ÑÓæáõ Çááåö (Õóáøóíó Çááåõ Úóáóíåö æó Âáöåö) : ÇáÎóãÑõ Çõãøõ ÇáÝóæÇÍöÔö æÇáßÈÇÆÑö.

2– The Prophet (SAWA) said, ‘Alcohol is the mother of all indecent acts and grave sins.’[Kanz al-`Ummal, no. 13181] 3Ü ÑÓæáõ Çááåö (Õóáøóíó Çááåõ Úóáóíåö æó Âáöåö) : ÌõãöÚó ÇáÔøóÑøõ ßõáøõåõ Ýí ÈóíÊò ¡ æÌõÚöáó ãöÝúÊÇÍõåõ ÔõÑúÈó ÇáÎóãÑö.

3– The Prophet (SAWA) said, ‘All evil in its entirety has been gathered in one house and drinking alcohol is the key to that house.’[bihar al-Anwar, v. 79, p. 148, no. 63]

ÚöáøóÉõ ÊóÍÑíãö ÇáÎóãÑö

The Reason for the Prohibition of Alcohol

4Ü ÇáÅãÇãõ Úáíøñ (Úóáóíåö ÇáøÓóáÇãõ) : ÝóÑÖó Çááøåþõ ... ÊóÑúßó ÔõÑúÈö ÇáÎóãÑö ÊóÍúÕíäÇð ááÚóÞáö.

4– Imam Ali (as) said, ‘Allah imposed…the abandonment of drinking alcohol in order to safeguard the intellect.’[Nahj al-Balagha, Saying 252] 5Ü ÇáÅãÇãõ ÇáÑøöÖÇ (Úóáóíåö ÇáøÓóáÇãõ) : ÍóÑøãó Çááøåþõ ÇáÎóãÑó áöãÇ ÝíåÇ ãöä ÇáÝóÓÇÏö ¡ æãöä ÊóÛúííÑöåÇ ÚõÞæáó ÔÇÑöÈöíåÇ ¡ æÍóãúáöåÇ ÅíøÇåõã Úáì ÅäúßÇÑö Çááøåþö ÚÒøæÌáø ¡ æÇáÝöÑúíóÉö Úáóíåö æÚáì ÑõÓõáöåö ¡ æÓÇÆÑö ãÇ íßæäõ ãöäåõã ãöä ÇáÝóÓÇÏö æÇáÞóÊáö .

5– Imam al-Rida (as) said, ‘Allah forbade alcohol due the corruption that accompanies it, and due to the way in which it alters the drinkers’ reason, and how it encourages them to deny Allah, Mighty and Exalted, and to slander Him and His messenger, and for all the other accompaniments of corruption and murder.’[`Uyoun Akhbar al-Ridha (as), v. 2, p. 98, no. 2]

ÚÇÞöÈóÉõ ÔõÑÈö ÇáÎóãÑö

The Consequence of Drinking Alcohol

6Ü ÇáÅãÇãõ Úáíøñ (Úóáóíåö ÇáøÓóáÇãõ) : ãõÏúãöäõ ÇáÎóãÑö íóáúÞì Çááøåþó ÚÒøæÌáø Íöíäó íóáúÞÇåõ ßÚÇÈöÏö æóËóäò .

6– Imam Ali (as) said, ‘When the alcoholic one meets Allah, Mighty and Exalted, he will meet him as an idol worshipper.’[al-Khisal, p. 632, no. 10] 7Ü ÇáÅãÇãõ Úáíøñ (Úóáóíåö ÇáøÓóáÇãõ) : ãóä ÔóÑöÈó ÇáãõÓúßöÑó áóã ÊõÞúÈóáú ÕóáÇÊõåõ ÃÑÈóÚíäó íóæãÇ æáóíáóÉð.

7– Imam Ali (as) said, ‘The one who drinks an intoxicant, his prayers will not be accepted for forty days and nights.’[al-Khisal, p. 632, no. 10]

ãõÚÇãóáóÉõ ÔÇÑöÈö ÇáÎóãÑö

Interacting with an Alcohol Drinker

8Ü ÑÓæáõþ Çááøåþö (Õóáøóíó Çááåõ Úóáóíåö æó Âáöåö) : ÔÇÑöÈõ ÇáÎóãÑö áÇ ÊõÕóÏøöÞæåõ ÅÐÇ ÍóÏøËó¡ æáÇÊõÒóæøöÌæå ÅÐÇ ÎóØóÈó ¡ æáÇ ÊóÚæÏæåõ ÅÐÇ ãóÑöÖó ¡ æáÇ ÊóÍúÖóÑæåõ ÅÐÇ ãÇÊó ¡ æáÇ ÊÃÊóãöäæåõ Úáì ÃãÇäóÉò.

8– The Prophet (SAWA) said, ‘When one who drinks alcohol speaks, do not believe him, and if he proposes do not marry him, if he falls sick do not visit him, and if he dies do not attend his funeral, and do not entrust him with anything.’[bihar al-Anwar, v. 79, p. 127, no. 7] 9Ü ÑÓæáõ Çááåö (Õóáøóíó Çááåõ Úóáóíåö æó Âáöåö) : ãóËóáõ ÔÇÑöÈö ÇáÎóãÑö ßãóËóáö ÇáßöÈúÑíÊö ¡ ÝÇÍúÐóÑæåõ áÇ íõäúÊöäúßõã ßãÇ íõäúÊöäõ ÇáßöÈúÑíÊõ.

9– The Prophet (SAWA) said, ‘The alcohol drinker is like sulphur, so keep away from him lest he pollute you with his stench for sulphur has a bad stench.’[bihar al-Anwar, v. 79, p. 150, no. 64]

ÕöÝóÉõ ÍóÔÑö ÔÇÑöÈö ÇáÎóãÑö

How an Alcohol Drinker Will be Resurrected

10Ü ÇáÅãÇãõ ÇáÕøÇÏÞõ (Úóáóíåö ÇáøÓóáÇãõ) : Åäø Ãåáó ÇáÑøóíøö Ýí ÇáÏøõäíÇ ãöä ÇáãõÓúßöÑö íóãæÊæäó ÚöØÇÔÇð ¡ æíõÍúÔóÑæäó ÚöØÇÔÇð ¡ æíóÏÎõáæäó ÇáäøÇÑ ÚöØÇÔÇð.

10– Imam al-Sadiq (as) said, ‘The ones who have quenched themselves in this world with an intoxicant [alcohol] will die thirsty, will be resurrected thirsty and will enter the Hellfire thirsty.’[Thawab al-A`amal, p. 290, no. 5]

ÇáÍóËøõ Úóáì ÊóÑßö ÇáÎóãÑö æáóæ áöÛóíÑö Çááøåþö

Enjoinment of Abandoning Alcohol even if it be for Other Than Allah

11Ü ÑÓæáõ Çááøåþö (Õóáøóíó Çááåõ Úóáóíåö æó Âáöåö) Ü : ãóäþÊóÑóßó ÇáÎóãÑó áÛóíÑö Çááøåþö ÓóÞÇåõ Çááøåþõ ãöä ÇáÑøóÍíÞö ÇáãóÎúÊæãö ¡ ÝÞÇáó Úáíøñ (Úóáóíåö ÇáøÓóáÇãõ) :áÛóíÑö Çááøåþö ¿! ÞÇáó : äóÚóã æÇááøåþö ¡ ÕöíÇäóÉð áäÝÓåö .

11– The Prophet (SAWA) said, ‘Whoever abandons alcohol for other than the sake of Allah, Allah will quench his thirst [in Paradise] with the sealed wine’. Imam Ali (as) exclaimed, ‘For other than Allah?’ The Prophet (SAWA) replied, ‘Yes, by Allah, for his own protection and well-being.’[bihar al-Anwar, v. 79, p. 412, no. 2]

ÍõÑãóÉõ ãÇ ÝóÚóáó ÝöÚáó ÇáÎóãÑö

The Prohibition of That Which Produces the Same Effects as Alcohol

12Ü ÇáÅãÇãõ ÇáßÇÙãõ (Úóáóíåö ÇáøÓóáÇãõ) : Åäø Çááøåþó ÚÒøæÌáø áã íõÍóÑøöãö ÇáÎóãÑó áÇÓúãöåÇ¡ æáßäøåõ ÍóÑøãóåÇ áÚÇÞöÈóÊöåÇ º ÝãÇ ßÇäó ÚÇÞöÈóÊõåõ ÚÇÞöÈóÉó ÇáÎóãÑö Ýåõæ ÎóãÑñ .

12– Imam al-Kazim (as) said, ‘Allah did not prohibit alcohol because of its name, rather He prohibited it due to its effects, so whatever produces the same effects as alcohol is [treated as] alcohol.’[al-Kafi, v. 6, p. 412, no. 2]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

(salam)

Exactly I don't Think Alcohol is the culprit / Haram , the outcome of consuming alcohol and it's repercussion are .

here is the Orthodox Christian perspective on alcohol.

Genesis 27:25 - So he said, "Bring it to me, and I will eat of my son's game, that I may bless you." And he brought it to him, and he ate; he also brought him wine and he drank.

Proverbs 23:20-21 - Do not be with heavy drinkers of wine, Or with gluttonous eaters of meat; For the heavy drinker and the glutton will come to poverty, And drowsiness will clothe one with rags.

Ecclesiastes 9:7 - Go then, eat your bread in happiness and drink your wine with a cheerful heart; for God has already approved your works.

Psalm 103:13-14 - He makes grass grow for the cattle, and plants for man to cultivate— bringing forth food from the earth: wine that gladdens the heart of man, oil to make his face shine, and bread that sustains his heart.

N

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

Alcohol is haram. It;s completely forbidden:

``O ye who believe! Intoxicants and gambling, (dedication of) stones, and (divination by) arrows, are an abomination,- of Satan's handwork: eschew such (abomination), that ye may prosper`` (5:90).

"Do not cause your own destruction" (2: 195)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member

(salam),

I don't think alcohol itself is haram, I think intoxication from drinking too much alcohol is haram cause alcohol occurs naturally in many halal fruits we eat and can be useful for treating bad wounds.

You think wrong.

We have explicit ahadith saying whatever intoxicates in larger amounts, is also completely prohibited in smaller amounts.

From Greater Sins by Ayt. Dastghaib Shirazi:

It makes no difference if the quantity consumed is less or more; liquor is absolutely Harām; whether pure or mixed. Thus even if a person licks a single drop it is Harām whether he gets intoxicated or not. In the same way if liquor is consumed by mixing it with other things, it is still Harām.

Allama Hilli (r.a.) has quoted an authentic tradition from Imam Ja’far as-Sadiq (a.s.), that he said:

“If more of it intoxicates, then to consume even a bit of it is Harām.”

A person enquired from Imam (a.s.), “but I dilute it with water?”

Imam (a.s.) told him,

“A Harām thing does not become Halāl by mixing it with water. Fear Allah, refrain from partaking of it.”

(Mustanad ush-Shia)

Umar Ibn Hanzala says that he enquired from Imam Ja’far as-Sadiq (a.s.):

“Does it matter if as much water is mixed in wine so that it is no more intoxicating?”

Imam (a.s.) replied:

“No! By Allah it is not. Even if a drop of wine falls into a well full of water it does not become Halāl. Rather the whole well has to be emptied.”

(Furu’ al-Kāfi).

Ibn Wahab has narrated this tradition from Imam Ja’far as-Sadiq (a.s.):

“Every intoxicant is Harām. Something that intoxicates only when consumed in large quantities, is also not allowed to be taken even in a lesser quantity.”

The narrator says, “I asked, ‘Then if a Harām thing is mixed in a huge quantity of water, does it become permissible?’”

Imam (a.s.) flailed his arms twice, indicating emphatically that it does not

(Furu al-Kāfi)

Liquor is harmful irrespective of the quantity consumed. Even if a drop of the poison enters the body it has harmful effects on it, whether apparent immediately or not. If you mix a few buckets of red dye in a pond of water, the whole pond water turns red. But on the other hand if you throw a glassful of ink in a pond of clear water it would not bring about any appreciable change in its appearance, yet, could you say that the ink has not affected the water at all? Certainly not! If the water is subjected to the process of distillation the glassful of ink could be recovered. If it enters the body it will cause harm.

A person who tastes liquor, one drop at a time, soon gets addicted to it till he needs to drink more and more of it. Consequently a stage is reached when he is unable to rid himself of this habit howsoever hard he may try. A stone is eroded when water drips upon it over a period of time. Similarly alcohol erodes the liver and other cells of the body. Grapes, raisins and dates, when unfermented have medicinal properties and are wholesome and beneficial to the body. But as soon as fermentation sets in these fruits and wine is produced they turn harmful and prohibited.

I fail to understand why this is a question. The Qur'an is pretty clear on the matter. Liquor does not need to be used in the same sentence with the word 'Haram' in order for it to be Haram.

This is the verse about the prohibition of swine:

ÍõÑöøãóÊú Úóáóíúßõãõ ÇáúãóíúÊóÉõ æóÇáÏóøãõ æóáóÍúãõ ÇáúÎöäúÒöíÑö æóãóÇ Ãõåöáóø áöÛóíúÑö Çááóøåö Èöåö æóÇáúãõäúÎóäöÞóÉõ æóÇáúãóæúÞõæÐóÉõ æóÇáúãõÊóÑóÏöøíóÉõ æóÇáäóøØöíÍóÉõ æóãóÇ Ãóßóáó ÇáÓóøÈõÚõ ÅöáóøÇ ãóÇ ÐóßóøíúÊõãú æóãóÇ ÐõÈöÍó Úóáóì ÇáäõøÕõÈö æóÃóäú ÊóÓúÊóÞúÓöãõæÇ ÈöÇáúÃóÒúáóÇãö ۚ Ðóٰáößõãú ÝöÓúÞñ ۗ Çáúíóæúãó íóÆöÓó ÇáóøÐöíäó ßóÝóÑõæÇ ãöäú Ïöíäößõãú ÝóáóÇ ÊóÎúÔóæúåõãú æóÇÎúÔóæúäö ۚ Çáúíóæúãó ÃóßúãóáúÊõ áóßõãú Ïöíäóßõãú æóÃóÊúãóãúÊõ Úóáóíúßõãú äöÚúãóÊöí æóÑóÖöíÊõ áóßõãõ ÇáúÅöÓúáóÇãó ÏöíäðÇ ۚ Ýóãóäö ÇÖúØõÑóø Ýöí ãóÎúãóÕóÉò ÛóíúÑó ãõÊóÌóÇäöÝò áöÅöËúãò ۙ ÝóÅöäóø Çááóøåó ÛóÝõæÑñ ÑóÍöíãñ {3}

Forbidden to you is that which dies of itself, and blood, and flesh of swine, and that on which any other name than that of Allah has been invoked, and the strangled (animal) and that beaten to death, and that killed by a fall and that killed by being smitten with the horn, and that which wild beasts have eaten, except what you slaughter, and what is sacrificed on stones set up (for idols) and that you divide by the arrows; that is a transgression. This day have those who disbelieve despaired of your religion, so fear them not, and fear Me. This day have I perfected for you your religion and completed My favor on you and chosen for you Islam as a religion; but whoever is compelled by hunger, not inclining willfully to sin, then surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. (5:3)

And these are the ones about alcohol (and all intoxicants):

íóÓúÃóáõæäóßó Úóäö ÇáúÎóãúÑö æóÇáúãóíúÓöÑö ۖ Þõáú ÝöíåöãóÇ ÅöËúãñ ßóÈöíÑñ æóãóäóÇÝöÚõ áöáäóøÇÓö æóÅöËúãõåõãóÇ ÃóßúÈóÑõ ãöäú äóÝúÚöåöãóÇ ۗ æóíóÓúÃóáõæäóßó ãóÇÐóÇ íõäúÝöÞõæäó Þõáö ÇáúÚóÝúæó ۗ ßóÐóٰáößó íõÈóíöøäõ Çááóøåõ áóßõãõ ÇáúÂíóÇÊö áóÚóáóøßõãú ÊóÊóÝóßóøÑõæäó {219}

They ask you about intoxicants and games of chance. Say: In both of them there is a great sin and means of profit for men, and their sin is greater than their profit. And they ask you as to what they should spend. Say: What you can spare. Thus does Allah make clear to you the communications, that you may ponder (2:219)

íóÇ ÃóíõøåóÇ ÇáóøÐöíäó ÂãóäõæÇ ÅöäóøãóÇ ÇáúÎóãúÑõ æóÇáúãóíúÓöÑõ æóÇáúÃóäúÕóÇÈõ æóÇáúÃóÒúáóÇãõ ÑöÌúÓñ ãöäú Úóãóáö ÇáÔóøíúØóÇäö ÝóÇÌúÊóäöÈõæåõ áóÚóáóøßõãú ÊõÝúáöÍõæäó {90}

O you who believe! intoxicants and games of chance and (sacrificing to) stones set up and (dividing by) arrows are only an uncleanness, the Shaitan's work; shun it therefore that you may be successful. (5:90)

I don't see much of a difference. Both the verses, are strict in saying that there is sin in drinking. As for why the word 'alcohol' specifically was not used (and instead 'al-khamr' was used) then that is to generalize the law so it applies to anything similar to alcohol. Pretty much like how when I say 'dairy' products, it should include milk and eggs. It's awkward if one questions why I didn't say 'milk' alone.

Also, the Qur'an is not the only source of law we have. We also have ahadith which are used to derive Islamic laws. You're missing a fundamental part of Islam if you choose to ignore ahadith (and obviously, we have scores of ahadith which clearly prohibit consuming alcohol (by name) ).

I hope that clears it up, inshaAllah.

wa (salam)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member

I'm talking about the compound called alcohol. It is a naturally occurring substance. What is forbidden is pressing and drinking of beverages that contain alcohol with the express purpose of getting us drunk or intoxicated. I'm saying if something contains some alcohol in it but can't get you drunk even if you drink a whole bucket or too of it, it isn't haram because many of the fruits we eat contain alcohol naturally. As far as I know, grapes and oranges are not haram to eat or press yet they contain an alcoholic content naturally from the moment they are picked. I believe the hadiths are speaking more on drinks made with the express purpose of intoxicating an individual beyond reason not necessarily a drink that has alcohol in it, such as orange juice.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

You think wrong.

We have explicit ahadith saying whatever intoxicates in larger amounts, is also completely prohibited in smaller amounts.

Not only that but khamr is also considered najis.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If the alcohol consumed gives you "intoxication" it is haraam. If you have a spoonful of brandy for a conjested chest which will not intoxicate you, but cure you it is allowed.

You will also note that most medicines which treat influenza, common cold, cough syrups contain a certain alcohol content. The only effect it has on the consumer is that it eases the pain and may induce sleep in some cases.

The word intoxication has been mentioned in the Holy Quran (so since alcohol is known to induce a state of intoxication, it is deemed as haraam).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member

If the alcohol consumed gives you "intoxication" it is haraam. If you have a spoonful of brandy for a conjested chest which will not intoxicate you, but cure you it is allowed.

You will also note that most medicines which treat influenza, common cold, cough syrups contain a certain alcohol content. The only effect it has on the consumer is that it eases the pain and may induce sleep in some cases.

The word intoxication has been mentioned in the Holy Quran (so since alcohol is known to induce a state of intoxication, it is deemed as haraam).

thank you and isopropyl alcohol can clean wounds.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you have a spoonful of brandy for a conjested chest which will not intoxicate you, but cure you it is allowed.

This isn't true. There are numerous hadiths that explicit forbid seeking medicinal treatment through wine, nabidh, and such.

You will also note that most medicines which treat influenza, common cold, cough syrups contain a certain alcohol content. The only effect it has on the consumer is that it eases the pain and may induce sleep in some cases.

Some do contain that, but it's pretty easy to find daytime formulas that do not contain alcohol. (And yes, drink enough of the ones with alcohol, you will get drunk. Why do you think they make you sleepy, alcohol is a depressant.)

The word intoxication has been mentioned in the Holy Quran (so since alcohol is known to induce a state of intoxication, it is deemed as haraam).

khamr, wine, is specifically forbidden in the Quran. The Prophet (pbuh) however forbade all intoxicating drinks, and so they are all haram. (this is an example of tafwid al-amr) This is known through the hadiths.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well...What is teh Purpose of your Question?

I know many Medicine in teh west contain alcohol....like 0.0002% of alcohol

If your question is that, then you should look for medicine that does not contain it but has the same effect. If that fails, The second stipulation is that you should search for the medication with the absolute least alcohol involved but still cure you. If you've sincerely done all this, then drinking the things you've found with the (lowest % of Alcohol possible but still cures you) is not considered a sin.

NOT

If you have a spoonful of brandy for a conjested chest which will not intoxicate you, but cure you it is allowed.

There are MANY things/medication that relieve a congested chest and work excellently. Some of them are even alcohol free.

However

Drinking alcohol for the intention of pleasure is a sin, whatever the circumstances may be.

Basically, unless it has to do with life or death or similar situations, then drinking alcohol is a sin, and even if it does (have to do with life or death), you should aim to look for something that has the lowest percentage of alcohol but still works.

Lets not over complicate things to a degree where they don't need to be complicated.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This isn't true. There are numerous hadiths that explicit forbid seeking medicinal treatment through wine, nabidh, and such.

Agreed 100% the logic behind them hadeeth' are if there are alternatives which are available which are sans prohibited substances, one must take those. Also, it had been recommended by the marja a long long time ago that when one visit's his or her Physician must ask for medicine without alcohol in accordance with the hadeeth which you have mentioned (herein above)

khamr, wine, is specifically forbidden in the Quran. The Prophet (pbuh) however forbade all intoxicating drinks, and so they are all haram. (this is an example of tafwid al-amr) This is known through the hadiths.

Absolutely right ! Greater Sins - Alcohol

But logically if there aren't any alternatives (cough syrups minus alcohol content, one can consume them on the grounds that they are not "ritually impure")

Question # 156 under heading Medicine

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

If the alcohol consumed gives you "intoxication" it is haraam. If you have a spoonful of brandy for a conjested chest which will not intoxicate you, but cure you it is allowed.

You will also note that most medicines which treat influenza, common cold, cough syrups contain a certain alcohol content. The only effect it has on the consumer is that it eases the pain and may induce sleep in some cases.

The word intoxication has been mentioned in the Holy Quran (so since alcohol is known to induce a state of intoxication, it is deemed as haraam).

Snake Venom also has certain cures for Leprosy if applied on the infected areas. Snake Venom is also good for skin.. but its HARAAM to drink it or eat it because its harmful for you and it may kill you. Some people intoxicate themselves with certain kinds of Snake bites on their tongue.

Cough Syrups are addicting, I know a few people who got addicted to it and damaged their liver. For medicinal use its fine (consult your marja on this) but any drug which will be abused is Haraam. You can abuse on a few kinds of drugs which are supposed to be a cure for certain illnesses.. but taking these drugs for the sake of "fun" .. "past time" "pleasure" then its obviously haraam.

internet can be haraam.. if used improperly.. there is a lot of forbidden content such as sexual porn sites .. but at the same time internet is very useful if used to gain free access to knowledge and information and business. Similarly boozing alcohol is haraam.. .or drinking Grandpa's cough medicine for fun.. is HARAAM... certain snake venoms are used as healing for the lepers. but doing intoxication with snake bite on their tongue is haraam.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

(salam),

You think wrong.

We have explicit ahadith saying whatever intoxicates in larger amounts, is also completely prohibited in smaller amounts.

From Greater Sins by Ayt. Dastghaib Shirazi:

I fail to understand why this is a question. The Qur'an is pretty clear on the matter. Liquor does not need to be used in the same sentence with the word 'Haram' in order for it to be Haram.

This is the verse about the prohibition of swine:

ÍõÑöøãóÊú Úóáóíúßõãõ ÇáúãóíúÊóÉõ æóÇáÏóøãõ æóáóÍúãõ ÇáúÎöäúÒöíÑö æóãóÇ Ãõåöáóø áöÛóíúÑö Çááóøåö Èöåö æóÇáúãõäúÎóäöÞóÉõ æóÇáúãóæúÞõæÐóÉõ æóÇáúãõÊóÑóÏöøíóÉõ æóÇáäóøØöíÍóÉõ æóãóÇ Ãóßóáó ÇáÓóøÈõÚõ ÅöáóøÇ ãóÇ ÐóßóøíúÊõãú æóãóÇ ÐõÈöÍó Úóáóì ÇáäõøÕõÈö æóÃóäú ÊóÓúÊóÞúÓöãõæÇ ÈöÇáúÃóÒúáóÇãö ۚ Ðóٰáößõãú ÝöÓúÞñ ۗ Çáúíóæúãó íóÆöÓó ÇáóøÐöíäó ßóÝóÑõæÇ ãöäú Ïöíäößõãú ÝóáóÇ ÊóÎúÔóæúåõãú æóÇÎúÔóæúäö ۚ Çáúíóæúãó ÃóßúãóáúÊõ áóßõãú Ïöíäóßõãú æóÃóÊúãóãúÊõ Úóáóíúßõãú äöÚúãóÊöí æóÑóÖöíÊõ áóßõãõ ÇáúÅöÓúáóÇãó ÏöíäðÇ ۚ Ýóãóäö ÇÖúØõÑóø Ýöí ãóÎúãóÕóÉò ÛóíúÑó ãõÊóÌóÇäöÝò áöÅöËúãò ۙ ÝóÅöäóø Çááóøåó ÛóÝõæÑñ ÑóÍöíãñ {3}

Forbidden to you is that which dies of itself, and blood, and flesh of swine, and that on which any other name than that of Allah has been invoked, and the strangled (animal) and that beaten to death, and that killed by a fall and that killed by being smitten with the horn, and that which wild beasts have eaten, except what you slaughter, and what is sacrificed on stones set up (for idols) and that you divide by the arrows; that is a transgression. This day have those who disbelieve despaired of your religion, so fear them not, and fear Me. This day have I perfected for you your religion and completed My favor on you and chosen for you Islam as a religion; but whoever is compelled by hunger, not inclining willfully to sin, then surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. (5:3)

And these are the ones about alcohol (and all intoxicants):

íóÓúÃóáõæäóßó Úóäö ÇáúÎóãúÑö æóÇáúãóíúÓöÑö ۖ Þõáú ÝöíåöãóÇ ÅöËúãñ ßóÈöíÑñ æóãóäóÇÝöÚõ áöáäóøÇÓö æóÅöËúãõåõãóÇ ÃóßúÈóÑõ ãöäú äóÝúÚöåöãóÇ ۗ æóíóÓúÃóáõæäóßó ãóÇÐóÇ íõäúÝöÞõæäó Þõáö ÇáúÚóÝúæó ۗ ßóÐóٰáößó íõÈóíöøäõ Çááóøåõ áóßõãõ ÇáúÂíóÇÊö áóÚóáóøßõãú ÊóÊóÝóßóøÑõæäó {219}

They ask you about intoxicants and games of chance. Say: In both of them there is a great sin and means of profit for men, and their sin is greater than their profit. And they ask you as to what they should spend. Say: What you can spare. Thus does Allah make clear to you the communications, that you may ponder (2:219)

íóÇ ÃóíõøåóÇ ÇáóøÐöíäó ÂãóäõæÇ ÅöäóøãóÇ ÇáúÎóãúÑõ æóÇáúãóíúÓöÑõ æóÇáúÃóäúÕóÇÈõ æóÇáúÃóÒúáóÇãõ ÑöÌúÓñ ãöäú Úóãóáö ÇáÔóøíúØóÇäö ÝóÇÌúÊóäöÈõæåõ áóÚóáóøßõãú ÊõÝúáöÍõæäó {90}

O you who believe! intoxicants and games of chance and (sacrificing to) stones set up and (dividing by) arrows are only an uncleanness, the Shaitan's work; shun it therefore that you may be successful. (5:90)

I don't see much of a difference. Both the verses, are strict in saying that there is sin in drinking. As for why the word 'alcohol' specifically was not used (and instead 'al-khamr' was used) then that is to generalize the law so it applies to anything similar to alcohol. Pretty much like how when I say 'dairy' products, it should include milk and eggs. It's awkward if one questions why I didn't say 'milk' alone.

Also, the Qur'an is not the only source of law we have. We also have ahadith which are used to derive Islamic laws. You're missing a fundamental part of Islam if you choose to ignore ahadith (and obviously, we have scores of ahadith which clearly prohibit consuming alcohol (by name) ).

I hope that clears it up, inshaAllah.

wa (salam)

AoA

Very v convincing, thank you. Its clear that alchol is so so v close to being 'haram' that its haram.

the english translation that you have "quoted" of the holy verses is very impressive and looks to b inclusive of finer details.

There r still sm questions:

...as said; great sin is in the trade / retail of alchol, specifically, no? (proving social conotations)

...are all 'great sins', haram?

...smthing "haram" is the ultimate prohibition of the Allmighty Lord, its the supreme lawgivers words laying down his laws, can this power be legally asumed on basis of interpretation, by a jurist?

...does the decleration of something to be 'haram' not need express proclamation from the Allmighty?

...no doubts are there in it that the undisputed ahadith recorded across the board r a sourse of law/jurisprudence, rest r to be seen by us in light of the basic source ie. The Quran.

...not abt alchol completely, but are generally exaggerations not done by ulema to scare the followers from a prohibited things. Does overdoing the kill, never happen, coz there r all kinds of ppl with varying mental & analytical capabilities in the world..so the message of the alim has to b such that it needs to b put accross to the whole section of the society.. For instance the procedure for a gussal (bath) is prescribed so all parts of body gets rinsed by water, although an educated person would know this but u cant argue if an illiterate person says that he didn't know,, so the same orders must go for literate &illiterate ...

...is not the term haram only to be used (legally), after express devine sanctioning & declaration.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member

AoA

Very v convincing, thank you. Its clear that alchol is so so v close to being 'haram' that its haram.

the english translation that you have "quoted" of the holy verses is very impressive and looks to b inclusive of finer details.

There r still sm questions:

...as said; great sin is in the trade / retail of alchol, specifically, no? (proving social conotations)

That's not what it says. It says there is profit (worldly gain) in it for man. This does not mean it only includes trade of intoxicants. Besides, what would be the point in the prohibition of 'trading' intoxicants if it was more of a 'trade' item (like gold and silver)?

Also important to remember is that the following was also one of the earlier verses revealed regarding intoxicants (which further clarifies matters):

íóÇ ÃóíõøåóÇ ÇáóøÐöíäó ÂãóäõæÇ áóÇ ÊóÞúÑóÈõæÇ ÇáÕóøáóÇÉó æóÃóäúÊõãú ÓõßóÇÑóìٰ ÍóÊóøìٰ ÊóÚúáóãõæÇ ãóÇ ÊóÞõæáõæäó æóáóÇ ÌõäõÈðÇ ÅöáóøÇ ÚóÇÈöÑöí ÓóÈöíáò ÍóÊóøìٰ ÊóÛúÊóÓöáõæÇ ۚ æóÅöäú ßõäúÊõãú ãóÑúÖóìٰ Ãóæú Úóáóìٰ ÓóÝóÑò Ãóæú ÌóÇÁó ÃóÍóÏñ ãöäúßõãú ãöäó ÇáúÛóÇÆöØö Ãóæú áóÇãóÓúÊõãõ ÇáäöøÓóÇÁó Ýóáóãú ÊóÌöÏõæÇ ãóÇÁð ÝóÊóíóãóøãõæÇ ÕóÚöíÏðÇ ØóíöøÈðÇ ÝóÇãúÓóÍõæÇ ÈöæõÌõæåößõãú æóÃóíúÏöíßõãú ۗ Åöäóø Çááóøåó ßóÇäó ÚóÝõæðøÇ ÛóÝõæÑðÇ {43}

O you who believe! do not go near prayer when you are Intoxicated until you know (well) what you say, nor when you are under an obligation to perform a bath-- unless (you are) travelling on the road-- until you have washed yourselves; and if you are sick, or on a journey, or one of you come from the privy or you have touched the women, and you cannot find water, betake yourselves to pure earth, then wipe your faces and your hands; surely Allah is Pardoning, Forgiving. (4:43)

...are all 'great sins', haram?

Yes. Anything that is a sin (minor or great), is Haram.

...smthing "haram" is the ultimate prohibition of the Allmighty Lord, its the supreme lawgivers words laying down his laws, can this power be legally asumed on basis of interpretation, by a jurist?

No.

...does the decleration of something to be 'haram' not need express proclamation from the Allmighty?

It does. I really think a couple of ahadith will answer you best. Relevant ahadith from Al-Kafi, Chapter on Innovations, Personal Opinions and Analogies:

Muwathaq kal Sahih according to Allama' Majlisi (hadith 1, pg 54):

Al-Husayn ibn Muhammad al-Ash’ari has narrated from Mu‘alla ibn Muhammad from al- Hassan ibn Ali al-Washsha’ and a number of our people from Ahmad ibn Muhammad from ibn Faddal all from ‘Asim ibn Hamid from Muhammad ibn Muslim from abu Ja‘far (a.s.) who has said the following.

"Imam Ali said in one of his sermons to people, ‘O people, mischief begins with following certain desires and obeying certain invented rules that are different from the rules and laws of the book of Allah. In such case people yield to other people as high authority if falsehood would have been clear they would have no fear for the people of Intelligence. If truth would have been clearly distinct there would have been no differences. But (practical life) people mix certain parts of truth and with a few things from falsehood and present them together and in such Satan overwhelms his friends and only those who has previously received protection from Allah remain safe.’"

Muwathaq according to Allama' Majlisi (hadith 13, pg 57):

Ali ibn Ibrahim has narrated from Muhammad ibn ‘Isa ibn ‘Ubayd from Yunus ibn ‘Abd al- Rahman from Sum‘a ibn Mihran who has said the following.

"I said to (Imam) abu al-Hassan (a.s.), ‘May Allah keep you well, in our meetings we discuss the issues and find out that for almost every thing there is something in writing with us and that is all because of the blessings of your existence among us. We only find few small things for which we do not find any thing in writing we look on each other and we find certain issues similar to it then we use analogy in its best form." The Imam said, "What do you have to do with analogy? Many people before have been destroyed because of analogy." The Imam then said, "When you face an issue and know he rule about it deal with accordingly and if you would have no knowledge about its rule then this. He pointed to his own mouth, meaning thereby; this will give you the answer." The Imam then said, "May Allah (___) Abu Hanifah who used to say, "Ali said so and so, therefore, I said so and so. The Sahabah said so and so, therefore, I said so and so." The Imam then asked me, "Have you been sitting with him?" I then relied, "No, I have not sat with him but such are his statements." I then said to the Imam (a.s.). "May Allah keep you well, did the holy Prophet bring in his everything that people needed?" The Imam said, "Yes, and all that they will need up to the Day of Judgment." I then said, "Is any thing lost from it?" The Imam replied, "No, it all is with the people to who they

belong.’"

Sahih according to Allama' Majlisi (hadith 19, pg 58):

Ali ibn Ibrahim has narrated from Muhammad ibn ‘Isa ibn ‘Ubayd from Yunus from Hariz from Zurara who has said the following.

"I asked Imam abu ‘Abdallah (a.s.) about lawful and unlawful matters who has said, "Whatever Prophet (s.a.) has made lawful will remain lawful forever up to the Day of Judgment and whatever he has made unlawful will remain unlawful forever up to the Day of Judgment. There will be no one other than him and there will come no one other than him. He said that Imam Ali has said, ‘No one has established any innovations without abandoning an established noble tradition."

And this:

And there has come already in the hadith of Muhammad b. Muslim and Zurara from Abu Ja`far ( Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ) (that) he said: The haram is only what Allah has forbidden in the Quran.

http://www.*******.org/hadiths/food-and-drink/lawful-foods/permission-in-the-absence-of-prohibition

...not abt alchol completely, but are generally exaggerations not done by ulema to scare the followers from a prohibited things. Does overdoing the kill, never happen, coz there r all kinds of ppl with varying mental & analytical capabilities in the world..so the message of the alim has to b such that it needs to b put accross to the whole section of the society.. For instance the procedure for a gussal (bath) is prescribed so all parts of body gets rinsed by water, although an educated person would know this but u cant argue if an illiterate person says that he didn't know,, so the same orders must go for literate &illiterate ...

This is a completely different issue (about how the speaker speaks, the tone and vocabulary he uses). But obviously, no speaker reserves the right to label what has been allowed as Haraam or vice versa. There are certain acts which are extremely disliked, but not Haraam, like the eating of rabbit. Because we have ahadith saying it was hated by the Prophet (pbuh) to eat rabbits, eating it has always been so discouraged that people now believe it is Haraam altogether (so as to continue an established Sunnah of the Prophet (pbuh) ).

wa (salam)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Veteran Member

The compound of alcohol is not forbidden for us to use because it was never "alcohol" that was forbidden rather it was "al-kamr" alcoholic beverages pressed for the intention of intoxication. "Kamr" doesn't mean "alcohol" from what I know, rather it means a certain kind of wine pressed for the purpose of intoxication. The wine of paradise is described with a different arabic term "al-rahiq" Yet both have been translated into english simply as "wine" and "pure wine" respectively.

However they both mean two distinct kinds of wine. So it was never wine or alcohol that was forbidden as alcohol occurs naturally in fruits that are halal for us rather it was intoxication that results from drinking too much alcohol in my view. Because whenever one drinks anything from a fruit that is halal such as an orange or grape there is some alcohol in it whether the person could possibly drink enough of that beverage to become intoxicated or not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

But logically if there aren't any alternatives (cough syrups minus alcohol content, one can consume them on the grounds that they are not "ritually impure")

Question # 156 under heading Medicine

Are you talking about these:

Q155: Before taking medication, is it obligatory to investigate and confirm the correctness of its components to find out whether it contains any prohibited ingredients?

A: Certainly not, it is not obligatory to investigate and confirm. (FM, p. 415)

Q156: Many medications and disinfectants contain a small amount of alcohol. Is it permissible to use them, and are they ritually impure?

A: They are not ritually impure and it is permissible for you to use them. (FM, p. 415)

Which mujtahid/s fatwas are these????

http://www.revivingalislam.com/2011/04/signs-of-day-of-judgment.html

Read sign 106

La Shafa Fil Haram

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Advanced Member

Another thing to remember is that in the time of the prophet nobody would have been able to tell that oranges and whatever had trace amount of the chemical we call alcohol. I don't know Arabic but in ancient contexts in Latin alcohol would better be translated as intoxicating substance than the chemical compound which nobody at the time could detect. If it made you drunk it was alcohol, if not then it wasn't. Since the Arabs didn't know much more about chemistry than the Romans, I would guess it works the same way as Saintly Jinn says.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Alcohol is worse than Haram. In the ayat, it comes in an order for us to avoid it, which means to avoid drinking it, entering a place that sells it, sitting with someone who is drinking it, and holding it.

Whereas for example, pork is Haram, but there is no problem sitting with someone eating pork

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 6 years later...
  • Advanced Member

There are so many things that contain alcohol through fermentation. Yogurt, cocoa butter/powder, cornstarch, etc.?

Edit: and also let's add in the extracts which are derived from alcohol. And if it's not Alcohol  then it is animal by product. If its not that then is your fruits and vegetables being dyed which can use solvents that are animal by product.only way you can guarantee 100 % halal is if you grow it in your backyard.

 

 

Edited by Askari313
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...